The Extremely Apologetic Kubrow Thread

[SmashEmDown]

I like that bit where you spoke directly to veteran players about how lowering the credits to maintain kubrows affects them.

 

This is the saddest part in all of gaming I've come across.

 

Veteran players saying that Kubrows are fine with their 100k maintenance is basically saying, I will gladly pay a large sum of credits to make sure that Kubrows are not accessible to new players. I will gladly support the 100k maintenance and in return, I want to feel special walking around with a Kubrow. I will wait patiently for 3 hours while my Kubrow recovers from stasis and anyone that does not want to wait 3 hours, well they should not have a Kubrow.

 

Seriously, where is the humanity in ppl that say shiit like this? Wtf is wrong with the world? Reducing the maintenance of kubrows affects you how? Please enlighten me. Reducing the time of stasis or completely removing the time of stasis affects you how? TELL ME.

 

It makes me sick seeing ppl support the 100k maintenance credits and 3 hour stasis for Kubrows. It really disgusts me. Maybe when DE finally fixes this, and Kubrows only require 10k to maintain and 5 mins to recover from stasis, you f*ckers will still be required to spend 100k maintenance and wait for a 3 hour recovery.

[SquirmyBurrito]

#1 - had the quest dropped from the Hyena Pack, I would not currently own one.  I hate the Hyena fight, and I will not do it for new content.  I may be alone, but then again, I may not.

 

#2 - Pushing the Kubrow further into the game simply denies new players access.  This does not encourage people to stay.  Too much grindiness required = a portion of the new players go to play things that reward you for playing, as opposed to saying "Oh look!  You can have this if youstick around for a few months!"

 

#3 - Create a credit sink for Vets.  Really?  And most vets say they can earn 100k in an afternoon.  So... exactly how does this hamper most vets at all?  If it is intended to reduce the credits veterans have, then it is a failed mechanic.  It only penalizes new players for having a key feature of the update.  You might just as soon lock it behind Mastery Level 10. 

 

If you wanted my thoughts on the subject, the cost for maintenance should be lowered to around 50,000 creds.  This is enough of a burden for new players that they can meet it while still leveling gear.  As noted earlier, Vets can earn as much credits as they want.  Nothing short of a ridiculous number is going to deter them, so making a discussion over credit sinks for Vets is pointless.

 

 

Good original post.  Nice attention to detail and a very thought out discussion. 

 

1. I too dislike the Hyena fight, but mostly because I almost always end up with a laggy host (I could solo it I guess...). I would have suffered through it for the quest though.

 

2. I continued playing warframe because of the thought that I could be that player who runs around oneshotting everything. Now that I'm at that stage, I continue playing because I want to be that next level player.

 

3. A credit sink doesn't have to drain your wallet to be a credit sink. What is important is that it costs a fair bit and is tempting. They could up the price to 500k and I'd still pay it. 1 mil not so much. I guess it's a good thing that I treat Sechura like old-xini, and pretty much exclusively play that (unless I'm leveling a kubrow).

 

A credit sink isn't supposed to deter vetern players.

[SquirmyBurrito]

I like that bit where you spoke directly to veteran players about how lowering the credits to maintain kubrows affects them.

 

This is the saddest part in all of gaming I've come across.

 

Veteran players saying that Kubrows are fine with their 100k maintenance is basically saying, I will gladly pay a large sum of credits to make sure that Kubrows are not accessible to new players. I will gladly support the 100k maintenance and in return, I want to feel special walking around with a Kubrow. I will wait patiently for 3 hours while my Kubrow recovers from stasis and anyone that does not want to wait 3 hours, well they should not have a Kubrow.

 

Seriously, where is the humanity in ppl that say shiit like this? Wtf is wrong with the world? Reducing the maintenance of kubrows affects you how? Please enlighten me. Reducing the time of stasis or completely removing the time of stasis affects you how? TELL ME.

 

It makes me sick seeing ppl support the 100k maintenance credits and 3 hour stasis for Kubrows. It really disgusts me. Maybe when DE finally fixes this, and Kubrows only require 10k to maintain and 5 mins to recover from stasis, you f*ckers will still be required to spend 100k maintenance and wait for a 3 hour recovery.

 

The three hour stasis recovery is a good way of preventing players from abusing it.

