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You Want Kills With Nova? Sucks To Be You.


-GM-Cha_Dude-
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Rhino's and Saryn's have to be present in an area for the enemies to die. Nova can cast, run off to another area, prepare another MP, and expect her teammates to award her with kills. 

But, it was her ability, her energy spent to cast it, her mods that increased that damage, her user's actions that killed those enemies. It's not their kill and it shouldn't be counted as such. 

 

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then why are you arguing about something as trivial as who got the most kills? that is less about logic and more about being a child that want's his way.

If you can't conduct yourself in an appropriate manner, you shouldn't be here. We're having a discussion; there's no need for personal attacks. I've been more than civil. 

Edited by -GM-Cha_Dude-
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But, it was her ability, her energy spent to cast it, her mods that increased that damage, her user's actions that killed those enemies. It's not their kill and it shouldn't be counted as such. 

 

Finders keepers. Gotta pull the trigger to earn the kill. 

 

Nova must be present to CAST M.Prime as well.  Why the double standard?

 
 
Here. Memory refresher assuming you read it. 

In the void(or any other map tileset), there are lots of corridors, each leading to their own enemy spawn. Molecular prime has an insane duration and range, so she can cast, run off in one direction while knowing that she will still get the kills that would spawn in the direction she is running away from. Meanwhile, the other player runs the opposite direction because he wants experience for his weapon, but get's sadly disappointed when he finds out that molecular prime's duration and range is infinite and every enemy he encounters is affected by molecular prime. 

In case you don't get it, other frames can't leave ultimate death-traps over the section of a map, they have to be present to get initiate and get the kill. 

Edited by TwiceDead
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Rhinos and Saryns have to be present in an area for the enemies to die. Nova can cast, run off to another area, prepare another MP, and expect her teammates to award her with kills. 

 

 

You must be trolling me. 

 

Example:

In the void(or any other map tileset), there are lots of corridors, each leading to their own enemy spawn. Molecular prime has an insane duration and range, so she can cast, run off in one direction while knowing that she will still get the kills that would spawn in the direction she is running away from. Meanwhile, the other player runs the opposite direction because he wants experience for his weapon, but get's sadly disappointed when he finds out that molecular prime's duration and range is infinite and every enemy he encounters is affected by molecular prime. 

Have you even played anything else than a Nova? 

Here's an analogy for you, and I ask that you be open to it. 

Let's say there is a child who is gifted. She is very smart and does very well. Do you praise her? Do you reward her and acknowledge her accomplishments? Of course you do, because that is the system of our society. 

In another shooter game, should you have thrown a grenade into a crowd and gotten kills, even though someone else was shooting at that crowd too, wouldn't that be fair? You wouldn't want to have your "last hit"  in LOL to count as an assist, would you?

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Finders keepers. Gotta pull the trigger to earn the kill. 

Exactly! You get the kill count to the enemy that you kill. Should that enemy then explode and kill lots of other enemies due to nothing that you've done, you should then be credited with assisting, not killing. 

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Here's an analogy for you, and I ask that you be open to it. 

Let's say there is a child who is gifted. She is very smart and does very well. Do you praise her? Do you reward her and acknowledge her accomplishments? Of course you do, because that is the system of our society. 

In another shooter game, should you have thrown a grenade into a crowd and gotten kills, even though someone else was shooting at that crowd too, wouldn't that be fair? You wouldn't want to have your "last hit"  in LOL to count as an assist, would you?

 

The child is obviously putting a lot of work into it and everything good that comes his/her way she'd probably deserve because he/she worked hard for it... That's the complete opposite of what Nova does. 

 

You can't use that analogy because that grenade doesn't affect 50% of the arena the combat is taking place on. 
 

This is an edited variant, a more accurate analogy of yours that describes the situation you're in on Warframe:

In another shooter game, you threw a grenade into every crowd on the map by the single press of a button without any skill involved automatically without effort and got the kills, even though someone else was shooting at that crowd too, wouldn't that be fair? 

 

Where the answer would be, no it isn't fair. 

 

Can Vauban not leave vortex/ tesla? Should those kills go towards the closest player?

 

Don't even pretend that Vortex or Tesla has the same magnitude as Molecular Prime has, because you know they don't. 

Vortex can still be found with a pile of live enemies in it, it's like finding a crab-trap with a bunch of live crabs in it where you get to kill them regardless who laid the trap. 

Edited by TwiceDead
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Nova must be present to CAST M.Prime as well.  Why the double standard?

 

M. Prime is a debuff, not an attack. Compare this to Roar or Warcry. If the extra damage provided by Roar allows you to get a kill does that kill go to you or Rhino? It goes to you, because you made use of the buff. Shooting a M. Primed enemy is making use of a debuff that has been graciously applied by the Nova, so it is the person triggering it that should get the kills, not the person who applied the debuff in the first place.

 

M. Prime was a double standard previously, now it is not.

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Should that enemy then explode and kill lots of other enemies due to nothing that you've done, you should then be credited with assisting, not killing. 

Exactly. The enemy, who is killed with bullets, should count as a kill for the one who shot him.  The guy who dies from the resulting explosions, caused by Nova's powers, should count as a kill for Nova.

