Shield Bypassing Hp Damage - Unwanted

[Mak_Gohae]

I'm pretty sure enemies could get up twice between one health pulse and the next. Those drops are extremely slow.

 

 

Are you not killing them while they are down? If you are not, why are you not killing them?

Remember, you can do more than one thing at a time.

 

Most importantly, when each tick hurts like a b***h you may not have enough time to find a suitable spot to drop the restore, reach said spot, kill the ospreys, switch to melee (which takes too long btw) and fend off other enemies.

 

Yes, it's up you to how to prioritize how you do stuff.

When i play infested i always remember the last tile i went through because since they rush at you, you always have to have an escape plan.

 

 

Any mechanic that completely bypasses a significant component of the player's defenses and can't be overcome by player skill is a bad one, and doubly so when it renders certain playstyles non-viable (particularly ones touted by the developers themselves).

 

 

Player skill can overcome this by killing before they attack and evading afterwards. Your job is to kill the enemy and evader their attacks, this is what is done against every single method or enemy attack.

And it doesnt render any playstyle non-viable, having to adjust for one unit type is not the end of the world.

 

And the reason why shields are/were the "go to" defense is due to the simple fact that they recharge. Conversely, the reason why health-tanking wasn't a popular option was due to the fact that all of the methods to regain health were frame-specific, slow, static, unreliable, or some combination thereof. Incidentally, that hasn't really changed.

 

People should to adjust to a different style, I dont use shields most of the time and i dont end up dying a tremendous amount of time.

Just because it doesnt work like shields it doesnt mean i cannot be done.

 

Giving the player more options in that regard is usually going to be a better alternative than simply forcing them once more into a standardized loadout that ultimately does more to reduce build diversity rather than increase it.

 

I find it strange that people say they dont want to switch mods because that means they are forcing you to use certain mods... that you never use because you never switch mods. Not that any of the mods suggested are required, the suggestions are there to help you along and it's up to you to decide how far you take it.

[Taranis49]

Player skill can overcome this by killing before they attack and evading afterwards. Your job is to kill the enemy and evader their attacks, this is what is done against every single method or enemy attack.

 

Actually, it can't. I covered this in the very post you quoted:

 

"Which isn't always possible, particularly in confined spaces like the New infested ship tileset or the old Corpus ship tileset. They and the clouds can be unavoidable when they're hanging out on the ceiling on the other side of a hallway door and can't be engaged until you go through or when they're camping an elevator. In short, a bunch of the same problems that plague concepts like broken lights/arc traps, and Mag Eximi - they're not reliably avoidable via the use of this thing called "skill"."

 

Mak, ever the defender of bad game mechanics :-P

Edited June 26, 2014 by Taranis49

[Mak_Gohae]

 

Actually, it can't. I covered this in the very post you quoted:

 

"Which isn't always possible, particularly in confined spaces like the New infested ship tileset or the old Corpus ship tileset. They and the clouds can be unavoidable when they're hanging out on the ceiling on the other side of a hallway door and can't be engaged until you go through or when they're camping an elevator. In short, a bunch of the same problems that plague concepts like broken lights/arc traps, and Mag Eximi - they're not reliably avoidable via the use of this thing called "skill"."

 

What's the problem here? Kill or avoid work just as well. Kill them before they attack and if they attack and drop a cloud wait till it disperses.

 

 

Mak, ever the defender of bad game mechanics :-P

 

Mak, the defender of using the tools that the game provides.

 

Anyway, they just took them out of Defense missions because of "pathing and flow" so there's a win for you.

They may yet end up like the arc traps which are a complete waste of space.

[Renegade343]

Mak, the defender of using the tools that the game provides.

Sometimes, the tools must be attacked in order for it to be replaced by a better one. 

 

Always defending existing tools can result in little to no improvements. 

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

 

Player skill can overcome this by killing before they attack and evading afterwards. Your job is to kill the enemy and evader their attacks, this is what is done against every single method or enemy attack.

 

And it doesnt render any playstyle non-viable, having to adjust for one unit type is not the end of the world.

