How You Feel About Nerfs?

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

 

Why can't we just buff everything to become overpowered so nothing is under powered and be happy?

 

That, is stupid.

[Azawarau]

did you read where I said "most"? 

Basically "most" nerf had more people complain than "most" buff thread. You can go to warframe abilities thread and read all of it. btw, do anyone even make a thread call "Nova's buff?" I also stated that: "If the buff is reasonable" 

Buff nekros and vaubro and rhino and loki and rhino prime since theyre all at the top of the list too?

 

Any of those receiving a buff would have the same result

 

Buff or nerf there are going to be complaints and there are going to be people who want it

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

I feel like nerfs just pass through while buffs are not very effective. They nerfed Frosts sphere because it was op but forgot to buff him. His bugged ultimate was freaking awesome but nooo they had to remove it.

 

As for nova and Trinity, i dont see anything wrong with nova, her ultimate doesnt do S#&$ at high levels except making enemies take increased damage from you. Maybe her 2. skill is a bit op but anyway she didnt need a nerf imo.

 

Trinity was just plain broken. Link, blessing + ogris penta pretty much lets you sit in one place while annihalating everything without moving a single meter. It was just ridiculous but i hope when they nerf her they give her something fun instead of god mod.

 

And for the love of god remove her skirt.

 

 

Nova, Mp could stand to lose the chain explosion damage, the enemy still explodes, because the visual looks good, but no/ significantly reduced damage. That's the thing that makes her so stupidly powerful at any lvl below 30, big AoE chain explosions. The actual 200% damage buff and 50% debuff to movement and damage, I'm actually okay with that. It keeps her in the game at higher lvls. That said, if something like that happens, MP should be moved to her 2nd power and AMD shifted to 4th. 

 

Frost yeah, SG is good a it is now, but his other powers lag behind badly. Shame as I like the concept of Frost. 

 

Trinity, I agree. Her powers in their current form need to be scrapped and reworked from the ground up. Blessing is game breakingly OP, Link is okay but not with blessing, and Energy Vampire and Well of Life really need a re work; there's no point in using them at the moment when Blessing gives 30 seconds of God mode.

[FuzzyRamen]

That, is stupid.

Go try 1 hour Survival run then come back and tell me how weak you feel. Start from Pluto, don't do Mercury. Edited April 26, 2014 by fuzzyramen

[Goosmo]

Its not a Nerf...  its Balancing :3

The lato nerf wasn't really balancing.

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

Go try 1 hour Survival run then come back and tell me how weak you feel. Start from Pluto, don't do Mercury.

 

So you need a broken power to do 1 hour survival. Clearly you're not as good as you thought you were.

[FuzzyRamen]

So you need a broken power to do 1 hour survival. Clearly you're not as good as you thought you were.

Don't need to be good, just need to be effective.

[Legion-Shields]

I hate nerfs. They kill games. Look at ME3! The MP sucks. I like to feel like a boss in the game. I don't want to feel like a weakling.

you obviously dont know how to play that game. Edited April 27, 2014 by Legion-Shields

[luanle21]

How do I feel about nerfs?

I feel if they are necessary, then they should happen. Same with buffs, and reworks.

If we need it, let it be so.

but ur missing 2 thing

DO IT RIGHT

and DONT BE LAZY

Edited April 27, 2014 by luanle21

[Shin]

Nova, Mp could stand to lose the chain explosion damage, the enemy still explodes, because the visual looks good, but no/ significantly reduced damage. That's the thing that makes her so stupidly powerful at any lvl below 30, big AoE chain explosions. The actual 200% damage buff and 50% debuff to movement and damage, I'm actually okay with that. It keeps her in the game at higher lvls. That said, if something like that happens, MP should be moved to her 2nd power and AMD shifted to 4th.

Reasons you counted doesnt make any sense to be honest. Mobs below 30 can be murdered by anything including the most trashies weapons. Now im not a nova fan or anything but if they reduce her damage its going to be an disappointing warframe. Sure you can dish out tons of damage with her 2. power but ultimates are meant to be powerful.

