Research Labs Aren't A Garbage Bin, De

[--FORMA--]

Imagine if there where a Loadout-style weapon building lab. That would be perfect.

[TheAscendedOne]

I think you and I play a very different game. Every gun is decent if you choose to put in the effort and energy to make your weapons good. From what I read, other then silly logistics issues, is that you want more Power Creep.

 

What, Soma isn't good enough for you?

 

Power Creep? I want the exact opposite of power creep. I want more of the top-tier investment weapons to actually be on par with existing top-tier weapons. That would even the game out and give players more options, not less.

 

And no, you're completely wrong. You can give a Supra full forma. It's still going to be inferior to a Soma. You can fully forma a Spectra. It's still going to be worse than a bloody Lato. Even if forma brought things like the Attica up to par (which it doesn't), that's not an argument in the weapons favor. If one weapon is good without investment and the other requires investment to be as good as the baseline other weapon, the second weapon is objectively worse.

[Sidathe]

Power Creep? I want the exact opposite of power creep.

Wouldn't the exact opposite of Power Creep be us getting weaker?

[Lunarsage]

I would have less of a problem with weapons going to clan tech if they weren't consistently terrible weapons. 80% of clan tech are subpar weapons that need massive buffs to even be moderately comparable to market weapons. And that list of effective market weapons is miniscule. I could care less if a weapon is is clan research, but the least they could do is make the weapon's effectiveness and mechanics proportional to the amount of investment required to build the average clan tech weapon. Why are all these weapons that require specialized (and expensive) clan materials, excessive amounts of forma, and weeks of research time utter crap? It makes no sense.

Resource costs are already not proportional at all to weapon strength, which is also something that needs to be fixed. 5 Neural Sensors for a Kama (and thus 10 total for Dual Kamas). 10 Cells for Detron and 4 for Vectis. Don't get me started on the nonsensical platinum pricing.

[Mazrim]

Every gun is decent?Well have you tried spectra? no ? you may claim i did not forma it enough NOPE 4 forma and it is as useless as it came out 

Yes I have, actually. It's arguably better then the Flux Rifle because Pistol mods. It made me regret potatoing my Flux Rifle. And I used that before Damage 2.0 where it was absolutely amazing. This is like people saying "Loki doesn't need Switch Teleport." Just because you say one thing doesn't mean your opinion should be taken as fact.

 

 

And no, you're completely wrong. You can give a Supra full forma. It's still going to be inferior to a Soma. You can fully forma a Spectra. It's still going to be worse than a bloody Lato. Even if forma brought things like the Attica up to par (which it doesn't), that's not an argument in the weapons favor. If one weapon is good without investment and the other requires investment to be as good as the baseline other weapon, the second weapon is objectively worse.

If you can't make a weapon decent through effort becase you legitimately enjoy using the weapon in question, then perhaps you should just stick with the meta. I for one, will enjoy my Spectra and Attica.

[TheAscendedOne]

 

If you can't make a weapon decent through effort becase you legitimately enjoy using the weapon in question, then perhaps you should just stick with the meta. I for one, will enjoy my Spectra and Attica.

 

 

I main a Sybaris. So meta.

[(PSN)friedricetheman]

Research weapons are not trash tier.

I have a 5 forma Ignis that melts mobs in a matter of seconds when combined with Accelerant. See my Ignis build in my ember playing guide series that I have just posted today. I can take down a level 90+ Corrupted Heavy Gunner without breaking a sweat with that build.

Also, my Ogris is a weapon of mass destruction that makes most players rage quit when they see me using it.

The Dual Ichors are one of the best melee weapons around.

Lab research weapons really shine when you give them some love (ie. throw a few forma)

Edited June 27, 2014 by (PS4)friedricetheman

[(PSN)Pengu_Imperialus]

I think people have no concept how op some of the "top tier" weapons are.

[Instinction]

the clan lab thread again? Okay, One more time:

 

Hello, F2P game here, buddy?

 

Pay to get it immediately or wait your turn as everyone else.

 

End of story.

 

There was literally not a single thing in the op about the wait time.

 

This isn't about the wait time, it's about generic trash weapons being thrown into a place that is supposed to have UNIQUE weaponry.

If it isn't unique, why on earth would we need to spend 3 days researching it??

Pretty sure any run of the mill crap rifle doesn't require scientific research into it to construct.

[TheAscendedOne]

Research weapons are not trash tier.

I have a 5 forma Ignis that melts mobs in a matter of seconds when combined with Accelerant. See my Ignis build in my ember playing guide series that I have just posted today. I can take down a level 90+ Corrupted Heavy Gunner without breaking a sweat with that build.

Also, my Ogris is a weapon of mass destruction that makes most players rage quit when they see me using it.

The Dual Ichors are one of the best melee weapons around.

