The New Player Experience Is...off

[OblivionNecroninja]

What rank are you?  Why didnt you trade for it?

Where would newbies get the plat/good mods to trade for good mods?

[mpastor]

Is this a serious question?  You start with 50 plat.  To buy a cold mod for your rifle would cost at most 1 plat.  However, that would even surprise me.  Any decent person would just give it to a new player.  That's the free to play guy.  Many people will spend some cash if they like the game.  All of this talk about new players and people seem to gloss over this point.   

Edited April 3, 2014 by mpastor

[Deristel]

Is this a serious question?  You start with 50 plat.  To buy a cold mod for your rifle would cost at most 1 plat.  However, that would even surprise me.  Any decent person would just give it to a new player.  

you can't trade the starting 50 plat.Do your homework kiddo.

[mpastor]

Holy cow, I edited my comment ten seconds after I posted it.  Still not fast enough to beat a quibbler to the punch.

[Deristel]

Holy cow, I edited my comment ten seconds after I posted it.  Still not fast enough to beat a quibbler to the punch.

Noone will like a game that they have to spend money on to keep goin.First you play and find the game likeable.Then,maybe,you buy something.Not the way around.

[mpastor]

Noone will like a game that they have to spend money on to keep goin.First you play and find the game likeable.Then,maybe,you buy something.Not the way around.

 

LOL,.. Do you think magic elves sneak into DE at night and do the game programming?  Of course people pay, lots of people... for this game like others, more people pay than don't.   I dont think the thousands of people about to play ESO got this memo either.  Are you really this naive or are you being sarcastic?

[Deristel]

You don't get the point it seem.
You play a game.You like it.You spend money on it.
Atm warframe is:You play it.you get to earth after a couple hours,you smash your face on eurasia,you smash your face on eurasia for multiple days till you get a high geared player in your party,or you quit.It's not worth to spend money in a game that require you to spend money to progress at early game.It's marketing.

[mpastor]

How is that marketing?  Do you even know what marketing is?  Did you mean to write that that was part of the business or economic model?  Are you implying that they allegedly made earth allegedly difficult to get more people to pay?  This sounds ludicrous and counter intuitive.  Would not making something prohibitively difficult chase people away.  Usually in MMO's, the opposite is the case.  Things are dumbed down so they appeal to broader audience and more wallets.  The reason to make something difficult is to help insure that a certain minimum skill set is achieved before going on, in spite of its economic impact.  Obviously that is the case here.  People who complain about the difficulty of this mission usually have sub par equipment and frame mods.  You yourself admitted as much in another thread.

[Deristel]

Your subpar equipment is all you can get at that point,even if you get a breaton you don't have mods for it unless you got extremely lucky.
The eurasia difficulty is a stupid move even in a marketing point of view.lotsa player are quitting for that,meaning that veteran have almost no need for platinum (leaving aside random exclusive skin and such),while people who prolly would have bought something once they got hooked in the game are mostly quitting causing a huge loss to de.

[mpastor]

I just looked at what a player could achieve in four hours of play.  Granted he was an experience player but he had a braton, 100 k, serration, and at Eurasia.  Now, even if you only do half as good... you will still be fine.  

 

BTW.  You have absolutely no idea if people are quitting or not.  Just look at you.  You were/are a poor player.  You dealt with the issue and continue to play.  Doesnt this fact fly in the face of your statement?

[Deristel]

I'm used to dark soul and to redo things over and over.Been playing online since i was 12.plus as i stated,when i started eurasia was easier than now so i had no issues.my first solid weapon was a drakgoon.once i got that i started to handle myself pretty well,but i just lucked out buying it thinking it was a missle launcher.

If you have to ask for help to veteran on region,like many player are doing,something is deeply wrong and should be looked at.