 

Nah, if they lowered the maintenance cost to 10k they might as well make DNA stabilizers free. And if they lower the stasis recover to five minutes, they might as well just remove it altogether. Hell, they might as well just sell fully matured kubrows on the market for 1 credit.

 

Your request for information regarding how it affects us has already been answered by another poster. 

 

If you can't wait three hours, don't stick your kubrow in stasis.

[Viverim]

1. I too dislike the Hyena fight, but mostly because I almost always end up with a laggy host (I could solo it I guess...). I would have suffered through it for the quest though.

 

2. I continued playing warframe because of the thought that I could be that player who runs around oneshotting everything. Now that I'm at that stage, I continue playing because I want to be that next level player.

 

3. A credit sink doesn't have to drain your wallet to be a credit sink. What is important is that it costs a fair bit and is tempting. They could up the price to 500k and I'd still pay it. 1 mil not so much. I guess it's a good thing that I treat Sechura like old-xini, and pretty much exclusively play that (unless I'm leveling a kubrow).

 

A credit sink isn't supposed to deter vetern players.

1 - our opinions align then, but for different reasons.

 

2 - You're a new player?  You define new players?  All players conform to your standards?  How odd.  My own observations do not seem to support any of this.

 

3 - I've already noted from your comments in other posts of a similar nature that you are one of the afore-mentioned veterans who thinks new players should be given nothing.  Your persistence in this observed opinion is therefore unsurprising.  And just because you enjoy ignoring the majority of the game in favor of an exploited mission does not in any way imply superiority.

 

You have also, I observe, failed to mention why someone other than yourself having a feature of the game at all impacts your ability to have a similar item.  If another poster has mentioned something that you agree with, you should either quote it or explain what you agreed with. 

[DAttila]

I believe the stasis system is the best bet to get around the DNA degradation.

Currently, however, the 3-hour recovery time is, as far as the vast majority of players is concerned, too much.

 

I think DE either needs to decrease the recovery time from stasis to 1hr or 30min, OR to give us a feature that you can buy with a one-time plat purchase that completely eliminates recovery time.

 

I think the DNA Stabilizers are meant to be used only on pups, as they have to be out of stasis to mature. Therefore, 1 DNA stabilizer per pup maturation cycle is pretty generous for 100k credits.

[Viverim]

I believe the stasis system is the best bet to get around the DNA degradation.

Currently, however, the 3-hour recovery time is, as far as the vast majority of players is concerned, too much.

 

I think DE either needs to decrease the recovery time from stasis to 1hr or 30min, OR to give us a feature that you can buy with a one-time plat purchase that completely eliminates recovery time.

 

I think the DNA Stabilizers are meant to be used only on pups, as they have to be out of stasis to mature. Therefore, 1 DNA stabilizer per pup maturation cycle is pretty generous for 100k credits.

In point of fact, what I underlined above is the reason stasis lock takes so long.  DE(L) is attempting to be sure that you can't use it to evade the DNA stabilizer mechanic.  One-Time purchases of a low number do not serve as a real life money sink, which I think DE(L) was hoping too many people would give in to impulse buys and waste platinum on.  Additionally, making a one-time platinum cost that is high would turn off most players to using it.

 

DAN Stabilizers are, I think, are intended to remove credits from the economy, however it isn't done well and it seems, to me, to be pointless.  Credits only effect things like gear upgrades.  You can't use them to trade with another player (although they do limit your ability to trade as they are a tax on trade actions), and you don't use them for the majority of store items.  As mentioned above, Veterans have access to high level content which make the acquisition of credits a trivial thing. It is possible that, as some elitist veterans seem to imply, that the entire Kubrow mechanic wasn't intended for anyone of a new/low level.  If so, then DE(L) should have been forthright and simply said so.  Bludgeoning new players with overpriced maintenance mechanics isn't going to win them much admiration, as the numerous Kubrow DNA stabilizer threads would seem to indicate.

 

Again, I think they were going for a different effect and it simply wasn't implemented properly.

[SquirmyBurrito]

1 - our opinions align then, but for different reasons.

 

2 - You're a new player?  You define new players?  All players conform to your standards?  How odd.  My own observations do not seem to support any of this.

 

3 - I've already noted from your comments in other posts of a similar nature that you are one of the afore-mentioned veterans who thinks new players should be given nothing.  Your persistence in this observed opinion is therefore unsurprising.  And just because you enjoy ignoring the majority of the game in favor of an exploited mission does not in any way imply superiority.