 

 

 

Bull crap. There is no real player skill in this game. If there was, a Mrk 1 Braton with minimal mods could overcome high lvl content, It can't. 

 

The only determining factor in this game is power. Mods, weapons and frames. That's the only thing that works. The lvl of power and how much DPS one can put out is the only contributing factor, dodging doesn't help, given the infested always overrun the positions, even when the Ospreys weren't around.

 

If your weapon, abilities and mods can't provide DPS or utility they're going to be useless. Ever taken a Mag vs high lvl grineer using unranked weapons? The result isn't pretty. Or Volt vs Grineer, when he isn't packing high lvl weapons and mods, Maybe Ember which isn't totally dependent of spamming accelerant. these are a few of play styles are rendered useless through out this game by bad design decisions and poor mechanics. There's a reason why Rhino, Trinity and Nova are go to frames. They ignore or mitigate the shoddy mechanics in the game. 

[Taranis49]

What's the problem here? Kill or avoid work just as well. Kill them before they attack and if they attack and drop a cloud wait till it disperses.

 

Still avoiding the actual point, and hoping you won't get called on it, I see. Bad habit. ;-)

 

Tell me how you kill or dodge one in a narrow hallway when it's hiding on the ceiling on the other side of doorway where it can't be engaged or camping an elevator that isn't gear-reliant, I'd love to hear it. I'll save you the trouble, there isn't one.

 

As noted, hate to break it to you, but player skill isn't a factor in the game, atleast not a significant one - every "challenge" in the game is primarily reliant on gear, that's not challenge, it's the absence of it.

[Mak_Gohae]

Sometimes, the tools must be attacked in order for it to be replaced by a better one. 

 

Always defending existing tools can result in little to no improvements. 

 

You have movement, weapons, abilities, mods, and gear.

All of that should help you stay alive, none of that is going to stop you from dying 100% of the time.

 

If there were actual problems where some of those things were helping at all then i would be on your side. 

I brought up that the Elite Grineer on Earth with the Karak were way too strong and that caused a flipout which ended up with a change.

Im not going to not say something isnt problematic when it is.

 

Bull crap. There is no real player skill in this game. If there was, a Mrk 1 Braton with minimal mods could overcome high lvl content, It can't. 

 

The only determining factor in this game is power. Mods, weapons and frames. That's the only thing that works. The lvl of power and how much DPS one can put out is the only contributing factor, dodging doesn't help, given the infested always overrun the positions, even when the Ospreys weren't around.

 

If your weapon, abilities and mods can't provide DPS or utility they're going to be useless. Ever taken a Mag vs high lvl grineer using unranked weapons? The result isn't pretty. Or Volt vs Grineer, when he isn't packing high lvl weapons and mods, Maybe Ember which isn't totally dependent of spamming accelerant. these are a few of play styles are rendered useless through out this game by bad design decisions and poor mechanics. There's a reason why Rhino, Trinity and Nova are go to frames. They ignore or mitigate the shoddy mechanics in the game. 

 

I never denied that equipment helps because, you know, the game has equipment and i also never claimed that this game was Street Fighter. 

But if this game required no skill and was all about equipment then this wouldn't be a problem, would it?

 

 

Still avoiding the actual point, and hoping you won't get called on it, I see. Bad habit. ;-)

 

Tell me how you kill or dodge one in a narrow hallway when it's hiding on the ceiling on the other side of doorway where it can't be engaged or camping an elevator that isn't gear-reliant, I'd love to hear it. I'll save you the trouble, there isn't one.

 

As noted, hate to break it to you, but player skill isn't a factor in the game, atleast not a significant one - every "challenge" in the game is primarily reliant on gear, that's not challenge, it's the absence of it.

 

How do you kill in a hallway? You put the targeting dot on the enemy when you see it and shoot.

How do you dodge? You run backwards. If it's on the other side of the door way... go back the way you came? Cause if it's on the other side it should not be able to charge the way you came. 

Isnt this common sense?

 

And l dont know where you folks get the idea where skill isnt part of this game.

