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Its Not Nostalgia


drMightyPotato
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Somewhere along the line, somewhere in these past few months something changed.

I'm gonna try to sum it up in  words, i may fail, i may, but I'm still gonna try.

 

Now i came in the game when the open beta started, maybe a week or so after the closed beta stopped but non the less i came at the open beta start.

Both me and my girlfriend saw some trailers and we were hooked to them. I am a older game now  (about 25 years) and have played more or less since my early ages, Super Mario and Contra were the bomb back then, and i knew that trailers are just some good bait. I scrounged the forums, youtube vids, ingame pics and every piece of info i could find about the game. The result was mind blowing.

This was the first game in my years as a gamer where i had everything i ever wanted: cool looking main characters, guns, swords and magic all wrapped into a nice little science fiction shooter (mind you while i played alot of games in live in a more of less backwater country that has a hard time keeping up with the modern world so my experience may not be as good as someone elses).

I downloaded the game, both me and my girlfriend tried it and we fell in love. The dark gritty atmosphere of the game coupled with great sounds and effects, hell the game even looked awesome even on low spec, made the first month or so of the game very enjoyable.

Sure it was repetitive, the mobs and the levels, the guns felt the same, the bosses were a bit lacking, and the grinding was, well, its wasn't the selling point that's for sure. However i felt drawn in into this world that i knew nothing about, hell no one did, those that were in alpha had some hints and guesses but that was it.

BUT, but, i felt immersed in the game. The controls were simple and by my standards intuitive (im just one person, for you it may have felt different), the gameplay, altho lacking, was fulfilling and promising and all in all i blasted trough everything the game could offer in a mere month. But i still came back for more!

I wanted to improve. I wanted to see how far i could go even with what i had and i enjoyed myself fully. All the shortcomings of the game ment nothing to me.

But then, i dunno, something happened.

Today i play the game and feel nothing. I feel that DE had a great idea about the game and that they took a wrong turn somewhere. The atmosphere is gone, replaced by bright fully lit corridors and crowded with sterile walls and boxes with a wire here and there. The enemies don't give the same feeling of gloom and terror over what awaits you if you fail your mission, the voices are LOUD! beyond reason, once i had to listen for their chatter and now i have to turn the volume down due to all the screaming, hell i can hear a Grineer 50 meters away from me like hes right behind my shoulder (seriously whats up with that).

I could go on and on about this. Ultimately i still like the game, i play it here and there, i take a break when i'm burned out and i follow the forum.

But somewhere in my mind something is bothering  me. DE had a great start building the game from ground up. I look the at the old videos and feel, not nostalgia, but a deep dread of what the game is becoming of.

Some of you may claim that i am searching for a needle in a haystack, some may claim that i am insane and have no idea what im talking about. Perhaps everything you say is true, but that doesn't change the fact that all i play now is mercury with no mods on my lvl 30 Volt and a mod less weapon of choice. I even bought a Lato for it (only to be shocked by its state).

So to end the entire thing here is a old video of Warframe. Granted i could of found older ones but this one has that ye-old feeling.

 

TL;DR: We have lost what was once the selling point in Warframe, i don't know how or when, but its gone and we may never have it back. HOW it happened tho ill let you think it trough, each and every one of us is a universe in itself and we all may not agree, my only hope is that someone from DE reads this and think of this a sort of feedback after several long months of gameplay (nearly a year tho).

 

PS: i may have some grammar errors here and there i apologize, english is not my main language.

PPS: i hope i made some sense in this entire text, instead of just typing something hardly understandable.

 

Thank you for your time.

 

Edit: Some of the ideas people started posting are quite genius, and someone mentioned they should i put in the OP post. Granted in order to have that old warframe feel back we need some things changed (like ai and the damage scale on both frames and enemies) and good ideas are always welcome.

With that in mind here is a link to the 7th page ripe with good ideas: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/230011-its-not-nostalgia/page-7

Do keep in mind tho, the goal of this entire post was to rekindle what was once known as Warframe, to get back what we once felt, a time where the skill of a player determined the winning factor.

Sure as someone mentioned some people would like to just be mindlessly overpowered and the thing is the old warframe had it both.

Do keep it in mind, and hope that we spark something in DE's mind.

Edited by Alinna
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It's the dark and gritty feeling we got from the sounds, aesthetics and some minor gameplay finishing touches.

 

Like a Braton that packs and feels like it can pack a punch without Forma or potatos.

The sound the Grineer, Lotus, weapons, your environment and your Warframe made had a mysterious and heavy feel.

The environment seems darker and sleek.

 

And so on.

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grind.. good one! rly laughed.

 

the grind is NOTHING compared to other games. also sure.. some grind-way is stupid like the new vey hek. but pls.. u need to farm MUCH less for stuff than u did months ago. warframe parts ALWAYS drop now at the end of mission and so on.. some time ago u couldnt even be sure to get 1 random part

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Warframe has changed. There's no doubt about that.

