Allies Of The Tenno (Putting This On Hold For Now) [Update 10/17]

[arch111]

I want to share this Vandal in the process of defacing property (or blow shizz up you descide ;))

[HappyApathy]

I have another idea for implementation. Instead of an entirely new gameplay mode, ally forces could "invade" existing missions.

 

For example when on an extermination mission on a corpus ship, maybe anti-corpus forces would crash into/attack the ship and help out the tenno?

 

That gives me an idea for a new mechanic, I'll post it once I've fleshed it out and make sure to credit you for the initial suggestion.

 

@arch111

 

Very nice :), I actually thought about some of the younger Vandals carrying around something like a futuristic paint spray can, problem is it's hard to envision it been turned into any sort of an effective weapon. I'll add your pic to the OP.

[arch111]

I suppose a spraycan is quite volatile stuff and can be made into makeshift flamethrower or bomb.

[livarpyl]

man this is so long i didnt read it :D

[HappyApathy]

man this is so long i didnt read it :D

but it is so worth reading :D

 

at least hunt for the pretty pictures embedded here and there

Edited August 14, 2014 by HappyApathy

[IceDragonofAmber]

man this is so long i didnt read it :D

You think this is long? There are some threads on the Warframe Forum that have 220+ pages of replies.

[emaralez87]

Grineer Defectors?

 

People have suggested the idea of small numbers of defecting Grineer clones be included in the Ghosts/Red Veil, whether or not this would be possible depends on how deeply ingrained loyalty to the Queens is with the Grineer. I personally suspect that clones have obedience imprinted into them during the cloning process to a point where they would jump off a cliff without question if their queens commanded it, that said it could be possible for the process to fail every so often giving clones more autonomy then they normally would have.

 

I think this idea have right to exist. mb not for inner logic of grineer lore, but because "betrayal is one of the most important parts of a war. sometimes betrayal is beautiful". corpus is a merchant cult so betrayal of corpus soldiers not so "beautiful" as betrayal of grineer.

and - yes- this is according to nowdays situation

Edited August 15, 2014 by emaralez87

[IceDragonofAmber]

(Currently getting a bug where I can't quote or copy/paste anyone else's posts, my apologies)

 

@HappyApathy - I imagine when the Grineer were first starting to be cloned, they would have had loyalty ingraved into their brains very deeply. However, as time went by and the Grineer clones became more and more genetically unstable, cracks started to appear in the cloning process, opening the chance of Grineer units being cloned with, atleats a smei opened mind, and we have already seen ingame that it is possible for a Grineer to defect, through Captain Vor.

 

We see Captain Vor defecting after he is revived by his "Judas Key", and unlike the other Corrupted, Vor seems to still have freewill (though this can be argued). Although this is a bad example, it is still an example.

 

However Vor, before he was revived for the first time, had been seen killing another Grineer general (as shown in "The Calling"). Now I don't know about you, but I don't think the Queens ordered him to do that, and im sure that Vor knew full well that doing that would only upset the Queens (at first)and diminish the Grineer ultimate goal, all for self gain, showing how he does possess atleast a bit of freewill,and is not completely loyal.

 

Also, the G3. If the Grineer were truly, completely loyal to their Queens and cause, they wouldn't have gone on their Grineer killing spree, even with their added hatred of Grineer due to their cloning "Malfunction". And the G3 are also living proof that it is possible for the Grineer to accidently make unwanted genetic rejects.

 

Also, if Grineer defects do get added to the Ghosts regime (which even I think is a bit far fetched, my main idea was the Grineer "Raiders", and I just tacked on the extra Ghost bit at the end) the player could talk to them at the friendly HUBs and get special inside info on Grineer politics, clone manufactory ect.

[emaralez87]

Red Veil quest (event?) inspired by my first thoughts about “Avalanche Offensive”

 

When I read what we will have to “take” Eximuses while their training my first thought was: “oh, will we kill young rookies (kids) in corpus barracks (school)? cool - this is more rough then killing wild kubrows for mod farming, destroy their “nests” for eggs and wait before your pat kubrow will die from genetic disease “on your hands” to empty stasis slot from it!”. But it stayed in my imagination :)

NB: 

I tried to be polite but I just don’t know how to be polite. So. We all know what “rebels” and “insurgents” are just soft term for “terrorists”. There is no difference in methods between “resistance” and “terrorism”. Who is rebel, who is insurgent and who is terrorists solves mass media, propaganda and winner, and never history solves it. So this is quest (event?) with Gradivus-like moral dilemma. 