 

Honestly everyone who cries about her ultimate are the people who only stays in below 30 pub. Those levels are nothing. If you want a challange go beyond 50wave in T3 Def or something. Nova cant blow up everything there. Just like every warframe

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

Reasons you counted doesnt make any sense to be honest. Mobs below 30 can be murdered by anything including the most trashies weapons. Now im not a nova fan or anything but if they reduce her damage its going to be an disappointing warframe. Sure you can dish out tons of damage with her 2. power but ultimates are meant to be powerful.

 

Honestly everyone who cries about her ultimate are the people who only stays in below 30 pub. Those levels are nothing. If you want a challange go beyond 50wave in T3 Def or something. Nova cant blow up everything there. Just like every warframe

 

So your aversion to stripping out the MP chain explosion or reduced damage on AoE explosions is what exactly? It does very little at high lvls, when it's used almost exclusively for the 200% damage and 50% debuff, while it makes it stupidly powerful and generally a bore to play with any Nova in lvl 30 and below content. 

 

Or is your point because things are easy to play under lvl 30 we should leave daft powers like MP in their current state?

 

It's not the 200% damage that makes it a problem, it's the combination of AoE damage and a 50% slow which lets Nova oneshot an entire spawn. Given that damage powers are poor in high lvl content and she already has AMD, why would you want another AoE damage power, when you could have a cheap 200% buff and 50% debuff for 50 energy?

Edited April 27, 2014 by (PS4)billy-d-squid

[FuzzyRamen]

So your aversion to stripping out the MP chain explosion or reduced damage on AoE explosions is what exactly? It does very little at high lvls, when it's used almost exclusively for the 200% damage and 50% debuff, while it makes it stupidly powerful and generally a bore to play with any Nova in lvl 30 and below content. 

 

Or is your point because things are easy to play under lvl 30 we should leave daft powers like MP in their current state?

 

It's not the 200% damage that makes it a problem, it's the combination of AoE damage and a 50% slow which lets Nova oneshot an entire spawn. Given that damage powers are poor in high lvl content and she already has AMD, why would you want another AoE damage power, when you could have a cheap 200% buff and 50% debuff for 50 energy?

 

Depends on the spawn, if you have 20 Grineer Gunners, MOA Drones, or even Toxic Ancients running at you. Dropping a MP with no slow can just take you out before you even finish the cast time because there is no backbone to the warframe if there is no reason to use it if all I can do is increase damage towards the enemies.

[Morec0]

I don't mind nerfs, I do feel as though they should have more foam bullets per package though.

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

Depends on the spawn, if you have 20 Grineer Gunners, MOA Drones, or even Toxic Ancients running at you. Dropping a MP with no slow can just take you out before you even finish the cast time because there is no backbone to the warframe if there is no reason to use it if all I can do is increase damage towards the enemies.

 

I don't mind the 50% debuff, I don't mind the 200% damage buff. Those should both stay. What I don't like is the AoE damage caused by chain explosions working in combination with it. The AoE explosions make the power stupidly OP below lvl 30, but don't scratch enemies at lvl 50. Hence my dislike of a power which is fundamentally unbalanced because it contains too many elements in one power. 

 

Frames like Ember require at least to get up close to deal significant damage with WoF, the max damage is limited to a 15m radius approximately. MP's large AoE combined with the chain explosion can wipe out an entire spawn, with 1 shot, but only at low lvls (probably why MP spammers are so maligned when they enter lvl >30 games or defence waves. 

 

What I'd prefer is MP being bumped down to her second power costing 50 energy, keep the 200% damage buff and 50% slow, but strip out the AoE explosion damage or reduce it. AMD then takes it's rightful place as Nova's damage power (personally, every time I play Nova, I prefer AMD over MP, and it's a shame it's not seen more often) MP stays as a utility power and retains it's effectiveness at high lvl matches. You just can't spam it in low lvl games and wipe everything out with chain explosions. (although the explosion animation could stay as it looks good, shame to waste it)

 

I wouldn't say that hurts Nova, given low lvl it's not difficult, but it does stop MP spam &!$$ing everyone else off by limiting AoE chain explosions at low lvl. As much as I do advocate nerfs, I want Nova to remain an effective frame, and a nuker, just not one which sucks the fun out of the game for everyone else leading to her being bashed with the nerf stick.