I do know from the same players that got stuck that they were on that mission for 3 days or more before i helped them.This is wrong.And this lead to quitting.You do realize that a smooth difficulty increase is better than a sudden falcon punch in the face like the one eurasia gives you.This lead player to quit for something better.Not all of them ofcourse.but you can't deny some of them will.This hurt DE as a company and hurts us as playerbase.

[XRAY0128]

I just looked at what a player could achieve in four hours of play.  Granted he was an experience player but he had a braton, 100 k, serration, and at Eurasia.  Now, even if you only do half as good... you will still be fine.  

 

BTW.  You have absolutely no idea if people are quitting or not.  Just look at you.  You were/are a poor player.  You dealt with the issue and continue to play.  Doesnt this fact fly in the face of your statement?

 

I only kept playing because I currently have no other games to play... 

 

I can't join most matches thanks to internet issues. I have to play solo most of the time. And grinding weapons constantly is getting on my nerves.  To top it off, since veteran players are the ones with the most say, I basically have no chance of seeing the game become easier to solo. So I might as well just give up at this point.

[mpastor]

I am sorry that you hate the grind.  Nobody really likes it.  But the alternative is infinite content with infinite loot.  Now that later point is really impractical. So, grinding loot is really all you at end game.  Certainly if you had everything you wanted, how many times would you play the missions currently available before you lost interest.  A day, maybe two?  What other motivation is there?

[Cpl_Facehugger]

Cold is probably the first elemental mod you are going to get,

Where, exactly? The earliest enemy who drops cryo rounds is shockwave moas. Good luck farming those when you're just starting out.

Deep Freeze drops from nobody according to the codex. Wiki says it drops as high end defense rewards and, presumably void containers. Obviously a newbie isn't going to be farming Xini.

North Wind does drop from relatively common enemies, yes. Butchers and moas are both acceptable targets. Butchers are common in Mercury and Moas are common everywhere corpus are found.

Just one problem here. North Wind is the melee mod. Going melee against shockwave moas, bombards, etc is an exercise in hilarity. North Wind sure as hek isn't going to turn the tide on Earth when you're slotting it into your Skana. Or, at best, your orthos.

I just looked at what a player could achieve in four hours of play.

You looked at what a player with luck can achieve in four hours of play. Tell that to someone who farms hundreds of scorpions but never sees a serration drop.

Edited April 4, 2014 by Cpl_Facehugger

[XRAY0128]

I am sorry that you hate the grind.  Nobody really likes it.  But the alternative is infinite content with infinite loot.  Now that later point is really impractical. So, grinding loot is really all you at end game.  Certainly if you had everything you wanted, how many times would you play the missions currently available before you lost interest.  A day, maybe two?  What other motivation is there?

 

Where did I say I wanted everything at once? I'd be fine with just using my favourite guns and just enjoying a good shooter, I don't mind earning my weapons. Think Unreal, or Doom, or Quake II where you had to find your weapons, and maybe if you knew where to look, you could find them early.

 

And if I had all the weapons, I'd have nothing to do? Well that speaks very badly for the game design. Back when my PS3 was working, I'd play what games I had over and over, even if I had unlocked everything. I guess there just isn't much reason to in this game.

[mpastor]

This is an MMO.  It's not just a first person shooter computer game.  Longevity is built into their business model unlike those games.  MMO's result in grind because the only other alternative is a massive amount of content released on a regular basis.  This is way too much to ask of these folks at this point.

[DoomFruit]

Cold is probably the first elemental mod you are going to get, and good thing too.  It can effectively double the output of your weapon and will give you bonus damage against both Grineer and Corpus.  If you don't have it reasonably early on, you should trade for it.  You dont need max to perform better.  I kept cold in my rifle against grineer until I finally picked up hvy caliber.

Trading is rank 2. A lot of the players I've seen stuck on Eurasia are rank 0 and 1. Rank 2 needs you to 30 a warframe, 2 weapons and then ten levels in a third. Not easy when you find it hard to kill things with unmodded guns.

