Glorious Battle And Victory In The Name Of Your Clan [Dark Sector Megathread]

OniDax · April 29, 2014

What about the time Sinai was taxed at 75% for members? It's not like members get all the benefits.

Yeah, that time is now past.

Yazyflame · April 29, 2014

That's good to hear you enjoy doing good things for fellow players. I hope that neither you nor any other SoV members misunderstood anything I said in this thread -- I never meant to insult SoV itself.

Sadly enough, the attackers are not getting it easy in here- people just thinkthey will put another 25% rail if they win- I bealieve they will keep it the same, they are not dumb enough to ruin their public image...

(That goes for you all paranoid people-)

Xylia · April 29, 2014

No, people here who have said they'll support SoV have been called greedy.

Because a lot of them (most?) are supporting them because they want to keep the entire mission's earnings to themselves.

And you are not in a position to guess the motives of people who actually play on zero tax rails.

Everybody has the right to make guesses about anything they wish. That's called, you know, Freedom of Speech?

And again, what is so wrong about playing a mission where you keep all of the credits you get (like most nodes in the game), especially when SoV WANTS people to keep all their credits?

Nothing wrong with it at all. However, demonizing another clan that wants to move in and get some profit merely because of a tax is not right either. What gives people the right to demonize a clan who wants to use the game as DE designed it?

You fail again and again to justify Eclipse's actions or to explain what is wrong about players keeping their credits.

Eclipse is using the Solar Rail/Dark Sector System as designed by DE. And people are crapping on them, crying out against them, demonizing them for it.

On what basis does Eclipse deserve a portion of the credits that are currently received on a node that ISN'T theirs? You act as if it's a crime to not be taxed. You act as though it's a crime to actually want to receive all of the credits you get from a mission, which again, is the way ALL of the non-dark sector nodes work.

They attack, they win, they own the node, they deserve to do with it whatever they wish while they own it. It is as simple as that.

You try to say that players playing these nodes aren't 'for the greater good', yet SoV is, and there is NOTHING, absolutely nothing about Eclipse's attack on Sechura that is 'for the greater good'. You fail to make a sound argument.

SoV is running a charity and that's very noble of them as I've said before. Eclipse wants to make a profit, since that's how this system was designed, and there's nothing wrong with that either.

What IS wrong, again, is demonizing Eclipse, calling them evil, etc.

Saenol · April 29, 2014

I'd rather take the chance of 1-10 missions for 10k each, than 0 for all missions.

I've run 100+ Dark Sector Defenses on Sechura in the last three days. I had two million creds four days ago, I've spent two million creds since then, and I have three million creds now. Getting 100k in battlepay vs. losing 500-600k in taxes is freaking joke.

I'm not calling SoV greedy, I'm calling the people crying out against taxes as greedy, there's a difference.

I offered SoV a million cred donation, and would likely have repeated the donation every two or three days, had they been receptive.

Clearly, I am an archetype of greed...I if could roll my eyes any harder I'd tear my optic nerve.

I'm calling the players crying out against taxes greedy, because the only reason they're doing so is because they want to keep the whole shebang every mission.

I don't play on any tax rails. Even 1% is 1% too much. I find taxation morally repugnant...borderline despicable. I do not need all the credits I bring in, and would be happy to hand over 90% of what I have and make to a cause I find worthy. However, these earnings are mine, do do with as I see fit, and I'll not have anyone, let alone a rampaging bureaucratic tax machine take my money just because "they are supposed to".

PhotriusPyrelus · April 29, 2014

What IS wrong, again, is demonizing Eclipse, calling them evil, etc.

Everybody has the right to make guesses about anything they wish. That's called, you know, Freedom of Speech?

:hrm:

OniDax · April 29, 2014

Because a lot of them (most?) are supporting them because they want to keep the entire mission's earnings to themselves.

Everybody has the right to make guesses about anything they wish. That's called, you know, Freedom of Speech?

Nothing wrong with it at all. However, demonizing another clan that wants to move in and get some profit merely because of a tax is not right either. What gives people the right to demonize a clan who wants to use the game as DE designed it?

Eclipse is using the Solar Rail/Dark Sector System as designed by DE. And people are crapping on them, crying out against them, demonizing them for it.

They attack, they win, they own the node, they deserve to do with it whatever they wish while they own it. It is as simple as that.

SoV is running a charity and that's very noble of them as I've said before. Eclipse wants to make a profit, since that's how this system was designed, and there's nothing wrong with that either.

What IS wrong, again, is demonizing Eclipse, calling them evil, etc.

What is wrong is saying that anyone here supporting SoV is doing so for the free rail and not for supporting SoV. Again, your accusation that SoV supporters are being selfish is wrong. THAT is wrong. And after repeatedly seeing their reasons for supporting SoV, continued misrepresentation of SoV-supporters' motives is essentially lying.

You say Eclipse is playing the game the way DE intended by attacking Sechura? I say people playing SoV's free node, and supporting them when they are being attacked, is partaking of the free node the way SoV intended. But of course you'll scoff at that too. You'll call that greed to. You'll twist that too.

Edited April 29, 2014 by AntoineFlemming

Xylia · April 29, 2014

And again, the whole reason there are people here who are against Eclipse is PRECISELY because they support SoV who is offering a free node, and the whole reason you and other Eclipse supporters are against us who support SoV is because you are against SoV who is offering this node.

Now look who is "making baseless accusations/guesses".

I'm supporting Eclipse in this thread, in response to people demonizing them for using the game as designed, and trying to make a profit (as DE designed, again).

It is unfair to demonize Eclipse just because they're playing the game.

I am not against SoV at all, I'm just responding to the "Tax Hate" and "Eclipse Hate".

