T4 Survival Needs Balancing

[darthrevan13]

I've tried to play a T4 Void Survival today with one of my buddies, me a Loki and him a Nekros and the spawn rate of enemies is simply overwhelming, a week ago things where much more balanced. What the hell happend? For the first 6 minutes we where sitting in the exact same room and the life support never dipped under 90%, that's how many enemies where comming.

Now, I wouldn't say that this overdid spawning is such a bad thing per se, but why the hell is Vor in T4 survival? It's almost impossible to kill him with the amount of enemies coming for us. Me and my friend where both shooting 1 cartridge our Soma's at Vor's belly and we barely managed to get through his shield and a 5th of his life, and after that we both died because my his and my 4th weren't enough to keep them occupied. One of us alone couldn't take out Vor.

TL;DR Why does Vor appear in T4 Survival? He doesn't in T1 survival, and because he does it the mission much too hard! Shouldn't he only spawn only in non-endless missions?

[Domaik]

Well i think it's fine i don't have a problem with it

[creeperZface]

DE DONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERFDONTNERF

 

 

 

 

ever

[meIody-]

"Oh no! A challenge!"

[noveltyhero]

Seriously? Don't run T4 if you aren't ready for the challenge. I love it, keeps you on your toes. miss a shot you're dead :D

[letir]

Bring some CC frame with you and try harder. Vor is weakling.

[Quizel]

Vor showed up in the voids when t4's were released and created a better experience if you ask me. He's less of a threat if you have a trinity and don't stand in fire, it doesn't heal you (wow mechanics 101).

 

As for spawn rate of enemies, i wish i could experience what you did every time.

Edited July 28, 2014 by Quizel

[Nelsonz80]

Just for this, im gonna play T4s, thanks for giving me a reason to play them again :D

[TaintedDream]

TL;DR Why does Vor appear in T4 Survival? He doesn't in T1 survival, and because he does it the mission much too hard! Shouldn't he only spawn only in non-endless missions?

 

Vor doesn't spawn in T1 Survival because it's a T1......

Vor does spawns in T4 Survival because it's a T4......

[Laserclawz]

I don't think DE should nerf the spawn rates because from my experience, I get like 5 enemies per 3 minutes. From my experience(s) the spawn rate is so low. Comparing to the spawn rates of a T2S, T4S has about 1/4 the spawns (from my experiences). The thing is, the low spawn rates for me isn't just coincidence. It has been recurring constantly. Well, the only thing I can ask is to make the spawn rates more constant.

[Anarchel]

I totally agree with darthrevan.

 

T4S needs balancing. I'm thinking like, 3 times the mobs that currently spawn below the 30 minute mark.

Before U14, the mobs were enough to go for like 60 minutes without a Nekros. Now, without you wouldn't stand 20 minutes. It was such a relief, not to have to have a Nekros with you, everybody was able to play the frame of his liking, instead of the "Press 3"-frame.

...and Vor? Hey he's coming! ...and dead. Dam, didn't even land a shot since my teammates were too fast.

[darthrevan13]

"Oh no! A challenge!"

 

Seriously? I'm rank 13 with a double formad Soma and my friend is a rank 12 with a double formad Soma. You try to do it with a friend, and post a screenshot before coming here and acting all macho about it.

The problem is the extreme difficulty. I'm not saying nerf the spawn rates and I'm not saying that Vor is impossible to beat, I'm just saying that in combination, both are devastating. This wasn't a problem a week ago because the spawn rates where not crazy as they are now, so Vor wasn't a problem but now, in T4 Survival, Vor is extremely har to kill because of the spawn rates. In a T4 Exterminate Vor is a breeze, I was doing T4E solo for a Rhino Prime Blueprints and the money.

And DE, for Pete's sake, why is mele useless against Vor? You made an entire update to show how viable mele is and I still can't solo with one. This is a very serious issue that needs to be addressed!

Edited July 29, 2014 by darthrevan13

[DSpite]

Seriously? I'm rank 13 with a double formad Soma and my friend is a rank 12 with a double formad Soma. You try to do it with a friend, and post a screenshot before coming here and acting all macho about it.