 

Is this a serious question?  You start with 50 plat.  To buy a cold mod for your rifle would cost at most 1 plat.  However, that would even surprise me.  Any decent person would just give it to a new player.  That's the free to play guy.  Many people will spend some cash if they like the game.  All of this talk about new players and people seem to gloss over this point.   

So, you're either relying on charity from other players (and the ability to locate said players with an abundance of mods which they don't either merge or sell for credits) or someone spending money on a supposedly free game that beats them over the head with a massive difficulty wall on one level.

[Neutralred]

Do you even know what sort of damage either gun puts out? I really dont think so. The Braton almost doubles the DPS of the MK1.  It has higher DPS than the Burston which I mistakenly quoted above.  It has near the DPS of the Boltor but with four times the critical chance.  If you mod it with cold, it will outperform the Boltor against Grineer.  And it is a hitscan weapon.

 

This ignorance in the forums is what I am on about.  It is very clear to me why many of you struggle, it seems many of you are using the MK1 for too long.

Okay, firstly: it can be empirically proven that the DPS of the Strun and Braton are nowhere near the other two that you mentioned. Just go look at DPSFrame.com. The Braton has *half* of the DPS of the Burston against all factions, disregarding mods. And mods operate on base damage, so if the player actually has damage mods the difference will be astronomical. Boltor's close behind. Not to mention the Boltor's enormous damage type advantage against Grineer.

 

Secondly, railing at the ignorance on the forums when you post this:

 

Is this a serious question?  You start with 50 plat.  To buy a cold mod for your rifle would cost at most 1 plat.

Setting aside the fact that you apparently still haven't gotten it through your skull that players below MR2 can't trade... the starting platinum isn't tradeable. Go start a fresh account and try it. It's an obvious measure to keep players from accumulating plat through smurf accounts.

 

But go ahead, carry on with your attention-seeking. The more you post, the further it betrays your lack of knowledge.

[Lickity-Split]

Is this a serious question?  You start with 50 plat.  To buy a cold mod for your rifle would cost at most 1 plat.  However, that would even surprise me.  Any decent person would just give it to a new player.  That's the free to play guy.  Many people will spend some cash if they like the game.  All of this talk about new players and people seem to gloss over this point.   

This guy still at it...

Do you read what other people reply or do you just pick little segments out ?

Do you even English ?

 

You cant trade the starter platinum for one...

You cant trade till you're mastery rank 2...

You cant get to mastery rank 2 without leveling different weapons...

You cant get the resources for the new weapons unless carried to another planet...

 

Your entire argument so far is based on a player spending 100+ Hours on every node before Eurasia gathering resources and credits to make up the gear you are talking about and then getting a rare drop from a rare enemy on Venus.

Even after this that Mod isnt going to make a whole hell of a lot of difference.

 

So far all you've managed to prove to me is that you were ungratefully carried through the starter area and have no clue what youre talking about and furthermore dont want to take the 2min to look up what youre talking about on the wiki before posting a completely irrelevant argument which I have to admit if you havnt figured out is  wrong then youre incredibly dense...

 

 

FYI I started in a Loki... 

Good luck getting the mods you need for him in the early levels... Took me till 2 weeks ago to get Continuity.

[mpastor]

You dont have to take my word for it go here and see someone run a frame up to and do eurasia in 4 - 5hrs.  Make up your own mind.  Notice he is using a braton and has place one elemental  mod in his rifle build, as I suggest.  His is toxic based and not cold.  This of course is the second best choice.  

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/205873-derp-loki-a-newbie-experiment/

 

He tried to mimic the play style of an average to above average player.  

 

Note:  DPS against a faction?  You do realize that factions are made up of multiple types of units.  Your DPS against any type will vary radically (especially depending on your mods).  You don't realize this do you.  You really dont have any idea and think all units in a faction are the same.

