Do You Go With The Flow?

[(PSN)Fenrushak]

So been playing since February, and it seems to me that Flow is utterly worthless without a supplementary mod. Equilibrium seems to fill it up well, but only if you can manage to have an abundance of Health Orbs...so basically Nekros or Oberon. Rage will fill it up pretty quickly, but using that method nearly requires a safety net (Quick Thinking), and is only good for people that can self-heal, which include Nekros, Oberon, Valkyr and Trinity.

 

With the exception of leveling up my Warframe, or having Quad Energy Siphons, I never manage to get enough Energy drops to fill my Flowed Energy pool.

 

I guess my question is, unless you are leveling with Affinity boosters, where you get a full Energy pool every other mission, is it really worth equipping on, say...Excalibur? He cant self heal, so Rage and Equilibrium are out of the question, unless I'm banking on all four people to show up with ES equipped.

 

What do you think? Is it really worth equipping? Why?

[AureusVulpes]

Flow is really good on a caster-type frame who has a high base energy already.

 

It's not worthless by itself; granted, it synergizes quite well with Efficiency mods, but there's a significant tactical difference between being able to cast Snow Globe (for example) 6 times without moving instead of 3.

[Frost.Umbra]

I use flow on almost all of my frames. I actually DON'T use them with Oberyn because he drops so many health orbs. Instead I use Rage and never let them kill me ;)

[Entari0]

in general, i try to maximize energy cap and efficiency, but if you can only do one,  you should generally go with efficiency. On Rhino, for example, with max energy cap, and no change to efficiency, you can stomp 3 times consecutively, and with max energy, you can stomp 6 times in a row. Really, it depends on your build

[(PSN)Bobtm0]

For me, I'd never leave home without Flow but that's due to my playstyle.  I never utilize Rage or Equilibrium either.

 

I tend to run Flow + Quick Thinking with literally no other defensive mods except on my second Valkyr as that defensive setup holds the greatest deal of synergy for me without utilizing excess mod space for it.  This literally means no Redirection, Vitality, Vigor, Fast Deflection, Steel Fiber at all.  Condensing the number of defensive mod slots to 1.5 (Flow serves double duty so it only counts as half) and frees up more space for other mods.

 

A build like that with practically all of my frames, with the remaining slots varying wildly depending on what my other goals are.  QT + Flow allows me to survive glancing blows for a really long time so long as I move constantly and don't over-utilize my abilities.  Basically I let my energy pool stay close to topped off at almost all times for a crap-ton of extra HP that's immune to Toxin procs and Slash procs.

[Darzk]

Flow falls far behind efficiency mods in terms of effective ability use. I'd only use it on top of 75% efficiency, and then it's pretty useless. To counter AureusVulpes; There's no significant tactical advantage in casting Snow Globe 24 times instead of 12, because there's really no reason why you'd need more than 12 in a row without having regen or the chance to grab some orbs.

 

Basically, it's relegated to use in 3 scenarios:

 

1: I can't use Fleeting Expertise because I need max duration (Ember WoF build for example)

2: I'm using QT (and usually Rage and Vital too)

3: I'm using a partial Flow to fill a slot nothing else useful will fit into (usually while leveling).

[TisForTat]

So been playing since February, and it seems to me that Flow is utterly worthless without a supplementary mod. Equilibrium seems to fill it up well, but only if you can manage to have an abundance of Health Orbs...so basically Nekros or Oberon. Rage will fill it up pretty quickly, but using that method nearly requires a safety net (Quick Thinking), and is only good for people that can self-heal, which include Nekros, Oberon, Valkyr and Trinity.

 

With the exception of leveling up my Warframe, or having Quad Energy Siphons, I never manage to get enough Energy drops to fill my Flowed Energy pool.

 

I guess my question is, unless you are leveling with Affinity boosters, where you get a full Energy pool every other mission, is it really worth equipping on, say...Excalibur? He cant self heal, so Rage and Equilibrium are out of the question, unless I'm banking on all four people to show up with ES equipped.

