Please Remove Friendship Doors

[SquirmyBurrito]

This is what I'm referring to

 

For those wondering about my previous thread: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/282772-de-please-remove-the-friendship-doors/page-8#entry3276267

 

The reasoning behind my request stems from their (the door's) failure to positively affect anyone's gameplay experience. I will explain how this applies under different assumptions:

 

If the doors were meant to be an anti rush mechanic, they fail because if a Rusher is moving fast enough that that it manages to get to the door well before the other players do, forcing said rusher to wait for them to catch up doesn't provide them (the other players) with any benefit. Because catching up with the rusher for that one door means nothing. As soon as that door is open that rusher will most likely leave them in the dust again. 

 

If the doors were meant to stop rushers from killing the boss/ending the mission too quickly they fail again because nothing is preventing the rusher from going back to rushing the second the door is open. When you have a full party the extraction timer will not start until more than one person is at extraction.

 

If the doors are meant to allow/force players to re-group... They still fails as it only requires two people to interact with it for them to proceed, meaning the first two players don't have to wait for the other two.

 

So what I'm saying is:

 

1. The doors don't work as an anti-rush mechanic.

2. They don't contribute to a positive gameplay experience. 

3. They don't benefit anyone.

4. They are still present in solo.

5. They can be reworked but until then, they should be removed.

6. Countermeasures to prevent a single fast player from ending the mission early in a full party game are unnecessary as it is already impossible for a single player to start the extraction timer when the other three are alive and not present at extraction.

 

 

"The topic is the removal of the doors due to them benefiting no one and only serving to prevent players from progressing for however long it takes for the second person to get there and open the door. They do not guarantee that slower players will be able to keep pace with the rusher for the rest of the mission. They don't benefit anyone. Discussing the experiences of a non-rusher and comparing them to a rusher's (or vice versa) is perfectly fine as long as its aim remains to discuss the doors. Do not attempt to have a Rusher vs. Non-Rusher argument in this thread. This is no the place for it and I will immediately report any posts that I see doing it."

 

When there are two rushers, the door is a minor inconvenience that adds nothing to the experience. As such, it fails to keep the two rushers with the two slow players. Door fails.

With one rusher, the door is a large inconvenience, but the rusher will not stay with the group either way as soon as the door is opened, it adds a negative experience to the rusher but no positive experience to the slow players. Door fails, only garners negativity. 

With no rushers, the door is a minor inconvenience that adds nothing to their experience, its purpose is unneeded. Intention succeeds, but not because of the door which was pointless in this scenario, thus still 'failing'.  

The rushers should play solo is largely irrelevant to the debate, the doors always fail at doing what it's intended to do, regardless of any number of rushers. The only time you need a friendship door is in front of a boss tile. I would say other mission objective tiles as well but nothing is really that significant except for maybe Capture targets. The door does nothing but add a minor inconvenience to the game, at least lockdowns create a unique experience and provide a full breathing room if needed as well as a puzzle to solve-simple though it may be.

This is not about playstyle but the doors purpose. In the majority of cases, the door fails or is not needed. The last case, one rusher in a group of four, is highly subjective to each case but most likely it still fails at that purpose because it's randomly placed. 

 

Edited August 8, 2014 by SquirmyBurrito

[Dark5eiD]

plus 1....

[TheErebus.]

Didn't you already make a post like this?

[Kylecrafts]

I think they should be changed, to only open when the whole team activates them.

[SquirmyBurrito]

Didn't you already make a post like this?

 

I did, but the previous thread was locked due to derailment. I was told I could start another topic.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/282772-de-please-remove-the-friendship-doors/page-8#entry3276267

 

I think they should be changed, to only open when the whole team activates them.

 

This would allow one troll to completely halt a game.

[Rexlars]

Didn't you already make a post like this?

 

I believe he/she did.

[vaugahn]

This is just a symptom of a larger problem: there's no reason to progress slowly through levels. The doors are obviously there to slow players down, which is a bandaid covering up for the fact that there's no reason to slow down whatsoever. 

[TheErebus.]

I did, but the previous thread was locked due to derailment. I was told I could start another topic.

Honestly, I don't have a view point on the friendship doors.

I can understand their purpose and but I also know that they don't really solve anything.

So I'm in the middle ground for this.

[Ariarch]

I agree with this.

[gnat6]

 

I think they should be changed, to only open when the whole team activates them.

That would be way to easy for people to troll with and would not have a positive affect on anyone's game.

[Ninjamander]

I have no problem with those door honestly.

