On Combo Attacks

[sinsinkun]

After hours of grinding, I finally managed to get my hands on some stances I could actually equip.

Now I have actual feedback I can give about it.

 

I got my hands on shimmering blight, and quickly equipped it on my orthos prime to test the waters. The waters were cold and unforgiving. For one thing, the amount of time you're allowed to "rest" between clicks is absurdly small. Like, 1/10th's of a second. Could it be intentional? Perhaps. Perhaps DE wants us to be quick on the draw. Fine, I can accept that.

What I cannot accept is that the buttons have to be pressed before the previous attack animation has finished. That is not okay. I have never, in my life, experienced such a discontinuous flow. It's like an inherent lag in the system that you just have to deal with. How do I know I wasn't actually lagging? See above. If you wanted timing to be an aspect of your melee system, THIS IS NOT HOW YOU DO IT. You CANNOT disjoint pressing the key and seeing the animation. This completely breaks any sense of control you might have over the attack - in fact, it feels more like an invisible QTE that has to be completed before the animation takes place... But it's even more disjointed than that, because it starts right as you click in that first attack!

 

DE, please, increase the amount of time you have between strikes to continue a combo. The current system just feels disjointed. Your input doesn't match with the output.

 

[Skynin]

I have the same issue with Clashing Forest. It's so confusing, right?
Well, i'm sure that this feedback will be seen, and issue fixed.

[JuicyPop]

Having one key for a combo system is beyond bonkers. No more needs to be said.

[Repligon]

Yeah. Dealy system is completely broken. The worst is that it's scales with speed mods. We need something like DMC's 1 second windows. Or better 2 button system.

[Axterix13]

So far, when trying combos, I haven't noticed any different from normal melee.  Which means I'm probably doing them wrong.  But, well, they say to hit E repeatedly, and that's what I'm doing.

 

System definitely needs some improvement.  Maybe even a UI element.

[Kaidinah]

Yeah, I have yet to see anything different from my current melee with a Stance equipped.

 

Any idea what a down arrow + E is supposed to be? I know it can't be "hold E" because "hold E" exists elsewhere.

[Repligon]

Yeah, I have yet to see anything different from my current melee with a Stance equipped.

 

Any idea what a down arrow + E is supposed to be? I know it can't be "hold E" because "hold E" exists elsewhere.

Arrow down is move backward button. Unfortunately you will have to turn on "camera controlls melee direction" option to use this combo.

Edited April 11, 2014 by Repligon

[LGear]

Arrow down is move backward button. Unfortunately you will have to turn on "camera controlls melee direction" option to use this combo.

 

Actually, you can use this combo without enabling said option. Your attack camera takes priority when using Melee attack, so you can press back as the third strike ends to initiate the combo.

 

Or you can do like I do, and hold backward first then melee attack, the combo engages as normal.

[MechaTails]

What? Pressing the button to combo while the previous attack is still happening is exactly how it's done in the Batman games, and everyone loves them. Warframe combos are performed similarly.

 

And anyway, you can get used to anything, just keep practicing, trying different timing. You definitely have more than enough time between presses, I just time the next press a little before the attack ends and it works fine, not sure how very fast weapons are affected though.

Edited April 13, 2014 by DarkTails

[Duk282]

Because of this I have noticed that stances with a double attack (E,E, etc) as opposed to triple or quad combo (E, E, E, etc or E, E, E, E, etc) openers are much easier to pull off. The system will queue up two button press so you can just hit E twice (with no timing) then pause then hit the next command. Longer openers require you to try to watch the animation but there is a minute lag in key press to animation. 

[sinsinkun]

Because of this I have noticed that stances with a double attack (E,E, etc) as opposed to triple or quad combo (E, E, E, etc or E, E, E, E, etc) openers are much easier to pull off. The system will queue up two button press so you can just hit E twice (with no timing) then pause then hit the next command. Longer openers require you to try to watch the animation but there is a minute lag in key press to animation. 

 

yes, this is what i'm finding as well... It should really be that you have to press right as the animation ends, or within a small window, not before the animation ends. The half a second before an animation ends that you have to press the button really messes with me :/

 

What? Pressing the button to combo while the previous attack is still happening is exactly how it's done in the Batman games, and everyone loves them. Warframe combos are performed similarly.

 

And anyway, you can get used to anything, just keep practicing, trying different timing. You definitely have more than enough time between presses, I just time the next press a little before the attack ends and it works fine, not sure how very fast weapons are affected though.

 

No, the batman games have you press the button AS the animation ends, which is half a second after when warframe wants you to do it.

Yes, I can get used to them, but it just seems so awkward when you start off :/ it really varies with weapon speed as well, so you have to re-learn for every weapon, and with each level of fury you put on it.