 

Trivia:

Many important members of one of the “wings” or “branches” [insert name of branch/wing here] of Red Veil was catched by Corpus. Existing of this branch/wing is impossible without them. Branch/wing should free them by any cost, or surrender. What means “surrender” for insurgents? - to be catched and killed in torture or betray the rebellion. Why didn’t they asked Tenno help again? - oh they did! But even tenno agents couldn’t find a prisoners (because Corpus patched lot of holes in security systems after “Arid Fear”).

 

So branch/wing seize as hostages students of elite Corpus school of economics, while their rest in camp. Security of the camp was low, ‘cause no one could ever think what some group would be so crazy to attack this camp - kids are useless members, big amount of forces needed for this attack and, obviously, this attack is a death sentence for all captured rebellioners. But crazy ones have advantage on the war, and this is advantage of “surprise effect”.

 

Corpus managers start parley with terrorists, because this is not profitable to show the colonists what corpus don’t care about kids, whose learning in elite school costs lot of money.

 

Dilemma:

to support terrorists (in the name of greater good) or to help Corpus to free the children (what means what this branch/wing of Red Veil would be “cutted”).

 

Red Veil side:

“Loud” exterminate, spy and sabotage missions on the Corpus ships.

 

Corpus side:

Stealth rescues (of groups of students), sabotages and assassinations.

[HappyApathy]

@IceDragonofAmber

 

I'll add that as a quote to the OP

 

@emaralez87

 

Actually Operation Avalanche involved us killing elite Corpus, not untrained rookies (seriously those guys were nasty), but that's besides the point. As for your suggested morally ambiguous quest I have a few issues with it, first of all having a situation where a school full of students is taken over by 'terrorists' and even potentially killed is a bit heavy handed for a game like Warframe, something that would draw unwanted negative attention to the game, pretty much ruin the image of the Red Veil in the eyes of the player, I also don't think one should be put in a situation where you would have to fight the Red Veil as their purpose is intended to be a sympathetic faction to the Tenno, not a potential enemy.

 

A better morally ambiguous scenario that would fit the game better would be something like having a rebel base come under attack and give the player the choice of assisting the rebels in repelling the attack or using the attack on them as a distraction to achieve another mission of greater importance (resulting in their death).

Edited August 16, 2014 by HappyApathy

[AlphaHorseman]

@IceDragonofAmber

 

I'll add that as a quote to the OP

 

@emaralez87

 

Actually Operation Avalanche involved us killing elite Corpus, not untrained rookies (seriously those guys were nasty), but that's besides the point. As for your suggested morally ambiguous quest I have a few issues with it, first of all having a situation where a school full of students is taken over by 'terrorists' and even potentially killed is a bit heavy handed for a game like Warframe, something that would draw unwanted negative attention to the game, pretty much ruin the image of the Red Veil in the eyes of the player, I also don't think one should be put in a situation where you would have to fight the Red Veil as their purpose is intended to be a sympathetic faction to the Tenno, not a potential enemy.

 

A better morally ambiguous scenario that would fit the game better would be something like having a rebel base come under attack and give the player the choice of assisting the rebels in repelling the attack or using the attack on them as a distraction to achieve another mission of greater importance (resulting in their death).

This really does sound like a good mechanic to add to the game. It makes players choose, but not between something so dark as the players turning on their allies and murdering them, or vice versa, but their Allies in dire straits and in need of help, while another objective that is crucial to their mission is at hand, it makes the mission far more interesting and meaningful, I'll +1 that one.

[emaralez87]

Actually Operation Avalanche involved us killing elite Corpus, not untrained rookies (seriously those guys were nasty), but that's besides the point. As for your suggested morally ambiguous quest I have a few issues with it, first of all having a situation where a school full of students is taken over by 'terrorists' and even potentially killed is a bit heavy handed for a game like Warframe, something that would draw unwanted negative attention to the game, pretty much ruin the image of the Red Veil in the eyes of the player, I also don't think one should be put in a situation where you would have to fight the Red Veil as their purpose is intended to be a sympathetic faction to the Tenno, not a potential enemy.