 

You have also, I observe, failed to mention why someone other than yourself having a feature of the game at all impacts your ability to have a similar item.  If another poster has mentioned something that you agree with, you should either quote it or explain what you agreed with. 

 

1. okay

2. No, and I never claimed to be. I was just sharing my motivations as a new player and how they still exist despite me no longer being new.

3. True and False. I do think that new players shouldn't be GIVEN anything. They should EARN all their things. I do not, however, think they should be barred access to Kubrows. A dedicated new player can get and afford a Kubrow. I never said I was superior, please do not attempt to delve into the potential implications of my statements. I'm a blunt person. I say what I mean.

 

No thanks, I have no desire to do extra work.

[Viverim]

1 - Agreed that they make eggs too rare, and the wait times for incubation and maturation are too long.  I think it takes 12 hours for a warframe part to be ready?  If so, then incubation should be a 12 hour wait, followed by a 12 maturation cycle. 

 

2 - as I have said before, 100,000 is too much in my opinion.  It should be lower.  (Just for the record, I can afford this.  I have like, 2.7 million in my ship bank.  But I think new users will find this far too costly.)

 

3 - This I cannot agree with.  I have a Huras, and she functions pretty well.  Not as active as I would like, however her Hunt skill is only rank 3.  I'd have to see how she performs with a fully ranked Hunt.

 

4 - the 3 hour swap, as I mentioned earlier, is to prevent people from skipping the DNA mechanic.  While I understand its purpose, it also pretty much makes having more than 1 kubrow rather pointless, so it is a mechanic which needs to be changed.

 

5 - The only time my kubrow disappears is when she gets stuck on some geometry or when she walks off a narrow bridge/terrain feature.  When I run she pretty much is by my side.  As such, I cannot comment on this point.

 

6 - Not sure what is up with this either.  As I say, my kubrow is usually in close proximity to me.  When she is under attack, I generally know about it and go full melee so Pack Leader can deal with any damage she has taken.  Of course, I also run with Rejuvenation on almost every frame (Excepting Loki, for the most part), which also helps as the aura affects her as well.

 

I agree that the process can be made better.  I am hopeful that DE(L) is working toward a more fun and interesting solution to the issues many of us have noted.

[Clawbo]

Oh boy, I logged on today and got 13 notifications about this thread, so I'll try to summarize my responses to each and every one of you;

 

I have come to the conclusion that the general execution of the Kubrows and their quest is wonly, and for lack of a better word - flawed.

 

The quest is given to you ex abrupto. You kill a boss and suddenly you recieve a message. Oh boy. Then you go around the planets, do trivial things, and suddenly you're asked to pay 150k credits for a power core. That, or spend platinum on it. It's a MASSIVE, unforseen delay in the quest that all but the high level players can surmount in an acceptable period of time.

 

That delay aside, you can't really establish a certain emotional bond with your Kubrow once it hatches, as I do believe that establishing the bond was DE's original intent. You have to wait for a long period of time for your puppy to become a fully functional creature, but that too is relatively rushed and stretched. In my humble opinion, I believe that the flow of the quest should be reworked to be more logical, fluent and ultimately longer. Players should NOT be given anything, that is true. But then again, a more fluent quest would be much better for establishing a link between Tenno and Kubrow. Because if you REALLY work for something, you're going to appreciate it much, much more -- one tends to take for granted the things one is simply given.

 

I urge you all to look at this thread: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/273981-kubrows-a-true-partner/

 

This is the best design of Kubrow evolution and acquisition I've seen so far. I truly think most of you would prefer this sort of quest and flow, rather than "Oh I got my dog, time to grind credits."

 

I would ask a question, if I may. Why is it so important to have a credit sink? What do you lose by holding on to a couple of million of creds? I understand that it gets boring with having nothing to buy, but the things you buy should be something that isn't as general as a Kubrow -- it should be things that are used to specialize in a specific field. Weapons and Warframes are the first thing that come to mind.

 

Honestly, the current progression system, at least when it comes to Kubrows, is jutted and stutters a lot. There are big leaps in fluency and that might throw people off. Something needs to be changed, but ultimately, Kubrows as of right now feel too punishing.

 

I'm sorry if this seems a bit incoherent, I just woke up and wanted to reply as soon as possible. Haven't achieved my work temperature yet.

