Enemy Scaling: Boss = High Health Low Damage, Normal = Low Health High Damage

[OrphanMaker]

The is my feedback on the general difficulty scaling of enemies in warframe. Enemies in warframe need a rebalancing to fit the gameplay.

 

Normal enemies need to hit hard and die easily. (They should not hit to hard nor die to easy, but their health should be lower than their damage.)

 

Bosses are messed up right now! I just ran the Jackal and he ripped a hole in me and my squad. He have to much health. My whole team hit him as hard as possible. We dumped over 4 magazines, a piece, into him and it did nothing to him. His rockets 1 hit us as well.

 

Simple boss fix: High health, and low damage. This will give us a chance to experience the boss fight and not be overwhelmed.

 

This system should also be implement on the stalker (high health, low damage). The stalker, as of now, hits hard and have high health. Also you can not use your powers on him.  The stalker is cool, so I would not mind fighter him for over 5 minutes but with my powers. So I believe he should have high health, not to high, and low damage. We should also be able to use our powers on him.

 

Normal enemies = Fun Cannon fodder

Boss enemies = Fun Endurance test

[DoomsDayDan]

I'd rather bosses become less bullet spongey, I can't stand to fight Lephantis anymore because it's so soul crushingly drawn out now

[(PSN)Bobtm0]

So... you want bosses to be super easy while normal foes are vastly more dangerous because not only do they do more damage, but there are a freaking buttload of them.

 

Good and fun bosses in games have generally moderate to high damage on normal difficulty settings, with 1HKO damage attacks on hard mode, but currently Warframe doesn't have difficulty so I'm getting ahead of the curve there just slightly.  A boss's quick attacks need to be fairly dangerous and punishing (moderate-high damage) but make them reasonably easy to dodge.  Make the boss's big attack do very high damage, but again don't have silly undodgable stuff.

 

Ruk (eh invulnerability aside) is actually really gnarly in that regard despite being somewhat low level.  His attacks feel threatening in vibe, and are in practice the first time through without being unfair.

 

Having super wimpy large bullet sponges is the recipe of a horrible boss fight.

[DSpite]

So on another post you complained that you had no replay value, and now that mobs scale and that they are harder - plese note your complaint:

 

"Hi, I have been playing warframe for a while. I have just finished the solar-map. Now like many other veteran players "I am bored." I have nothing to do now but forma on weapons I never got a chance to use. As a player I have nothing to do now and is about to drop the game all together. I really like this game and would like to continue playing it further so I came up with a idea that will add replay value to warframe."

 

Ie you have TONS of skills and TONS of Forma's weaponed ... and can't kill the Jackal?

 

This is what you ASKED FOR:

 

http://www.mobygames.com/images/shots/l/555272-call-of-duty-black-ops-wii-screenshot-choosing-difficulty.png

 

Now that you GOT it, you complain?

Edited August 7, 2014 by DSpite

[OrphanMaker]

So on another post you complained that you had no replay value, and now that mobs scale and that they are harder - plese note your complaint:

 

"Hi, I have been playing warframe for a while. I have just finished the solar-map. Now like many other veteran players "I am bored." I have nothing to do now but forma on weapons I never got a chance to use. As a player I have nothing to do now and is about to drop the game all together. I really like this game and would like to continue playing it further so I came up with a idea that will add replay value to warframe."

 

Ie you have TONS of skills and TONS of Forma's weaponed ... and can't kill the Jackal?

 

This is what you ASKED FOR:

 

http://www.mobygames.com/images/shots/l/555272-call-of-duty-black-ops-wii-screenshot-choosing-difficulty.png

 

Now that you GOT it, you complain?

Don't troll me. Every time I post something it seems to be you are right there to post something negative. Last, time you was cursing at me and off topic. Do that again I am reporting you. Now do you GOT it!

Edited August 7, 2014 by OrphanMaker

[OrphanMaker]

I'd rather bosses become less bullet spongey, I can't stand to fight Lephantis anymore because it's so soul crushingly drawn out now

I believe boss battle suppose to be endurance runs, but they do not suppose to last more than 10-15 minutes. I don't know if Lephanits has been nerfed since but the last time I played him it took over 45 minutes, and we didn't even kill him. I don't think enemies should have that much hp, but I do believe it should take a good 5, 10, maybe even 15 minutes to defeat. 15 minutes is okay if the boss is changing states. But no more than 15 minutes, it should be like a 15 minute survival mission. First stage 5 mins, second 5 mins, and last 5 mins.

