May 23Rd: Community Hot Topics!

[Little-Cunny]

The biggest problems with utility mods is giving up a spot to use them when you're not sure you need them.

The perfect example:

 

Ice environmental effects are completely random. No one with any understanding of the game will slots this mod in the off chance that the mission they're going into will have ice effects (frankly, even if I *did* know that there were ice effects in a mission, I'd rather just throw in a maxed Vigor on top of Redirection/Vitality rather than to slot Warm Coat).

 

 

What I feel we need is two additions to the game:

 

1) The ability to see what effects there are in any given node. Instead of making it random at load in, make the current state of the node visible during mouse-over (pardon the weak photoshop skils):

 

2) A hot-swap Mod slot available at the map screen, similar to the old Artifact system. While the new Aura system won a lot of players over with the additional mod points it added to Warframes, the utility of being able to see each other's Team-Boost and the ability to swap it in the lobby depending upon your squad makeup was never really addressed. No Trinity on team? Hot swap to Rejuvenation. All four players have Energy Siphon equipped? One person can change to Corrosive Projection. This is something that I sorely miss from the early open Beta days. It's something that should be brought back in one form or another. Maybe Artifacts 2.0 is the place for Utility mods like Warm Coat and the verious Damage Resistance mods.

 

How about creating a modslot specific for elemental defense??

[Rhiasu]

All I can say is, make juggernaut immune to ragdoll or any type of CC.

 

Maybe it's time to start adding enemies who have some form of immunity to certain skills/damage or have skills like stealth detection and such.

Edited May 26, 2014 by Rhiasu

[Little-Cunny]

For Miter, just make it OP as hell like the Gear Shredder in Transformers:FOC. Also I sent a submission in the enemies of the Tenno which are like guards?bounty hunters that could be put as a Capture challenge instead of introducing T4 keys..

[Kartumterek]

Restore the Miter to the bugged state...it was SOLID, not op. Plus it was fun

Make all powers require line of sight to affect... solves sooooooooo many problems. Enemies take cover, flank, use tactics and for what? Some dude 3 floors up and 6 rooms over hits 1 button and just wipes the map. Help our enemies be actual enemies

Need more stances for melee, if you wanna go the total BOSS route add stances for secondaries (gun kata)

You guys made me sad by not picking my GLORIOUS Grineer Assailant for the content... /off to sulk in the corner

Edited May 26, 2014 by Kartumterek

[Krjal]

The problem with that being, Renewal gets shorter the more you improve it. Adding mitigation to it means an upgrade will make the effect more situational.

 

Personally, I think they should scrap Renewal and give Hallowed Ground a healing effect for allies standing in it; Hallowed Ground has higher output, scales linearly, and STACKS, so you can boost your burst healing to high levels (ie the ~1400 health cap your Ash, Zephyr and Saryn buddies have, rather than the 200 health of a half-leveled Excalibur) as needed... provided you have the energy, timing, positioning (to maximize your mobility while healing), and range.

Granting that a paladin should be a close-range combatant anyway.

Bonus points, since putting the healing in the environment would eliminate wasting the effect via early dispersion while remaining somewhat druidic, just to keep the line blurred.

 

THEN there would be space for an impressive standalone party-mitigation skill.

 

Again, just one opinion.

 

I love the idea of Hallowed Ground having a purpose. I haven't been able to get it to do anything so far.

[theKasura]

i can't invite my friends,what can i do?????

Please

[(PSN)mglhasa2]

i can't invite my friends,what can i do?????

Please

 

Oh please, you don't have any idea about "Warframe Bug Report"...                                                                                                                              

 

By the way, all i want from warframe is to account migration from PS4 to PC or account reset for PC, :‹

[Helleborr]

So how about those "W+E" combos still making it impossible to perform a basic "EEE" combo on the run, like it is with Crossing Snakes and Clashing Forest (in latter case, the said combo was introduced as a new one, effectively murdering all the fun Amphis offered before)?