Edited July 27, 2014 by Clawbo

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

I've been playing a little over a year, mastery rank 11. And I have to say the idea that 'you have to put in effort' is a little bit skewed because of the Sechura comment. Warframe is a game that should encourage players running different missions and experiencing different situations. We should not be forced to grind one mission over and over for an hour for anything.

Lol. Nearly everything in WF encourages playing the same thing repeatedly.

[notlamprey]

There isn't much I can add to the thread at this juncture, but I'll say this:

 

I'm shocked - SHOCKED - that our only option for permanently freeing up a Kubrow slot is "starving" them to death.

 

Pay up, or watch this digital creature waste away. As a lifelong pet owner and general animal lover, this is completely unsupportable. I'd really love to make an impassioned argument, but frankly I don't think one is even necessary.

 

We're meant to make an emotional investment in these creatures. We can watch them hatch from eggs, listen to their energetic puppy noises and watch them jump around. A lot of care went into making Kubrows that we can suspend disbelief to invest in.

 

Once that job is accomplished, DE is asking us to fork over our cash or starve an animal to death. What kind of request would that equate to in the real world?

 

It upsets me beyond the bounds of rational, courteous discourse, and I think it should.

 

I've buried four dogs in my lifetime. One was my self-appointed protector from my birth until his passing. Two were sisters; one passed of old age and the other couldn't keep going without her litter-mate.

 

The fourth was just months ago. He followed me every afternoon from the back door to the garden gate, and ran a full lap of the garden every time that gate swung shut behind me. In his last days, he could only walk that lap, but he pushed his body on with all the effort his eager spirit could supply. He rests now, underneath the honeysuckle patch he helped water for fifteen years.

 

Now, DE has given me the option to pay up or watch my Kubrow starve and die like an unloved and unwanted child. It disgusts me. It disgusts me because the illusion works, and that is about as abusive as game mechanics can get.

 

Please think about that, DE. For your own good and for your community.

[kimahn]

kubrow was a great concept. like anything they do. totally crippled by extremelly bad game design choices. like everything they do.

 

and yes, i was thinking kubrow was a feature who could unite the nub and the vet alike, and make the game enjoyable for those who are not in the numbers/farm/high action.

 

sadly, no. a lot of women i know wanted to try warframe, i waited the whole tutorial, who is EXTREMELLY crude, the kubrow thing is nowhere near approachable for a nub, and to make it at full power, you need super heavy fusion/farm/formaing.

[CBAROG]

There's a suggestion to swap loyalty and health. Here it is

 

Kubrow DNA Integrity/Loyalty Improvements: 

 

Now with Kubrows being with U14.0.7, it is a nice addition to Warframe (another option besides Sentinels, even it is a bit expensive), but it can be improved to make it more palatable and less frustrating to players. My suggestion for improvements is this: 

 

Kubrow DNA Integrity will decrease over time, from 100% to 0%, then to 0% to -100% (at which it dies [assumed]). Even though this is DE(L)'s way of attempting to make players care for their Kubrows by logging in each day to check up on it, it could be better if it the DNA Integrity would just decrease from 100% to 0% over time (i.e.: From double to normal health).

 

To compensate, an injury system can be introduced, where if the Kubrow dies during a mission, it will suffer an injury that will deduct a percentage of the base health (e.g.: A Kubrow dies in a mission. Because of this, it will now have a 20% base health penalty to itself [meaning at maximum DNA Integrity, it would be 180%]). The percentage of these injuries will be random, but to the point where it will only make the mean of the percentage have a small standard deviation. These injuries can stack, meaning a Kubrow can die if the stacked injuries deducts ≥100% of base health. These injuries will heal over time (say between 3-4 days?), but using DNA Stabilisers will deduct the injury percentages first (i.e. reducing base health penalty first) before boosting the health to the maximum of 100% more health (as though actually treating the injuries on the Kubrow). Using the Stasis chamber when the Kubrow is injured will halve the injury healing time. 

 

Also, with Kubrow Loyalty, it can be tweaked so that it will go from 100% to -100% in 4 days after the last login (at Loyalty = 0%, Kubrow deals normal damage). When Loyalty <0%, there is a chance when the player equips the Kubrow to come with him/her in a mission, the Kubrow will not come with the player (dependent on negative Loyalty value), with a 100% of not coming with the player on any mission. Players can now pet the Kubrow to increase its Loyalty by 15% (a slight decrease in value from the current build), but the Market will now have something akin to Kubrow Food (say 85,000 for 5 of them?) that, when fed to the Kubrow, will increase its Loyalty by 20%. Using the Stasis chamber will halt the Kubrow's rate of loyalty decrease.