[[DE]Saske]

Like last time keep them! -1

[LukeAura]

Edit: Nuts I forgot to make a joke.
Round 2 
Fight
No seriously don't.
 

Didn't you already make a post like this?

Got locked due to derailing. 
I think Einde said he would be watching a recreation more closely to preventing flamewars and derailing. 

Again, my plus 1 to the OP. And I'm not even a rusher before any one suggests, I always stick with the team or play solo. 
Every other form of gate in this game provides a unique value to it. Lockdowns create a full breathing room, offer a mini-puzzle, and players can affect their duration under their own power without being stuck due to trolls or afkers. 
Elevators can be used as a convenient break from combat if used correctly, and some can actually create rather scenic views. 
Friendship gates aren't scenic, do not break from combat as other doors are still open in a room, do not offer a puzzle to open. They do not provide value to the game in their current rendition.
 

 

yep...he pretty much copied and pasted, most likely because he didn't get all the pampered support he wanted from his first thread. Unfortunately for him however, most people don't like rushers and he probably wont be getting that support no matter how many times he copies and pastes.

Do understand he is suggesting that they should be reworked to provide a valuable addition to the game, but until then should be removed so they stop being an awkward and pointless pause to mission progression. Unlike other systems in place in the game which might need touching up they at least hold unique value and thus can stay until they are improved. Friendship doors lack a unique value to them, and if they are not going to be touched on immediately, any small fix that makes their placement static only outside of mission objectives or gone altogether will suffice. 

Edited August 8, 2014 by LukeAura

[Dark5eiD]

friendship doors are alot of fun when people take a ride on the afk train thru alerts and etc...soo damn frustrating.. remove them.

[SquirmyBurrito]

I have no problem with those door honestly.

 

I think indifference will be most player's reaction towards these doors as at their best they're just a minor (1-2 second) inconvenience. I can understand how one might feel this way.

 

Like last time keep them! -1

 

Care to tack on something more constructive? Such as your reasoning for wanting them to stay?

[Letter13]

While I personally don't have a problem with the doors (even when I see them in solo mode), I'd just like to remind everyone to avoid flaming, making incendiary, hostile or derailing comments and to be civil.

 

Squirmy got permission from Einde when Einde locked the last thread to reopen this. Derail at your own risk Tenno.

[AveryJ]

Do understand he is suggesting that they should be reworked to provide a valuable addition to the game, but until then should be removed so they stop being an awkward and pointless pause to mission progression. Unlike other systems in place in the game which might need touching up they at least hold unique value and thus can stay until they are improved. Friendship doors lack a unique value to them, and if they are not going to be touched on immediately, any small fix that makes their placement static only outside of mission objectives or gone altogether will suffice. 

alright,i can understand that.  in that case i apologize to squirmyburrido. i thought he was just trying to complain about it so i obviously didn't read his posts clearly.

 

 i still think he should learn a little patience though.

[Cinematic_30FPS]

+1

 

The doors don't even appear in some missions (e.g. Void, Earth tileset, capture), and yet no one cares. More evidence of how unneccesary they are.

[wolf96781]

Get rid of them, it's annoying to me when I have to wait on someone, it's annoying to others when they have to wait on me. Then you have the trolls and leeches who refuse to open the door

[Quizel]

Fun change would be to put a double locked cipher for players that rush. Also, simultaneously solving the afk issue. 

 

 

Implementation might be a bit clunky though. Like as soon as a 2nd player runs up to the other pad auto solve the locked cipher or something.

 

 

Removing them completely somewhat feels like a loss of immersion. edit: Could reduce the frequency of seeing these doors though.  As I also think it really slows down the pace of a fast pace shooter.

Edited August 8, 2014 by Quizel

[HellEnforcer]

1. The doors don't work as an anti-rush mechanic.

2. They don't contribute to a positive gameplay experience. 

3. They don't benefit anyone.

4. They are still present in solo.

5. They can be reworked but until then, they should be removed.

6. Countermeasures to prevent a single fast player from ending the mission early in a full party game are unnecessary as it is already impossible for a single player to start the extraction timer when the other three are alive and not present at extraction.

 

 

 Based on this list, your main problem is that sets back the rushers.

 

 1. Directly stated. It might not stop the rushers from leaving the team behind again, but at least the team got to see the next room with some enemies. The solution in this case would actually make every door a team door. This, however, would be annoying. One or two of these doors per level are fine, every door to be one of them is boring and annoying.

