My Feedback for what its worth

[2mer]

pay2win on a PvE oriented game. whats going on in dev's mind?

I understand they need to generate some sort of income and I would happily do so but restricting me to limited option and forcing a payment to get a wide array of selection does not make me want to donate jack.

very bold move to do on a game that hasn't got the exposure.

[Kreddi]

pay2win on a PvE oriented game. whats going on in dev's mind?

I understand they need to generate some sort of income and I would happily do so but restricting me to limited option and forcing a payment to get a wide array of selection does not make me want to donate jack.

very bold move to do on a game that hasn't got the exposure.

5 $ to get a total of 6 pro upgrades doesn't seem bad to me at all.

Besides its not needed to use pro to win, most definetly possible to beat every single current mission without it

EDIT: About the exposure part, i would say having ForceStrategy and TotalBiscuit make videos about the game pretty good coverage

Edited January 9, 2013 by Kreddi

[TeamWorkTom]

So far the game has been pretty awesome. Its a lot of fun.

The biggest issue I have at the moment is that this game is 100% P2W. You can't pro items with out real money. Crafting items is a joke with its craft timer. You already spent time to find the materials to craft your item, then you have to wait 12 hours to use the item or pay money? Again it screems cash grab.

Other than feeling like im wasting my time because I am forced to spend money if I want to actually progress the game is fun. Hopefully the need to spend money on the game will change.

[Scypher]

The Pro part is being looked at by the Devs, the crafting mechanics are fine. F2P games make their money on cosmetics and convienence, you can easily wait 12 hours, and if you can't god help you when you try to make a new Warframe. That takes 3 full days *gasp*. Also the game is no where near 100% pay 2 win, atm its maybe 10% the majority of what there is to buy out there is all stuff that does not give paying people an combative advantage. Getting an item faster than another person is not pay 2 win. Its convienence.

Edited January 9, 2013 by Scypher

[Frostosti]

You are fighting with each other, not against each other. So it doesnt matter that much.

And i do not see a problem with the crafting timer. Still possible to get relatively fast a new warframe. I know plenty of other games where it takes much much longer than 2-3 days to earn something with in game credits.

[jestersheepy]

Theres nothing wrong with Pay to win if it's 100% PvE...

[MaragiAccel]

The Pro part is being looked at by the Devs, the crafting mechanics are fine. F2P games make their money on cosmetics and convienence, you can easily wait 12 hours, and if you can't god help you when you try to make a new Warframe. That takes 3 full days *gasp*. Also the game is no where near 100% pay 2 win, atm its maybe 10% the majority of what there is to buy out there is all stuff that does not give paying people an combative advantage. Getting an item faster than another person is not pay 2 win. Its convienence.

I'd agree with you on most of the PW2 arguments except one thing, mod slots from pro, esspecially later on when you start getting 50% clip size / damage / fire rate increase mods, those extra mod slots add a huge advantage to someone who used plat compared to someone stuck with the free unlock tree. even the pro versions of the frames get access to the 4th ability, which is usually quite powerful, in addition to more stats all around.

[Scypher]

I'd agree with you on most of the PW2 arguments except one thing, mod slots from pro, esspecially later on when you start getting 50% clip size / damage / fire rate increase mods, those extra mod slots add a huge advantage to someone who used plat compared to someone stuck with the free unlock tree. even the pro versions of the frames get access to the 4th ability, which is usually quite powerful, in addition to more stats all around.

I never said the "Pro" versions weren't Pay 2 Win, I said the crafting wasn't, and I also said that the devs are looking into a more suitable way to do "Pro".

[MLuminos]

Has anyone hit endgame without spending?

I havent spent a penny on this game, namely because it is in beta phase and partially because i dont have money lol.

But it has seemed fair enoough to me. Maybe if they allowed players to pay and unlock the pro version of a gun or warframe with plats and allow players to trade amongst themselves?

one person could then unlock a gun and sell it for credits to another person.

[TeamWorkTom]

I never said the "Pro" versions weren't Pay 2 Win, I said the crafting wasn't, and I also said that the devs are looking into a more suitable way to do "Pro".

I never said the crafting was pay to win I said it was a needless cash grab. "Pro" items are 100% pay to win. They add more stats to the items as well as mod slots. You really can't get anymore pay to win than "Pro" items.

I understand that F2P games need to make money, but making needless cash grabs is not the way to do it. Sure they might get money in the short run, but in the long run it will deter more people thus losing profit.

Everyone wants the best items. Making it painfully obvious that the best items are paid for instantly creates a negative impression of the game and instantly gives it the image of P2W which deters people very very fast.

Cosmetic and Speed up Boosts are fine. The crafting time is a way to falely increase game length, and creates the cash crab of paying to speed it up.

Making money is great I thought about supporting this game and becoming a founder, but I will never support a company that makes artifical and P2W cash grabs.

[Scypher]

I never said the crafting was pay to win I said it was a needless cash grab. "Pro" items are 100% pay to win. They add more stats to the items as well as mod slots. You really can't get anymore pay to win than "Pro" items.

