Oberon Rework (True Paladin)!

[HavocWolf]

Around 11.5, when Oberon was released, he was classified as a paladin/templar type frame. Currently only the names of the abilities fit the 'paladin' arch-type that Oberon came with. I have some suggestions to make oberon feel much more 'paladin' like. However, first we should discuss what is a paladin.

What are paladin's?

Paladins were actually real things back in the Mid Ages. They believed that they used holy energy to attack. On a side note, if the tenno had any religion, we could use Oberon as a bit of a back story their religion. Or vice versa to use their religion as a back story to why oberon is a paladin type frame.

Anyway back to hit abilities. Paladins were known to be a balance of offensive and defensive roles. From demolishing and their enemies, to buffing and healing their allies. So we should try to incorperate offensive and defensive abilities into his kit. How about as a start, 1 strictly offensive ability, 1 offensive buff ability, 1 defensive heal/buff ability, and 1 offensive but at the same time defensive ult.

SKILLS

Ability 1:

Spear of Light/Divine Spear- Basicly you summon a spear of light, either from the heavens (or what ever the tenno believe in) or make a spear out of your energy and you toss it, going through enemies it hits and doing damage to each of them. Once it hits the ground, it explodes doing AoE damage. There are a few different ways you could implement this. First you could just give it a fix distance. But i suggest a new mechanic that is something a bit more interesting. When you hit the ability it brings up a red circle on the floor. u can move your mouse forward or back to adjust how far or close the spear would land. Since it doesn't use keys you are still mobile and since it doesn't use the mouse's horizontal movement you can still turn left and right. This implementation is kind the same as just aiming at the ground and hitting the ability, but the i feel like giving you a ground reticle gives you a bit more control and accuracy.


OR


Smite- A fiery beam of light comes down and strikes your enemy, and when it hits, explodes dealing damage to enemies in an AoE fasion (something like this, the explosion when it hits the enemy is the AoE except it would be on a bit of a larger scale)
.

Both AoE explosion's from both abilities would knock down enemies as to give them a bit of utility.


Ability 2:


Righteous Fury (Maybe toggle-able?)-This is an offensive buff to you and your fellow Tenno. Granting them increased damage and speed (both movement and attack speed). This might seem overpowered, but if you balance the damage and speed buff so every enemy doesn't get gibbed instantly, it can be a very viable ability to have in any situation.


Ability 3:

Renewal-This ability is almost fine as it is, however a few changes could make it a much better skill than it already is. First of all, an armor buff as long as the buff is active would make this a much more viable ability allowing you to gain more health while in fights taking damage. The skill would also still activate on people, even if at full health, this way if they wind up taking damage while its still active they can still get health back, it would also work if someone wanted to charge in on a bunch of enemies. You apply renewal and boom a great tank, but not op as u can still die with renewal on.. This next change is optional but it would still be a big help to the ability. Instead of a traveling orb, its instant. Finally, in terms of powering up this ability with mods, duration mods should increase how long the HoT lasts, while +power should increase how much each tick heal. Right now they are opposites. Your allies would see a green circle around their feet with green healig energy flowing up kinda like this in addition to the green aura that surrounds the frame:


This would be an above view. It's the closest thing i could find to what it would look like. Just with or without the dragon (the dragon would be a cool touch even though it doesnt fit the paladin arch-type)


OR


(Preferred) Healing Light: Oberon radiates healing light. Basicly everything from renewal, but instead a healing aura that is toggleable. The armor buff, the HoT (Healing over time), the green circle at the bottom (that radiates the light). It affects oberon as well. Seeing as how this would be an aura, maybe it could affect pets as well?


Ability 4:

Reckoning-There really is nothing wrong with this ability. Oberon is known as the 'dunkmaster' throughout the community because of this ability and i think a lot of people like that. There are a few changes to make it better. Such as a damage buff and maybe also drop energy orbs to give it an even bigger supportive role. If energy orb drops were added, they would have a smaller chance to drop than health orbs (20%? (This can be tweaked to be balanced and not overpowered)) and only one orb out of the 2 can drop from each enemy. That means no getting a health AND an energy orb as a drop. It's one or the other. The animation with the ability is also fine, if you wanted/needed to add anything to the animation you could just a a beam of light in addition the the energy ball to make it more flashy. But that's just me.