 

Please don't tell me you just decided it's all ok as it is and nothing's gonna change, DE. :(

[hoeskioeh]

’Hardest’missions are too Easy

[...] One of the issues with releasing T4 keys is figuring out how to scale enemies so that they are challenging for experienced players but not too restrictive for players who might not have optimized gear. [...]

 

No!

_The_ issue with T3 keys was, that there was no challenge to - experienced - players with low-level gear. The whole reason for introducing T4 is to challenge those who are bored with T3... If all you do is enter a new but ultimately indistinct tier to the towers, nothing is gained.

 

The one really cool concept I admired in the Borderlands series where end-game bosses. Enemies specifically designed to be taken down by a team of veterans. Lephantis isn't even close to that.

 

Please please please accept that T4 should _not_ be attempted by lvl 15 frames with lvl 12 weapons...

[CrimsonCrown]

No!

_The_ issue with T3 keys was, that there was no challenge to - experienced - players with low-level gear. The whole reason for introducing T4 is to challenge those who are bored with T3... If all you do is enter a new but ultimately indistinct tier to the towers, nothing is gained.

 

The one really cool concept I admired in the Borderlands series where end-game bosses. Enemies specifically designed to be taken down by a team of veterans. Lephantis isn't even close to that.

 

Please please please accept that T4 should _not_ be attempted by lvl 15 frames with lvl 12 weapons...

And it should be only accessed if you have at least 2 power creeps in your current loadout and only run wiht rhino.

/sarcasm

[1N33DM0N3Y]

My ideas for T4 Keys the key it self dropped only in secret rooms in the Void & in locked Spind in vanilla Missions.

Or you can buy the blueprints and forging it by putting  two TII key or one T1 key and T3 Key.

T4 keys difficult will have one random efect of the Dragonkeys for the team

Only on T4 surv there are enmies with higher damage instead of the speed reduction.

[Seele]

And it should be only accessed if you have at least 2 power creeps in your current loadout and only run wiht rhino.

/sarcasm

I think you're confusing the overpowered gear we are capable of creating being "mandatory" with it being "strongly suggested".

 

To use the Borderlands comparison (they really did nail endgame content), absolute top-of-the-line gear was still overkill, but if you didn't at least put some effort into designing your loadout, you were going to fail or at least struggle.

[CrimsonCrown]

I think you're confusing the overpowered gear we are capable of creating being "mandatory" with it being "strongly suggested".

 

To use the Borderlands comparison (they really did nail endgame content), absolute top-of-the-line gear was still overkill, but if you didn't at least put some effort into designing your loadout, you were going to fail or at least struggle.

It's called sarcasm, are you goddamn blind?

And yeah, people won't accept you if you won't be overpowered rhino in t4 by normal warframe community logic.

Edited May 26, 2014 by CrimsonCrown

[Seele]

It's called sarcasm, are you goddamn blind?

And yeah, people won't accept you if you won't be overpowered rhino in t4 by normal warframe community logic.

Sarcasm is defined as harsh or bitter derision or irony.

You seemed offended by the thought that high level content should require equally high level gear.

If that was not what you meant to convey by including "/sarcasm" then you do not yourself understand the very words you wrote.

 

Rhino is largely overrated anyway. Weaponry matters more.

[CrimsonCrown]

Sarcasm is defined as harsh or bitter derision or irony.

You seemed offended by the thought that high level content should require equally high level gear.

If that was not what you meant to convey by including "/sarcasm" then you do not yourself understand the very words you wrote.

 

Rhino is largely overrated anyway. Weaponry matters more.

You're pretty slow.So, if I take a ballistica, it won't be accepted because it's not highlevel.If i take a skana, it won't be accepted. If i take a nikana, maybe, but it should be dragon nikana, because highlevel gear means OP gear. as in MR7+. We'll wait and we'll see. 

Anyway, tier 4 is only more dillution.

[Seele]

You're pretty slow.So, if I take a ballistica, it won't be accepted because it's not highlevel.If i take a skana, it won't be accepted. If i take a nikana, maybe, but it should be dragon nikana, because highlevel gear means OP gear. as in MR7+. We'll wait and we'll see. 