 

 

I'm sorry, did you like, type the wrong numbers there? Rank 13 and Rank 12 ... in T4 missions.

 

Wat?

[TaintedDream]

I'm sorry, did you like, type the wrong numbers there? Rank 13 and Rank 12 ... in T4 missions.

 

Wat?

 

Have you heard of Mastery Rank?

 

Though frankly, yes, he should have just used MR 13 and 12.

[darthrevan13]

I'm sorry, did you like, type the wrong numbers there? Rank 13 and Rank 12 ... in T4 missions.

 

Wat?

I'm was refering to my mastery rank, all our warframes and weapons where potatoed and maxed during the mission.

 

 

 

Have you heard of Mastery Rank?

 

Though frankly, yes, he should have just used MR 13 and 12.

 

Yeah, sorry, I forgot.

Edited July 30, 2014 by darthrevan13

[Turnoverman]

Seriously? I'm rank 13 with a double formad Soma and my friend is a rank 12 with a double formad Soma. You try to do it with a friend, and post a screenshot before coming here and acting all macho about it.

 

Get another pair of people. T4 is hard because T4 is hard. It shouldn't be nerfed because it's intended for a full team with varying weapons intended on supporting each other. A Loki and a Nekros don't exactly make tanks, and, without some kind of support, should fail at T4S. No, it's not a problem that pairs can't do it because pairs aren't the way Warframe is set up to be played. It's set up for four. I'm not saying pairs don't work at the lower ends of things, but the very tippy tippy top of difficulty should require a full cell.

[UFOLoche]

....Can I just chime in and say T4 isn't hard?  I don't get it, it's literally just T3 with Vor in it, am I missing something?  Is that what makes it hard?  That Vor pops up eventually..?

 

I think T4 S is fine as it is, although I think Survival in general needs a rework 'cause the whole "There are no enemies for some reason" thing happens way too often

[TaintedDream]

The difficulty is really just two things:

-Increased enemy damage, which makes some frames lose some viability.

-Vor. Who is really only a problem if he pops out in a mode where enemies spawn constantly: Defense (only if he appears near the start of a wave), Survival, and Mobile Defense, if he shows up after you've activated the console, but with plenty of time left on it. And even in those three situations, he's still a joke if your team is packing the DPS.

 

But in actual difficulty? There's not nearly as much as people make it seem like. I use T4 to level up weapons.

Edited July 30, 2014 by TaintedDream

[UFOLoche]

I have not seen an increase in damage, huh...

 

Well, thanks for telling me.

[Austerity]

Seriously? I'm rank 13 with a double formad Soma and my friend is a rank 12 with a double formad Soma. You try to do it with a friend, and post a screenshot before coming here and acting all macho about it.

The problem is the extreme difficulty. I'm not saying nerf the spawn rates and I'm not saying that Vor is impossible to beat, I'm just saying that in combination, both are devastating. This wasn't a problem a week ago because the spawn rates where not crazy as they are now, so Vor wasn't a problem but now, in T4 Survival, Vor is extremely har to kill because of the spawn rates. In a T4 Exterminate Vor is a breeze, I was doing T4E solo for a Rhino Prime Blueprints and the money.

And DE, for Pete's sake, why is mele useless against Vor? You made an entire update to show how viable mele is and I still can't solo with one. This is a very serious issue that needs to be addressed!

 

Maybe you aren't ready for a T4 survival just yet. Maybe perhaps you are just weaker than you believe yourself to be. It's ok, but just because you had a tough time in 1 T4 survival, shouldn't mean the entire system needs a Nerf.

 

#1 Run multiple T4 survivals. Is this a recurring problem?

 

#2 Go to friends or the forums and ask for advice on how to better complete the task you are having difficulty with.

 

#3 If a vast number of people are also experiencing the same situation, then post a polite request for DE to look into re-balancing.

 

 

Right now it just looks like you had one bad experience and have come to the forums to b1tch about it.