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M. Prime is a debuff, not an attack. Compare this to Roar or Warcry. If the extra damage provided by Roar allows you to get a kill does that kill go to you or Rhino? It goes to you, because you made use of the buff. Shooting a M. Primed enemy is making use of a debuff that has been graciously applied by the Nova, so it is the person triggering it that should get the kills, not the person who applied the debuff in the first place.

 

M. Prime was a double standard previously, now it is not.

WRONG.  The slowing effect and the damage boost is a debuff.  The resulting explosions are an attack.

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Exactly. The enemy, who is killed with bullets, should count as a kill for the one who shot him.  The guy who dies from the resulting explosions, caused by Nova's powers, should count as a kill for Nova.

This. She's obviously OP, but that doesn't mean she should get her kills taken from her. 

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DE's newest change to nova makes it so that whoever starts the explosion chain for molec prime gets credit for every kill even though you're the one who does the damage with your ability. 

 

This is terrible.

Incorrect.  Molecular Prime does no damage.

<edit> To be clear, this is because the explosion kills are counted as the triggering player's weapon damage.</edit>

 

It debuffs the enemies.  The damage done while they are debuffed is what kills them, not the skill, and there's nothing stopping you from killing them yourselves after applying it.  In addition, the way EXP split for kills is set up, MP-based explosion kills would previously give you mainly warframe experience, not weapon experience.  If somebody else kills something though, you do get weapon experience for it.

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Experience_Mechanics

Edited by Rydian
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Incorrect.  Molecular Prime does no damage.

<edit> To be clear, this is because the explosion kills are counted as the triggering player's weapon damage.</edit>

 

It debuffs the enemies.  The damage done while they are debuffed is what kills them, not the skill, and there's nothing stopping you from killing them yourselves after applying it.  In addition, the way EXP split for kills is set up, MP-based explosion kills would previously give you mainly warframe experience, not weapon experience.  If somebody else kills something though, you do get weapon experience for it.

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Experience_Mechanics

Molecular prime does do damage... That's what the explosions are. It even varies with power strength and the mod level.

 

Primed enemies move and attack 10% / 20% / 25% / 30% slower, take 200% damage from all sources, and detonate upon death dealing 150 / 300 / 500 / 800 18px-Blast_b.png Blast damage to enemies within 6 / 7 / 8 / 10 meters

Edited by -GM-Cha_Dude-
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Already did, thanks.

If that is the case why do you think this change hurts Nova?  She will get radial exp instead of warframe exp when others cause the explosion chain, but otherwise she still gets exp.  The change may make leveling Nova up slower but it will purely benefit players who are using a level 30 Nova and trying to level up weapons.  

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If that is the case why do you think this change hurts Nova?  She will get radial exp instead of warframe exp when others cause the explosion chain, but otherwise she still gets exp.  The change may make leveling Nova up slower but it will purely benefit players who are using a level 30 Nova and trying to level up weapons.  

It's because the issue is not with getting experience. I can't stress this enough. It's about kill credit, that's it. Please don't respond with "kills don't matter." It is illogical for the Nova to kill the enemy and the credit go to someone else, regardless of the xp system. Think of your immersion!  <-- joke font

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If that is the case why do you think this change hurts Nova?  She will get radial exp instead of warframe exp when others cause the explosion chain, but otherwise she still gets exp.  The change may make leveling Nova up slower but it will purely benefit players who are using a level 30 Nova and trying to level up weapons.  

 

 

Suppose Player A kills an enemy with his Secondary, and the enemy was worth 1000 experience.

His Warframe and Secondary will receive 500 experience each.

 

His teammates, Players B, C and D, will also receive 1000 experience each: 250 to their Warframe, 250 to their Primary, 250 to their Secondary and 250 to their Melee

 

If they were going to change the skill to give weapon XP then they could just have easily made the XP apply to the weapon Nova was holding when the explosions started. There is no reason the majority of XP and the kill credit should be going to someone else when it is Nova's Skill doing the killing.

Edited by (PS4)DesecratedFlame
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I knew there was going to be a whine thread about this. And it stems mainly from people not understanding how exp works.

 

Here, taken from another post I made in another thread:

 

 

Nova change is fine. It's exactly what people have been getting angry about: Nova taking literally all the kills in a room by using Mprime.

 

In fact this is a great thing for Nova users. You ONLY got frame exp when you set off those explosions. Now, if someone else sets them off, you get exp split between everything. This is great, because most of us already are max ranked on Nova.

 

"But what about those that aren't max yet?" Either set off the chain quickly, or use Antimatter Drop. Bam, there's your frame exp farm button.

 

Also, someone said earlier that AD was useless. They haven't played Nova before.

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It's because the issue is not with getting experience. I can't stress this enough. It's about kill credit, that's it. Please don't respond with "kills don't matter." It is illogical for the Nova to kill the enemy and the credit go to someone else, regardless of the xp system. Think of your immersion!  <-- joke font

Gameplay-wise, kill count doesn't matter for anything.  That said, assuming people actually care (you and some others have demonstrated this) the equitable solution would be 1) no one gets the credit or 2) both players get the credit.  Not sure which one makes sense.  Maybe 3) Nova gets half the credit and the other party gets the other half?  Either way, it doesn't have an impact on gameplay and Nova spammers could cheese leaderboards by stealing all their squadmates' kills before this change; now their teammates can steal all the kills back. :p

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