The fact that there is a unit that causes this much trouble shows that there is. You people are confused on how to deal with something that has little health and charges in straight lines.

[Taranis49]

How do you kill in a hallway? You put the targeting dot on the enemy when you see it and shoot.

How do you dodge? You run backwards. If it's on the other side of the door way... go back the way you came? Cause if it's on the other side it should not be able to charge the way you came. 

Isnt this common sense?

 

And l dont know where you folks get the idea where skill isnt part of this game.

The fact that there is a unit that causes this much trouble shows that there is. You people are confused on how to deal with something that has little health and charges in straight lines.

 

Ahem: "Tell me how you kill or dodge one in a narrow hallway when it's hiding on the ceiling on the other side of doorway where it can't be engaged or camping an elevator that isn't gear-reliant, I'd love to hear it. I'll save you the trouble, there isn't one."

 

Three times you've tried running from that point like a little girl and failed, sorry, you're out. :-P

 

Further, like a bunch of folks, you don't grasp the difference between "punishing" and "challenging". If I walk up behind somebody while they're playing and keep bouncing a volleyball painted like a Roller off the back of their head or unplug their keyboard, it's not actually testing their skill even though they'd definitely have more trouble playing the game. Though, by your standards it would be - hint, this is why your standards are bad.

Edited June 26, 2014 by Taranis49

[Mak_Gohae]

Ahem: "Tell me how you kill or dodge one in a narrow hallway when it's hiding on the ceiling on the other side of doorway where it can't be engaged or camping an elevator that isn't gear-reliant, I'd love to hear it. I'll save you the trouble, there isn't one."

 

Three times you've tried running from that point like a little girl and failed, sorry, you're out. :-P

 

 

It's on the post you quoted. Here it is in bold.

 

 

How do you kill in a hallway? You put the targeting dot on the enemy when you see it and shoot.

How do you dodge? You run backwards. If it's on the other side of the door way... go back the way you came? Cause if it's on the other side it should not be able to charge the way you came. 

Isnt this common sense?

 

 

If this is not providing an answer that satisfies you then can you provide some diagram of what exactly the problem is so i can make marks that you can understand?

 

Since we are using words my understanding of your scenario may be different because of how i read it.

 

 

Further, like a bunch of folks, you don't grasp the difference between "punishing" and "challenging". If I walk up behind somebody while they're playing and keep bouncing a volleyball painted like a Roller off the back of their head or unplug their keyboard, it's not actually testing their skill even though they'd definitely have more trouble playing the game. Though, by your standards it would be - hint, this is why your standards are bad.

 

The unit is the only flyer infested which means they are easy targets to pick out.

They need to dump another unit which means that they do not attack unit this happens.

Before they attack they tell you they are going to attack.

They charge in one direction.

 

There's plenty you can do between all of that to stop the unit.

This unit does not magically teleport in front of you and performs the raging demon.

[Renegade343]

You have movement, weapons, abilities, mods, and gear.

All of that should help you stay alive, none of that is going to stop you from dying 100% of the time.

And we have Toxic damage, which is unfair to us and the enemies. That is not a good thing. 

[JHarlequin]

 At times the damage through shields is almost worthwhile, but right now it is a bit over the top.  Still it hasn't been exactly the stuff always killing me on the breeding grounds missions.  For some reason, just after topping off life and shields, then suddenly instant death to one regular charger attacking me.  It is barely trackable but there just doesn't ever seem to be any other explanation.  Sometimes a single attack just instant kills.  Nice work there but not really important to this discussion, so moving on.

 

 As for the Mutalisks, their behavior and pathing pattern tends to make them kill just like a toxic ancient.  Toxic's don't punch you and then rush you.  No, they run faster then you while sprinting and then pace you so that their toxic aura can kill you almost instantly.  They don't attack most of the time, they just stay near you.  The Mutalisks are similar in that they will be out of sight, and then suddenly drift down and dash passed you leaving a cloud everywhere that you can barely get out of.  If there are two, then yeah, you might as well stand in it while trying to kill one because there won't be any clean air and you are going to die anyway.