 

A better morally ambiguous scenario that would fit the game better would be something like having a rebel base come under attack and give the player the choice of assisting the rebels in repelling the attack or using the attack on them as a distraction to achieve another mission of greater importance (resulting in their death).

I sad I don't know how to be polite :) whyle gradivus lot of players helped grineer to enslave colonies of the mars and all was OK. I mean I just can't make trivia in such genius way how it was made with gradivus :) 

 

Trivia is about one of the wings of RV, not about RV at all. And I loved this game because there is no black-and-white. Tenno are not just the knights who make Origin System balanced, they "fight for money" and "hunting for treasure" (and make a balance stuff in same time. UPD: also tenno steal money and resources from soldiers' closets, even when they help this soldiers :D). I think RV shouldn't be just good guys who fighting bad guys.

 

about mechanics - all of this were for mechanics, for stealth mechanics. I suggested several complex mechanics for "repel the enemy attack" in The Safo concept, there I wanted to suggest complex mechanics for stealth. 

 

So I'll be glad if you guys in this thread would help me to rework this stuff in more appropriate way! :) as I see there are 3 main problems: 1) we shouldn't kill RV members , 2) trivia should be more polite, 3) there should be place for complex stealth mechanics what I wanted to suggest

Would you help me with this?

Edited August 16, 2014 by emaralez87

[GrimR3APER]

I have a... proposition, for you. 

   I would like for you to take a look at my thread and think about merging some of our ideas, your current thread about different factions like the Red Veil or Turncoats being given events and missions not to mention hubbs plus my ideas of events and new alerts and free roam and what not would mix nicely. 

         My thread is all about creating new immersion for the game so it feels alive and one of the planned things for it was to create new factions so it doesn't just feel like the main three enemy ones plus us. I think you and I could create some great new things and would like for us to try sometime.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/255769-immersion-like-never-before-alerts-mission-effects-events-freeroam-maneuvers-mechanics-melee-time-to-evolvetenno-lotus/

Edited August 16, 2014 by GrimR3APER

[emaralez87]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/255769-immersion-like-never-before-alerts-mission-effects-events-freeroam-maneuvers-mechanics-melee-time-to-evolvetenno-lotus/

I had read it before. lot of good ideas but most of them need some game mechanics rwork and... lot of love with engine source.

also I like your point of view on missions, except some moments like ... um... I'll call it "death 2.0" :) I hope your approach would be accepted somewhere in this thread :)

[HappyApathy]

@emaralez87

 

While I do believe stealth mechanics need a rework I don't think this is the thread to discuss it, while I have suggested some new mechanics for the most part they are on a more macro level like the solar map UI and general mission layouts, rather then new ways of killing/subduing enemies or a change in overall game play style when in mission. My focus has always been more about lore expansion and creating an emotional connection with the game through the use of NPC's and sympathetic factions, I have no intention of expanding the scope to include in-game mechanics such as stealth.

 

@GrimR3APER

 

I've read through your thread and I would love to see some of your concepts been implemented, especially the free roam and greater player immersion. The problem is that while you can draw concepts and ideas from my thread to put into yours (your more then welcome too) I don't think it works the other way around for me. I am purposefully trying to suggest mechanics that work as much as possible within the existing framework of Warframe while your one is suggesting large overhauls in game mechanics in many ways. As I stated earlier my main focus here is more on generating the overall lore and expanded story for Warframe that would allow for a world with greater immersion like the one in your concept to be possible, rather then dictating what it would be like and how it would be implemented in terms of game play.

 

In a way you can view my concept here as stepping stone towards yours, your concept is Warframe 1 year from now, my concept is Warframe 3-6 months from now depending on one's level of optimism. I hope by getting my concept through I can make concepts like yours possible in the future.

Edited August 16, 2014 by HappyApathy

[emaralez87]

While I do believe stealth mechanics need a rework I don't think this is the thread to discuss it, while I have suggested some new mechanics for the most part they are on a more macro level like the solar map UI and general mission layouts, rather then new ways of killing/subduing enemies or a change in overall game play style when in mission. My focus has always been more about lore expansion and creating an emotional connection with the game through the use of NPC's and sympathetic factions, I have no intention of expanding the scope to include in-game mechanics such as stealth.