Anyway, tier 4 is only more dillution.

I'm the slow one?

For one the 4th tower doesn't even exist yet, you're making unfounded speculations.

For two, what will not accept your ballistica or skana? Other players? Nothing is going to mandate what gear you take.

 

You seem like you're whining about presumably needing high level gear to complete high level content, which is absurd. But apparently I'm slow so I could be wrong.

[CrimsonCrown]

I'm the slow one?

For one the 4th tower doesn't even exist yet, you're making unfounded speculations.

For two, what will not accept your ballistica or skana? Other players? Nothing is going to mandate what gear you take.

 

You seem like you're whining about presumably needing high level gear to complete high level content, which is absurd. But apparently I'm slow so I could be wrong.

 And yes, t4 will be even more rare. Which means people hosting will be even more picky.

Yeah. You ARE slow.

We can only speculate about things not released.

That's why it's called speculating.

I'm not going to waste my time with semantics.

[Seele]

 And yes, t4 will be even more rare. Which means people hosting will be even more picky.

Yeah. You ARE slow.

We can only speculate about things not released.

That's why it's called speculating.

I'm not going to waste my time with semantics.

Alright buddy. Let me know the next time you get kicked out of a lobby for trying to mooch affinity for bad weapons.

/sarcasm.

[Garuda4711]

Hey guys, calm down! ;-)

 

Fact is, this game definitively lacks any kind of endgame-content! And as long as you can do it without top-notch gear it just cannot be called "endgame-content"! The very idea of that term suggests that you cannot play it otherwise.

 

...and none of us knows, if T4 would have anything to do with it!

[Seele]

Hey guys, calm down! ;-)

 

Fact is, this game definitively lacks any kind of endgame-content! And as long as you can do it without top-notch gear it just cannot be called "endgame-content"! The very idea of that term suggests that you cannot play it otherwise.

 

...and none of us knows, if T4 would have anything to do with it!

That's what I was trying to convey, if my tired mind failed to do so as concisely as you did...

 

The fact that true end-game content should require a careful balance of gear choice, mod specifications, and player skill.

Hell if you bring an 8-forma strun, ballistica, and skana and do well, good for you.

The idea is to (hopefully) give purpose to the gear we can make which is far too good for the content available to us currently.

[Helleborr]

LFM New T4 content, be a rhino prime with 2k health/shields, have a 40k+ dps primary and secondary which you can fire at the same time plus dragon nikana, have pre-nerf molecular prime, blessing, invisibility and your 8k iron skin equipped, bring a lvl4 spectre and 160+ IQ and 200 plat and link achieve or gtfo.

Not missing those days of future past.

Content must be interesting before hard. Leph is interesting, despite being easy, because it's creepy and atmospheric. Making it much harder would just hide it behing grindwalls and smugwalls, turning it into non-content. Same must be considered when designing new high end missions. For now I have faith in DE, despite the new nerf-fest ramping up.

[Garuda4711]

Content must be interesting before hard

True statement, wrong topic! ;-)

 

We were not talking about normal content (~95% of a game); we were talking about "endgame-content". Or as the OP [DE]Drew called it "Hardest Missions are too easy".

[(PSN)andyb_b5]

Once T4 is available it will probably be about 2 - 3 minutes before someone starts complaining its too easy and they need T5. Even if to complete T4 it requires four specific frames with highly specialised builds and the ability to use them. There will be cries for T5.

 

Personally if we have to go T4 I would like it that even for the better geared and skilled players there is still a high chance of failure, that success is by no means expected, let alone guaranteed.

 

Not expecting to like T4 however based on a lot of the posts I see about players complaining about other players. Bigger number content just makes it worse and I've seen it all before in enough other games.

[Seele]

Once T4 is available it will probably be about 2 - 3 minutes before someone starts complaining its too easy and they need T5. Even if to complete T4 it requires four specific frames with highly specialised builds and the ability to use them. There will be cries for T5.

 

Personally if we have to go T4 I would like it that even for the better geared and skilled players there is still a high chance of failure, that success is by no means expected, let alone guaranteed.

