Does Anyone Want A 'tank' Frame? Are They Even Necessary?

[RespectTheInternet]

Specifically, a frame who's purpose is to protect other frames from damage while disabling / aggroing* enemies. A almost 100% defender frame. When you look at the title, you either think Frost, Rhino, Valkyr, or Volt (I suppose), Loki,  and Trinity.  But most of them aren't actually "tanks" in a conventional sense.

 

*By aggro I mean drawing enemy fire, like Loki's decoy.

 

Frost's only ability that is defensive is his Snow Globe, which isn't tanking in the sense that Frost is taking damage, but rather is a Redirection skill because it just redirects all damage outside the globe. . . onto the globe. But technically, his Globe is tanking, and by transitive property, Frost is tanking you could argue.

 

Rhino has his iron skin, but that's just a self buff skill, doesn't help anyone else except when reviving them. His stomp skill is incredibly useful I won't disagree, but the thinking behind it isn't to "protect" others, but rather to harm enemies and render them helpless. It just so happens that it can be used for reviving and regrouping as well though.

 

Valkyr is immortal. But like Rhino's Iron skin, that isn't a particularly helpful skill to anyone except the user.

 

Volt has his shields, but they don't perfectly block damage like Frost's snow globe unless you stack several of them all at once and mod for it for maximum effect.

 

Loki has his decoy combined with radial disarm (Super Effective) but I feel like that's more of a gimmick than anything since you can put decoys in impossible to reach areas and almost every enemy will attack it for hours since they are all brain dead potatoes.

 

Trinity is a healer. She has her link skill which make's her Incredibly hard to kill, but besides that her entire role is heals and energy regen.

 

Now, while all of these frames have skills useful for taking large amounts of damage, or disabling enemy's in some way, there exists no single frame who's whole point is to take damage and disable enemies. Does anyone want that? If we did want that though, then we have to ask: Do we even Need one? Given enough time and credits, anyone can slap on a max redirection / vitality / vigor etc. and be mostly self sufficient. The high mobility all Tenno are endowed with makes for fast strafing in and out of cover while dodging hailstorms of lazers  and bullets.  Combined with any combination of the aforementioned frames (or some I haven't), dying almost never happens if the player is Trying not to. So, are they even necessary?

 

tl;dr

With the vast abundance of powerful game-changing warframe skills, high mobility, and powerful defense mods, is a 'defense' or tank frame wanted, or even needed?

 

Thoughts?

 

[Mirriky]

We have enough tanks. To have one all rounder would be overkill and take over the rest of the frames.

[Guest Tehnoobshow]

Nyx, absorb for taking damage, and chaos for CC.

[Toaman1994]

The way the game is set up now, for a character to be a "Tank", they need to be:

A) Playing a mission where all the team members are nearby at all times

B) Playing a mission where the amount of damage caused by enemies is enough to be a serious danger for teammates

C) Having way more health/shields/armor than other players.

 

Really, a Tank character needs to be incredibly strong to actually be viable (in theory). When playing with a good team, every player will be able to cause/take a ton of damage; it's a little weird to say, but an Aggro-drawing Tank usually isn't necessary in this game. It's nice to have a teammate draw aggro when you're in a tight spot, but it's not like high-level characters need that type of character.

 

From what I've experienced, CC characters (Rhino Stomp and Loki Disarm, for instance) are immeasurably more useful than some aggro-drawing frame, especially in high level combat.

[RespectTheInternet]

We have enough tanks. To have one all rounder would be overkill and take over the rest of the frames.

How do you equate 'tank' = all rounder?

[Guest Tehnoobshow]

How do you equate 'tank' = all rounder?

Because Rhino.

[RespectTheInternet]

The way the game is set up now, for a character to be a "Tank", they need to be:

A) Playing a mission where all the team members are nearby at all times

B) Playing a mission where the amount of damage caused by enemies is enough to be a serious danger for teammates

C) Having way more health/shields/armor than other players.

 

Really, a Tank character needs to be incredibly strong to actually be viable (in theory). When playing with a good team, every player will be able to cause/take a ton of damage; it's a little weird to say, but an Aggro-drawing Tank usually isn't necessary in this game. It's nice to have a teammate draw aggro when you're in a tight spot, but it's not like high-level characters need that type of character.

 

From what I've experienced, CC characters (Rhino Stomp and Loki Disarm, for instance) are immeasurably more useful than some aggro-drawing frame, especially in high level combat.

I mentioned that near the end, with all of our extremely powerful defense mods. I also agreed that Rhino stomp and loki disarm are pretty much god buttons. A tank frame would have to be incredibly useful in some fashion.

[RespectTheInternet]

Because Rhino.

Except he's not a tank. He just spams stomp.

[CybrinZ]

For Rhino to be a tank, his stats need to reflect it. His Armor would need to be on par with Valky and his HP/Shields would need to be on par with Zephyr. To counteract this high health, his speed would need to be reduced and Iron Skin and Roar would need to draw enemy fire.

 

 

Unfortunately this probably won't happen. Cause you know Rhinos.