(SIDE NOTE): Both if Righteous Fury and Healing Light are chosen and are both toggle-able, maybe they can both be toggled on at the same time? At the cost of more energy/second of course. Again I think anything can be balanced with enough time and dedication. This would also make Oberon unique, as he would be the only frame with toggle-able aura heals and buffs! So I would definitely prefer them both to be toggle-able!

 

ABILITY SYNERGY: I tried and I believe succeeded in giving his abilities synergy. The movement speed boost in Righteous Fury helps you stay in range for for your auras. While, the armor buff during Healing Light allows you to actually gain health while under a little bit of fire (you can still go down if your under TOO MUCH fire) and you must pay attention to make sure you don't. 


Anyway thats my take on how to make Oberon lean more towards the 'paladin' arch-type. Oberon is my favorite frame and I play him so often i know what most of his problems are, even if they're small and most people don't notice them. paladins are one of my favorite classes in any game that has them. I'd appreciate some feedback on what you guys think! Thanks for reading!

PS. I know these names for abilities are kinda generic but i couldnt think of any better ones. if you can come up with any post them!

PSS ill be making some changes to the forum as ideas come to me such as why this change to the ability would be more beneficial than the current ability, and also, i'm not really good with numbers so if my abilities are chosen, i'll leave that up to the devs so it's not overpowered or anything :)

Edited July 25, 2014 by HavocWolf

[rechot]

sounds awesome to me. Oberons 1 and 2 is why i dont play him that much he is just too useless as a support 

[HavocWolf]

sounds awesome to me. Oberons 1 and 2 is why i dont play him that much he is just too useless as a support 

Thanks! I also agree about his 1 and 2. They also feel lack luster

[HavocWolf]

Removed

Edited July 16, 2014 by Brawleee

[HavocWolf]

Bump made added a few new abilities and some grammar edits.

[HavocWolf]

Bump made a few grammar changes

Edited July 25, 2014 by HavocWolf

[Yousho]

I love the idea.
I LOVE Oberon as a frame, I LOVE the idea of him...but the abilities...they don't fit so well, so I just can't play him...the ult is really satisfying to use, though. 

This is a great post. What about a Resurrection ability? That could be neat. 
Or maybe an AoE that both damages and heals? 

Also, for the love of god, can DE just go an get sued by Blizzard (It's for the greater good.) and call one of his abilities 'Divine Storm'? Pretty please? 

Edit: I think the Teeno do have some kind of religion. There's something going on with The Lotus, The Stalker something called 'The Warrior' and somebody (possibly us) murdering innocents. Also Excalibur seems to be an object of worship among the Orokin (his statue in The Vaults). 

Also, when The Lotus talks about Alad V she describes it as 'blasphemy.' 
 

Edited July 25, 2014 by Yousho

[HavocWolf]

I love the idea.

I LOVE Oberon as a frame, I LOVE the idea of him...but the abilities...they don't fit so well, so I just can't play him...the ult is really satisfying to use, though.

This is a great post. What about a Resurrection ability? That could be neat.

Or maybe an AoE that both damages and heals?

Also, for the love of god, can DE just go an get sued by Blizzard (It's for the greater good.) and call one of his abilities 'Divine Storm'? Pretty please?

Edit: I think the Teeno do have some kind of religion. There's something going on with The Lotus, The Stalker something called 'The Warrior' and somebody (possibly us) murdering innocents. Also Excalibur seems to be an object of worship among the Orokin (his statue in The Vaults).

Also, when The Lotus talks about Alad V she describes it as 'blasphemy.'

Thanks for the support! As for a redirection ability i think that would be a bit too op :P but what do i know XP but yea his abilities right now are lack luster. I also dont think u can get sued or copying a name ability, as many games have an ability called divine storm (probably) its a different story if its like a company or product name though. As for the religion i like to believe that they do as well. Also I've never been to the vaults I'll prolly go when I get back from vacation! Edited July 25, 2014 by HavocWolf

[Moderius]

Why would you smite the Young Lizard. Why.

 

Also "fixing" Oberon would require a rework from the ground up, basically. Or a major change, at the least. But I wouldn't know where to start, because I don't know what people like about the existing frame enough to really build around. I was like "mehhh" through 30 levels as Oberon. I have him rebuilt and waiting in the foundry for whenever he may be worth playing again.

[011100110110000101101101]

Also Excalibur seems to be an object of worship among the Orokin (his statue in The Vaults). 

 

I highly doubt the Orokin  worship Excalibur or the other Tenno, if you would read Mag's codex entry, the Orokin saw the Tenno as impure mutant freaks.  I think, after the Orokin won the war, they saw the Tenno as heros to be celebrated, but there probably were the odd cults who worshipped the Tenno as gods.