 

Not expecting to like T4 however based on a lot of the posts I see about players complaining about other players. Bigger number content just makes it worse and I've seen it all before in enough other games.

I hate to sound like a broken record, but Borderlands. They did it right.

 

The "Invincible" brand of enemies were among the most expertly crafted endgame bosses I've seen in all my years of gaming.

 

Quite basically you lost the first time you fought them unless you were exceedingly lucky (or cheesed it and read the wiki first). You had to figure out how to beat them, and even after you knew it required precision, reactive adaptation, and carefully selected gear. I'd love to see content like that in this game - a reason to use a gun I don't normally, modded a way I don't normally mod other guns in the category. A reason to have all of my weapons modded for different elements, or no elements at all. So on and so forth.

[Helleborr]

I'd like to ask an essential question: what's the point of T4?

 

Are we gonna get same tower missions with same mobs, just starting at higher levels and scaling up faster? What would that accomplish? Surv and Def missions will still have endless scaling, with same diluted loot tables, making that yet another 30 minute/wave run with prayers to gods of randomization just longer.

 

It's gonna be even worse for one-burn missions, if they are made so hard that running same T4 Mobile Def or Ext for a chance to get that one last piece of something you need becomes an even more excruciating task. Sure, my 6-forma Boltor P makes it as easy to run T3 over and over as T1, but I'm grateful, because last thing I need in that supergrindy experience is a possibility of failure, making the grind even longer.

 

Hardest missions are too easy? I don't think 40th minute in T3 Surv, when heavy gunners require so many rounds of the said 6F Boltor to kill, that you're simply starting to run out of ammo, is easy. I also don't think 50th wave of ODD, where ancients can almost one-shot you with ticks of their toxic auras easy. And I don't think missions that are harder in terms of mob level will be more fun in any way.

 

And don't even get me started on wow-style bosses that are meant to be a gearcheck in one way or another, because those are hardest for people that actually need something off them, making it a mechanic that shoots itself in the leg. Plus having to put up with a number of other people, having to check if each one of them meets a set of conditions, has brought consumables, has the right spec etc, and even then it would be a night of wipe after wipe after wipe after wipe... In my 7 years there I always had a problem with the game requiring you to invest huge time and effort just to experience all of it. I eventually quit because I got tired of feeling like I'm just hanging around in a game where the only people that can actually be considered to be playing it are those people in raid guilds with raid spots and love for repetitive experience of wiping on (or even killing) the same boss over and over.

 

I am currently Rank 15. I have 5-6 weapons that I formaed 5-6 times. I have almost everything obtainable in the game, and I only regret coming too late for Wraith Vipers. I love this game because it doesn't restrict me from experiencing everything it has to offer.

 

But if tomorrow I wake up to find new content barred from me by requirement of a perfectly tuned group, that would be a deal-breaker. That would mean, as previous posters said, getting kicked from the lobby for bringing the wrong frame/weapons. That would mean being pigeonholed into using only popular choices, regardless of how well you can perform with a Ballistica, because there are no performance measuring tools in the missions, and you'll have no proof before the mission ends.

 

We had a glimpse of this in the new rescue missions, where pugs would run into the warden room and set off the timer, even if you told them to stay back, but it was ok, because you only lost 3 out of 9 points, and you could always just solo it with a Loki + Dragon Nikana.

 

I don't mind introduction of T4 keys, but I see them as a non-solution to a non-problem. Hardest missions aren't too easy, because there are scaling missions, and because non-scaling mission types would still let you run through with Banshee + Obex, and have fun. Having even harder missions with same kind of random loot tables, which you just have to grind until you get lucky, with the only difference being that you now have to do that only with your best gear, taking away any sort of variety from those endless grinds.... I just don't see what that would accomplish.

tl;dr: I oppose to introduction of anything that would bind my success to actions of other people. Can I pug it even if I have to carry it? Fine. Can I solo it? Fine. Do I need to care about what other people bring and do in that mission? Not fine. BG/ragequit. :P

Edited May 26, 2014 by Helleborr