How You Know That Snipers Are Unbalanced

[yarash2110]

when boltor prime does more damage per shot then snipertron vandal... not even kidding... both with 3 formas

[Dalu__Ka]

Both with the same mods?

[BlasterOfMuppets]

I guess there's a reason why it's no longer available... ;)

 

Still the weapons need more balancing work done IMO.

[BrotherIcarus]

Sniper rebalance coming U14 or right after.

[NoggDog117]

Snipers, specifically Snipetron(Vandal) and Vulkar, need buffs, but all snipers should be balanced to the point where they're viable against the famed flavor of the game weapons, like Boltor Prime.

[yarash2110]

Both with the same mods?

nope, boltor p had all damage mods, svandal had damage and crit, and an ammo convulsion mod, but the primary reason was probably that i was running grineer, but still, shouldn't be this way,can't wait to see what will they do on u14 to snipers and shotguns

[Detheroc]

It doesnt. Wtf, BP does 54 damage, SV does 120. If you would give both the same mods, SV still has higher damage per shot.
 

nope, boltor p had all damage mods, svandal had damage and crit, and an ammo convulsion mod, but the primary reason was probably that i was running grineer, but still, shouldn't be this way,can't wait to see what will they do on u14 to snipers and shotguns

So you compare 2 weapons that dont even have the same mods on. Genious.

Edited July 13, 2014 by Detheroc

[-Grizzlye-]

Your sniper can suck my Duck! Goo Snipertron prime!

[BlasterOfMuppets]

It doesnt. Wtf, BP does 54 damage, SV does 120. If you would give both the same mods, SV still has higher damage per shot.

 

So you compare 2 weapons that dont even have the same mods on. Genious.

Well you really want to gauge the potential of each weapon, so you should go with the optimal setup for that weapon. Still putting ammo mods on won't do you any good in this matter.

[yarash2110]

It doesnt. Wtf, BP does 54 damage, SV does 120. If you would give both the same mods, SV still has higher damage per shot.

 

So you compare 2 weapons that dont even have the same mods on. Genious.

crit mods are better then the damage mods i had on bp, i tested it, and an ammo mod is pretty much a must have on bp, so its only fair that i use mods that are needed on the weapon for the run

[Vunie]

if your boltor prime is doing more damage per shot  than your snipetron vandal then you have no idea of how to mod weapons 

[yarash2110]

if your boltor prime is doing more damage per shot  than your snipetron vandal then you have no idea of how to mod weapons 

tell me how should i mod it, just to see how the genius would do it, and i got all three duel stat mods

Edited July 13, 2014 by yarash2110

[Dalu__Ka]

http://warframe-builder.com/

http://www.dpsframe.com/

 

Or something.

[yarash2110]

http://warframe-builder.com/

http://www.dpsframe.com/

 

Or something.

check your links

[Tarille]

Without the same mods on weapons I can say silly things too:

 

For example, both with 5 Forma I can say that the Lato does more damage than the Boltor Prime

 

Now... Snipers could do with some buffs, especially since Bows function in a similar way to them (Precision weapons with high DPH) but outclass them in pretty much every way possible.

 

But with the same mods on, Snipetron (Both Vandal and Normal) will deal more damage per shot than the Boltor Prime. What makes Boltor Prime so strong, is that it does high damage and has a very high fire rate causing it to do lots of DPS.

 

As far as building the Snipetron goes, I'd say something along the lines of this would be a good way to go about it (Preferably, use the Vandal though for significant damage increase and reload speed reduction)

[yarash2110]

Without the same mods on weapons I can say silly things too:

 

For example, both with 5 Forma I can say that the Lato does more damage than the Boltor Prime

 

Now... Snipers could do with some buffs, especially since Bows function in a similar way to them (Precision weapons with high DPH) but outclass them in pretty much every way possible.

 

But with the same mods on, Snipetron (Both Vandal and Normal) will deal more damage per shot than the Boltor Prime. What makes Boltor Prime so strong, is that it does high damage and has a very high fire rate causing it to do lots of DPS.

 

As far as building the Snipetron goes, I'd say something along the lines of this would be a good way to go about it (Preferably, use the Vandal though for significant damage increase and reload speed reduction)

you are reading what you feel like reading, so i would rather not write unless you decide to actually read,

 

i wrote that i used crit mods, which are clearly more effective and do more damage, i used an ammo mod because without it i would only be able to kill 100 enemies or so.

[Tarille]

i wrote that i used crit mods, which are clearly more effective and do more damage, i used an ammo mod because without it i would only be able to kill 100 enemies or so.

 

Yes.

 

And I also pointed out, that discrepancies are going to be found based on using different mods.

 

As with my Lato vs Boltor Prime comparison, it's hyperbole but it was to show you that different mods will make weapons seem far more different from the reality.

