What Is The Logic Behind M Prime Speed Up?

[TheCometCE]

I keep getting this same response over and over, and I'm getting tired of it.

 

Everyone keeps telling me they run -power strength m prime to speed up their defense runs (despite encountering it in survival as well), while I get to sit and try to explain that as the game goes on, they're making CC through elements impossibly short and effectively bordering on trolling by buffing enemy dps.

 

I don't get it, where down the line did someone think it was a good idea to allow this to even be a thing? All it does it make me frustrated and leave a defense pub drop early because I'm not a fan of having my face eaten at the speed of sound by chargers.

[Trowicia]

The only time M. Prime is actually USEFUL is against infested for 1 specific purpose: farming credits from Sechura, Pluto. I don't usually run with -Power Strength on my Nova, and I was shunned for this numerous times. These are $&*&*#(%& players I've just encountered, that's all.

Edited June 29, 2014 by Trowicia

[7grims]

From what I know, this is actually a bug, that the devs decided to keep, or to stay for a wile...

[fishworshipper]

Lightspeed Ancient Disruptors are not fun.

[HitPointPredator]

Screw logic, its a game. That crap doesn't belong here. 

The increased speed has its uses though, it helps during Infested defense as it increase the speed which the Infested march towards their death.

[taiiat]

*shrugs* i have no problem with Speedup, avoiding the vast majority of the Damage regardless how fast they may or may not shoot pretty much negates the extra potential Damage.

 

having more bullets flying at me certainly makes it a bit more difficult to avoid taking Damage, but normally it's still just fine.

 

besides, someone else can pick up CC then if you have Speedup.

 

 

 

you've already solved the problem though, if a match has Speedup, just leaving is the right thing to do if you don't want Speedup.

The only time M. Prime is actually USEFUL is against infested in defense missions

that's interesting, since MPrime has fantasic CC, Range, and Power. making it useful in everything but like.... an Exterminate Mission.

[fishworshipper]

that's interesting, since MPrime has fantasic CC, Range, and Power. making it useful in everything but like.... an Exterminate Mission.

I do believe he was referring to Speed Prime.

[Iraetus]

Vauban Vortex on a Loki Decoy with - Strength M Prime makes up the infested Death March.

[Drlathe]

I would imagine the idea is to partner it with a loki running a max range radial disarm build, that way they all group together at the defense objective and then you can pop everyone in one shot. You could add uncle booben to the mix running a vortex build so the defense objective never gets harmed. The same strategy can be applied to survival except in survival you are the defense objective. You could also add bonedaddy (nekros) to maximize loot. For anything other then that, maybe people like enemys to go fast like us?

[(PSN)StoneRevolver]

I don't have any issues with my duration build, and I've used it for everything.

 

Including 60 min+ T3 survival. Granted we don't have T4 yet. But you get the point.

[AdunSaveMe]

I'm sick of it, personally. It doesn't just increase speed. It increases attack speed and recovery time, too.

 

It would all be so much better if neg strength Novas would STOP RUNNING THIS BUILD UNLESS YOU HAVE A VAUBAN OR SOMETHING TO WORK WITH. The extra 200% damage taken is NOT worth it, I don't care if you think it speeds missions up, it also speeds up our deaths and makes it really hard to kill stuff.

Defense missions go fast enough. ODD goes fast enough. Are you seriously so impatient you'd BUFF the enemy just to avoid waiting a couple more seconds per wave? STOP IT. I BEG YOU. Christ, by all means have fun, but find a way to do it that DOESN'T ruin it for other people. Not everyone loves your super op speed build.

 

Also, the explosion does very little damage, which when coupled with removing the slow debuff on enemies, pretty much means you are gutting the ability and making it wholly worthless.

Edited June 29, 2014 by AdunSaveMe

[Kurnuttaja]

What amazes me most is that DE decided to keep this "bug" around for griefers to joy.

[Trowicia]

that's interesting, since MPrime has fantasic CC, Range, and Power. making it useful in everything but like.... an Exterminate Mission.

 

I understand that, but that's not the point I was making.