[Lickity-Split]

You dont have to take my word for it go here and see someone run a frame up to and do eurasia in 4 - 5hrs.  Make up your own mind.  Notice he is using a braton and has place one elemental  mod in his rifle build, as I suggest.  His is toxic based and not cold.  This of course is the second best choice.  

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/205873-derp-loki-a-newbie-experiment/

 

He tried to mimic the play style of an average to above average player.  

 

Note:  DPS against a faction?  You do realize that factions are made up of multiple types of units.  Your DPS against any type will vary radically (especially depending on your mods).  You don't realize this do you.  You really dont have any idea and think all units in a faction are the same.

As Ninjaboy00 pointed out to him in that thread his experience betrays him.

While I admire what he done and I have done it aswel and had an absolute blast its no where near a "Newbie" experience.

 

He knew exactly where to look for everything he needed and has the added skill of a veteran player.

 

As for everyone else in that thread saying "Its easy" I have also stood on the tower in the middle with my Nova just casting MP and letting the noobs shoot 1 target each.

That makes it trivial yes.

 

Again I admire him for trying, but you can in no way compare someone who is running a Grandmaster title and Excalibur Prime meaning they have been with the game from the very start and know every little trick to someone who just started and is wondering how the hell to mod his gun or get a new weapon.

 

 

Edit - Also just noticed that the guy posting is RexSol... 

If you look for his posts on the forum you'll realize he knows his S#&$ better than most.

Edited April 4, 2014 by Lickity-Split

[mpastor]

As Ninjaboy00 pointed out to him in that thread his experience betrays him.

While I admire what he done and I have done it aswel and had an absolute blast its no where near a "Newbie" experience.

 

He knew exactly where to look for everything he needed and has the added skill of a veteran player.

 

As for everyone else in that thread saying "Its easy" I have also stood on the tower in the middle with my Nova just casting MP and letting the noobs shoot 1 target each.

That makes it trivial yes.

 

Again I admire him for trying, but you can in no way compare someone who is running a Grandmaster title and Excalibur Prime meaning they have been with the game from the very start and know every little trick to someone who just started and is wondering how the hell to mod his gun or get a new weapon.

 

 

Edit - Also just noticed that the guy posting is RexSol... 

If you look for his posts on the forum you'll realize he knows his S#&$ better than most.

 

Sure he is a good player.  But he is mimic'n what a typical new player might go through.  Outside of serration his mods don't look anything other than average or below average.  You don't need serration to kill six or seven guys a minute in that mission, and that is what it on average takes.  More important is positioning and having a decent primary weapon.  So, before you go here there,

 

1. Have a good weapon with at least one elemental.

2. Understand the map a bit or have good positional sense.

3. Pray that at least one other non-poor player joins.

 

I could see this map being a nightmare for solo noob players, but I don't see it as anything more than a fun challenge for average or above new players in a group.

Edited April 4, 2014 by mpastor

[Taranis49]

Sure he is a good player.  But he is mimic'n what a typical new player might go through.  Outside of serration his mods don't look anything other than average or below average.  You don't need serration to kill six or seven guys a minute in that mission, and that is what it on average takes.  More important is positioning and having a decent primary weapon.  So, before you go here there,

 

1. Have a good weapon with at least one elemental.

2. Understand the map a bit or have good positional sense.

3. Pray that at least one other non-poor player joins.

 

I could see this map being a nightmare for solo noob players, but I don't see it as anything more than a fun challenge for average or above new players in a group.

 

"6 or 7 guys a minute in that mission" is what it takes on average? Really? Ahem...

 

http://cloud-3.steampowered.com/ugc/450665965701526322/52B72FA80921007B9E2185E75A7C4A079A5D7626/ (because the site still has issues with certain image extensions, it seems).

 

From my last excursion carrying newbies through the first round of Eurasia - over 300 enemies total and that's pretty typical. Hint, the first round doesn't last 45 mins.