[Yousho]

 

I highly doubt the Orokin  worship Excalibur or the other Tenno, if you would read Mag's codex entry, the Orokin saw the Tenno as impure mutant freaks.  I think, after the Orokin won the war, they saw the Tenno as heros to be celebrated, but there probably were the odd cults who worshipped the Tenno as gods.

 

Still, the religious undertones are throughout the game, at least, it seems to me like they are. 

Maybe 'religious' is the wrong word, since they may not involve a God...Maybe 'devoted' undertones. 

[011100110110000101101101]

Still, the religious undertones are throughout the game, at least, it seems to me like they are. 

Maybe 'religious' is the wrong word, since they may not involve a God...Maybe 'devoted' undertones. 

I completely agree that there are religous undertones with some parts of the game, especially with Vor and his cult of the corrupted.  I just disagree with what the Orokin worshipped.

[HavocWolf]

Why would you smite the Young Lizard. Why.

 

Also "fixing" Oberon would require a rework from the ground up, basically. Or a major change, at the least. But I wouldn't know where to start, because I don't know what people like about the existing frame enough to really build around. I was like "mehhh" through 30 levels as Oberon. I have him rebuilt and waiting in the foundry for whenever he may be worth playing again.

I have a build right now that puts him on par with other frames IF they are unmodded. However it still takes a lot of effort to play him even with my build. What do u think of my rework though? I think it makes him unique (auras) and paladin like at the same time :)

Edited July 25, 2014 by HavocWolf

[HavocWolf]

Still, the religious undertones are throughout the game, at least, it seems to me like they are. 

Maybe 'religious' is the wrong word, since they may not involve a God...Maybe 'devoted' undertones. 

 

I completely agree that there are religous undertones with some parts of the game, especially with Vor and his cult of the corrupted.  I just disagree with what the Orokin worshipped.

I also agree with the tenno worshiping something. I also wonder if the corpus and grineer, knowing how they are 2 different factions of the same species, worship the same thing or different diety's. But that is a topic for another time, can we get back to the OP please? :)

[Yousho]

I also agree with the tenno worshiping something. I also wonder if the corpus and grineer, knowing how they are 2 different factions of the same species, worship the same thing or different diety's. But that is a topic for another time, can we get back to the OP please? :)

Never! What has been Hijacked, cannot be UN-Hijacked. 

Okay...Lets...

I think, if your serious about trying to re-design him, you probably first need to understand and define what about him people like now. Also, wouldn't have dual-auras make him a bit too 'passive'? That said, Nova is probably the only frame I use more than 2 abilities on...

 

[HavocWolf]

Never! What has been Hijacked, cannot be UN-Hijacked. 

Okay...Lets...

I think, if your serious about trying to re-design him, you probably first need to understand and define what about him people like now. Also, wouldn't have dual-auras make him a bit too 'passive'? That said, Nova is probably the only frame I use more than 2 abilities on...

 

I will add a bit more to the post about what people like and don't like. However, i disagree about the passive-ness. The abilties a bit, but the action the player must take to get the most use or 100% out of the auras is not at all passive. It requires you to be mobile (the movement speed bonus with his 2 helps with that SYNERGY! :D) and manage your energy to a bigger degree.

 

I tried and i believe succed in giving his abilities synergy. The movement speed boost in Righteous Fury helps you stay in range for Healing LIght and helps keep you in range for your auras. And the armor buff during healing light allows you to actually gain health while under a little bit of fire (you can still go down if your under TOO MUCH fire) and you must pay attention. 

Edited July 25, 2014 by HavocWolf

[Pbrandon1]

Hmm, I would prefer for Hallowed Ground to probably get changed where Oberon slams down a large device that if any teammate comes near, it will heal them and if any enemies come near it will poison them, causing them to slowly lose health or radiation...think of it like when people take too much medicine they get sink or they can't handle the overwhelming amount that it will get them sick.

 

The Warframes are built to deal with that amount and channel the excess out and take in what they need.

 

Other then that..good post.

[HavocWolf]

Hmm, I would prefer for Hallowed Ground to probably get changed where Oberon slams down a large device that if any teammate comes near, it will heal them and if any enemies come near it will poison them, causing them to slowly lose health or radiation...think of it like when people take too much medicine they get sink or they can't handle the overwhelming amount that it will get them sick.