Edited April 27, 2014 by (PS4)billy-d-squid

[Shin]

So your aversion to stripping out the MP chain explosion or reduced damage on AoE explosions is what exactly? It does very little at high lvls, when it's used almost exclusively for the 200% damage and 50% debuff, while it makes it stupidly powerful and generally a bore to play with any Nova in lvl 30 and below content. 

 

Or is your point because things are easy to play under lvl 30 we should leave daft powers like MP in their current state?

 

It's not the 200% damage that makes it a problem, it's the combination of AoE damage and a 50% slow which lets Nova oneshot an entire spawn. Given that damage powers are poor in high lvl content and she already has AMD, why would you want another AoE damage power, when you could have a cheap 200% buff and 50% debuff for 50 energy?

Umm fun? Maybe i like her MP chain alot ? She is fine the way she is, being able to kill mobs below 30 doesnt really mean anything, if nothing they should buff every warframe instead of nerfing them.

 

Yes i like her skills, i dont even use her secondary skill even though it deals tons of damage. Do you know why? Its not fun. Her ultimate blowing up everything is much more fun to see. 

 

Honestly instead of asking for nerfs because nova can murder your 30 pub, ask for buffs for your warframes. Nerfing others fun doesnt help anyone in this game. Why would i need another aoe damage power? Because its fun to use. Some people likes aoe powers. Sorry if its not your thing.

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

Umm fun? Maybe i like her MP chain alot ? She is fine the way she is, being able to kill mobs below 30 doesnt really mean anything, if nothing they should buff every warframe instead of nerfing them.

 

Yes i like her skills, i dont even use her secondary skill even though it deals tons of damage. Do you know why? Its not fun. Her ultimate blowing up everything is much more fun to see. 

 

Honestly instead of asking for nerfs because nova can murder your 30 pub, ask for buffs for your warframes. Nerfing others fun doesnt help anyone in this game. Why would i need another aoe damage power? Because its fun to use. Some people likes aoe powers. Sorry if its not your thing.

You want another Trinity shooting herself in the foot with an ogris? How about 30 second invincible Snow Globes, Duration based Iron Skin, Stomp ignoring armour, Molecular Prime going through walls. How about the quick thinking and rage combo nerf? Should we bring that back again?

 

We should buff everything up to those lvls, there was no reason any of those were nerfed in the first place was there? It was just for kicks and giggles.

 

Edit:

 

And if you like chain exploding things you're not going to be doing that over lvl 30.So we can now disregard whatever you say given that that's what you're basing MP's use on. Not it's imbalance in killing the game for the rest of the team under lvl 30 and it's balance for high lvl play. But, who gives a damn if half the people who run defence get &!$$ed when a Nova steps in and spams MP then because they picked up no skills along the way they get downed constantly after lvl 30 because all they learnt to do was MP spam. Right? Right? Because "fun" chain explosions on low lvl games trump everything.

[WingsOfGryphin]

Been playing for the past year and this game have always been about "how to reach the end game". So now we have many viable builds that can easily take out enemies with little to no efforts because they are low levels. People start thinking they are "overpowered", yeah...right. Did you try Survival in Pluto and hold for 1 hour? Or sat around in Mercury with thumbs up your...uhm you know...back to the topic. So I literally went into 4 dominant team comps since Damage 1.0 then adjusted in Damage 2.0 of what to do for end game survival mainly, and now after today's livestream "Oh all those powerful Warframes get nerfed, and buff all useless Warframes".

 

Why can't we just buff everything to become overpowered so nothing is under powered and be happy?

You got one thing correct - buffing is an alternative. But it's not always an option. 

Because you must also balance around the content. If DE buffed every frame and weapon instead of bringing them to a set balance line (buff / nerf), then the content (enemies) will become even bigger cookie cutters. 

Buffing and nerfing are like simple arithmetic. Imagine if the balance is a number 0 and you have a weapon which stands out as a number 4 and a weapon which stands out as a number -1. You use buffs and nerfs to give or take away value to be closer to the balance line. in this case you take the 4 down to 0 to be as good as anything else and you buff the -1 to 0 because it was lacking.  

There is also an option to move the balance line.... But then again, which is easier to move - a road or the car itself? 