 

What do you think? Is it really worth equipping? Why?

Flow is better than nothing, but Flow by itself is bad. Without utilizing quick thinking or equilibrium, there is no point, because Flow alone only matters when both of these conditions are satisfied:

 

1) You use energy occasionally and go beyond your normal limit.

2) But don't use energy constantly and allow energy to stockpile beyond your normal limit.

 

That means if you have to use your abilities in bursts to actually take advantage of Flow.

[Sloan441]

In and of itself, flow isn't terribly useful. It does have its place, however.

 

1) You're new and playing a caster 'frame. Since you don't have corrupted mods or energy siphon, this will pad your reserves when topped up. As you get more efficiency, it will become less useful. Energy siphon and 75% efficiency means flow is borderline useless.

 

2) You're running quick thinking. The combination of flow and QT means more energy to protect yourself from, well, bad things. Simple enough.

 

And that's about it.

[Naftal]

Flow is only good when paired with Quick Thinking. Otherwise it's always worse than power efficiency mods and most of the time useless, because max energy doesn't do much...

 

EDIT: This is obviously when you have all/most mods available.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Naftal

[Keiiken]

Until Quick Thinking broke in U14 I used flow on all my squishies. Combined with quick thinking it gave a greater safety net for incoming damage than Vigor and Vitality combined. Plus energy regenerates faster and energy orbs are far more abundant than health orbs when you have a lazy healer or no healer.

 

On non-squishy frames I use flow with streamline instead of fleeting expertise so I can use abilities more often when fleeting expertise could reduce duration too much. Whats the use of the massive damage boost from Blind Rage to rhino charge or excal slashdash if you have to be right in the enemies face to do it or the cost is so high you deplete your energy pool completely.

[(PSN)Fenrushak]

Until Quick Thinking broke in U14 I used flow on all my squishies. Combined with quick thinking it gave a greater safety net for incoming damage than Vigor and Vitality combined. Plus energy regenerates faster and energy orbs are far more abundant than health orbs when you have a lazy healer or no healer.

 

On non-squishy frames I use flow with streamline instead of fleeting expertise so I can use abilities more often when fleeting expertise could reduce duration too much. Whats the use of the massive damage boost from Blind Rage to rhino charge or excal slashdash if you have to be right in the enemies face to do it or the cost is so high you deplete your energy pool completely.

We haven't hit 14 yet on PS4. How do you mean it broke?

[Airwolfen]

We haven't hit 14 yet on PS4. How do you mean it broke?

 

QT just does not work atm. dont worry though, will likely be fixed before the update hits ps4.

 

EDIT: but same here though. flow creates a big health pool combined with QT.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Airwolfen

[Yazeth]

Flow is good on caster frames so that they can spam their ability more often. With the combination of Rage and QT, it can make squishy frames for tanky, while allowing them to cast abilities easily as well.

[Naftal]

Flow is good on caster frames so that they can spam their ability more often. With the combination of Rage and QT, it can make squishy frames for tanky, while allowing them to cast abilities easily as well.

Flow doesn't really let you use your abilities more often, it doesn't give you more energy, it gives you more MAX energy.

[Airwolfen]

Flow doesn't really let you use your abilities more often, it doesn't give you more energy, it gives you more MAX energy.

 

yes? and 525 energy does not allow more skills then 175?

 

People generally leave a trail of energy orbs behind anyway or just waste energy on nothing and pick m up.

 

EDIT: next to that rage easily fills the entire energy bar on most casters if done in a controlled manner.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Airwolfen

[Kylecrafts]

Flow is staple to all my frames. One some I use complimentary mods to it, others I don't.

[Latronico]

The difference between more Energy and more Power Efficiency is that to have the first you just need one mod, to have the second you need TWO mods (one of them reduces power duration).

So, what's better? Use 1 slot or 2?

