The Best And Worse Of Melee 2.0 In 7 Seconds...

[BritishBob]

 

Now here comes the text... There is a TL;DR.

 

So that was a 148k+ charged crit on Phorid killing him in a single pass... Now this is epic, however it's also the problem. It's too easy.

 

"That was only a level 19!" I hear you cry... Ok then;

 

http://youtu.be/M2gri2SgTpc

 

That was a hit Ambulas on for apox 49k. Again, killing him instantly. It's so  cool that I can hit these massive numbers. But now what... Again this was too easy.

 

Onto the void. (No images or vids here) In the void I have no shields or HP, so invisibility is life. That means no/very few charged attacks. Charged attacks drain energy and this means I cannot permanently go invisible, this leads to a squishy end. Running around a T3 mobile defence mission, with no charge, results in average hits of 1k-2k with crits of 5k-10k.

 

So it's great fun chopping everything to pieces, but it seems far too easy.

 

For comparison the Boltor Prome is hitting 300 and critting for 2.1k in this vid from mugamu:

 

 

How to fix this... Personally I think the easy fix is to lower the stealth damage from 400% to 200%. This should drop normal hits down to 500-1k and crits to 2.5k-5k. More reasonable numbers.

 

"But your using the most extreame case!" I hear you utter... Well an unranked dark dagger vs lvl 5 Greneer was hitting over 70 stealthed and over 100 charged. 

 

While I feel melee needs to be more powerfull than bullets to justify bringing a knife to a gun fight, with stealth and charge it feels like it's just too much. While on the one hand I want to use melee and Loki, I don't want to have to handicap myself to make it feel fair.

 

tl;dr

Nerf stealth multi from 400% to 200%.

 

 

Feel free to disagree with me, I will be interested in reading other people views in the comments.

Edited April 12, 2014 by BritishBob

[BrotherIcarus]

This is why the damage multiplier from being invisible needs to be removed, DE said this in a live stream and they new it would be utterly broken but they listened to the community who wanted it to stay and now we have this.

[BritishBob]

This is why the damage multiplier from being invisible needs to be removed, DE said this in a live stream and they new it would be utterly broken but they listened to the community who wanted it to stay and now we have this.

 

 

I'm not saying it should be removed... But it's too much. It is nice to have a frames than can be dedicated to melee with stealth as it's awesomely fun, but it does seem broken. 

 

Edit - Also the stealth bonus would promote the use of melee. The mobility, extra damage and safety stealth provides is a large incentive to use pure melee.

Edited April 12, 2014 by BritishBob

[WhiteCopain]

Stealth damage is pretty absurd considering how spammable it is. But Loki players will never agree with you that god mode and 4x damage isn't balanced.

[BrotherIcarus]

I'm not saying it's bad... But it's too much. It is nice to have a frames than can be dedicated to melee with stealth as it's awesomely fun, but it does seem broken. 

Well if they did remove the multiplier from stealth it would still be powerful with melee just not utterly broken.

[immolator1001]

mind posting your build?

[BritishBob]

Stealth damage is pretty absurd considering how spammable it is. But Loki players will never agree with you that god mode and 4x damage isn't balanced.

 

 

The thing is I love it. But I love it for all the wrong reasons and that just makes me feel bad.

 

 

mind posting your build?

 

 

I'd rather not as I don't want to see it being spammed everywhere. That would just get obnoxious. 

Edited April 12, 2014 by BritishBob

[Davoodoo]

I'm not saying it should be removed... But it's too much. It is nice to have a frames than can be dedicated to melee with stealth as it's awesomely fun, but it does seem broken. 

 

Edit - Also the stealth bonus would promote the use of melee. The mobility, extra damage and safety stealth provides is a large incentive to use pure melee.

How about giving stealth channeling dmg bonus and effects without actually using channeling, of course these 2 couldnt stack. Gives it some incentive and doesnt make it horribly op.

[SquirmyBurrito]

As a Loki player my heart screams in protest. But for balance's sake, I'd have to agree with it being reduced to 200%. 

[immolator1001]

 

I'd rather not as I don't want to see it being spammed everywhere. That would just get obnoxious. 

Well that didn't stop me from making it.... http://goo.gl/KxR69G You should be doing about 70k before the stealth bonus and after around 280k

[BritishBob]

How about giving stealth channeling dmg bonus and effects without actually using channeling, of course these 2 couldnt stack. Gives it some incentive and doesnt make it horribly op.

 

 

That could work, but I do like the optional boost you get from channelling while under stealth. If you made stealth the same as channeling, then you could remove the channel mod and add more damage mods as loki=perma stealth.

 

But then I don't have to watch how/when I channel. It becomes an either or and each becomes situational. I, personally, would ignore channeling completely and I think that would be a waste of a useful and cool mechanic.

[BritishBob]

Well that didn't stop me from making it.... http://goo.gl/KxR69G You should be doing about 70k before the stealth bonus and after around 280k

Clearly didn't get the point... I didn't want those who didn't know how to build it, building it... I don't have the second channel mod and the second damage mod.

This was hitting 109k:

http://i.imgur.com/NSOUECO.png

This hit 150k:

http://i.imgur.com/n2LrFVi.png

Edit-

This thing is I wouldn't do anything to channeling and I wouldn't do anything to the weapons. So that just leaves the stealth. But the stealth is why melee only works so well, so it's got to be the damage on the stealth. Remove all of the damage and guns become better again. So it's got to have a reduction rather than a removal on the damage side.

 

 

Edit2- I imagine these are going to be all over PVP now...

 

Edit 3.0- Also how scary is that... 150k on a build that isn't even min/max yet..

Edited April 12, 2014 by BritishBob

[immolator1001]

Clearly didn't get the point... I didn't want those who didn't know how to build it, building it... I don't have the second channel mod and the second damage mod.

This was hitting 109k:

http://i.imgur.com/NSOUECO.png

This hit 150k:

http://i.imgur.com/n2LrFVi.png

Edit-

This thing is I wouldn't do anything to channeling and I wouldn't do anything to the weapons. So that just leaves the stealth. But the stealth is why melee only works so well, so it's got to be the damage on the stealth. Remove all of the damage and guns become better again. So it's got to have a reduction rather than a removal on the damage side.

 

 

Edit- I imagine these are going to be all over PVP now...

Eh people could have figured it out on their own, and those numbers don't really seem to add up.

 

As for pvp who cares it was never balanced to begin with.

[RejectionOfFate]

Keep in mind, the multiplier changes. 200% For the Invisibility, but the enemy is aware. 400% for Invisibility when enemies are unaware.

Either way, I'm fine.

[BritishBob]

Keep in mind, the multiplier changes. 200% For the Invisibility, but the enemy is aware. 400% for Invisibility when enemies are unaware.

Either way, I'm fine.

 

 

From the wiki:

As of U11, it appears that regular, charge and finisher attacks have a 400% stealth damage multiplier.

 

Now that we have replaced charge attacks with channelled ones I assume channelled attacks work as charged ones, giving it the full 400%.

 

As far as I know, you start boss fights with them being aware of you from the cut-scene onwards.

Edited April 12, 2014 by BritishBob

[BritishBob]

Well that didn't stop me from making it.... http://goo.gl/KxR69G You should be doing about 70k before the stealth bonus and after around 280k

 

 

 

I can confirm this. 25k under, but this was with jagged edge rather than the channelling mod.