Edited April 27, 2014 by Letter13
Let's not call each other names

[Jordio99]

Why can't we just buff everything to become overpowered so nothing is under powered and be happy?

Power creep.

[Shin]

You want another Trinity shooting herself in the foot with an ogris? How about 30 second invincible Snow Globes, Duration based Iron Skin, Stomp ignoring armour, Molecular Prime going through walls. How about the quick thinking and rage combo nerf? Should we bring that back again?

 

We should buff everything up to those lvls, there was no reason any of those were nerfed in the first place was there? It was just for kicks and giggles.

 

Edit:

 

And if you like chain exploding things you're not going to be doing that over lvl 30.So we can now disregard whatever you say given that that's what you're basing MP's use on. Not it's imbalance in killing the game for the rest of the team under lvl 30 and it's balance for high lvl play. But, who gives a damn if half the people who run defence get &!$$ed when a Nova steps in and spams MP then because they picked up no skills along the way they get downed constantly after lvl 30 because all they learnt to do was MP spam. Right? Right? Because "fun" chain explosions on low lvl games trump everything.

Speak for yourself. Comparing Trinity and nova is dumb. Trinity basically murder whole map without moving a single meter. Nova on the other hand is fragile. Her ultimate what makes her nice.

 

You are talking about things that never came into this conversation and to be honest you just want the game balanced around your idea of fun. You can kill things because nova uses her ultimate? How dare she! Remove her from the game. Whats going to happen next? Remove Volt, saryn etc? Because when Nova gets nerfed some of the warframes will get buffed then people like you who cant stand enemies more than 30 level will be crying and crying and flooding the DE headquarters with their tears. Why? Because of your inability to aim down and shoot the mobs, because of your hate of ultimates. Why? Because you cant take kills. People like you shouldnt be allowed to sound their opinion because you  just want the game balanced around YOUR idea of perfection.  

 

Then again you are talking about mobs under 30 lvl. I guess this is where i say Get good and go beyond 30. Dont cry and call execution orders because you cant do S#&$ on 30 lvl because of some warframe. Im saying this, when nova gets nerfed other warframes will be buffed and they will murder everything just like nova.

 

Stop forcing YOUR idea of perfection into others just because you cant stand harder content.

[Dalu__Ka]

I love nerfs.

 

It is hilarious to see the threads that follow them

Edited April 27, 2014 by Tenn00b

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

Speak for yourself. Comparing Trinity and nova is dumb. Trinity basically murder whole map without moving a single meter. Nova on the other hand is fragile. Her ultimate what makes her nice.

 

You are talking about things that never came into this conversation and to be honest you just want the game balanced around your idea of fun. You can kill things because nova uses her ultimate? How dare she! Remove her from the game. Whats going to happen next? Remove Volt, saryn etc? Because when Nova gets nerfed some of the warframes will get buffed then people like you who cant stand enemies more than 30 level will be crying and crying and flooding the DE headquarters with their tears. Why? Because of your inability to aim down and shoot the mobs, because of your hate of ultimates. Why? Because you cant take kills. People like you shouldnt be allowed to sound their opinion because you  just want the game balanced around YOUR idea of perfection.  

 

Then again you are talking about mobs under 30 lvl. I guess this is where i say Get good and go beyond 30. Dont cry and call execution orders because you cant do S#&$ on 30 lvl because of some warframe. Im saying this, when nova gets nerfed other warframes will be buffed and they will murder everything just like nova.

 

Stop forcing YOUR idea of perfection into others just because you cant stand harder content.

 

Nova's getting looked at again. MP is a pain in the arse at anything below lvl 30, I join games to actually play them, not sit there drinking tea until it hits lvl 50, when I actually need to start playing because MP doesn't wipe everything out. 

 

I call broken imbalanced powers as I see then, "but it's fun to blow up entire maps" doesn't cut it as a balance suggestion and it never will. 

 

Trinity is broken. Nor was I comparing either of them. MP os broken for an entirely different set of reasons and at what lvl it hurts the game, but broken none the less, stop sipping that kool aide, pull your head out your arse and grasp that this isn't about nerfing MP, Blessing or other powers, it's about trying to fix what is clearly broken and damages any new game experience for players when Nova walks in (or trying to use the new melee and channeling system with Nova Spamming MP, that one I'm looking forward to being a barrel of laughs, but I forgot, "AoE explosions is the funz" right?) and enhancing the variety of frame types used in game by toning down some and buffing others.