 

The Warframes are built to deal with that amount and channel the excess out and take in what they need.

 

Other then that..good post.

Thanks! But most people i have asked said they believe Oberon needs an entire rework on his 1 and 2 and a little bit on his 3.

[Cyberspace100]

I love the idea, fully supportive of an oberon rework. +1

[Moderius]

I have a build right now that puts him on par with other frames IF they are unmodded. However it still takes a lot of effort to play him even with my build. What do u think of my fix though? I think it makes him unique (auras) and paladin like at the same time :)

 

What you're building is a whole new frame. It's not a "fix", it's a whole different concept.

 

I think people really latch onto the Paladin thing a little too much. Yes, he would better as a tanky healer. But he's not that right now. If you want to "fix" him then you have to rearrange the tools he has, into a more cohesive kit.

[HavocWolf]

I love the idea, fully supportive of an oberon rework. +1

Thanks!

[HavocWolf]

What you're building is a whole new frame. It's not a "fix", it's a whole different concept.

 

I think people really latch onto the Paladin thing a little too much. Yes, he would better as a tanky healer. But he's not that right now. If you want to "fix" him then you have to rearrange the tools he has, into a more cohesive kit.

I meant to say "rework", my bad :P. It has been fixed. :)

[Moderius]

I personally think Oberon should get a big bump in Armor, and have his Renewal just grant a portion of his armor to himself and allies for a period of time. His Reckoning should knock enemies down and slow them for a degrading duration (the visual effect could use a rework, too) and increase the chance to drop an energy orb for affected enemies (health orbs were redundant with his heal anyway)

 

I think Hallowed Ground could stand to be something defensive. Cover, a bullet-deflecting shield, whatever. I hate Hallowed Ground as it is. Smite is also lackluster, and could stand to do something additional, like blind the target for a duration. Also the targeting is awful for Smite.

 

Ignoring Hallowed Ground, because of the previously mentioned hatred, that would at least make Oberon tanky, have some team-oriented utility, and some CC. Also I hate Hallowed Ground.

[(PSN)oracle-ryuu]

What you're building is a whole new frame. It's not a "fix", it's a whole different concept.

 

I think people really latch onto the Paladin thing a little too much. Yes, he would better as a tanky healer. But he's not that right now. If you want to "fix" him then you have to rearrange the tools he has, into a more cohesive kit.

 

To this i Agree-

 

Havoc wolfs concepts aren't bad, but it would require a lot of work, and thats work the Digital extremes will "probably" not ever do.

 

Moderius's approach is a lot simpler to handle, making it a lot more approachable. havoc wolf is right, in that oberon's abilities need to better reflect that of a paladins, but lets try to use tools he has (moderius) to achieve that

 

ABILITY 1: SMITE

 

Whats wrong with this power? well for one its useless almost right off the bat, let alone at later levels. all it does is some moderate damage to one target,  and send out non-tracking orbs that may-or may not, slightly inconvenience other enemies. ow can it be made better? i know what you're all thinking, but no.. its not a damage buff. but tracking orbs would help it be better. instead what we really want here is UTILITY, a function that makes it useful in ALL situations. something like a debuff or a stun. For smite, allowing the additional orbs to home in on targets and detonate on impact, causing moderate damage and an AOE/Knockdown/stun, would be extremely practical, especially when enemies get tougher. remember damage isn't key here, seeing as most damage abilities fall off later anyways. giving smite these utilities would help Oberon's survivability in large group situations by letting him control the mobs around him, which benefits everyone really.

 

Ability 2: HALLOWED GROUND

 

now this one is an interesting idea, but again, minor damage over time is barely useful, though it does work relatively well early on. what can make this one better? still not damage...again think UTILITY! but first , what does hallowed ground do? it creates a field of holy fire/energy on the ground that damages enemies who stand in it. pretty straightforward, and it sounds good on paper, but in practice, ....well, lets put it this way. how useful is a small patch on the ground in a fast pace space ninja game where the enemies rarely decide to stay put for very long and probably end up getting killed before they even have the chance to step on your holy patch? exactly. don't misunderstand, HALLOWED GROUND STILL HAS APPLICATIONS! especially as it can be spammed! you can literally lay down as many as you want at a time,(I am not sure if this compiles the damage though). this really shines in defense missions or bottleneck points. but even then, the  enemies won't be standing there for long.and receiving two of three ticks of damage ain't gonna ruin any Grineers day. solution? ADD LONG LASTING EFFECTS! a proc for the ability would be GREAT! something like radiation, which would confuse enemies and turn them against each other! this would make it a great nix-esque trap. OR perhaps the field trap can slow enemies the stand on it down, forcing them to stay on the patch longer and receive more damage. this would help it TRULY become a bottleneck trap! the only other thing i could suggest for it at the moment is that perhaps allies that stand in the trap receive a long lasting buff, or heal while in it, but maybe we should save that for something else....lets say...RENEWAL?