 

With these two changes, I hope to keep the vision of DE(L) wanting players to take care of their Kubrow, while making it less frustrating for players.

 

 

Renegade343

 

To see my other threads, please go to my profile.

Health will decrease when Kubrow dies in a mission. And requires the stabilizer to change it back. So you don't need to spend 100k every week and Loyalty is much more logical.

DE stated that you will be able to leave it on Earth some time in the future. Stasis timewall is an another problem. Maybe change it to a temporary reduced speed, shield and health recovery. Given that out of stasis Kubrow needs some time to recover.

 

[CBAROG]

I've buried four dogs in my lifetime. 

Right in the feels.

[notlamprey]

Right in the feels.

 

Yeah, I got a little emotional. There must have been something in that first cup of coffee.

[(PSN)IIIDevoidIII]

Yeah, I got a little emotional. There must have been something in that first cup of coffee.

Making me think about all my passing pets. :c

[Clawbo]

There isn't much I can add to the thread at this juncture, but I'll say this:

I'm shocked - SHOCKED - that our only option for permanently freeing up a Kubrow slot is "starving" them to death.

Pay up, or watch this digital creature waste away. As a lifelong pet owner and general animal lover, this is completely unsupportable. I'd really love to make an impassioned argument, but frankly I don't think one is even necessary.

We're meant to make an emotional investment in these creatures. We can watch them hatch from eggs, listen to their energetic puppy noises and watch them jump around. A lot of care went into making Kubrows that we can suspend disbelief to invest in.

Once that job is accomplished, DE is asking us to fork over our cash or starve an animal to death. What kind of request would that equate to in the real world?

It upsets me beyond the bounds of rational, courteous discourse, and I think it should.

I've buried four dogs in my lifetime. One was my self-appointed protector from my birth until his passing. Two were sisters; one passed of old age and the other couldn't keep going without her litter-mate.

The fourth was just months ago. He followed me every afternoon from the back door to the garden gate, and ran a full lap of the garden every time that gate swung shut behind me. In his last days, he could only walk that lap, but he pushed his body on with all the effort his eager spirit could supply. He rests now, underneath the honeysuckle patch he helped water for fifteen years.

Now, DE has given me the option to pay up or watch my Kubrow starve and die like an unloved and unwanted child. It disgusts me. It disgusts me because the illusion works, and that is about as abusive as game mechanics can get.

Please think about that, DE. For your own good and for your community.

It's too early today for these feels.

If I can be brutally honest, the passing of a dog always hits me like a truck. I love them so much more than people. So yes, having to let your companion waste away is brutal. Morality may be a gray zone, but this is where I draw the line.

I'm very, sincerely sorry about all the losses you've endured. We'll never see each other, but at least our love of dogs unites us.

God damn it man, you've pushed me THIS close to b'aww-ing like a child.

Edited July 27, 2014 by Clawbo

[ThePresident777]

I have well over 500 hours in game, closer to 1000.  I'm sitting on 2mil credits.  My Kubrow dies within a minute the first time I took him out, in mercury.  I'm not going to waste time chasing after the 100,000 credits necessary to keep him alive.  It's just not fun for me to be locked into a perpetual credit treadmill, limiting my choices.  I start every Warframe session looking to have fun, wondering what location has the fun I'm looking for, and some useful stuff.  I don't want this game to become, for me, all about Sechura or where ever The One True Credit Source just happens to be.  So, I'm putting my Kubrow in stasis indefinitely and moving on to having fun.

[DSpite]

I like that bit where you spoke directly to veteran players about how lowering the credits to maintain kubrows affects them.

 

This is the saddest part in all of gaming I've come across.

 

Veteran players saying that Kubrows are fine with their 100k maintenance is basically saying, I will gladly pay a large sum of credits to make sure that Kubrows are not accessible to new players. I will gladly support the 100k maintenance and in return, I want to feel special walking around with a Kubrow. I will wait patiently for 3 hours while my Kubrow recovers from stasis and anyone that does not want to wait 3 hours, well they should not have a Kubrow.