Edited August 7, 2014 by OrphanMaker

[DSpite]

Don't troll me. Every time I post something it seems to be you are right there to post something negative.

 

It's actually the opposite. You start topics I find laughable in the extreme, and point them out, then you get offended.

 

You want me to say something actually thought out and constructive on your post? OK then.

 

---

 

I have only had one bad Boss battle where Zanuka seemed Godlike, but then, I used to do that battle solo in 10 seconds. Drop Alad V, and when Zanuka stops to fix him, drop Zanuka.

 

You should not be able to farm bosses with impunity, and you can still "game" the system by going in with lower rating gear/frames anyway, but if a team goes in with 5 Forma everything, not scaling the boss makes little sense. At least now everyone knows that going in with over the top gear can be done so as an additional combat challenge, and can still EASILY take a Mag and Shield Polarize and I hear Alad and Zanuka still one-shot.

 

Nothing has changed other then the fact that now people have to pick a decent setup and not just throw random mods on and go kill bosses.

 

Seems to me to be change in the right direction, and since lots of feedback is generated on the scaling, comments that actually report results are useful, while posts that simply contain "it's too hard" and contain no metrics on team makeup, frames used, and gear used, can't really be used to figure out if there is a real problem - and there might be - or it was simply an inefficient team setup.

 

Level of "difficulty" is relative to players. You stated your idea on the subject, but I'd rather see bosses get more maneuverability, better CC, better response time with defensive and offensive abilities, etc forcing me on the defensive more often. Most of the time we just used to focus fire, and they just died. At the absolute minimum, we should at least have to flank the damn mobs.

Edited August 7, 2014 by DSpite

[OrphanMaker]

It's actually the opposite. You start topics I find laughable in the extreme, and point them out, then you get offended.

 

You want me to say something actually thought out and constructive on your post? OK then.

 

---

 

You do know this game is unfinished and the bosses we are facing are placeholders. I posted my comment as feedback to the DE for something to come in mind for future bosses. It was intended to be none specific and very general. The only boss I may be able to comment on is Lephantis because he is next to finished. The other bosses will change in due time.

 

ps calling some ones topics laughable is off topic and is an insult.

Edited August 7, 2014 by OrphanMaker

[arsyadpower]

u need to shoot his leg first, then the jackal will fall down, thats when you hit.

[OrphanMaker]

u need to shoot his leg first, then the jackal will fall down, thats when you hit.

I have been playing this game for over a year! I think I know how to beat the jackal.

[Babellon]

Edited- nevermind. This is why this game has such easy maps, low spawn rates, simplistic objectives, and unresponsive AI. Every time DE makes something decent, a crowd pops up to tell them how everything is to hard. People can't play if they have to fire a weapon more than once in a match. Cant respond if there's an obstacle that requires them to do more than sprint down a hallway, Can't survive if mobs or bosses do anything more than stand there and get shot, if anything, this, right here, will be the downfall of this beautiful game. 

 

You're a veteran? with maxxed out gear? and you can't kill bosses? I'm not a veteran, I have a lot of weapons and frames to level, and I can kill bosses, all of them. while playing solo. The bosses are supposed to be hard. They need more mobs on maps, who hit harder, use better tactics, and pose a real threat to the player, mobs and bosses who scale more adequately with the players level, rank, and power levels. 

 

One minute theres a dozen posts screaming to nurf every frame and weapon, then theres posts to nurf all the content. HOw bloody easy do you need this game to be? 

 

Dear DE, 

Pleas implement a new mode option system in the game. Normal-Hard-Heroic. 

Normal mode- make really simple, for new players and those who don't want any challenge. lvl 1-30

Hard mode- increase mob counts, damage of mobs and bosses, Higher hp and shields on mobs lvl 30-60

Heroic mode- double what ever hard mode settings are, perfect for team play, gives a purpose to having all those weapons and frames all godlike. lvl 60-90

Edited August 7, 2014 by -Malachi-

[Legonist]

Gonna be honest with you OP: There is never a formula that can work for every boss/enemy. A good boss has some type of weakness, be it after a heavy attack he has a weak point, he doesn't handle long range weapons well, or there is a pillar you can hide behind when he does his heavy attack. The grunt enemys should not be able to kill you on their own but in combinations with a few of their friends should make it so that they are not too easy to destroy on level.

 

I find that most bosses are easy to defeat with an Ash/Loki that has a Dread/Paris Prime.