 

Ability 3: RENEWAL

 

THIS SORELY NEED A BUFF! theres no other way to put it! currently this heals for anywhere from "not a lot" to " Darnit, I died before it could help me!" so, lets talk buffs. first off all the base heal time and how much it heals for. heals for 100 health over 15 seconds....ok that nice i guess for beginners.. lets take it to maxed. 200 health  over 10 seconds? .....ok lets face....how much is 200 health end game....and over ten seconds? what help is that? you might as well just pop a team health restore and be done with it! this needs to be rearranged so that its not just "slightly helpful"...which is pushing it at any time unless you're out of combat, and who's gonna wait around for tens seconds to be healed for only 200 health? NOT ME I CAN TELL YAH THAT MUCH! how can we make it better? how does it actually work? well, lets say you increased power strength. then it would heal for more health over the same amount of time. increasing durability will actually LESSEN the time it takes to heal for the same amount. thats...a little weird...SO! lets change it! the same basic concepts will apply except they're be rearranged, so power strength will increase the amount of health healed, but by a "per second" basis, not and "overall" basis. next, duration should actually just make it last longer, like you would think it would. this means that power strength means more health for short term, and duration would mean the same per second health for longer, put them together, a lot more health, a lot faster, a lot longer. still, something is missing, its still not going to be terribly effective if your enemies are going to shoot you in the face and you take any (or more) damage than you heal for. INTRODUCING THE BUFF! instead of just healing, this could add an armor buff! or a speed buff! .....OR BOTH! ..well...maybe just one, and if i had to choose one it would be Armor, leave the speed buff to Volt. this would help Oberon be the tanky healer he WAS PROMISED TO BE. seriously his armor is literally average, but an armor buff could fix that! maybe at max rank, renewal can add 50% of Oberon's current armor to all affected allies...yes including himself. I'm not going to rag on the orb travel speed too much.....TOO much. there does need to be a balance after all. but maybe make it faster than loki at least? that way it will EVENTUALLY get there. finally, the application of Renewal. why do i need to be hurt in order for this to work? i need to be able to PRE-EMPTIVELY apply this ability, not get hurt, realize im hurt, then spend 2 seconds taking damage while casting a spell thats going to heal me for the first hits a took...in TEN SECONDS. the ability should be applied, whether or not you have taken damage, especially if you add the armor buff as suggested, because who wants to get hurt to apply a buff that is supposed to help PREVENT you from getting hurt! RAISE YOUR HANDS!!! anyways, onto the final volley.

 

ABILITY 4: RECKONING

 

now...this ability is...actually ok? yeah, it really DOESN'T need to be changed.....BUT! here are some possible changes since we're at it anyways. for one, the health orbs. ok, i get this is a primarily offensive ability, but if your gonna give it a healing aspect, them maybe you make it heal for a percentage of the damage done? but it would only heal allies within the range of the enemies being damaged. so to make it clear, reckoning still smacks people down for a slam dunk. but now, allies, (and the casting oberon) who are in range of the enemies being damaged, will received a percentage of the damage dealt as health. that means oberon WOULD NOT receive  health from all the damaged enemies, only enemies that are close enough to him when he casts it (cause lets be fair, oberon needs a buff, but not THAT big a buff). it IS a little complex, but to give him a percentage of damage dealt from ALL the enemies? trust me when i say there would be a surplus of max efficiency, max ranged oberons out there, spamming away, and thats only really fun for the one spamming. if not that, then maybe health orbs drop based on how much damage is done, and not depending on whether or not the enemy dies, (and even then its only a chance).

 

so thats my rant/suggestion. perhaps in terms of base stats they could give him 90 armor but I'm not going to harp on that idea. i'd like to know what you guys think, and if you like it maybe we could get Digital Extremes to consider some, if not all, the changes.

Edited July 26, 2014 by (PS4)oracle-ryuu

[fatpig84]

His original Renewal gave people a weaker version of quick thinking.

DE "fixed" that because to them it's functional immortality.