    If the rusher is ignoring the enemy, the problem then becomes the rusher can trigger the extraction ahead of time making the team run if they want the credits, or kill the boss without the team. Probably a team door before each of these rooms (extraction and boss) is enough and probably the best solution without a change on the doors themselves.

 

 2. I disagree. Making at least an event on the game that takes more than one player to complete makes the game a little bit more fun even if the event is something as simple as pushing a button.

 

 3. True, yet they only hurt rushers. That is if you count a slow down that is determined by how far the rusher left the team behind as a negative effect.

 

 4. What's the problem if they are present in solo? Most of the argument was that you needed to wait for another member, here you just have to go to the side and push the button before keep running.

 

 5. Sure, a rework might be fun. I see no reason to remove them though.

 

 6. This is related to the rushers as well.

 

 

 

 

 I am strongly against taking these door out. If you are solo, they present nothing bad. If you are in a team, it only present a problem for the rusher, since if you are not a rusher, then you are with the team and opening the door is trivial.

 

 I think this boils down to this: If you want to rush, go solo. Door problem solved. Rushers can rush at their hearth's content, team players have no problem with it. Everyone happy.... Sort of. It is true that these doors can cause problem if in a team of two, one of them is a troll. However, in this situation, a lot of things will be a problem, most of which can be temporal fortunately.

Edited August 8, 2014 by HellEnforcer

[DarthRevan84]

I say get rid of them.

[SquirmyBurrito]

 Based on this list, your main problem is that sets back the rushers.

 

 1. If the rusher is ignoring the enemy, the problem then becomes the rusher can trigger the extraction ahead of time making the team run if they want the credits, or kill the boss without the team. 

 

 2. I disagree. Making at least an event on the game that takes more than one player to complete makes the game a little bit more fun even if the event is something as simple as pushing a button.

 

 3. True, yet they only hurt rushers. That is if you count a slow down that is determined by how far the rusher left the team behind as a negative effect.

 

 4. What's the problem if they are present in solo? Most of the argument was that you needed to wait for another member, here you just have to go to the side and push the button before keep running.

 

 5. Sure, a rework might be fun. I see no reason to remove them though.

 

 6. This is related to the rushers as well.

 

 

 

 

 I am strongly against taking these door out. If you are solo, they present nothing bad. If you are in a team, it only present a problem for the rusher, since if you are not a rusher, then you are with the team and opening the door is trivial.

 

 I think this boils down to this: If you want to rush, go solo. Door problem solved. Rushers can rush at their hearth's content, team players have no problem with it. Everyone happy.... Sort of. It is true that these doors can cause problem if in a team of two, one of them is a troll. However, in this situation, a lot of things will be a problem, most of which can be temporal fortunately.

 

Everything you said has been addressed... in the OP.

 

1. One rusher in a full team of players can't start the extract timer until another player arrives at extraction. You don't have to be present at extraction to get the rewards. And the existence of these doors doesn't stop the rusher from rushing and killing the boss before the other players can catch up.

 

2. You find pressing one button to open a door fun, cool beans.

 

3. False. Its effect affects everyone, the issue is that it is often little more than a minor inconvenience unless you're the rusher.

 

4. The doors are still present in solo. So a player is still forced to run over to the panel, activate it, and wait for the door to open. Basically wasting 1-2 seconds on a mechanic that didn't add anything positive to their experience.

 

5. Until they get reworked, they're just a mechanic that forces players to pause in their gameplay for a varying amount of time. Some players find this annoying, most will just be indifferent, and then... you find it fun.

 

6. What? No, this was the point that addressed some of your claims in #1. This is what I meant when I said it was already addressed.

 

If I am solo, they present me with a unnecessary, unfun (IMO), obsticle that adds nothing positive nor benefits me in anyway.

 

Playing solo doesn't fix the issue as the doors still exist in solo. And even if DE were to remove the doors in solo, why should one group of players be forced to play solo just because a failure of a mechanic still exists? One that could be stealth removed and would garner zero complaints due to most people only having neutral non-memorable experiences with them.

[Gigatron-Prime]

I want the doors to stay. It is a small deterrence to rushers but it is all we non rushers have. I want the doors and I want rushing to stop.

[zoboso]

I think using the timer doors from suspicious shipments with a timer reduction for each player would be better game-play wise, because it gives the rushers a fun mini-game to play and encourages sticking together and allows for slower players an opportunity to catch up while not permanently blocking the active members of a bad party from moving forward. I think that 1:10 with each additional player reducing the timer by 20 seconds should do it.