 

 To give a few basic ideas that might make this situation a little less frustrating to any player, especially new players that don't have a one shot gun and don't mash 4 every moment of gameplay, the toxic gas that can get spread anywhere and bypass the truly effective method of survival, probably shouldn't do as much damage.  I've been hit by a gang of three disruptor's and taken less damage.  I have been shot at by 10 corpus including a couple tech's and taken less damage.  Hell the Napalms and bombards do less damage over time then toxic damage.  Modding for it only cuts it down, it doesn't stop the damage, which means that it still wittles you down rapidly and will be more likely to kill then any normal infested attack.  So, it really shouldn't do as much damage.

 

 The other idea would be to add extra gear items.  How about a consumable that perhaps halves your shields for a few moments but uses that energy to cleanse and protect the frame from any dot or hazard effects for the time that the shields are weakened?  Certainly a powerful item and might become a quick favorite, but it would still cut off some real hassles.

 

 Another side of how all the constant effects getting annoying in the breeding grounds is that of all the Eximus I have seen during breeding grounds runs, only one has been anything other then parasite.  While players do tend to favor their powers that get them through everything, the answer isn't to make sure they are generally running around without any energy, the answer is to keep the powers from walking through everything.

 

 The mixture of the various effects and the high damage does start to become kind of ridiculous for anyone that doesn't want to just use a maxed out frame and gun for everything they do.

Edited June 26, 2014 by JHarlequin

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

I never denied that equipment helps because, you know, the game has equipment and i also never claimed that this game was Street Fighter. 

But if this game required no skill and was all about equipment then this wouldn't be a problem, would it?

 

 

And yet, given that toxic damage ignores shield mods, that renders all shield equipment irrelevant, The damage procs are so high, maxed vitality does nothing, and as the armour system is broken, unless you're carrying Valkyr, Rhino or Frost lvls of armour Steel Fibre is useless. 

 

So please, tell me how equipment can help in this case? Especially when poison resistance mods only prevent 45% of the damage. None of those have any impact on the effectiveness of the Frame, given that  Mag prime with over 1000 shield is still going to get stomped hard, given that she has no armour, and only 300 base hp. While shields are irrelevant. 

 

So, no equipment doesn't matter. 

 

As you didn't read what I said clearly, it's about power. That's the only deciding factor. The amount of DPS you can generate via mods, weapons and frames. The one exception is Trinity, and she deals with it by ignoring or mitigating almost entirely the mechanics which were supposed to "challenge" players, but just punishes them for not using one of the 3 or the most powerful dps weapons. 

[Gigaus]

@ Mak: Hey, buddy....We get you can't read, but could you stop filling the thread with your stupidity? .....Either come out as a troll, or admit you have no clue what you're talking about so we can move on and have an actual discussion, instead of having to lower ourselves down to your level.

 

No, the game doesn't have skill-- It has been and probably always will be about what you own and having luck [Or money]. There is no skill involved in picking the Best gun, with the highest stats, highest AoE, or picking the Frame that can ignore half the game, or has AoE's from New York to Old York that insta nuke anything under level 9999. As people have pointed out, if skill were involved, mk1 Braton would be viable for every level of the game, the same way Naked-No BF runs are viable in DarkSouls/2.

 

And if enemies completely block a path, while being damageable, going back will change nothing....it's going to be stuck on the same bit of S#&$ it was if you turn around or not. Stop acting like you know all and that everyone with a argument other than your's is an idiot.

---

 

Now could someone please report this jackass so we can have a half reasonable discussion, and avoid getting the thread locked for 'excessive trolling'?

[Naftal]

And yet, given that toxic damage ignores shield mods, that renders all shield equipment irrelevant, The damage procs are so high, maxed vitality does nothing, and as the armour system is broken, unless you're carrying Valkyr, Rhino or Frost lvls of armour Steel Fibre is useless. 

 

So please, tell me how equipment can help in this case? Especially when poison resistance mods only prevent 45% of the damage. None of those have any impact on the effectiveness of the Frame, given that  Mag prime with over 1000 shield is still going to get stomped hard, given that she has no armour, and only 300 base hp. While shields are irrelevant. 