Edited April 27, 2014 by Letter13
removing profanity

[TrashSpider]

As long as it makes sense I suppose, however DE nerfing the Lato, wait wut? 

[FuzzyRamen]

You got one thing correct - buffing is an alternative. But it's not always an option. 

Because you must also balance around the content. If DE buffed every frame and weapon instead of bringing them to a set balance line (buff / nerf), then the content (enemies) will become even bigger cookie cutters. 

Buffing and nerfing are like simple arithmetic. Imagine if the balance is a number 0 and you have a weapon which stands out as a number 4 and a weapon which stands out as a number -1. You use buffs and nerfs to give or take away value to be closer to the balance line. in this case you take the 4 down to 0 to be as good as anything else and you buff the -1 to 0 because it was lacking.  

There is also an option to move the balance line.... But then again, which is easier to move - a road or the car itself? 

 

You can always buff everything to the state of balance so every weapon and frame is viable and not the selected few. I want more selections and not the few that we keep in the back of our inventory. If a weapon or frame is not appealing to the consumer nobody will pay platinum or even spend time with forma's.

[Shin]

Nova's getting looked at again. MP is a pain in the arse at anything below lvl 30, I join games to actually play them, not sit there drinking tea until it hits lvl 50, when I actually need to start playing because MP doesn't wipe everything out. 

If you dont want the whole map getting blown up by MP then move. Do something and you blow up the map. Noone is going to wait for you to have fun. Its a random pub. Nobody cares about anyone nor they have to. They are there to have fun not there to watch you have fun with your trash level equipments.

 

 

I call broken imbalanced powers as I see then, "but it's fun to blow up entire maps" doesn't cut it as a balance suggestion and it never will. 

Fun and balance are different things. Nova is not on the level of Trinity because she has to give up shields, hp or warframe abilities in order to blow up the map. To be honest you just want to kill things without anyone interfering. There is a place for that. Solo. Try it sometimes instead of crying on the forum like" Oh no nova killed everything its not fun i cant get kills".

 

 

MP os broken for an entirely different set of reasons and at what lvl it hurts the game, but broken none the less, stop sipping that kool aide, pull your head out your arse and grasp that this isn't about nerfing MP, Blessing or other powers, it's about trying to fix what is clearly broken and damages any new game experience for players when Nova walks in (or trying to use the new melee and channeling system with Nova Spamming MP, that one I'm looking forward to being a barrel of laughs, but I forgot, "AoE explosions is the funz" right?) and enhancing the variety of frame types used in game by toning down some and buffing others.

Okay you are making no sense at all. MP is broken because new players cant kill things? Its like asking for a buff to axes while Nuclear bombs annihalates everything. It doesnt make any sense. If you are a newbie, there are places for newbies like mercury etc. Dont expect people not to use their MP on a T3 Def etc. People wants to be done with it. They are not there to wait for a newbie to have fun. They are there for the loot and will do anything to end it fast. Its no different in normal maps.

 

The thing you are talking about is something else Its about newbie experience and its terrible in this game. You are thrown into a fhitstorm and you know nothing. Not related to Nova. In a corpus map, a fully modded Volt can kill everything with his ultimate. Can you say anything about it ? Ofcourse no. A saryn can destroy waves of mobs before you realise it with her ultimate skill. Same thing goes for almost every warframe. You cant blame it all on MP. MP is not different than other 4.abilities aside from that 200% damage buff and 50% slow that leaves on the affected targets.

 

You just want nova to be nerfed because you cant do a thing. Why? You are a newbie? Yeah maybe you are a newbie and noone says its wrong to be one but coming here on forums without any further game knowledge and calling for nerfs just makes DE to nerf things for nothing. Try to expand your gaming knowledge. Play solo. See everything that this game has to offer than come here. Otherwise after Nova nerf you will come here and ask other warframes to be nerfed to ground because you cant kill things.

Edited April 28, 2014 by Shin