 

I just think it would be easier to learn (and to switch out weapons when you fancied it) if the button press window was more aligned with the animation sequences.

[MechaTails]

If the timing isn't the same, then why am I comboing in this game almost exactly like in the Batman games?

[sinsinkun]

If the timing isn't the same, then why am I comboing in this game almost exactly like in the Batman games?

probably because the batman games have shorter animations =P

[MechaTails]

nnaaahhhh lol

 

I just played a Batman game, there are moves in there that take longer to complete (like counters), and they all work fine when I press the button right before an animation ends, same as Warframe. The varying animations in the Bat games also require you to pay attention so you press the button at the right time... just like Warframe.

 

It still took me a few minutes to figure out the timing for this game though, but once I did there was an AHA! moment and now all the other combos are easier to perform.

 

The timing for the Bat game combos does seem a little more forgiving, but could just be my imagination exaggerating things.

Edited April 13, 2014 by DarkTails

[Ketec]

90% of the times i never use a combo - if i can barely even get some done in peace - then doing that with 10 napalms around just wont work.

 

The pause ones are somewhat doable. But i havent been able to get any combo that needs hold  to work. Be it some lag or ultrafine timing issue...

 

On top of that the directional key combos are the worst. U don't stand in one spot and melee. ur always moving around.

 

 

 

Iv simply just used standard melee spam - with barely any visual queue and badly timed combos its just too frustrating to use.

[LunarWind]

I use Shimmering Blight constantly.

I love it, even though it is a 'simple' stance with only one combo.

 

Try Tanquil Cleave, now that is a fun stance!

3 different combos with 3 different operational changes, and after about 4 missions I can effectively chain them together depending on what enemies/how many there are around me.

I love the melee combo system, only using one button + modifiers like pauses/holding is great in my opinion because my other fingers can be manipulating movement/slide/ability keys instead of trying to hit the 2nd or 3rd attack keys.

[sinsinkun]

nnaaahhhh lol

 

I just played a Batman game, there are moves in there that take longer to complete (like counters), and they all work fine when I press the button right before an animation ends, same as Warframe. The varying animations in the Bat games also require you to pay attention so you press the button at the right time... just like Warframe.

 

It still took me a few minutes to figure out the timing for this game though, but once I did there was an AHA! moment and now all the other combos are easier to perform.

 

The timing for the Bat game combos does seem a little more forgiving, but could just be my imagination exaggerating things.

I definitely think the time window is more forgiving, I am almost certain you are still allowed to continue your combo just slightly after the animation ends (batman just kind of freezes in the final frame, and you have a small window of extra time), but then again I haven't played arkham city in a long time xD

 

Regardless though, I believe that the timing on warframe is just a little too difficult, and when you throw in pauses and holds (on top of latency issues that wf is prone to), its just too damn difficult to do the combo you want in the heat of battle.

 

 

90% of the times i never use a combo - if i can barely even get some done in peace - then doing that with 10 napalms around just wont work.

 

The pause ones are somewhat doable. But i havent been able to get any combo that needs hold  to work. Be it some lag or ultrafine timing issue...

 

On top of that the directional key combos are the worst. U don't stand in one spot and melee. ur always moving around.

 

 

 

Iv simply just used standard melee spam - with barely any visual queue and badly timed combos its just too frustrating to use.

 

My sentiments. The hold ones are really difficult to perform while in combat, I can only SOMETIMES pull it off outside of battle... I mostly fall back on pause combos as well. There's also the ones where you are required to press right and left at the same time, but my brain says "right THEN left!" and I end up doing a pause combo instead :| 

 

 

I use Shimmering Blight constantly.

I love it, even though it is a 'simple' stance with only one combo.

 

Try Tanquil Cleave, now that is a fun stance!

3 different combos with 3 different operational changes, and after about 4 missions I can effectively chain them together depending on what enemies/how many there are around me.

I love the melee combo system, only using one button + modifiers like pauses/holding is great in my opinion because my other fingers can be manipulating movement/slide/ability keys instead of trying to hit the 2nd or 3rd attack keys.

 

Yes, tranquil cleave is quite fun. I hope all the other stances get "buffed" to have the same amount of variety that tranquil cleave does, but then again, I can only ever pull off 1/3 in battle, unless I really really focus (on the attack, instead of the enemy) xD

 

I actually think the block button should be used more often, almost like a secondary attack button. This would open up a much larger range of combos, and doesnt really detract from attacking (since you cant block while doing a combo anyways).

Edited April 14, 2014 by sinsinkun

[Lord_of_Lords]

The left + right combos are awful and should be changed immediately.  I can't use them with my controller on my pc.

 

I also have a hard time getting the hold combos working on fast weapons.  Using Berserker doesn't help either.