Royce_Bracket Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Disclaimer=I use the collector/completionist terms loosely here. I hope none of you get offended or w/e, it's just a word that I am using to describe a tendency or style of play. I have found that one of the most confusing things about Warframe is that there are so many people furiously complaining about exclusives and whatnot. What I am going to say here, is that exclusives aren't inherently bad (Sometimes, they can be, but that's another argument for another day.). The thing that makes them so touchy here, is the general mindset of the community. We all know that the vast majority of gaming communities have their own unique flavor, depending on the nature of the game, and the kinds of players that are attracted to them. In the same way pasta lovers tend to eat at restaurants that serve good pasta, or seafood lovers tend to eat at restaurants that serve good seafood, the various gamer archetypes congregate in various communities depending on what they like (Common sense, I know, but just clarifying.) That brings me to my main point. Warframe is a game that caters heavily to the "collector" or "completionist" archetype. While it does contain much fast paced action, a good chunk of the entertainment value comes from crafting a large variety of different weapons, and watching your arsenal/codex grow. Just look at you (Maybe) and me, or anyone else who has stayed with Warframe as their main game for a significant amount of time, and all those people that craft and level weapons purely for Mastery Rank. Rather than playing the game mostly for the action (Which can get repetitive and stale quite fast), we play to craft that shiny new Prime, and to reach that shiny new Mastery Rank. Do you enjoy playing through multiple Void missions over and over for fun, or do you enjoy obtaining the item that eventually comes from doing those Void missions? Over time, as most of the people who stay are collectors, the general community starts leaning closer to that archetype. Now, what is a large thorn in the side of collectors? The answer is simple: exclusives. Determined enough completionists will obtain anything and everything possible given the chance. Those of you who are willing to trawl through hundreds of Void Keys for that Prime or pay thousands of Platinum for Primed Chamber are walking proof of that. However, no matter how hard anyone tries, they will never, ever, be able to obtain something that is exclusive, whose time of obtainment has passed. As the main mindset of the stereotypical completionist is to obtain "everything", that can be a big problem. The issue is magnified by the composition of our community as it has matured over time, hence why exclusives as a large problem has only appeared and proliferated on these forums some time after the game went into open beta. I have played plenty of very different games where exclusives, even fairly game breaking ones, weren't nearly as big deals, and I am sure that many of you guys out there have too. For a grossly oversimplified example, take a person who might or might not like pasta. If his/her favorite type of pasta at a restaurant became unavailable, the impact it would make would depend on how much that person loves aforementioned pasta. For a person that dislikes pasta, this isn't an issue at all. For someone who really loves pasta, it can be a pretty bad thing. Our community is affected by exclusives in a similar way. Someone who doesn't care about wanting everything wouldn't care nearly as much about exclusive items. Someone who does care, on the other hand, would constantly desire these exclusives, and be frustrated by how they are out of grasp. So, did I get it right, or is this community just really weird with anything pertaining to exclusives? This observation comes purely through personal observation and experience, and I realize that there are multiple holes in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeAura Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 I'm not entirely sure if true, I think I'll still remain a little sceptical. But I can't think of anything to disagree with your hypothesis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboDoge Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 About Founders, nothing will bring them back. People can be hoarders as much as they want, but they also need to accept that some items are out their reach. Nothing will change that. As much as i would like to have all weapons at max level, i am accepting that i didnt bought Founder pack, Prime Access 1 or 2. But i was lucky enough to participate in every event possible so i have weapons and shiny from them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaboomonme Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) This post is just a doormat to invite flaming. But it's completely true!The day Excalibur Prime becomes tradable though...(IMO Disney Vaults aren't even needed if exclusives become tradable, DE may even generate more revenue from people buying plat just to trade for exclusives.Then again, Disney Vault effectively allows them to recycle content, so it's a hard to say which is the better option..) Edited April 8, 2014 by kaboomonme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaftMeat Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 "Fantasies have to be unrealistic because the moment, the second that you get what you seek, you don't, you can't want it anymore. In order to continue to exist, desire must have its objects perpetually absent. It's not the "it" that you want, it's the fantasy of "it." So, desire supports crazy fantasies. This is what Pascal means when he says that we are only truly happy when daydreaming about future happiness. Or why we say the hunt is sweeter than the kill. Or be careful what you wish for. Not because you'll get it, but because you're doomed not to want it once you do. So the lesson of Lacan is, living by your wants will never make you