 

I recently watched the Excalibur profile video, and was shocked at how different it is, even from where I am now, a year and more into the game. 

 

The heaviness has left the game: The gravity of each moment in combat has been diminished. Our enemies are insects to be trampled upon, no longer feared. The infested fights take place in brightly lit areas, no longer in silent, dark corridors, where we were chased down and mauled to death. We've been given too much power, and we've soaked it in gratuitously. 

 

Our hunger was our undoing. We craved power. But the stronger we got, the less meaningful the struggle became. Each strike became lighter, faster, harder, and every moment, we're bombarded with numbers and explosions and the death of our enemies.

 

We no longer feel threatened. And even if we do, it is by the streaming of countless enemies, rather than by a few, and we're more often swarmed upon and die in exceedingly great numbers, rather than just because we were stupid.

 

HansVanHugendong may say that the grind isn't bad. True, compared to back then, it wasn't. But back then, we didn't have to grind to fight bosses, we didn't have to grind to get keys to fight certain missions, and we at least knew what we were looking for. Now, it's just over-saturation of grind, and dilution of drops. In the past, there were so few things relatively that RNG made us grind for. Just Warframes. Now, you grind for 90% of the things you want. Prime? Grind. Vay Hek? Grind. Stalker? Grind. Rare resource? Grind, grind, grind.

 

Has Warframe changed? It sure has. 

 

And not entirely for the better. 

 

There's more content, there's more things to do, more things to kill, but at the root of it...

 

What's to keep us killing anything

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Hard to feel atmosphere when you are walking around as a god one shotting everything .

So very true, i think the entire game needs to be toned down in power. Sometimes i think 'what is the point of trying to improve your skills when you can just take the bigest nuker in the game and go wild'. I think its one of the reason why so many new players rush Nova and spam ulti all day, no point in trying anything else.

 

-snip-

Well put good sir, take my internet +1

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So very true, i think the entire game needs to be toned down in power. Sometimes i think 'what is the point of trying to improve your skills when you can just take the bigest nuker in the game and go wild'. I think its one of the reason why so many new players rush Nova and spam ulti all day, no point in trying anything else.

 

Well put good sir, take my internet +1

 

I've been a great advocate of weapon and warframe balancing (which I feel will greatly help improve the experience), as well as improving enemy AI (which is indeed most crucial to bringing back the soul of this game, even without balancing). 

 

I just bought an MK1-Braton, equipped Aklatos and a Skana, all with no mods, and my Loki. 

 

I gotta say, it ain't the game I once got into. When enemies start shooting you, they're very simple-minded. Either get into cover and shoot, stand and shoot, or run away from you and shoot. They're not awfully smart. It's become a numbers game, where we compete who's got the biggest gun, largest health pool, and fastest aim. It's no longer the slow, tactical combat we once knew. Now it's a gratuitous gore-fest. 

 

At some point in time... We traded our souls for the numbers game. RNG and damage, alike. 

 

Also, Ishki, we asked for a lot of things. Perhaps if we ask again, they may take heed? Besides, you're one of us.

 

"DE gave us what we asked for".

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I loved the game some time ago.

 

Why ?

It was fast and easy killing.

 

But with every update some of that easy fast fun was killed.

 

- aura got a inventory slot (before it was for all frames and the whole team was able to see it) to make polarized frames a joke (oh i still have 16 points with all mods full)

- Nerfs.

- remove of infested from star map

- Skills removed.

- Nerfs

- skill nerfs

- energy drain aura.

- traps

- IMMUNITIES. (the point where i quit the game (alt +f4 and uninstall))

 

I'm ok with grinding.

I'm ok with RNG.

I don't want balanced frames or weapons.

I'm ok with the platin price.

 

I just want to kill hundrest of enemies :D

Not immunities, nerfs, bosses with algorythm or annoying traps.

 

So yes it was a great game.

But this days are gone.

And I fear they will never come back.

Edited by Chupachab
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Hard to feel atmosphere when you are walking around as a god one shotting everything .

 

This is why I feel that the addition of Forma was the moment everything turned for the worse. It lets players become too powerful.

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This is why I feel that the addition of Forma was the moment everything turned for the worse. It lets players become too powerful.

Its not just the weapons, it also the skills, no thats a wery wrong word, the powers of warframes are some of the biggest problems. If you take a look at the trailers those powers are not mashed at lightning speeds the way we do now, they are used in a strategic manner.

Sure one could say they are just trailers but we have now come to a point where EVERYTHING in this game can and will be solved with a single button pressed, the frames that cannot do so are tossed aside by many and clamed to be weak and underpowerd (or as many tend to say, not fun).

THE ONLY two frames that have avoided this thus far as also the only frames with any direct damage skills: Loki and Trinity, but that is only because their skills make 99% of the game trivial.

Sure i want some challenge in warframe, but apparently that is a far fetched dream covered by the constant outcries of nerf and buff ragers.