Lab research weapons really shine when you give them some love (ie. throw a few forma)

 

 

No one has ever said that there aren't really good research weapons. Some of them really shine, especially in the bio and chem labs. But there are also many legitimately bad research weapons - primarily in the energy section. 

[Renegade343]

You make a point on dual weapons being difficult to learn to use, but that's why they require their own leveling, even if you've already mastered the single. What does affinity represent, if not learning how to use the weapon?

 

There is no logical reasoning behind requiring a special blueprint or orokin cells or a link or any other arbitrary grind thing to figure out that you can hold a pistol in each hand. The dual cestra are simply the worst example by far.

 

And yes, I'll be a little ironic here. The Mutalist is exactly what I want from a research weapon. It just doesn't fit into any of the labs thematically. Maybe if there was a "Hybrid Technology" lab, it would be right at home.

Orokin Cells are meant as a link for both weapons so that they can share the mods, as far as I know (and seems the most plausible). 

 

And speaking of Hybrid Technology, can we have a Tinkerer's Lab as a module in our ships for that? Make random weaponry that does varying things. 

[Lunarsage]

Research weapons are not trash tier.

I have a 5 forma Ignis that melts mobs in a matter of seconds when combined with Accelerant. See my Ignis build in my ember playing guide series that I have just posted today. I can take down a level 90+ Corrupted Heavy Gunner without breaking a sweat with that build.

Also, my Ogris is a weapon of mass destruction that makes most players rage quit when they see me using it.

The Dual Ichors are one of the best melee weapons around.

Lab research weapons really shine when you give them some love (ie. throw a few forma)

Those weapons are all all from the pevious era of clan tech, where they were unique for their time, sans the Ichors. We're talking about the recent flood of reinforcement weapons that are all released into clan research.

[Ritchel]

the newer upcoming weapons are intended for newbies & content addition

 

and it is intended to build up mastery to rank 30

 

and it is for you to grind them, thats all what you do in this game anyway lol

 

clantech weapon and market is a pool of random weak and strong weapon

 

grind grind grind.

[-HAKUNA-YOUR-TATAS-]

Those weapons are all all from the pevious era of clan tech, where they were unique for their time, sans the Ichors. We're talking about the recent flood of reinforcement weapons that are all released into clan research.

Right you are. In your earlier post you mentioned about how the crafting requirements are nonsense and I believe all of these quirks negatively affect the way a newer player sees clan tech. Beyond mastery points for mastery rank's sake, why should someone even build some of these weapons?

[Brahmastra]

Its pretty sad. Clan tech used to be something special.. something more endgame..  Now that stuff is even more common than the market.

[LikeABawsh]

I agree with the notion of buffing some of the clan weapons. However, I gotta rep the energy dojo and say that the Cestras are not garbage. They're pretty ok.

 

Anywho, +1

[ONiMETSU_Z]

the clan lab thread again? Okay, One more time:

 

Hello, F2P game here, buddy?

 

Pay to get it immediately or wait your turn as everyone else.

 

End of story.

You literally did not read the OP, did you? 

This is nothing about complaining about having to wait.

Calm down.

[aSmileyLemon]

 

1) Make all research weapons actually viable. Buff up trash like the Attica, Supra, Dera, Flux Rifle, Spectra, etc.

Once upon a time, the Flux Rifle was a weapon of the gods.

[Noxonion]

Supra's bad? Watch your mouth, buddy.

[FailMedicXIII]

I actually agree with this. I think some weapons should actually be in the market instead of always being in the clan.

[ONiMETSU_Z]

Supra's bad? Watch your mouth, buddy.

 

It is bad. For what it is, it simply can't compare to any other automatic other than the Gorgon. It's literally just a really inaccurate Gorgon with slow travel speed and puncture damage. This weapon doesn't have any uniqueness to it over other weapons to be classified as clan-tech, and it doesn't have the damage to make it end-game tier.

 

As I see it, if it's not helping me through end-game content, or it doesn't have a distinctive uniqueness to it, it's a waste to be clan-tech.

 

The effort to make these weapons should be reserved for stuff that's actually worth making. 

[WhisperByte]

Not gonna happen, OP. DEvs realized that clan tech is a great gating mechanism that promotes plat purchases so it's gonna stay. It's no longer about uniqueness. Profit numbs the feeling

[Tulzscha]

Moved to the proper section.

[(PSN)IIIDevoidIII]

Why have so many people that posted here, haven't even read to understand the OP, and just pasted the same power creep junk.

 

Yes, unique weapons go here, a lot of them really belong in the market.

[TheAscendedOne]

Those weapons are all all from the pevious era of clan tech, where they were unique for their time, sans the Ichors. We're talking about the recent flood of reinforcement weapons that are all released into clan research.

 

Ichors WERE unique at their introduction. They were the only melee that allowed the wielded to hold charge attacks for a longer duration and release them at will.