I understand that F2P games need to make money, but making needless cash grabs is not the way to do it. Sure they might get money in the short run, but in the long run it will deter more people thus losing profit.

Everyone wants the best items. Making it painfully obvious that the best items are paid for instantly creates a negative impression of the game and instantly gives it the image of P2W which deters people very very fast.

Cosmetic and Speed up Boosts are fine. The crafting time is a way to falely increase game length, and creates the cash crab of paying to speed it up.

Making money is great I thought about supporting this game and becoming a founder, but I will never support a company that makes artifical and P2W cash grabs.

You realize the crafting system is just another speed up boost right? I understand you don't have patience but that is exactly what it is and you just said it was fine. XP/Credit boosters allow other players to get better gear faster then the free to play gamers, so I lack to see the difference. All you have to do is start crafting while you go to bed or go to work.

[Skyrage]

Things that are currently rather bad in Warframe:

Pro-mode platinum only = payers and non-payers are treated differently. Which is always very bad. As seen many react very negatively - something you never want to see.

4 respawns a day and then pay for more (bet those who are really casual gamers simply ADORE this one - specially as this game does present challenge of a fair degree). This one serves nothing but pushing players away.

1 rankup/day - there are so many other ways of introducing risk and consequences of failing the task.

Platinum for different colours. Yes, this one is cheap as hell. Skins I can understand, animations I can understand etc etc, but pay for more colours? Bad, bad, bad moneygrubbing image is the only end result you will get from this. Remember, you want to keep players not scare them away. Charging for extremely petty, basic features sort of does that - specially when many players will be very aware of the dozens of other online games where you can alternate your looks and colors for free. The trick here is to know what to offer for free and what to charge for money.

Selling alternate weapon skins, warframe skins, maybe even alternate animations for moves is the way to go. Specially when you consider that the combat is rather heavily geared towards being "kickass looking", and it is these strong points that should be exploited.

Inventory space/boosters/packs fall under the acceptable category as these are merely comfort-based purchases and not directly pay-to-win. In the case of inventory/weapon slot space, it could be clever to have a "rental" cost here for ingame money as an alternative. Pay credits for a 24 hour inventory boost or pay plat for a permanent slot. You get pretty much the best of both worlds, and in fact even show that you fairly cater for everyone. This will attract players instead of pushing them away.

[Mezecs]

Things that are currently rather bad in Warframe:

Pro-mode platinum only = payers and non-payers are treated differently. Which is always very bad. As seen many react very negatively - something you never want to see.

4 respawns a day and then pay for more (bet those who are really casual gamers simply ADORE this one - specially as this game does present challenge of a fair degree). This one serves nothing but pushing players away.

1 rankup/day - there are so many other ways of introducing risk and consequences of failing the task.

Platinum for different colours. Yes, this one is cheap as hell. Skins I can understand, animations I can understand etc etc, but pay for more colours? Bad, bad, bad moneygrubbing image is the only end result you will get from this. Remember, you want to keep players not scare them away. Charging for extremely petty, basic features sort of does that - specially when many players will be very aware of the dozens of other online games where you can alternate your looks and colors for free. The trick here is to know what to offer for free and what to charge for money.

Selling alternate weapon skins, warframe skins, maybe even alternate animations for moves is the way to go. Specially when you consider that the combat is rather heavily geared towards being "kickass looking", and it is these strong points that should be exploited.

Inventory space/boosters/packs fall under the acceptable category as these are merely comfort-based purchases and not directly pay-to-win. In the case of inventory/weapon slot space, it could be clever to have a "rental" cost here for ingame money as an alternative. Pay credits for a 24 hour inventory boost or pay plat for a permanent slot. You get pretty much the best of both worlds, and in fact even show that you fairly cater for everyone. This will attract players instead of pushing them away.

I don't really mind the respawns thing, maybe it's because I'm pretty good and dont use them often. They pretty much just allow you to mess up more, and you can still play the game if you run out. If you're playing co-op you will rarely have to use them.

Also I think the colour thing is acceptable, since it's only cosmetic. I agree with everything else though.

Edited January 9, 2013 by Mezecs

[Skyrage]

Respawns don't really affect me at all either but then again, not everyone is a seasoned gamer either. This is important to remember and these small details do matter in the end.

Colours may be cosmetic, but charging for the most basic and oldest of customization features in games? No, that is just way too cheap. Again, you'd make more money in the end if you charge for skins etc and let players customize these skins further for free.

Simple reason is that people will then think "How cool wouldn't this skin look like with red colors" instead of thinking "Pay for both skin and colors? No thank you!". Some won't of course, but many will.

You know, the cool thing about All Points Bulleting (whilst the game itself was so-so), was it's very impressive design feature where you could use decals (which you had to unlock) and so on to create logos which you could then plaster onto your clothes or vehicle, allowing for near-endless design possibilities. If the game itself had been a bit better I would probably have ended up paying for it simply in order to double my max decal limit. With the limit that I had, I still managed to create a very nifty Fluttershy logo that I pasted all over my pink van. Have I had doubled my limit, the detal level of that Fluttershy would have probably reached epic proportions...and I'd probably have ended up getting rich from it (as you could sell your designs in that game).