[Azawarau]

OP why do you do this over again...

 

Fun is subjective and your experience and logic dont seem to be enough to give reasonable input on the game honestly

[OrphanMaker]

You're a veteran? with maxxed out gear? and you can't kill bosses? I'm not a veteran

Hey I am a veteran. I will post a video of my facing jackal later. But the truth of the matter is the scaling is broken. I for one is a hardcore gamer. I have been video games since the old days when you had no save option and had to beat a game in one sitting. My aptitude with video game is through the roof! Jackal is broken as of now, and needs proper scaling. The DE are doing a balancing act. One second the enemies are too hard then next second they are too easy. Right now we are going threw the "they are too hard" phase.

 

ps I constantly ask the de to buff enemies, so don't put me in the "please nerf this DE" group. I want balance, its is as simple as that.

You probably do not see the full power of jackal yet due to your low rank. Enemies scale with your rank. With me being a higher rank I, naturally, face tougher harder enemies. The scaling as of now is scaling with a multiplier. At my level the enemies may be 12x what you are facing. Like I said the jackal can one hit! "What do you think that means!" The jackal should never one hit even with scaling.

[Renegade343]

Hey I am a veteran. I will post a video of my facing jackal later. But the truth of the matter is the scaling is broken. I for one is a hardcore gamer. I have been video games since the old days when you had no save option and had to beat a game in one sitting. My aptitude with video game is through the roof! Jackal is broken as of now, and needs proper scaling. The DE are doing a balancing act. One second the enemies are too hard then next second they are too easy. Right now we are going threw the "they are too hard" phase.

You think the Jackal is too difficult?

 

I swore last night, I just took it down with a few shots with the Hek. 

 

And just run around shooting it, if it is really that difficult as you perceive. You will dodge most, if not all, of the shots. 

[Babellon]

Hey I am a veteran. I will post a video of my facing jackal later. But the truth of the matter is the scaling is broken. I for one is a hardcore gamer. I have been video games since the old days when you had no save option and had to beat a game in one sitting. My aptitude with video game is through the roof! Jackal is broken as of now, and needs proper scaling. The DE are doing a balancing act. One second the enemies are too hard then next second they are too easy. Right now we are going threw the "they are too hard" phase.

 

ps I constantly ask the de to buff enemies, so don't put me in the "please nerf this DE" group. I want balance, its is as simple as that.

You probably do not see the full power of jackal yet due to your low rank. Enemies scale with your rank. With me being a higher rank I, naturally, face tougher harder enemies. The scaling as of now is scaling with a multiplier. At my level the enemies may be 12x what you are facing. Like I said the jackal can one hit! "What do you think that means!" The jackal should never one hit even with scaling.

My rank, is MR 11, I've killed jackal multiple times in the last 2 weeks, I've gone to almost every planet, and killed the bosses there, and lephantis, since U14 hit. Jackal isn't really any harder than he was before. none of the bosses are, lephantis takes a little longer than he used to. but I'm able to kill him and every other boss, with my lvl 30 karak. 

I seem to recall that mobs and bosses scale to your conclave level, not your mastery rank. 

 

AS far as aptitude with games is concerned, I played my first video game in 1986. Atari 7800. Nintendo 1990, bought my first computer in 1999, built a computer for the first time in 2003. I've been playing games for a very long time.

Edited August 8, 2014 by -Malachi-

[OrphanMaker]

My rank, is MR 11, I've killed jackal multiple times in the last 2 weeks, I've gone to almost every planet, and killed the bosses there, and lephantis, since U14 hit. Jackal isn't really any harder than he was before. none of the bosses are, lephantis takes a little longer than he used to. but I'm able to kill him and every other boss, with my lvl 30 karak. 

I seem to recall that mobs and bosses scale to your conclave level, not your mastery rank. 

 

AS far as aptitude with games is concerned, I played my first video game in 1986. Atari 7800. Nintendo 1990, bought my first computer in 1999, built a computer for the first time in 2003. I've been playing games for a very long time.

No, matter many people have argued the same, but I will retest jackal and I will post a video.

What is your concalve?

Edited August 8, 2014 by OrphanMaker

[vaugahn]

Then what is your conclave level?

 

Conclave level is meaningless. Unranked status mods give more conclave than a maxed spoiled strike. I wouldn't rely on those to tell you anything. 

[fatpig84]

Hard mode, high hp but even higher damage please.

Bosses on hard mode should be able to one shot you if you are not careful like the level 80 lephantis.