Convert Serration To Corrupt Multishot - Wait, Hear Me Out!

[MXultra]

I'm not saying this is the magical solution to all the various views on the problems of the mod system. But it's going to be a while before Mods 3.0 comes out. So in the meantime, why don't we try something CRRRRRAAAZY?

 

If we convert Serration to something along the lines of:

 

120% Multishot / -65 accuracy

 

This would:

 

A) Force players to use the weapon differently (closer range, targeting groups, essentially more like an SMG). Sometimes I put serration/heavy cal/multishot on snipers and hip fire them at close range like a shotgun. This would be even cooler if the sniper could spit out 3-4 shots instead of just 2.

 

or

 

B) For players that want to preserve mid-long range accuracy, this change would break up a lot of the Serration+Heavy Caliber builds, forcing them to choose damage OR multishot. And no, they are not exactly the same thing because multishot involves crit / proc considerations. You could have a "weaker" DPS build specifically for the utility of enhanced procs.

 

or

 

C) Maybe players would consider equipping Stabilizer or Vile Precision to balance out the accuracy while keeping the damage and multishot?

 

or

 

D) It could also have unexpectedly awesome effects on weapons like the Ignis, Flux Rifle, Amprex, Mutalist Quanta, Bows (w/ Thunderbolt), Miter, Phage, and (as mentioned above) snipers.

 

So again, this *IS* a band-aid solution to the so called "same-y builds". But it wouldn't be hard to implement and if nothing else, it will get us the corrupt multishot that this city deserves.

[Amberpaw]

but we already have a multishot mod. why make a 2nd?

[RahuHordika]

The problem lies that no matter how much you nerf serration/every dmg mod it is still a encesary thing, why? Because of the stupid scaling system of this game. Dmg mods themselves are a bandaid for that problem.

[-HAKUNA-YOUR-TATAS-]

but we already have a multishot mod. why make a 2nd?

 

 

Yo dawg...  Why not?  XD

[MXultra]

The reason to make another multishot mod is the same reason they made any of the corrupt mods, you can stack them.

 

And what I'm proposing here would make you actually consider how important damage is to you when it is adversely affecting your accuracy.

[Vyrn.]

Considering Serration is already a base damage mod vital* for weapons and is obtainable early on, I don't think making it a Corrupt mod would be a good idea. Placement would have to change (throwing off new players even more), and there would have to be a new base damage mod. If there weren't some new base damage mod, then all weapon classes would need to lose base damage mods, and total damage would be severely cut. That'd make this game even more heavily drenched with ability spam, too.

At best, you'd get a new Corrupt mod, not a replacement of an old mod.

*Vital for damage-dealing builds. Some builds (mainly hardcore status builds) might roll without increased base damage, but 99% of builds use it and need it to actually make a noticeable difference.

[Guest]

[removed my opinion b/c i don't care anymore]

Edited July 10, 2014 by Guest

[yarash2110]

that will kind of nerf primaries... a lot, you are talking about making all primeries suck, this has nothing to do with balance 

[MXultra]

The reason it needs to replace serration is that if it doesn't, it will just become another mandatory mod alongside serration/heavy cal/split chamber

 

Yarash, you don't even know how it would affect the damage. More shots = more damage, more crits, more procs. It would vary a lot from weapon to weapon. So you'd have to figure out how you want to build it. Either way, damage can be tweaked to keep primaries viable.

 

It could also be fun to make a corrupt multishot for secondaries...

[Taranis49]

The reason it needs to replace serration is that if it doesn't, it will just become another mandatory mod alongside serration/heavy cal/split chamber

 

Yarash, you don't even know how it would affect the damage. More shots = more damage, more crits, more procs. It would vary a lot from weapon to weapon. So you'd have to figure out how you want to build it. Either way, damage can be tweaked to keep primaries viable.

 

It could also be fun to make a corrupt multishot for secondaries...

 

I'm not convinced by that reasoning; if it replaces Serration, that doesn't somehow make it any less mandatory (likely the opposite). Particularly since you already acknowledge heavy cal as a "mandatory" mod and it has the same drawback you suggest - that wouldn't somehow change if it was the only +base damage mod.

 

On the same vein, it's not going to make mods like Stabilizer/Steady Hands useful... particularly since they don't actually offset the accuracy penalties since they reduce recoil. Notable fact, even when HC's drawback was recoil rather than accuracy nobody used those mods.

[Vargras]

...but multishot mods are basically mandatory too. You've changed nothing in converting it from damage to multishot.

[Cpl_Facehugger]

The reason to make another multishot mod is the same reason they made any of the corrupt mods, you can stack them.

 

And what I'm proposing here would make you actually consider how important damage is to you when it is adversely affecting your accuracy.

 

Heavy Cal already does that.