 

I was saying that increasing the speed of enemies with M. Prime is useless in every instance except Infested on Defense missions. Yes, adding Power Strength and Range does make Molecular Prime demolish everything in an area, that being said I'm always in favor of power strength and range versus speedy enemies, but some other players as Nova wouldn't agree with my decision.

 

To address the topic at hand: I feel like this "new meta" for Nova is slowly creeping its way in (starting with Sechura, Pluto), and I absolutely hate it. I want these people to be aware that I'm playing Warframe, not Sanicframe.

Edited June 29, 2014 by Trowicia

[SquirmyBurrito]

I'm sick of it, personally. It doesn't just increase speed. It increases attack speed and recovery time, too.

 

It would all be so much better if neg strength Novas would STOP RUNNING THIS BUILD UNLESS YOU HAVE A VAUBAN OR SOMETHING TO WORK WITH. The extra 200% damage taken is NOT worth it, I don't care if you think it speeds missions up, it also speeds up our deaths and makes it really hard to kill stuff.

Defense missions go fast enough. ODD goes fast enough. Are you seriously so impatient you'd BUFF the enemy just to avoid waiting a couple more seconds per wave? STOP IT. I BEG YOU. Christ, by all means have fun, but find a way to do it that DOESN'T ruin it for other people. Not everyone loves your super op speed build.

 

Warframe is not the kind of game that punishes the impatient. It gives us numerous tools to speed things up. -power strength nova builds being one of the best. I actively encourage these builds when I am 

A) Playing Vauban.

or

B) Not planning on staying very long (Sechura). 

 

That (IMO) is the only acceptable build for infested in those situations. Not all of us feel like spending extra time just standing around waiting for our enemies to finally get to us.

[AdunSaveMe]

Warframe is not the kind of game that punishes the impatient. It gives us numerous tools to speed things up. -power strength nova builds being one of the best. I actively encourage these builds when I am 

A) Playing Vauban.

or

B) Not planning on staying very long (Sechura). 

 

That (IMO) is the only acceptable build for infested in those situations. Not all of us feel like spending extra time just standing around waiting for our enemies to finally get to us.

And IMO not all of us want to trade a few seconds of waiting for an annoying buff.

 

These builds can sometimes be useful, if you have someone like a Vauban. If not, it's not useful, for the reasons I listed.

 

There is absolutely nothing to warrant forcing it on people who don't want it or do not have a nearby Vauban.

 

Not all of you feel like waiting for a whopping total of five seconds for the enemies to trickle in, but not all of us would rather have this buff on the enemy, especially when we don't have a Vauban or are not playing Defense.

Edited June 29, 2014 by AdunSaveMe

[EdBazokatone]

The only reason is farming credits/ranking weapons faster. I don't see why you are so dramatic about it, it just for 5 wave runs, or longer with a vauban.

Edited June 29, 2014 by EdBazokatone

[AdunSaveMe]

The only reason is farming credits/ranking weapons faster. I don't see why you are so dramatic about it, it just for 5 wave runs, or longer with a vauban.

This stuff sees action in most game modes, not just Defense or credit/exp runs.

 

We don't even get the choice. It's either endure a type of play we don't want anything to do with, or leave.

And leaving is not a fix, nor is it a continuously viable option.

Edited June 29, 2014 by AdunSaveMe

[SquirmyBurrito]

And IMO not all of us want to trade a few seconds of waiting for an annoying buff.

 

These builds can sometimes be useful, if you have someone like a Vauban. If not, it's not useful, for the reasons I listed.

 

There is absolutely nothing to warrant forcing it on people who don't want it or do not have a nearby Vauban.

 

Not all of you feel like waiting for a whopping total of five seconds for the enemies to trickle in, but not all of us would rather have this buff on the enemy, especially when we don't have a Vauban or are not playing Defense.

 

1. If you're the one playing Nova, play however you wish to play.

2. If you aren't the one playing Nova, either abort or get over it.

3. If you do not plan on going to very high waves/time there is very little reason NOT to use this strategy. Faster infested doesn't mean much if you avoid them/kill them before they can do anything (if my non-invisibility build Loki can survive the zombie sonics, so can your whatever).