Xylia · April 29, 2014

:hrm:

There's a difference between Freedom of Speech and Slander.

Yazyflame · April 29, 2014

Sold 5 Bleeding Willow and 2 Tranquil Cleaves all from Transmuting with Eclipse's money-

yeh- "I was poor yesterday man- I swear!"

Disinmas · April 29, 2014

My Fang Primes are on the side of SoV. They have yet to go back onto their promises, and until the day they do I will side with them.

Anyway I'm running the things for the mods anyway, might as well side with the clan I agree with.

Xylia · April 29, 2014

What is wrong is saying that anyone here supporting SoV is doing so for the free rail and not for supporting SoV. Again, your accusation that SoV supporters are being selfish is wrong. THAT is wrong. And after repeatedly seeing their reasons for supporting SoV, continued misrepresentation of SoV-supporters' motives is essentially lying

What I saw in these two threads is more Tax Hate and Eclipse Hate more than SoV love.

It wasn't "OMG We love SoV, help these guys!"

It was more "OMG we don't want to lose 0% tax! We hate Eclipse!"

In a nutshell. Or at least that's the tone I got from what I read.

OniDax · April 29, 2014

There's a difference between Freedom of Speech and Slander.

Slandering is saying all SoV supporters do so only because they want to "keep all our monies".

Keep misrepresenting the thread. The entire point of the thread, like the other one, is to show support for SoV.

Edited April 29, 2014 by AntoineFlemming

SimplyEvil · April 29, 2014

Yeah, that time is now past.

Oh my apologies. I guess everyone can just forget about history and politics and how they can intermingle or influence each other.

Or

Let's just focus on information that benefits an argument and ignore or denounce information from/for the opposition. That works too.

At the end of the day, no one is forcing players to play on that dark sector or this dark sector. Don't like a Dark Sectors' taxes? Don't play on it. Don't like how one clan/alliance taxes on a specific dark sector? Contest it, just as Eclipse is contesting others now.

OniDax · April 29, 2014

Oh my apologies. I guess everyone can just forget about history and politics and how they can intermingle or influence each other.

Or

Let's just focus on information that benefits an argument and ignore or denounce information from/for the opposition. That works too.

At the end of the day, no one is forcing players to play on that dark sector or this dark sector. Don't like a Dark Sectors' taxes? Don't play on it. Don't like how one clan/alliance taxes on a specific dark sector? Contest it, just as Eclipse is contesting others now.

No, I don't play on Eclipse's sectors, but don't characterize me and other SoV supporters as greedy free loaders because we support SoV and oppose Eclipse taking the sector (and yes, we've been called those by Eclipse supporters).

Verazix · April 29, 2014

@Verazix:

First of all, I'm not going to copy&paste multiple blocks to manually quote them because this forum system sucks for splitting up pre-formatted quotes, so please forgive me if I miss anything in your last post I'm replying to. I'm not "picking it apart" and "only replying to what I wanna reply" to, just so you know.

#1: They put in the work to conquer that many nodes, they figure they should be rewarded for their work. You work, you get reward. Right?

#2: Again, I'm not calling SoV greedy, I'm calling the players crying out against taxes greedy, because the only reason they're doing so is because they want to keep the whole shebang every mission.

#3: Then that's great! I'm glad you love playing the game again. This is clearly what DE wanted.

#4: My responses do favor Eclipse, perhaps indirectly. I'm more 'attacking' the people who are claiming "for the greater good!" when what it boils down to is people supporting charity only because they benefit from it, not because they actually care about the people running the charity.

#5: I haven't seen any "lies" first-hand, but meh. If they jack the taxes up higher then I just won't support them and they'll end up losing nodes. 25% I'll take, though I think they could easily make a profit at 15% or even 10% on Pluto. 30%? Eh, no. That's when I join the other side.

This forum sucks period, it likes to randomly send me to profile pages and delete my entire message QQ.

1) I agree! Those with power should use power. Eclipse is definitely doing something I'd do in their shoes, and win or lose I harbor no ill feelings towards them. That doesn't change the fact that this is still basic human greed, but we're all human right?

2) That really isn't what I thought you meant to begin with anyway. Calling someone greedy as you come in to take away what they have, is making you the greedier of the two parties here. You want it, you take it, power rules all. But for you to call them greedy? Pot, meet kettle. Makes the entire argument horrible, and it just doesn't hold water with anyone who sees the entire picture. It's like telling me you can come take 25% of my paycheck because you put the paper there, without giving me a say in the matter, and then calling me greedy when I complain. It's a silly argument that just has no place in a debate and shows you're grasping at straws.

3) Yup! It's actually fairly awesome. I'm even considering getting into a clan on one side or the other (Eclipse or one of the ones opposing) at some point so I can participate and perhaps give myself enough drive to not wander off again. Time will tell for sure, but it's something I am currently strongly considering.

4) This goes back to #2 here. It just doesn't work well when it seems so hypocritical. It simply doesn't fit well with a debate when you preach one thing while doing it to a greater extent yourself.

5) Look in this thread earlier where I call out Megasnail for his earlier lie about taxes collecting only from the credits collected and not final pay. While he may not be directly related to them, supporters do effect viewpoints directly too.

Rydian · April 29, 2014

Still find it odd that Eclipse is taxing everyone but their own members for use of the rail. I'm going to be brutally honest... that's a scumbag thing to do. It's like letting politicians not pay taxes.

25% tax for non-Eclipse players. 0% tax for Eclipse players.

No one should be exempt. Especially not your members, Eclipse. Don't be that guy.

Gabii (Ceres)

Credits/Resource Tribute: 15%/5%

Member Credits/Resources Tribute: 15%/5%

Seimeni (Ceres)