[Azamagon]

Or how about this: Nerf the crap out of all damageincreasing mods (elemental and multishot mods included) so they are still nice to have, but less necessary + rescale enemies so their health etc don't scale as crazy fast. I'm talking about ranges of bringing Serration down to 5% per rank rather than 15% (so 55 max instead of 165).

 

What this does is:

* Helps noobs/unlucky people who hasn't got Serration (and similar) yet. They can still do damage and such

* Enemy defense scaling (health/armor/shields) don't scale so fast, which means damagedealing abilities also indirectly last longer in their scaling

* Utilitymods (such as Fast Hands, Eagle Eye etc) now are a bit more viable to use, since the damage you sacrifice for them is way lower than currently

 

More thoroughly, do something like this

[Cpl_Facehugger]

* Utilitymods (such as Fast Hands, Eagle Eye etc) now are a bit more viable to use, since the damage you sacrifice for them is way lower than currently

 

That still doesn't fix the problem since nobody's going to choose higher zoom over more damage, even if it's something paltry like 10% more damage.

[Azamagon]

That still doesn't fix the problem since nobody's going to choose higher zoom over more damage, even if it's something paltry like 10% more damage.

I certainly would at least. And I bet a whole bunch of other people would do that as well.

 

I mean, I ALREADY tend to put in Quickdraw or Fast Hands in my builds as I really don't like long reload times + Playing Killing Floor made me a reloadaholic :P

[DSpite]

Ok, if we are going to come up with crazy ideas that will never be implemented anyway, here goes:

 

Stacking penalties from having mods of the same type (be it damage, multi-shot, elementals, proc or crit chance, etc)

 

Here's my crazy basis in another game http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Stacking_penalties

 

You might still stack 4 elemental mods even though the 4th one might have little damage increase just because you still want the chance for procs, but at least base weapon damage wont shift up by a factor of x1000 from a non-Forma version of it.

 

I know, crazy, right?

[Mak_Gohae]

Doesnt that much multishot create a freaky firerate?

When i say that much i mean when people min/man and end up with 300% multishot.

[MXultra]

...but multishot mods are basically mandatory too. You've changed nothing in converting it from damage to multishot.

 

OK... what a lot of you guys seem to be missing is that this is a CORRUPT multishot that has ACCURACY loss as the penalty. The combined effect of a Corrupt Multi and Heavy Cal is going to ruin most guns. If you put them both on your Soma, it might have a 90 degree cone of fire.

 

This actually affects gameplay (rather than just cranking the damage numbers). Your long range game is done, mid-range you're reduced to bursts and even then you can forget about getting headshots. So yeah, if you use rifles like melee weapons, then I guess it will become another mandatory mod.

[Zeitzbach]

Multishot is already pretty strong. If it fires twice, it's worth *2 to FINAL damage. If it fires thrice, it's *3 with more proc chance per ammo too.

 

Basically, what we're doing here is removing +165% from base damage, and slapping *3 into the damage at the end instead of * 2. Probably a 10% decrease in overall damage or something since the weapon's base will be at 265% instead of 430%.

 

Accuracy is no problem either. THe target is cc'd and right next to you. Who needs accuracy with pointblank shot? I mean, Loki for one wouldn't give a single crap about this with his Radial Disarm forcing people to come into melee range.

 

What this will do though is move the card to the Orokin Vault and make it impossible to find any actual damage boost early game beside those crappy 30% damage to one type or elemental card on a low base weapon. Best go Bow + Crit in this case.

Edited July 11, 2014 by Zeitzbach

[--Q--Ascended-Seraphim]

Max Corrupt multi shot -55% accuracy

Max Heavy Caliber-55% accuracy

Every shot head shots yourself for 165% damage.

Twice.

[neKroMancer]

Without serration , there will be other base stat mods like heavy caliber/elemental damage to take its place since Warframe relies on mod as progression system. In order to completely make mods a customization tool, we need two changes.

A. A way to give player progression that is not mod.

B. Mod design that works as a customization tool.

In fact, this means a major change for the game. The only possible way is to turn weapon into progression tool and allowing weapon to grow with the player through mastery rank while turning weapon into drops like the Kril/Vor boss fight reward but with tier. And limit mod we can install based on category of damage/support/utility without stacking.

Big changes if we really want mods to act solely as customization.

[[DE]Momaw]

Samey builds are a reaction to the way the game's scaling works.  You NEED to stack damage on top of damage with a side order of damage to have any impact on the high level enemies.  Nerfing Serration isn't going to fix sameyness of primary weapons builds, it's just going to make secondary weapons even more attractive than they already are and/or force more people into using the few frames which have attack abilities so powerful they don't really need to use weapons.

 

If you really want to address this then roll the required damage increase into the base weapon ranking.  Retire Serration, Hornet Strike and Pressure Point, but give weapons +5% to final damage per current rank. Observe and assess.