 

Seriously, where is the humanity in ppl that say shiit like this? Wtf is wrong with the world? Reducing the maintenance of kubrows affects you how? Please enlighten me. Reducing the time of stasis or completely removing the time of stasis affects you how? TELL ME.

 

It makes me sick seeing ppl support the 100k maintenance credits and 3 hour stasis for Kubrows. It really disgusts me. Maybe when DE finally fixes this, and Kubrows only require 10k to maintain and 5 mins to recover from stasis, you f*ckers will still be required to spend 100k maintenance and wait for a 3 hour recovery.

 

I was ok with this reading this post up to the "you f*ckers", and I'm not even a vet, I've only being playing under two months, and my gross income shows as just under 23 MILLION credits.

 

So yea, based on your little outcry there, I'm all for keeping you out of owning a Kubrow, as obviously you don't play this game enough, and don't deserve MORE free stuff on top of free reactors, and weapons, and cash and blueprints (longer list) just for logging in once a day and doing nothing at all. You can already jump into any alert with a totally UNRANKED frame, without even having the location unlocked, with mates, and sit back and get even MORE free stuff by just hoovering everything after the team moves on, and here you are wanting MORE stuff for free.

 

Can't afford to play the new mechanic? Too bad.

 

Comments with "Humanity", "Wrong with the world", "makes me sick", "really disgust me" and ending with "you f*ckers" shows that this game is not your problem, and combined with the fact you think that a "game" is punishing you, you seriously need to see a mental health specialist.

[DSpite]

There isn't much I can add to the thread at this juncture, but I'll say this:

 

1) I'm shocked - SHOCKED - that our only option for permanently freeing up a Kubrow slot is "starving" them to death.

 

Pay up, or watch this digital creature waste away. As a lifelong pet owner and general animal lover, this is completely unsupportable. I'd really love to make an impassioned argument, but frankly I don't think one is even necessary.

 

We're meant to make an emotional investment in these creatures. We can watch them hatch from eggs, listen to their energetic puppy noises and watch them jump around. A lot of care went into making Kubrows that we can suspend disbelief to invest in.

 

Once that job is accomplished, DE is asking us to fork over our cash or starve an animal to death. What kind of request would that equate to in the real world?

 

2) It upsets me beyond the bounds of rational, courteous discourse, and I think it should.

 

I've buried four dogs in my lifetime. One was my self-appointed protector from my birth until his passing. Two were sisters; one passed of old age and the other couldn't keep going without her litter-mate.

 

The fourth was just months ago. He followed me every afternoon from the back door to the garden gate, and ran a full lap of the garden every time that gate swung shut behind me. In his last days, he could only walk that lap, but he pushed his body on with all the effort his eager spirit could supply. He rests now, underneath the honeysuckle patch he helped water for fifteen years.

 

Now, DE has given me the option to pay up or watch my Kubrow starve and die like an unloved and unwanted child. It disgusts me. It disgusts me because the illusion works, and that is about as abusive as game mechanics can get.

 

Please think about that, DE. For your own good and for your community.

 

1) What? No, that's is JUST YOU seeing the "not feeding a pet" freeing up a slot as "an option". If you already know you can't take care of your "virtual pet", maybe DONT GET ONE? You know how to keep a slot free? Don't get a pet until you can take care of it, and AMAZINGLY, it wont die.

 

2) Comparing pixels to real life animals. Seek professional help. This is a game, meant to be played to relax. This is like you saying that you go to friends to play this game:

 

http://www.amazon.com/Lightning-Reaction-Reloaded-Shocking-Game/dp/B0006B2Q50

 

and are incredibly upset when you get shocked. Would you not stop playing? Apparently not, you would keep playing and THEN COMPLAIN about the shocks.

 

Kubrows: Optional. Play or don't play.

[DSpite]

kubrow was a great concept. like anything they do. totally crippled by extremelly bad game design choices. like everything they do.

 

and yes, i was thinking kubrow was a feature who could unite the nub and the vet alike, and make the game enjoyable for those who are not in the numbers/farm/high action.

 

sadly, no. a lot of women i know wanted to try warframe, i waited the whole tutorial, who is EXTREMELLY crude, the kubrow thing is nowhere near approachable for a nub, and to make it at full power, you need super heavy fusion/farm/formaing.

 

You have just accused DE of "constantly making extremely bad game design choices" in "everything they do".