 

In this case you were comparing a fully damage modded Boltor Prime to a weapon that sacrificed damage for ammo and crit (Which will cause it to do more damage overall. But non-crits will suffer immensely)

 

A properly modded Snipetron will do significantly more damage per hit than a max damage Boltor Prime:

 

Max Boltor Prime = 2k DPH average - Body Shot = ~2k - Headshot = ~4k

Max Snipetron = 4k DPH average - Body Shot = 1.8k non-crit and 5.9k crit - Headshot = 3.6k non-crit and 23.6k

Max Snipetron Vandal = 7.2k DPH average - Body Shot = 2.3k non-crit and 10k crit - Headshot = 4.6k non-crit and 40k crit

 

With the same mods as the max Boltor Prime, Snipetron and Snipetron Vandal will do double the damage per hit (Though it's not recommended due to their lower accuracy making Heavy Caliber not very good and crit mods providing better, albeit less consistent, damage output)

Edited July 13, 2014 by Tarille

[yarash2110]

 

Yes.

 

And I also pointed out, that discrepancies are going to be found based on using different mods.

 

As with my Lato vs Boltor Prime comparison, it's hyperbole but it was to show you that different mods will make weapons seem far more different from the reality.

 

In this case you were comparing a fully damage modded Boltor Prime to a weapon that sacrificed damage for ammo and crit (Which will cause it to do more damage overall. But non-crits will suffer immensely)

 

A properly modded Snipetron will do significantly more damage per hit than a max damage Boltor Prime:

 

Max Boltor Prime = 2k DPH average - Body Shot = ~2k - Headshot = ~4k

Max Snipetron = 4k DPH average - Body Shot = 1.8k non-crit and 5.9k crit - Headshot = 3.6k non-crit and 23.6k

Max Snipetron Vandal = 7.2k DPH average - Body Shot = 2.3k non-crit and 10k crit - Headshot = 4.6k non-crit and 40k crit

 

With the same mods as the max Boltor Prime, Snipetron and Snipetron Vandal will do double the damage per hit (Though it's not recommended due to their lower accuracy making Heavy Caliber not very good and crit mods providing better, albeit less consistent, damage output)

i was referring to a crit with svandal, and once again ammo is a must on svandal, also, on your "best build" you used a fire rate mod... so you can't blame me for using an ammo mod that is an absolute must to actually use it on the long run

[Tarille]

i was referring to a crit with svandal, and once again ammo is a must on svandal, also, on your "best build" you used a fire rate mod... so you can't blame me for using an ammo mod that is an absolute must to actually use it on the long run

 

Ammo mods aren't necessary. Not when headshots can be so efficient (A single crit headshot should take out things for a long time) and Ammo Restores can be utilized instead.

 

That fire rate mod also could be replaced with an ammo mod if you feel it's really necessary (But the Punch Through really helps with ammo efficiency - Being able to hit 2-3 enemies per shot is very nice) - Replacing the Fire Rate mod would not reduce the damage per hit in this case.

Edited July 13, 2014 by Tarille

[Dalu__Ka]

check your links

Nothing wrong with the links.

I posted them so perhaps someone could debunk what OP is saying.

[yarash2110]

Ammo mods aren't necessary. Not when headshots can be so efficient (A single crit headshot should take out things for a long time) and Ammo Restores can be utilized instead.

 

That fire rate mod also could be replaced with an ammo mod if you feel it's really necessary (But the Punch Through really helps with ammo efficiency - Being able to hit 2-3 enemies per shot is very nice) - Replacing the Fire Rate mod would not reduce the damage per hit in this case.

even when all enemies take 1 shot, if you are unlucky and don't get an ammo drop every 10 enemies then you will run out of ammo... even if you get an ammo drop every 20 shots, you will run out, on a survival or defense, ammo on snipers and bows is really lacking

[yarash2110]

Nothing wrong with the links.

I posted them so perhaps someone could debunk what OP is saying.

i thought you were trying to post a build, sorry

[Tarille]

even when all enemies take 1 shot, if you are unlucky and don't get an ammo drop every 10 enemies then you will run out of ammo... even if you get an ammo drop every 20 shots, you will run out, on a survival or defense, ammo on snipers and bows is really lacking

 

I guess I hadn't really noticed when I spend 40+ minutes in survivals using only a Bow without even using Ammo Restores.

 

Must be some lucky RNG on my part... Though Ammo Restores are always a thing and can be useful (As can Scavenger Auras depending on how reliant you are on your Aura's)

[Detheroc]

Crit mods are better on most snipers and damage mods are better on Boltor Prime. He picked the best mods for each weapon to maximize damage in both cases. Shows how "genious" you are, I'd say.

Its clearly not maximized damage if he gets a weapon with less than HALF Dph (NOT Dps) to deal more Dph after modding. Unless he didnt take the crits in his average Dph calculation while building for crits, which is genious again.

[yarash2110]

Its clearly not maximized damage if he gets a weapon with less than HALF Dph (NOT Dps) to deal more Dph after modding. Unless he didnt take the crits in his average Dph calculation while building for crits, which is genious again.

i would guess that the cause was boltor having mostly puncture and i was running grineer and me using an ammo mod on svandal,