Broken Status Rng Is Broken

[Taikaponi]

I am assuming that the RNG which determines when the elemental effect activates is broken. I tested this with my Boar Prime. I was able to reach 92,3% status chance. Boar Prime also has 15% unmodded critical chance. Even though the elemental effect should activate much more commonly than the critical hit, I was still seeing more yellow numbers than procs. This might be a problem with all the shotguns.

 

Here's a video of me with my Boar Prime:

Edited July 4, 2014 by Taikaponi

[Sev7n]

Little hard to see in the video cause your moving the camera around too much. 

But the 92% status chance means you have 92% chance to proc 1 of the status's on your gun every time you shoot. From the video i saw a lot of impact proccing but half the time camera made it to difficult to see if anything procced next to the numbers

[Methanoid]

the Boar Prime shoots 9 pellets per volley, your status% is split among those 9 pellets, so your 92.3% status chance is actually 10.25%, also im assuming you have Hells Chamber fitted, multishot mods artificially increase your status%.

 

the "REAL" stats are as follows.

 

Your Boar Prime without multishot = 68.8% status, that divided by 9 pellets = 7.64%.

 

so there you go, each pellet fired by your boar prime in reality has a 7.64% chance to individually proc, adding hells chamber back on artificially raises this, but thats because the UI is dumb and "assumes" that each new free shot fired will definatly proc which is why your status seems and looks higher than it really is.

 

but yeah the number your looking for is 7.64% per pellet. which yeah sounds depressing and the whole thing is very confusing if you arent a frequent wiki user and have taken the atypical warframe math tests.

[Taikaponi]

the Boar Prime shoots 9 pellets per volley, your status% is split among those 9 pellets, so your 92.3% status chance is actually 10.25%, also im assuming you have Hells Chamber fitted, multishot mods artificially increase your status%.

 

the "REAL" stats are as follows.

 

Your Boar Prime without multishot = 68.8% status, that divided by 9 pellets = 7.64%.

 

so there you go, each pellet fired by your boar prime in reality has a 7.64% chance to individually proc, adding hells chamber back on artificially raises this, but thats because the UI is dumb and "assumes" that each new free shot fired will definatly proc which is why your status seems and looks higher than it really is.

 

but yeah the number your looking for is 7.64% per pellet. which yeah sounds depressing and the whole thing is very confusing if you arent a frequent wiki user and have taken the atypical warframe math tests.

 

How does the crit calculation work then? 1,66% chance per pellet?

The stats shown in the UI are so misleading.

Edited July 4, 2014 by Taikaponi

[Methanoid]

crit is normal, applies fully to every shot/pellet fired.

Edited July 4, 2014 by Methanoid

[Cryp2Nite]

It's per volley, not per pellet.

[KingIzek]

yeah shotguns are weird. Your status is calculated per pellet per volley. As in each pellet has a chance to cause a status - but if one procs, they all proc. And crit is normal. 

Agreed that the ui is very messed up; but i believe they are addressing this in U14

[Methanoid]

It's per volley, not per pellet.

 

 

WIKI

The status chance shown on shotguns is actually the calculated probability that at least one of the pellets will proc. For example, the Strun Wraith displays a 40% status chance, but in fact has a ~5% chance for each of its ten pellets.

This causes an issue where shotguns may proc less often than they should, if at all.

Edited July 4, 2014 by Methanoid

[RealPandemonium]

yeah shotguns are weird. Your status is calculated per pellet per volley. As in each pellet has a chance to cause a status - but if one procs, they all proc

Not true.  Only the pellets that procced will proc.  You can see that when you get a DoT proc that is only dealing a fraction of the damage it would have if all the pellets procced.  

[Yopee]

Just to clear some questions I'm seeing in this thread:

 

Strun Wraith
base 10 pellets, 4.98% status/pellet, 40% at least one status/shot, 2.45% at least two status/shot

My Strun Wraith status build

Hell's Chamber 22 pellets, ScaInf+SheSho+ToxBar+ShoSav 15.44% status/pellet, 97.5% at least one status/shot, 41.18% at least two statuses/shot

 

With the above build, I have two procs in one shot happening often. Sometimes I'm lucky and get four procs in one shot.

So no, shotgun status RNG is not broken and each pellet's status proc is separate.

 

Next time you test status chance on a weapon, take off all base damage mods, shoot a T3 or T4 heavy gunner with your weapon, and watch. It's hard to count the number of statuses on enemies that die in one shot.