 

Why are you still here? Go play Barbie Online.

 

I'm playing a game where I log to slaughter mindless AI in the thousands, pretty sure that was exactly what was in the Warframe Brouchure, and that is exactyl what I am getting. Maybe you read it wrong?

[LukeAura]

Lol. Nearly everything in WF encourages playing the same thing repeatedly.

Not at all and certainly not for a common resource. The game dictates nothing to you. 

If you want to farm exterminates that's for you, you can still get most mods that way. Invasions are optional for higher resources. That grind is your choice, and Brakk and Detron parts can be obtained just by playing often enough in pug. Possible without doing the invasion yourself and without going against your pace. Prime Parts will always be there, you never have to run the same mission repeatedly or any number of days in a row. There are also break ups between prime parts. Want X prime, run any faction survival, or have a friend hook you up and skip it, or use recruitment. Tired of farming for one part of the weapon, farm in another for a different one.  

And just because that's what it is, doesn't mean that's what it should be. Effort is effort, no matter where the player directs it. So long as they're enjoying putting in that effort and at their own pace they will eventually apply that effort to get whatever they are looking for. 

As the resources goes up in rarity their locations shrink true, but that makes sense. A common resource is not something we should feel like we have to farm every day or every other day. 

Not even Argon is this bad, because while it does degrade it is something easily farmed again and something that never requires to be obtained at any given time. 

Kubrows are the only  implementation that near to requires credit optimal farming, and forces the schedule for that farming. 

Edited July 28, 2014 by LukeAura

[notlamprey]

1) What? No, that's is JUST YOU seeing the "not feeding a pet" freeing up a slot as "an option". If you already know you can't take care of your "virtual pet", maybe DONT GET ONE? You know how to keep a slot free? Don't get a pet until you can take care of it, and AMAZINGLY, it wont die.

 

2) Comparing pixels to real life animals. Seek professional help. This is a game, meant to be played to relax. This is like you saying that you go to friends to play this game:

 

http://www.amazon.com/Lightning-Reaction-Reloaded-Shocking-Game/dp/B0006B2Q50

 

and are incredibly upset when you get shocked. Would you not stop playing? Apparently not, you would keep playing and THEN COMPLAIN about the shocks.

 

Kubrows: Optional. Play or don't play.

 

You may want to reconsider bringing your armchair psychology against an M.S. holder. I am the professional help.

 

Let's start by addressing your concerns regarding the alleged instability of my mental causeway to the real, since it seems only fair to attempt the establishment of a modicum of credibility before I ask you to listen.

 

Are you familiar with the precepts of formal logic? For the purpose of delivering feedback, which is our unofficial purpose here, I chose to proceed under the assumption that DE succeeded in doing what they set out to do when they designed Kubrows.

 

If I am to assume they succeeded, a necessary part of that assumption is the acceptance as true of the premise that DE created a virtual animal in which the player feels drawn to emotionally invest. This serves a dual purpose: it gives the argument my own personal stamp, simultaneously presenting one of the more extreme perspectives DE will have to contend with as a result of the tentative design decisions they've made. I didn't set out to write a stream-of-consciousness blog post, after all.

 

I'd be irresponsible if I didn't mention the fact that I'm a pet owner and general softie when it comes to caring for creatures who depend on us to do so. In the interest of disclosing my bias, I specifically mentioned this.

 

Your unwillingness to suspend disbelief is duly noted, but that doesn't change the inherent usefulness of feedback from the perspective of those who choose to accept the actor in black as invisible.

[Clawbo]

1) What? No, that's is JUST YOU seeing the "not feeding a pet" freeing up a slot as "an option". If you already know you can't take care of your "virtual pet", maybe DONT GET ONE? You know how to keep a slot free? Don't get a pet until you can take care of it, and AMAZINGLY, it wont die.

 

2) Comparing pixels to real life animals. Seek professional help. This is a game, meant to be played to relax. This is like you saying that you go to friends to play this game:

 

http://www.amazon.com/Lightning-Reaction-Reloaded-Shocking-Game/dp/B0006B2Q50

 

and are incredibly upset when you get shocked. Would you not stop playing? Apparently not, you would keep playing and THEN COMPLAIN about the shocks.

 

Kubrows: Optional. Play or don't play.