 

And what's better, to have 150+ Energy or 300+?

[Naftal]

yes? and 525 energy does not allow more skills then 175?

 

People generally leave a trail of energy orbs behind anyway or just waste energy on nothing and pick m up.

Your numbers are weird... Flow doubles any rank 30 frame's max energy.

 

It doesn't matter if you have more max energy when you're using your energy, you still need to find just as many orbs or wait as long to have energy to cast the same ability. It doesn't matter if you can't pick up energy orbs, they stay in the ground too for quite some time.

 

It only really helps if you need to use more than your max energy (without flow) in so small window of time that you can't get more from anywhere else. This is a situation that I feel doesn't exist at all.

[Naftal]

The difference between more Energy and more Power Efficiency is that to have the first you just need one mod, to have the second you need TWO mods (one of them reduces power duration).

So, what's better? Use 1 slot or 2?

 

And what's better, to have 150+ Energy or 300+?

If you're comparing power efficiency to power max, using only one efficiency mod is much better than using flow. Power efficiency gives you more abilities per energy gained. Flow does not.

[Noble_Cactus]

With max efficiency on any frame, I rarely ever find myself needing a higher energy cap. The few times I do need more energy (i.e., pre-patch Disruptors), I can just pop an energy restore and get back up to speed.

 

It does provide more effective health for Quick Thinking if you are above your regular energy cap when you "die" at least.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Noble_Cactus

[Malindros]

all i know is a max flow is better for Rhino's stomp than a max streamline.  I get 3 stomps with Flow before additional energy is aquired, as opposed to 2 from max streamline.  both together are best, but head to head, i go for flow, pending tenno powers.

[Naftal]

all i know is a max flow is better for Rhino's stomp than a max streamline.  I get 3 stomps with Flow before additional energy is aquired, as opposed to 2 from max streamline.  both together are best, but head to head, i go for flow, pending tenno powers.

But if you use Flow instead of Streamline, you need to pick up 4 energy orbs before you can Stomp again. If you use Streamline, you only need to pick up 3 orbs and still have 5 energy left after stomping.

[Airwolfen]

Your numbers are weird... Flow doubles any rank 30 frame's max energy.

 

It doesn't matter if you have more max energy when you're using your energy, you still need to find just as many orbs or wait as long to have energy to cast the same ability. It doesn't matter if you can't pick up energy orbs, they stay in the ground too for quite some time.

 

It only really helps if you need to use more than your max energy (without flow) in so small window of time that you can't get more from anywhere else. This is a situation that I feel doesn't exist at all.

 

Those numbers are from loki prime, ok, extreme example.

 

Going back for energy orbs is only done in survival and defence. So you will leave orbs in those maps.

 

I do however only use flow in builds with rage designed to be able to take health damage. and i never use those frames in ^those two missions.

[Naftal]

Those numbers are from loki prime, ok, extreme example.

 

Going back for energy orbs is only done in survival and defence. So you will leave orbs in those maps.

 

I do however only use flow in builds with rage designed to be able to take health damage. and i never use those frames in ^those two missions.

Loki Prime has 262.5 max energy at rank 30 without Flow.

 

Missions that are non-endless are so short that the loadouts don't really matter that much in those missions. Still, even then, efficiency gives more ability casts, power max does not.

[Airwolfen]

Loki Prime has 262.5 max energy at rank 30 without Flow.

 

Missions that are non-endless are so short that the loadouts don't really matter that much in those missions. Still, even then, efficiency gives more ability casts, power max does not.

 

woops, looking at the base.

[Darzk]

It only really helps if you need to use more than your max energy (without flow) in so small window of time that you can't get more from anywhere else. This is a situation that I feel doesn't exist at all.

 

But if you use Flow instead of Streamline, you need to pick up 4 energy orbs before you can Stomp again. If you use Streamline, you only need to pick up 3 orbs and still have 5 energy left after stomping.

 

QFT and +1's all around.