 

 

 

the Boar Prime shoots 9 pellets per volley, your status% is split among those 9 pellets, so your 92.3% status chance is actually 10.25%, also im assuming you have Hells Chamber fitted, multishot mods artificially increase your status%.

 

the "REAL" stats are as follows.

 

Your Boar Prime without multishot = 68.8% status, that divided by 9 pellets = 7.64%.

 

so there you go, each pellet fired by your boar prime in reality has a 7.64% chance to individually proc, adding hells chamber back on artificially raises this, but thats because the UI is dumb and "assumes" that each new free shot fired will definatly proc which is why your status seems and looks higher than it really is.

Should actually be 19.8 pellets, 12.13% status chance/pellet --> 92.48% (20 pellets) or 91.44% (19 pellets) chance of at least one status/volley

Without multishot would be 9 pellets, 12.13% status chance/pellet --> 68.79% chance of at least one status/volley

 

No idea what you mean by multishot being artificial or whatever.

[Methanoid]

1. No idea what you mean by multishot being artificial or whatever.

2. Without multishot would be 9 pellets, 12.13% status chance/pellet --> 68.79% chance of at least one status/volley

1. its artificial because the UI assumes those extra shots are likely to proc, which isnt the case obviously.

2. not sure i follow your math you got there, how did 68.79% divided by 9 pellets = 12.13?

[Yopee]

1. its artificial because the UI assumes those extra shots are likely to proc, which isnt the case obviously.

2. not sure i follow your math you got there, how did 68.79% divided by 9 pellets = 12.13?

1. UI doesn't assume anything differently for multishot pellets versus the original 9 pellets. It treats all pellets the same with 12.13% status chance.

2. I don't divide 68.79 by 9 to get 12.13. I convert the 68.79% status proc/volley into 31.21% no status proc/volley and then 9th root 31.21% to get 87.86% no status proc/pellet. Convert the 87.86% into 12.13% status proc/pellet.

[Pythadragon]

1. its artificial because the UI assumes those extra shots are likely to proc, which isnt the case obviously.

2. not sure i follow your math you got there, how did 68.79% divided by 9 pellets = 12.13?

 

That's not quite how it works. Please see my post here for a full explanation or read up on probability.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/194955-status-chance-should-be-showing-a-different-number-multishot-math/?p=2265688

 

Otherwise:

 

Pellet status chance =1-(1-arsenal status chance)^(1/number of pellets)

 

Pellet status chance = 1-(1-0.6879)^(1/9)

Pellet status chance = 1-(0.3121)^(0.11)

Pellet status chance = 1-(0.8786)

Pellet status chance = 0.1213 (12.13% status chance per pellet)

 

Probability isn't as simple as multiply and dividing.

Edited July 5, 2014 by Pythadragon

[Yopee]

That's not quite how it works. Please see my post here for a full explanation or read up on probability.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/194955-status-chance-should-be-showing-a-different-number-multishot-math/?p=2265688

 

Otherwise:

 

Pellet status chance =1-(1-arsenal status chance)^(1/number of pellets)

 

Pellet status chance = 1-(1-0.6879)^(1/9)

Pellet status chance = 1-(0.3121)^(0.11)

Pellet status chance = 1-(0.8786)

Pellet status chance = 0.1213 (12.13% status chance per pellet)

 

Probability isn't as simple as multiply and dividing.

A fellow statistics expert to the rescue!

 

I agree with your thread's idea that the way status chance is shown in the UI right now just isn't clear enough. Hopefully update 14 will improve that but we'll see.

And talk about irony - the same guy here replies first to your thread :P

[Methanoid]

even with multishot the UI shouldnt magically bump up the status%, it shouldnt matter if you have 9 pellets, 29, 109 or 1,000,009 pellets, you would still have say 10% status chance, its the individual chance to proc, the only difference is that you have a differing number of shots, so yeah theres potentially lots more shots fired but they should all have the exact same low proc chance.

 

imho if you had say 50% status on 1 shot and added a multishot mod to ensure you always fired 2 shots, that shouldnt be 100% or even close to it, as far as im concerned 2 seperate 50% chances is very different to 100%, multishot shouldnt affect the UI's status% at all it just leads to confusion.

 

its deffo a headache, its no wonder the wiki and a few math guru's are needed to understand the game, dmg2.0 and esp the codex entries on dmg dont help people either, resulting in a need for the forums+wiki for clearer info.

 

awaiting UI 2.0