Edited August 4, 2014 by CybrinZ

[Dtexas]

Starts thread about tank type warframes, mentions volt (ha, volt a tank), frost (is much more defense then he is tank) and loki (can not tank for anything and is more for drawing aggro and messing with the enemy).

 

Yet no mention of Saryn who can draw aggro and tank damage. I has sad.

 

And no, a warframe specifically designed to be a tank is not needed. We have so many frames that do that job in their own way and have other abilities to go with it (Rhino, Saryn, Valkyr, etc) that a frame like that is not needed.

Edited August 4, 2014 by Dtexas

[ShortBear]

For Rhino to be a tank, his stats need to reflect it. His Armor would need to be on par with Valky and his HP/Shields would need to be on par with Zephyr. To counteract this high health, his speed would need to be reduced and Iron Skin and Roar would need to draw enemy fire.

 

 

Unfortunately this probably won't happen. Cause you know Rhinos.

 

God forbid they change our precious Rhino!

[Galvantula]

For Rhino to be a tank, his stats need to reflect it. His Armor would need to be on par with Valky and his HP/Shields would need to be on par with Zephyr. To counteract this high health, his speed would need to be reduced and Iron Skin and Roar would need to draw enemy fire.

 

 

Unfortunately this probably won't happen. Cause you know Rhinos.

Straight defenses aren't quite what makes a tank.  He posses a strong defensive steroid (Iron Skin), has a good amount of crowd control (Rhino Stomp), and a great team-based utility spell (Roar).  While I'd like to see his iron skin draw enemy fire, it isn't crucial in making someone a "tank."

[Cannamancer]

Lol I guess no one know how to use Rhino the right way lol. He is a tank plain and simple.

[RespectTheInternet]

Starts thread about tank type warframes, mentions volt (ha, volt a tank), frost (is much more defense then he is tank) and loki (can not tank for anything and is more for drawing aggro and messing with the enemy).

 

Yet no mention of Saryn who can draw aggro and tank damage. I has sad.

 

And no, a warframe specifically designed to be a tank is not needed. We have so many frames that do that job in their own way and have other abilities to go with it (Rhino, Saryn, Valkyr, etc) that a frame like that is not needed.

Sort of forgot she exists, and if you at least read the ending, you would see I said the exact same thing.

That written, I pretty much agree : /

[CybrinZ]

Straight defenses aren't quite what makes a tank.  He posses a strong defensive steroid (Iron Skin), has a good amount of crowd control (Rhino Stomp), and a great team-based utility spell (Roar).  While I'd like to see his iron skin draw enemy fire, it isn't crucial in making someone a "tank."

A tank is generally one that is drawing away aggro and taking all the damage. Usually that correlates with strong defenses, and if there's going to be a tank in this game, that's going to be the most important thing, considering how enemies scale.

[Vitras]

Sorry that I didn't read all of your post, but I saw you said to be a tank they have to draw enemy fire. Then you said ironskin wasn't it, but the thing is it actually has aggro. Or at least unless they changed it? Anyway, that's all I was gonna say.

Edited August 4, 2014 by Vitras

[Mr.ToastForPresident]

I want a warframe that has a Tank barrel for a nose and runs on treads.

[fatpig84]

IIRC Ironskin previously on cast, will draw more aggro than anything except the Cryopod or Decoy now.

Not sure was this changed though.

 

That is why Rhino users in high levels noticed iron skin getting evaporated, because everyone and their mum is shooting you, or you are playing really badly.

[Incunabulum]

I think we need to get away from the tank/DPS/healer paradigm that's been an MMO staple for a long freaking time now.

 

We don't need dedicated tanks - guys who stand there and have the mobs wail on them.  That is, IMO, a cheesy exploitation of limited AI.  Having a *beefier* frame is good, though I don't really think we need another Rhino.

 

It'd be OK to see some more CC and healing abilities spread around the frames - but no dedicated tank or healer frames.  We should be trading agro among the team, sort of like a pack of wolves taking down prey. 

[DJ_Redwire]

Except he's not a tank. He just spams stomp.

 

You're describing a play style - not a character class. Making distinctions on warframe classes gets muddy very quickly when you start making broad generalizations about them when only looking at them from a single perspective at a single portion of the frame. 

[Mastikator2]

Tanks draw agro, that may or may not involve actually taking damage.

 

Also, Warframe is not WoW and that is a good thing. The rpg group dynamics of WoW do not and should not exist in warframe, warframe is a parkour shooter with some stealth.

[Galvantula]

Tanks draw agro, that may or may not involve actually taking damage.

 

Also, Warframe is not WoW and that is a good thing. The rpg group dynamics of WoW do not and should not exist in warframe, warframe is a parkour shooter with some stealth.

Some class mechanics from mmos isn't a bad thing.  However, it should never be to the point where we're required to have specific team makeups in order to do T4 content.  In a perfect setting, 4 damage-based warframes should be just as capable of doing T4 compared to one with some support-based warframes.

[(PSN)dukezap1]

Mentions Loki as a 'Tank' Can't take rest of post seriously