 

T4's are endgame content. Meaning when you finally get 4 forma on your soma and have a maxed out damage build with maxed mods, you have someplace to go to use that powerful weapon. And the amount of  forma you spent on your soma matters little if you have crap mods and a bad loadout. 

 

Personally I'd rather see an increase in enemies in T4 survivals not the opposite, but I like having a challenge.

 

Even though you did not ask for it, here is some advice. When you get the warning that Vor is coming, move to a smaller tile (room). This makes keeping line of sight on him easier as he will remain closer. Additionally, learn the void. There are plenty of areas where you can move to, that enemies can't follow. Vor is an exception to this meaning you can usually seperate him from the mobs to make killing him easier. Make sure you pop air before moving to that location, you don't want to be so distracted by Vor that you let the air run out.

 

Remember: Just because something is too hard for you, does not mean it's too hard for the majority of other players. Seek help first, there are many many experienced players here that are happy to help out.

[Zeitzbach]

Having something to kill is better than nothing to kill. You just got lucky (or for you, unlucky) you were in a room near many spawn rooms, and that you probably weren't killing fast enough. Why were you worried about them killing you anyway? Just radial disarm them and destroy them. Number doesn't matter if they are all melee.

 

Also, Vor is meh. Just shoot him with a snipe weapon like Marelok. With a proper element, you can easily breeze through his shield and armor like it's nothing.

 

And funny no one mentioned this yet..

 

#typicalSomauserhuehuehue.

[darthrevan13]

Okay, so I play a 4 Player T4 today,  team was: a Nekros, Nova, Mirage, and me a Nyx. We had Weapons raging from Paris Prime, Orthos Prime, Ogris and Penta. Vor appeared at around the 5 minute mark, and it took a great group effort, with me casting my 3rd a bunch of times to be able to defeat Vor at about the 15 minute mark. After that things where extremely easy till the 40 minute mark. We tried to push for more but at 43 minutes we where at 8% Life Support so we ended the mission up there.

Coming out of this experience I still think Vor should be removed entirely from T4 survival, I mean things get much too easy after defeating Vor. It doesn't seem right, Survival means that it should get progressively harder, not very hard in the beginning, easy afterwards and the progressively harder again. If this is intended then why then I strongly disagree with the reward at every 5 minutes thing in T4 survival. It should be linear, you earn more if you can stay more, not you either earn squat (or close to squat) or you defeat Vor and get a ton of stuff.

I would agree if there where harder enemies or more enemies in T4, I know it's T4, I also think it should be very hard, but not a slap in the face hard in the begining, like Vor, and then very easy.

Edited July 30, 2014 by darthrevan13

[UnknownBlademaster]

I don't think DE should nerf the spawn rates because from my experience, I get like 5 enemies per 3 minutes. From my experience(s) the spawn rate is so low. Comparing to the spawn rates of a T2S, T4S has about 1/4 the spawns (from my experiences). The thing is, the low spawn rates for me isn't just coincidence. It has been recurring constantly. Well, the only thing I can ask is to make the spawn rates more constant.

Simple f*cking reason.

 

STOP.

BEING.

A.

FREAKIN.

DOORWAY.

WARRIOR.

 

Or TL;DR don't run around the entire map trying to find enemies; let them come to you.

[DSpite]

Have you heard of Mastery Rank?

 

Though frankly, yes, he should have just used MR 13 and 12.

 

I think my point was "what the hell does MR have to do with player skill?"

 

I can Hit high MR but sitting on a perch with a Penta and even just fail missions because WF does not take away affinity once you have it.

[Flamingfighter]

I'm failing to see why the Vor, who apparently makes T4 difficult in the first place, should be removed entirely. If you're problem is that the game is too easy without Vor around, then how does taking him out entirely help with the lack of difficulty players are experiencing. This also goes against the experiences many players had where they found Vor too easy. I've had friends solo him with a melee weapon. I've had a friend solo him with the MK-1 Braton. Perhaps it is a question of weapon optimization?

 

Additionally, high mastery rank does not equal high skill in the game. I'm MR 16 and friends I have at MR 7 are more skilled than I am.