 

So, no equipment doesn't matter. 

 

As you didn't read what I said clearly, it's about power. That's the only deciding factor. The amount of DPS you can generate via mods, weapons and frames. The one exception is Trinity, and she deals with it by ignoring or mitigating almost entirely the mechanics which were supposed to "challenge" players, but just punishes them for not using one of the 3 or the most powerful dps weapons. 

Why do you mod yourself for shields if you know you are going against poison damage? (Infested)

[arisaka]

Why do you mod yourself for shields if you know you are going against poison damage? (Infested)

Maybe because there are other enemies in the Infested faction that don't do exclusively poison damage, and because certain frames can't effectively build much HP at all.

[Liminal]

Are you not killing them while they are down? If you are not, why are you not killing them?

Remember, you can do more than one thing at a time.

Maybe because recovery from radial knockdown attacks is slow, and after that's done you have to choose: do you kill the dudes on the ground or the osprey getting ready to charge again? Oh wait, and that OTHER osprey ... and that Ancient that just spotted you (ie: melee knockdown doesn't take care of flying enemies and it has very limited range, if your weapon has any at all). It's so unforgiving that small things like needing to reload mean you are royally screwed. Once you take a mutalist proc you get zero breathing room no matter what you do (except certain powers I guess).

 

Unless of course you are talking about nuking everything from orbit with frame abilities, which is what these new enemies actually encourage. So much for tactics and skill ...

Edited June 26, 2014 by The_Doc

[Naftal]

Maybe because there are other enemies in the Infested faction that don't do exclusively poison damage, and because certain frames can't effectively build much HP at all.

But hp works against all enemies and melee is very easy to dodge anyway. It's your choice to bring a frame with bad hp against infested. And all those frames have disables to handle the situations too...

[BloodArmoredApostle]

Oh that's funny... 

 

I decide myself whether or not I want to treat the game as a twitch shooter, and it certainly doesn't come down to your or anyone elses decision. It certainly doesn't hurt me or make me perform worse, in fact the reason I perform better than most is probably thanks to this.

Then again I am curious, what decides if twitch reactions is part of the core gameplay here...? Or rather, why can't I treat it as a twitch shooter? What's stopping me? You? 

Please, explain. 

I read your whole reply, but you answered your own question. You, yourself, saw it this way. This would negate a lot of the current mods in place and would turn this game into a bland shooter. Again, your opinion of the matter, but this is not implemented in any fashion in this game which makes that part of your suggestion irrelevant.

 

Customization and tanking would cease to exist as well as a whole level a game play lost if this was implemented.

Edited June 26, 2014 by BloodArmoredApostle

[Mak_Gohae]

And yet, given that toxic damage ignores shield mods, that renders all shield equipment irrelevant, The damage procs are so high, maxed vitality does nothing, and as the armour system is broken, unless you're carrying Valkyr, Rhino or Frost lvls of armour Steel Fibre is useless. 

 

So please, tell me how equipment can help in this case? Especially when poison resistance mods only prevent 45% of the damage. None of those have any impact on the effectiveness of the Frame, given that  Mag prime with over 1000 shield is still going to get stomped hard, given that she has no armour, and only 300 base hp. While shields are irrelevant. 

 

So, no equipment doesn't matter.

 

 

Rank 2 Anti Toxin brought down the poison proc of a rank 25 mutalist to 13hp pec tic which means it does 104 dmg. If you equip it plus some Vitality you should be able to survive several procs. Cloud damage was 27 per tic but since we are all smart enough to run around this should not be a problem. 

 

 

As you didn't read what I said clearly, it's about power. That's the only deciding factor. The amount of DPS you can generate via mods, weapons and frames. The one exception is Trinity, and she deals with it by ignoring or mitigating almost entirely the mechanics which were supposed to "challenge" players, but just punishes them for not using one of the 3 or the most powerful dps weapons.

 

That's equipment.

What is your definition of equipment?