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I agree that the game becomes less and less satisfying the stronger you get - the whole challenge element just becomes pointless as there is no longer a challenge. At the very least you could then go slaughter tons of enemies for fun, but even that gets stale after so long.

 

I personally think that Warframe is now at the point where the enemies and hazards need to become stronger as opposed to the Tenno - no matter what happens in terms of nerfs/buffs, the community will always find a way to make the strongest build using what they have to plow through enemies. Enemies, on the other hand, are still mostly the same generic bullet sponges with a few more annoying status effects and more specific weaknesses. We need more varied enemies that are much harder to kill - the Prison Wardens in Specters of Liberty were a good step in the right direction, but I feel at higher levels a lot of enemies should be using AI at the level of a Tenno Spectre or Stalker to present a challenge in terms of actual skill as opposed to just requiring some more bullets or a specific style of attack.

 

More mobile hazards along the lines of Orokin box traps would also encourage a Tenno to be more parkour/movement savvy, too, as they would encourage us to actually mind the layout of the stage instead of just blindly running through the area. (Arc Traps don't count as they hit you regardless of where you are, whereas you can actually dodge the heat lasers.)

Edited by ZephyrPhantom
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The feeling still exists, but you dom't ever get a chance to feel it anymore. Everything dies the second you even think about aiming at it, and nothing really poses the same threat it used to, unless you're 2 hours deep into Survival, which by that point you're deadened to the feeling anyways. Nothing carries weight anymore. That boss cutscene no longer really carries any impact when you know Ruk is going to put up as much of a challenge as the Shield Lancer 5 seconds ago and die in two Boltor Prime shots. Skills are cheap and spammable, Warframes can nuke most content that their guns don't vaporize twice as fast, and overall nothing in the scope of the actual game feels like a real challenge, just more bigger numbers.

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I wish Warframe was owned by a different company with Mynki still being the artist.

Activision controlled studio? Or even EA?

 

 

Yes, that would be much better because we would have 60 $ Warframe every year. Great idea.

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I knew someone would do this lol

No, RoboDoge. Not a greedy company. Ok? :)

*sigh*

Every company is greedy, or they start getting greedy at some point.

 

Profit is everything for everyone who ever started business. There is nothing romantic in having your own business, and "customer care" is a myth. If companies that say "we care about our customers" were doing so, they would go bankrupt in few months. Everything is either commercial or add. There is no bad publicity, only publicity in general.

 

 

So, people need to understand that developers are not making games for the sake of gamers. Instead they make games because they want to eat, sleep in warm beds, having everyday security, have decent life. We might see it as greedy and they might or might not be that way. But in the end this is business that needs to generate profit. And they will do what they seem fit to increase that profit generation.

 

 

Simple as that.

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Every company is greedy, or they start getting greedy at some point.

 

Profit is everything for everyone who ever started business. There is nothing romantic in having your own business, and "customer care" is a myth. If companies that say "we care about our customers" were doing so, they would go bankrupt in few months. Everything is either commercial or add. There is no bad publicity, only publicity in general.

 

 

So, people need to understand that developers are not making games for the sake of gamers. Instead they make games because they want to eat, sleep in warm beds, having everyday security, have decent life. We might see it as greedy and they might or might not be that way. But in the end this is business that needs to generate profit. And they will do what they seem fit to increase that profit generation.

 

 

Simple as that.

 

There is a difference between being greedy and turning a profit. Besides that you are intentionally missing Chloras point just so you can argue about something.

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There is a difference between being greedy and turning a profit. Besides that you are intentionally missing Chloras point just so you can argue about something.

My intention is not to argue or anything. People mostly thing that offering your opinion or even sharing it with other people is arguing.

 

 

Especially on Forums.

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My intention is not to argue or anything. People mostly thing that offering your opinion or even sharing it with other people is arguing.

 

 

Especially on Forums.

If thats how you go about offering your opinion then more power to you buddy.

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Every company is greedy, or they start getting greedy at some point.

 

Profit is everything for everyone who ever started business. There is nothing romantic in having your own business, and "customer care" is a myth. If companies that say "we care about our customers" were doing so, they would go bankrupt in few months. Everything is either commercial or add. There is no bad publicity, only publicity in general.

 

 

So, people need to understand that developers are not making games for the sake of gamers. Instead they make games because they want to eat, sleep in warm beds, having everyday security, have decent life. We might see it as greedy and they might or might not be that way. But in the end this is business that needs to generate profit. And they will do what they seem fit to increase that profit generation.

 

 

Simple as that.

Oh please, RoboDoge.

Writing more isn't going to justify how you mentioned 2 horrible companies in your reply to my post about an unspecified company.

 

And your emotional appeal with those paragraphs isn't going to break anyone.

Don't tell me what a business is, I know what business is. Wipe that smut off your face.

It is COMMON knowledge in the forums among the veteran portion of the playerbase that Warframe is quantity over quality.

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