Now I know that Warframe is a whole different kind of game, but maybe it could still take a page or two from APB's design scheme, considering Warframe so heavily relies on "coolness" in combat.

[Wanny1]

My only complain so far. Upgrade to pro requires real money. I almost uninstalled it but I decided to calm down instead...

[MadMast3r]

My only complain so far. Upgrade to pro requires real money. I almost uninstalled it but I decided to calm down instead...

so i did but i still want to know if or if not the pro versions will still platium only

[Marvyra85]

There is no such thing as pay to win in a PvE game, if this game had PvP then I would agree.

Anyway, I would suggest putting a credit price on all the platinum only stuff (except the stuff in the store of course), so that people can decide to either use their time to farm for it or if they're too lazy they can just buy it with plat. Similar system to Planetside 2.

Pay to progress faster!

[Venarge]

I really cant understand this guy.... This game is a AAA in my eyes. And it is free to play. You can get almost every weapon for credits

right now (bo and such may follow) and even the frames are purchasable for credits. And saying this is pay to win was the biggest fail he said. Pay to win would mean he would be at a disadvantage compared to other players. How can he be disadvantaged? He cant even fight other people....

Pro is just 20 Platinum. People these days spent 60 bucks for garbage like cod and pay additional 15 for dumb dlc´s! You get 75 platinum for 5 bucks at the moment. thats 3 weapons on pro. your done. buy your fav stuff with credits and spent just 5 bucks to get them pro. I just hate this attitude. Wants everything but isnt even willing to spent 5 bucks for this awesome game. I glady spent money to support this awesome game and its creators!

[Daerados]

PvP is a must have, but such pvp that won't affect pve dudes, because i see many enemies of pvp here, but believe m,e there is no less people interested in player versus player modes, it will atract much more people

[MaragiAccel]

You guys know since the last patch almost everything is now accessable to free players now right?, Bolto, Akfuries, the starting frames, pro mode litterally everything that was made a complaint about has now been changed

[Litego]

pay2win on a PvE oriented game. whats going on in dev's mind?

I understand they need to generate some sort of income and I would happily do so but restricting me to limited option and forcing a payment to get a wide array of selection does not make me want to donate jack.

very bold move to do on a game that hasn't got the exposure.

Well p2w is much less of a problem in a PvE game than PvP. I don't mind that much about it. However I do not support p2w and will not spend money on p2w games, so there you go, the devs won't get my money unless they remove p2w from the game. A game can be successful and thrive without it, so why make a bad game when you have the option to make it good?

[Venarge]

PvP is a must have, but such pvp that won't affect pve dudes, because i see many enemies of pvp here, but believe m,e there is no less people interested in player versus player modes, it will atract much more people

And again. PVP would cause a massive re balance. Trinity and loki would disappear and everybody would play as ember or something else. Dumb idea.

[Gentlemoa]

And again. PVP would cause a massive re balance. Trinity and loki would disappear and everybody would play as ember or something else. Dumb idea.

I don't think Loki would disappear. It would be fun making himself invisible and attacking your enemy from behind ^^

Trinity would be nice in a Team-Deathmatch PvP mode.

But you are right. PvP is ,now, a bad idea.

[FreshJB2]

TL;DR This game contains grossly overpriced items of little value (color scheme expansion for 5$? Seriously?), severely biased power increase for paying players, and over-all little value contained within the Founders pack. Frankly, if I don't get a T-shirt or a hat, it ain't worth it!

+1. One thing i'd like the devs to consider is that most of this stuff they want real money for is already made. What i mean is, the content is already there, we just pay to use it. If you were to make things $1 and $2, at most, you'd get more people buying more, rather than putting that burden on the most avid fans. While this game is heading in a good direction overall, firefall is offering the best deal out there. I, personally want to play and support both games, but my money is tight and $5 for a color scheme, pistol, or any other trivial object is too much. The platinum system definitely needs reworking. /mytwocents

[FreshJB2]

At that point why not remove Pro and just add a lot more cosmetics/etc to buy?

Possibly increase the Affinity Booster's XP gain (to 3x) and increase the XP weapons/gear need to level-up (by about 33%, so someone with an Affinity Booster gets the same time-to-level-up) if people think paying for the convenience of being able to get more powerful faster is a good idea.

Paying for XP boosts, extra slots and custom designs is ALWAYS the better way to go. Considering the process it takes to design one (let alone eight) characters, the devs could offer custom appearances, extra armor customiztaions (like an alternate helmet/armor) and other non-essential items for pay that, while not necessary, would make you stand out more. They could also add decals to the guns for pay.

While i, personally, don't mind being able to pay for weapons and armor, i do think it should be cheaper and have the option of getting them through in-game currency.