4. It isn't just five seconds that is lost, especially on bigger maps. It is even worse when you have a Nova playing the exact opposite build, slowing everything down to a crawl (and whatever the crawler equivalent is). 

5. Defense is not the only mission where this strategy is useful. Defense, Survival, Mobile Defense, Extermination, and invasion should all benefit from this strategy.

Edited June 29, 2014 by SquirmyBurrito

[EdBazokatone]

This stuff sees action in most game modes, not just Defense or credit/exp runs.

 

We don't even get the choice. It's either endure a type of play we don't want anything to do with, or leave.

And leaving is not a fix, nor is it a continuously viable option.

 

Well... I agree, but you are going into a deeper territory there, where the problem lies in the random matchmaking system. Nobody gets that choice, the ones bothered by some Nova speeding things are not the only ones suffering from that.

 

I could point out many scenarios where other frames could change the flow of any game, as an example, you might find Nyx casting chaos during infested defense missions, where normally the enemies would go to the pod and the party would focus their fire there, but because of chaos every enemy would stop moving towards the pod to fight themselves, slowing every wave. This particular case bothers me.

 

In the end... people should know how and when to use their abilities to the better outcome of the mission. In the case of Nova speeding things, I see no problem for 5 wave runs for credits/exp, which are the only runs I encountered that kind of build.

[AdunSaveMe]

1. If you're the one playing Nova, play however you wish to play.

2. If you aren't the one playing Nova, either abort or get over it.

3. If you do not plan on going to very high waves/time there is very little reason NOT to use this strategy. Faster infested doesn't mean much if you avoid them/kill them before they can do anything (if my non-invisibility build Loki can survive the zombie sonics, so can your whatever).

4. It isn't just five seconds that is lost, especially on bigger maps. It is even worse when you have a Nova playing the exact opposite build, slowing everything down to a crawl (and whatever the crawler equivalent is). 

5. Defense is not the only mission where this strategy is useful. Defense, Survival, Mobile Defense, Extermination, and invasion should all benefit from this strategy.

I've already given my input on all these points

[Azawarau]

The only time M. Prime is actually USEFUL is against infested for 1 specific purpose: farming credits from Sechura, Pluto. I don't usually run with -Power Strength on my Nova, and I was shunned for this numerous times. These are $&*&*#(%& players I've just encountered, that's all.

If you play around with numbers a bit you can get infested that move at average speed but still get debuffed

 

That way you arent killing your team and are still being useful

[taiiat]

I would imagine the idea is to partner it with a loki running a max range radial disarm build, that way they all group together at the defense objective and then you can pop everyone in one shot. You could add uncle booben to the mix running a vortex build so the defense objective never gets harmed. The same strategy can be applied to survival except in survival you are the defense objective. You could also add bonedaddy (nekros) to maximize loot.

this person freaking gets it.

 

 

 

and once again, avoiding your Enemies should be something you're always doing, it's the single most effective way to avoid taking Damage.

i don't usually see the need for Speedup either, but if it was to happen in some Missions, i'd be fine with it, since the Enemies would all instantly die. aside from that, i don't think i've ever even seen PuG's with Speedup, other than Sechura. i play all kinds of random Missions, and i actually haven't seen anyone using this strategy. 

 

and yes, in this situation, the answer is absolutely to leave the match if Players are playing in a way you don't like. the same applies for any Player which may be playing in a manner which you don't like. 

asking them politely to avoid using the Power may also be a possibility, however.

[SquirmyBurrito]

I've already given my input on all these points

 

You gave your input... Am I supposed to not post just because you did? The brunt of your argument against our impatiences hinged on you lowballing how much longer we're forced to wait while enemies run in to die at their normal pace. Your answer for the 'get over or quit' bit was little more than 'that doesn't fix anything', implying their is something that needs to be fixed. The only way faster enemies are going to lead to your death is if you aren't very good at avoiding them. If that is the case, you need to practice as that is a very basic skill. You never actually addressed point 4, you just kept lowballing the time we're stuck waiting. You also did not address point 5 (if you did, I didn't see it).