 

Maybe because recovery from radial knockdown attacks is slow, and after that's done you have to choose: do you kill the dudes on the ground or the osprey getting ready to charge again? Oh wait, and that OTHER osprey ... and that Ancient that just spotted you (ie: melee knockdown doesn't take care of flying enemies and it has very limited range, if your weapon has any at all). It's so unforgiving that small things like needing to reload mean you are royally screwed. Once you take a mutalist proc you get zero breathing room no matter what you do (except certain powers I guess).

 

Unless of course you are talking about nuking everything from orbit with frame abilities, which is what these new enemies actually encourage. So much for tactics and skill ...

 

So now you just added some other thing to show how hard it is?

Why dont you add the G3, the Stalker, and Harvester attacking at the same time? Might as well, no?

Then some Eximus for good measure, dont forget the Eximus.

 

Dude, if it gets hard it gets hard, it's up to you to beat the game.

This is why there are people out there calling other folks noobs, so what about this? What about that? And that?

Figure it out, man.

Edited June 26, 2014 by Mak_Gohae

[(PSN)billy-d-squid]

But hp works against all enemies and melee is very easy to dodge anyway. It's your choice to bring a frame with bad hp against infested. And all those frames have disables to handle the situations too...

 

 

No.

 

So which is it? HP is effective or HP isn't? Because if it was effective, then frames with minimal HP and without shields will function fine (which they don't) or HP isn't an effective absorber and because toxic damage ignores shields, you tend to be hit hardest. On top of that, "taking a frame with bad hp" So we should all run Rhino, Trinity and Nova... then everyone screams that they're noobs for using those frames and the game should be harder, which comes back to the original problem that these 3 frames just ignore the "challenge" that was created in the first place, solving absolutely nothing. 

 

HP does not regen, and dropping hp gear to regen when infested are bum rushing you isn't going to happen unless you're spamming fully modded and forma'd Prime gear or super powered AoE spam using mods. Which. goes back to my original point which everyone seems to keep missing, either conveniently or by accident. 

 

Power. It's the only real deciding factor in this game. And no, those frames don't have disabling powers. Ash will get hit with Toxin Procs while in blade storm for God's sake. Ember has an effective range of 20m, Mag will get stomped hard and on and on. So no, these frames suffer disproportionately, they are usable for those of us with an arsenal of potato'd and fully forma'd weapons with a stack of high powered mods. For anyone else? Not a chance. Hence Trinity, Rhino and Nova, and there goes the "challenge"

[Marthrym]

 

So now you just added some other thing to show how hard it is?

Why dont you add the G3, the Stalker, and Harvester attacking at the same time? Might as well, no?

Then some Eximus for good measure, dont forget the Eximus.

 

Dude, if it gets hard it gets hard, it's up to you to beat the game.

This is why there are people out there calling other folks noobs, so what about this? What about that? And that?

Figure it out, man.

G3, Stalker and company are not hard. They're "gear-check" enemies. It's that simple. Though the G3 have a little something extra that can make them more interesting. Sometimes. Maybe.^^'

Eximi would be fine if some of them didn't have unavoidable auras. Half of the time the tilesets they're in make them impossible to kill or dodge without entering their auras. Which is just plain moronic. That's why I think DE went cross-eyed with their auras.

 

Personally I don't have too much problem with the Ospreys. I use Nyx and Life strike (that is of course before enemy scaling goes bonkers, then nothing can really help^^'). AND I avoid Infested like the Black Plague, because I find them boring as frack and far from "challenging", and the addition of the buggy ospreys hasn't done them any good IMHO.^^'

But that's only my opinion, and I'm happy that at least some players find them "fun". And only fools don't change their minds, so who knows? Maybe what's coming with U14 will change my mind! I sincerely hope so.^^

[Naftal]

No.

 

So which is it? HP is effective or HP isn't? Because if it was effective, then frames with minimal HP and without shields will function fine (which they don't) or HP isn't an effective absorber and because toxic damage ignores shields, you tend to be hit hardest. On top of that, "taking a frame with bad hp" So we should all run Rhino, Trinity and Nova... then everyone screams that they're noobs for using those frames and the game should be harder, which comes back to the original problem that these 3 frames just ignore the "challenge" that was created in the first place, solving absolutely nothing. 