 

And I've covered this, even by his own admission, he needed to get carried through Voids and ODD to succeed, which is the whole point. i.e. he still needed charity from better-equipped players (Derelict keys require nanospores, which drop after Earth).

 

Even T1 Void has the standard mobs go up to level 18, (the leader variants go into the 20's), ODD starts at level 25. I said it there, I'll say it here: having to get carried through level 25 content to prepare for a level 6 - 8 mission to prove the newbie experience isn't bad - seems totally legit.

Edited April 4, 2014 by Taranis49

[Lickity-Split]

Sure he is a good player.  But he is mimic'n what a typical new player might go through.  Outside of serration his mods don't look anything other than average or below average.  You don't need serration to kill six or seven guys a minute in that mission, and that is what it on average takes.  More important is positioning and having a decent primary weapon.  So, before you go here there,

 

1. Have a good weapon with at least one elemental.

2. Understand the map a bit or have good positional sense.

3. Pray that at least one other non-poor player joins.

 

I could see this map being a nightmare for solo noob players, but I don't see it as anything more than a fun challenge for average or above new players in a group.

EXPERIENCE > GEAR

How difficult is it for you to understand that a Veteran masquerading as a Noob is not the same as a noob!

Unless someone hit RexSol on the head with a Piano before he started that new char its not even close to a "Newbie Experience"

(Nothing against you RexSol, youre a great guy and you talk sense from what I have seen)

 

Go look up on youtube Skill vs Gear.

You'll be surprised how Veterans of other games (WoW in particular, a game where Gear score is everything) tear things up wearing the weakest possible items...

Do you know why ?

Work it out...

 

As for your 1,2 & 3 rubbish its been explained to you countless times, in this thread... Problem is you're not reading what anyone is saying.

 

 

Im done replying to you now dude... You're going in circles...

You've turned this thread from something that was meant to help the new players into your own personal ego trip.

You refuse to read what others say and constantly make the same mistakes.

Your ignorance and lack of knowledge has been proved now on various occasions yet you insist on repeating the same things over and over.

Also I have this sneaky suspicion that you play CoD.

 

Face it, you were carried through your new player experience and have no idea what your talking about.

Edited April 4, 2014 by Lickity-Split

[mpastor]

"6 or 7 guys a minute in that mission" is what it takes on average? Really? Ahem...

 

http://cloud-3.steampowered.com/ugc/450665965701526322/52B72FA80921007B9E2185E75A7C4A079A5D7626/ (because the site still has issues with certain image extensions, it seems).

 

From my last excursion carrying newbies through the first round of Eurasia - over 300 enemies total and that's pretty typical. Hint, the first round doesn't last 45 mins.

 

And I've covered this, even by his own admission, he needed to get carried through Voids and ODD to succeed, which is the whole point. i.e. he still needed charity from better-equipped players (Derelict keys require nanospores, which drop after Earth).

 

Even T1 Void has the standard mobs go up to level 18, (the leader variants go into the 20's), ODD starts at level 25. I said it there, I'll say it here: having to get carried through level 25 content to prepare for a level 6 - 8 mission to prove the newbie experience isn't bad - seems totally legit.

 

Your misrepresent what he did, harp on little things, and in general try to skew the information.  Your image is a bit funny, and typical of guys like you.  First off,.. nobody knows what it refers to.  Second, let's assume we are looking at the same quest.  How do we have any idea where or how those kills were made.  HOw can you spend all of that time critiquing him and then post something so ambiguous yourself?  It's laughably hypocritical.  

 

Sorry bud.  YOur comments and image there would not stand up in court.  IN fact, they would be inadmissible.  Put some thought into what he did instead of acting like a stubborn jealous little boy.  Have a bit of respect and admit your defeat with some dignity.

 

ONe last thought... a large number of deaths occurred in his game after the mission was a success.  Some before, these get counted in the final mix too and don't play a big factor in success or failure.