 

You made three posts in a row just to complain about everything, without bringing up a valid point. Rather, you stroked your hard-boiled e-peen saying how you're here to "slaughter thousands" and that you feel nothing while doing so. And all the while I held a sliver of respect for your opinions because in a twisted sense, I could yank an opinion on the topic at hand from your rants.

 

But when you said "Go play Barbie Online", I reached the conclusion that you are perhaps 12 years old, maybe even 13.

 

Perhaps you skipped over the part in the original post that says "Not everyone plays equally" and not everyone can gross 23 million with such ease as you have. Why, if ever Warframe turns into an e-sport, I'm sure you'll take the cup in no time.

 

Look, if DE did not want players to get attached to Kubrows, they would have designed a synthetic companion that would've been manufactured. Put together. A cold machine with nary a hint of emotion that would follow you around and do your bidding. They could've said that the Tenno recently learned how to replicate the Orokin Neural Sentry that corrupts those who venture into the Towers, turning them into unwilling slaves that are forced to defend that they once sought to plunder and destroy. And such a machine would be a tool, an instrument. I don't know about you, but I've yet to find a person who grew an emotional bond with a lamp or a power drill, or any other electric-powered utensil. At least a bond that wasn't asymmetrical.

 

But that is not the case now, is it? No sir, you are sent to retrieve an EGG. A living being is going to hatch from that egg. That tiny puppy is going to release the cutest, high-pitched barks. That puppy is going to drag its butt around the floor. It was all intended to emulate the behavioral patterns commonly found in real world puppies. And I do believe that it's safe to assume that DE made them the way they are now in order to evoke an emotional attachment to them from the players. As notlamprey stated in his first post here, the Kubrow puppies jitter around happily and act as a living being in all regards. They require upkeep as all pets do, so that's just adding to the sense of bonding between players and Kubrow.

 

I'm all for separating work from play, and real life from game, but many players, myself included, like to be immersed in a game they play. Kubrow are one of the factors that help me achieve that immersion. I'm not here to win the game or be the very best when it comes to, I don't know, T4 Defense or something. I'm here to have fun. To do what a space ninja would do. And that is why I grew attached to my Kubrow.

 

And let's face it, if you were going to obtain a Kubrow solely for its utility, you might as well have stuck to your Carrier or Djinn. After all, as you said, Kubrows are completely optional. Why bother with it, then? Do correct me if I'm wrong, but while your Kubrow was a puppy, you were either annoyed by the things it did, or you merely ignored them. See what I'm aiming at here? You were the sole reason why there is no emotion involved. And I have to say, you are the minority. So stay your tongue with those would-be insults and drop the attitude, I don't much care for it, and I'm certain most people in this thread share my sentiment.

 

The huge selling point, as it were, of U14 WERE the Kubrows. They were in 3 previous dev streams, and then suddenly half the playerbase can't have them, because of what? Credits? Pardon me for making assumptions, but releasing an update and then not allowing players to enjoy a major part of it seems, how should I put it... counter-intuitive.

 

My original goal was to let DE know that Kubrows were a great concept, but their execution was lacking in accessibility. They aren't so terribly overpowered that only the best of the players should have them. Now weapons I can understand, but pets? Companions? They were meant for everyone. No reason to hide them behind a paywall.

[traybong111]

Considering that Kubrows have mods, would they be assigned conclave ratings? (I'm at MR11 thiiiis close to MR12 but I still consider myself a noob and have not yet got a Kubrow.) 

 

With how early a player can obtain Kubrows I think they have potential to be much more of companions that become stronger alongside the player, who just doesn't gain more levels but more knowledge into the game's mechanics. The so-called "meta" stuff. I think they were meant for both new and veteran players and would provide a lot of immersion to new players if Kubrows were also noobs growing beside their masters. 

 

This is a compromise and has a lot of loopholes but my suggestion, if there absolutely MUST be some kind of credit sink for Kubrows, is to have stabilizers or pet foods with different prices according to the Kubrows' rank and/or conclave rating. (Even without mod rank 30 sentinels, warframes and weapons have a set minimal conclave rating so the same rating and food price could apply to a ranked Kubrow.) I don't know what kind of excuse to come up with suddenly feeding different stuff to Kubrow so I'm going to leave that to others. With how much XP gain has been decreased I think an average new player will be spending some time ranking his warframe and Kubrow, so why not give them a break for the first few planets while the player builds some attachment to his Kubrow and the game?