 

HP does not regen, and dropping hp gear to regen when infested are bum rushing you isn't going to happen unless you're spamming fully modded and forma'd Prime gear or super powered AoE spam using mods. Which. goes back to my original point which everyone seems to keep missing, either conveniently or by accident. 

 

Power. It's the only real deciding factor in this game. And no, those frames don't have disabling powers. Ash will get hit with Toxin Procs while in blade storm for God's sake. Ember has an effective range of 20m, Mag will get stomped hard and on and on. So no, these frames suffer disproportionately, they are usable for those of us with an arsenal of potato'd and fully forma'd weapons with a stack of high powered mods. For anyone else? Not a chance. Hence Trinity, Rhino and Nova, and there goes the "challenge"

They work fine. At least I don't have any problem using them. If you think just those three frames are viable you are delusional.

 

Yes the frames do have disables or other means to help them and Ash still doesn't take damage while in blade storm even if something procs. You can use any frame against infested. But if you refuse to use any kind of help with your hp when you clearly struggle with hp against this enemy type, it's your choice.

 

Learn to play against melee and the one nonmelee unit in a faction won't be a problem either.

[Liminal]

So now you just added some other thing to show how hard it is?

Why dont you add the G3, the Stalker, and Harvester attacking at the same time? Might as well, no?

Then some Eximus for good measure, dont forget the Eximus.

 

Dude, if it gets hard it gets hard, it's up to you to beat the game.

This is why there are people out there calling other folks noobs, so what about this? What about that? And that?

Figure it out, man.

Stop exaggerating. I mentioned a standard situation with the infested. You don't get ONE osprey and no other enemies around.

Pretty much nobody would be annoyed by toxin if it happened in isolated cases.

The problem I'm trying to explainis that toxin procs affect a normal infested fight (which admittedly is easier than a fight with the other factions) in a disproportionate manner. It multiplies difficulty by a metric $!€#ton simply because our "tools to fight it" are quite ineffective.

Basically put: if you take one proc, any single "detail" immensely affects our efforts to survive an osprey proc.

 

Anyhow, I'm pretty sure Osprey damage has been lowered not long ago. I've yet to meet them. That doesn't change my opinion that bypassing shields should be saved for special/uncommon enemies, not for regular cannon fodder.

[Viverim]

I predominantly do Exterminate, so other experiences may differ, but I have noticed a slight decrease (emphasis on slight) in their spawn rate, and their damage does seem to be toned down.  Additionally they don't seem to proc as often as before.  All good changes.  I still find, however, that for a "light flying minion" type enemy they have a ton of health.  Still a little hard to hit and they still take a lot of damage.

Edited June 27, 2014 by Viverim

[TwiceDead]

I read your whole reply, but you answered your own question. You, yourself, saw it this way. This would negate a lot of the current mods in place and would turn this game into a bland shooter. Again, your opinion of the matter, but this is not implemented in any fashion in this game which makes that part of your suggestion irrelevant.

 

Customization and tanking would cease to exist as well as a whole level a game play lost if this was implemented.

 

So, because the option to stack shield, health and armor along with other damage mitigating devices is in the game, I should stop playing as if hazards and bullets could actually hurt me, and kill as quickly as possible, as if I was playing a twitch-based shooter, which ultimately benefits me and my team in every way possible since I won't be a dumbass and rely on my shields to keep me alive, so I won't waste their time by going down needing them to revive me. . .

It's a fact that good situation awareness, good aim, reflexes and clever movement will keep you alive longer than a doofus relying on his shields. 

It's not an opinion. 

 

I also found it funny that you would use Planetside 2 and Battlefield 4 as examples for twitch-based shooters, while personally I'd go with any old-school arena shooter in currently in existence, but that's just me and I admit that this is an opinion, unlike the previous. 

Edited June 27, 2014 by TwiceDead