I'm not suggesting new mechanics I suggesting complex mechanics. eg: extermination with drain of shields in The Safos concept.  or we have now ingame "nightmare" missions - this is complex mechanic too, but not new. I'm suggesting this kind of mechanic :) (UPD: and I really would be sad if this thread will become another "lore project". "lore projects" belong to fanzone.)

 

I have an idea. RV wing just preparing for "something suspicious" (as Lotus would say) and Tenno should check what's the deal. here we could see "the dark side" (described in polite way. *) of the rebellion (and make some stealth). so it would be quest about Tenno intruders who help RV in their stuff.

*I mean not only this part where "terrorism and killing people are bad", I mean what rebellion is hard, not all rebels are good people, show some turncoats, show how "rebellion grows and eat it's children", show how "strong-ones" (boardsmen?) use rebellion in their purposes etc etc 

what you think about it?

Edited August 16, 2014 by emaralez87

[dragonkingofthestars]

I vote for this.

 

It would add much needed depth to the game, Warfame is a game that is too smart for it's own good. It's world is above par, but a online shooter can't explore those ideas well, and this would be an ideal way to explore the universe more and more and add depth to the game.

[GrimR3APER]

I had read it before. lot of good ideas but most of them need some game mechanics rwork and... lot of love with engine source.

also I like your point of view on missions, except some moments like ... um... I'll call it "death 2.0" :) I hope your approach would be accepted somewhere in this thread :)

Thanks for taking interest. Sure some will need to have certain things tweaked but I'm positive it will be figured out before it ever got in-game. The whole death 2.0 thing would only apply to the sabotage mission, the whole first part of the thread that talks about missions actually only applies to that type of mission as sabotage should be a little more stealthy and risky/fail-able. 

         I hope we can work a few things out and mix them together because I know it would be interesting :D

[arch111]

I did some modeling of a helmet and tweaked my corpus wip a bit.

I think this could be a good start for a Vandal unit/units.

I am real interested in getting feedback into it to produce a painted version fairly quickly.

So, suggestions?

[emaralez87]

I did some modeling of a helmet and tweaked my corpus wip a bit.

I think this could be a good start for a Vandal unit/units.

I am real interested in getting feedback into it to produce a painted version fairly quickly.

So, suggestions?

nice I like it!

mb smthng like hoses or wires what go from bottom of the helmet's "face" to the undercap or somehow to the back...?

[arch111]

Yeah wires is a must. Should the gear be Crewmanny tho, or more loose or separate pieces?

I figure corpus fashion is pretty tied to the Crewmen, but Alad dress pretty gaudy. He IS the enemy of the Vandals I suppose though.

[arch111]

By the way, I allways begin with base models and build on them. So what I show might not at all look like the final render.

Iterations ftw!

[HappyApathy]

@emaralez87

 

Thing is despite Warframe been a rather dark world I would rather the Red Veil stay been viewed as a "rebel movement" instead of been labeled as "terrorists", perhaps if your scenario was reworked to use a pirate group instead, or a more extreme group then the Red Veil.

 

@dragonkingofstars

 

Thank you, not nearly enough people come here just to compliment the idea.

 

@arch111

 

Very nice, one thing I will say is that I liked the darker colors you used in your first concept art, though maybe with the brighter colors toned down like Artwarren suggested. I would like to point out that Alad V was also a rich business man/scientist type and hardly dressed the part for combat.

Edited August 17, 2014 by HappyApathy

[emaralez87]

Yeah wires is a must. Should the gear be Crewmanny tho, or more loose or separate pieces?

sry - language wall... but I'll try: I like it how it is... when imagine a wires :)

Edited August 17, 2014 by emaralez87

[emaralez87]

Thing is despite Warframe been a rather dark world I would rather the Red Veil stay been viewed as a "rebel movement" instead of been labeled as "terrorists", perhaps if your scenario was reworked to use a pirate group instead, or a more extreme group then the Red Veil.

um... thought I should write "IMHO"... rebels, terrorist - several names, but the rose will smell as rose. rebellion is a movement, terror is a method. rose is flower, rose is a color.

 

to divide rebels on "good" RV and "bad" not-RV rebel-pirate movements... ok, though it may be fun :) "challenge accepted" :D but this guys whatever will say about RV smthng like Sargas Ruk says about "Tenno honor" :P

 

UPD

I've just noticed what this may be a way how history schoolbooks are writing in my country XD

though it should be fun experience :)

Edited August 17, 2014 by emaralez87