happy. What it means to be fully human is to strive to live by ideas and ideals and not to measure your life by what you've attained in terms of your desires but those small moments of integrity, compassion, rationality, even self-sacrifice. Because in the end, the only way that we can measure the significance of our own lives is by valuing the lives of others." The Life of David Gale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tun3X Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) Too much writing (-_-) my head hurts from reading all day. Edited April 8, 2014 by Tun3X Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoid25 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Way too long for me to even care about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royce_Bracket Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share Posted April 8, 2014 (Sorry, quote system refuses to work for me on this craptop) @DaftMeat=That is one extremely interesting quote. @Tun and Zoid=Why did you even post... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erelas Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Up-voted this, mainly due to the fact that I myself am a big fan of making things exclusive, or in the case of Warframe, unique. Games need to have items that are unobtainable, thus why I'm a big fan of those items that are as such. (E.g. Excaliber Prime [which I myself due to a fluke of transaction via Steam don't own]). The idea here is that by making something unique it gives a nod to players that have stuck with the game for a while, been here since release, or worked hard to get something that shouldn't be floating around nilly-willy throughout the solar system on every Tenno out there. Giving unique items makes a sense of ownership and pride for those that are able to get such items. For those that haven't it may be a source of discontent, but their time will come too should they stick it out. When games break down and cater to every whiner out there is when the game gets dummed down and no longer provides the intriguing content that made it worthwhile to invest in in the first place.~Tenno out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angius Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 "I WANT IT!" attitude basically. God, I hate people that are demanding everything, even things they can not get. They're like 5yo chilren crying in the store "Mommy, mommy, by me this! I WANT IT" That said, I think the best solution will be to remove exclusives from the Codex. Now the "collectionists" will be able to see all of the weapons/frames marked and maybe they'll stop whining finally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tun3X Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) (Sorry, quote system refuses to work for me on this craptop) @DaftMeat=That is one extremely interesting quote. @Tun and Zoid=Why did you even post... Cuz i am bored. And i just had 2 say something. Sorry if i offended u in some way or something but that was my way of saying make it shorter cuz i read half of it and then u no what happened. Edited April 8, 2014 by Tun3X Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angius Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Cuz i am bored. And i just had 2 say something. Oh, I remember you, you are the guy that everything is "2 hard 2 read" for... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taiiat Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 this theory sounds plausible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tun3X Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Oh, I remember you, you are the guy that everything is "2 hard 2 read" for... Yes i hate reading specially during my free time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TunaMayo Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 For the majority of players who want exclusives released, it's simply, "I must have them all" attitude. Bearing in mind which itema are actually exclusive, it would most probably be a "mastery and dump" job for all apart from a few. For founders, it's more a small symbol that we were part of funding this game and letting others know we supported it. From my point of view, the exclusives mean something to the founders, and would mean very little to the collectors. As someone previously mentioned, it might be wise to remove the exclusives from the codex of those without them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VoidPunch Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 I didn't read because I don't know why it's a "theory" but I will say that making an exclusive nonexclusive anymore takes any for it's worth and people like to have things of value. It's human nature. Or If something was promised to be exclusive and the Devs release it again, then the trust for the Devs' word will go down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loswaith Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) Well your analogy is a bit off, for a lot of people their favorite pasta wasnt on the menu when they started going to that restaurant, but they found out it was on the menu previously (or they just didnt order it). You cant then expect them to put it back on the menu just for you. In essence, the pasta in this reference is the founders exclusives/ retired gear. The collecters just have to learn to live with that they wont get the founders/retired stuff, just like others that start playing warframe after them may not get stuff they have themselves. They may get lucky and prehaps DE will add them to the trading pool, but like all exclusives after the fact they will be paying a premium. At the end of the day it is all just some digital goods that no one will have after the game has played out its life for that individual (or everyone, which hopefully wont happen for a while). Edited April 8, 2014 by Loswaith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angius Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Yes i hate reading specially during my free time. You must have a truly sad life. No books, no ability to read longer sentences, nowhere to find out how to write properly... Besides, if all you have to say is "2long 4me 2read", don't bother answering in the topic. Just a little tip for the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboDoge Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 You must have a truly sad life. No books, no ability to read longer sentences, nowhere to find out how to write properly... Besides, if all you have to say is "2long 4me 2read", don't bother answering in the topic. Just a little tip for the future. People tend to use number in place of some letters, and i also never found that amusing. How hard is to write whole sentences? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shehriazad Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) Anyway...any gaming community will be sensitive about exclusives suddenly becoming non-exclusive.There is a number of games that made exclusives non exclusive after promising it. What happens is always the same....the company will be terribly sorry and try to offer some cheap ingame reimbursement.Quite a few will be too &!$$ed and demand a monetary refund.A small part of the playerbase will be driven away eventually.Even a really big game did this. (A certain League....of...Legendary....things....) They made event exclusive skins available to everyone again. The amount of refunds they had to issue was huge.Many mmos did the same....It never ends good...why?Because you essentially betray the trust of anyone that buys stuff with "exclusivity" BEING A PART OF THE DEAL. Look at the WF deal...some people spent over 100 bucks to get exclusive gear.Now tell those people that now everyone will be able to have this again.A small part won't care A bigger part will be angry Another part will be very angryThe last part will be demanding refunds/reimbursements (which quite frankly is their right, no ToS can allow to break a deal with exclusivity for money.)On the other side all the people coming too late for the offer will get to buy it...great for them.... but you insult the core gamers that were there first.It's a bit like going to a Ferrari retailer and demanding that they give you a limited Edition glow in the dark Ferrari that isn't built anymore...and they actually build it for you.While that is great for the guy...it totally destroys the value of the original ones' and messes up the trust that the company had built up. Edited April 8, 2014 by Shehriazad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ensignvidiot Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 the founder pack should NEVER make a comeback with any other exclusives (such as the Lato Vandal, which i will never get). The reason i have for this is simple: Fraud. DE would immediately be guilty of business fraud because they themselves have stated that the rewards available from the founder packs will NEVER be available again. It was a contract of sorts, between DE and each person with a badge. If you look at it that way, if DE breaches said contract, they can be held financially and legally accountable for that descision. Now, I DO think that PS4 players should be allowed to get SOMETHING that shows that they are pioneers for the PS4... but that will cause disparity and striff in the PC vs PS4 community. Should they get something? Yes. Is this an easy thing to resolve? Oh &^$% *&^%ing No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tun3X Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) You must have a truly sad life. No books, no ability to read longer sentences, nowhere to find out how to write properly... Besides, if all you have to say is "2long 4me 2read", don't bother answering in the topic. Just a little tip for the future. Lol did u read the part where i said "During My Free Time". Unlike u who has like 3655 posts i have other stuff to do during my free time, i have limited amount of time 2 stay on the pc. Called having a LIFE. Go to school at 7am and come back at 6pm 2much work..... Edited April 8, 2014 by Tun3X Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaboomonme Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Lol did u read the part where i said "During My Free Time". Unlike u who has like 3655 posts i have other stuff to do during my free time, i have limited amount of time 2 stay on the pc. Called having a LIFE. Whoa whoa... easy there fella. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ensignvidiot Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) Lol did u read the part where i said "During My Free Time". Unlike u who has like 3655 posts i have other stuff to do during my free time, i have limited amount of time 2 stay on the pc I THINK its trying to communicate to us. I will attempt the Univsersal greeting to see if we can speak to this creature. "Bah-weep-graaaaagnah wheep nini bong" Still, you should read a book, or at least embrace a concept such as the paradox of knowledge (which is my favorite by far). At any rate. FRAUD BAD. LEGAL STUFF BAD. GAME GOOD, NO LEGAL STUFF GOOD! Edited April 8, 2014 by ensignvidiot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tun3X Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 (edited) I THINK its trying to communicate to us. I will attempt the Univsersal greeting to see if we can speak to this creature. "Bah-weep-graaaaagnah wheep nini bong" Still, you should read a book, or at least embrace a concept such as the paradox of knowledge (which is my favorite by far). At any rate. FRAUD BAD. LEGAL STUFF BAD. GAME GOOD, NO LEGAL STUFF GOOD! What i am trying to say is it doesn't matter how i talk in a game or online. And this way i can increase my post :D so ty guys so the next time i want 2 get more post u can help me out again. Big numbers look better want 696969 Edited April 8, 2014 by Tun3X Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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