I Love My Grakata Over Any Soma.

[Zero.No.Hikari]

I'd personally drop tactical pump for tainted mag.

You lose out on some dps overall, but it makes it easier to headshot with all the pellets, which is where your real damage is going to come from.

Really it is up to you though and if you prefer being up close, or right in their face.

Tainted Shell you mean, might have to get that mod then.  Welp back to wading through the infested pulp I leave behind when using Kronen.

Edited September 3, 2014 by Zero.No.Hikari

[ARavenousPanda]

The idea is that WFBuilder doesn't accurately account for the Tigris' fire rate. It doesn't actually take a whole second to fire two shots.

 

If you could have a Tigris with unlimited ammo/magazine capacity, and fired it at the rate it can, its DPS would be similar to the figure mentioned earlier.

yes, but theres a difference between "potential dps" and "actual dps" i.e. in x scenario, y, whilst ignoring that it cant actually put out y without the hypothetical x [which in this scenario doesnt exist]. Thats the reason why people use full auto weapons, less punishing if you miss whilst being more consistent in damage output. Spiking [like critting] can be highly unreliable and [for the masses] wont be relied upon.

good find though.

[OkamiMilo]

i hate both weapons, shotgun forever!! =D

[GhostYogurt]

Agreed. I would take the Grakata any day over the Soma. Hell I even added 6 forma to my Grakata. 

 

 

[kubbi]

The recent ammo capacity buff has made it capable of holding through even T4S without an ammo mod, but Nekros helps as always.

Giving it an extra 75 ammo really helped? ಠ_ಠ

[Seele]

Giving it an extra 75 ammo really helped? ಠ_ಠ

Yes. That's more than a whole 'nother magazine.

 

Of course the ammo economy improves as you add forma and thus increase the damage output as well.

[OverlordMcGeek]

I have never used tha Grakata before. Guess I should start now.

Another convert, yesssssss!

Forma the thing 6 times. Run Point Blank, vicious spread, hells chamber and blaze. Final four slots are up to you.

I usually sacrifice damage to run seeking force and that -spread -fire rate mod. Then corrosive for infested and corrrupted, radiation for Grineer and magnetic for corpus.

Learn trigger discipline and learn to aim for the head. Don't double shot if you don't need to.

Apart from that movement and positioning

I will try the tigris now thanks. Edited September 3, 2014 by OverlordMcGeek

[Gahrzerkire]

Said it once to a few clan members, I will kill heavy gunners 60+ faster with my Grakata then the others with their Soma.

That´s why I would like to see a Grakata Wraith.

We really need a Grakata Wraith. i.e. x3 crit damage multiplier and 30% status chance and crit. +5 more general damage points. i love that weapon so hard.

[elele]

Agreed. I would take the Grakata any day over the Soma. Hell I even added 6 forma to my Grakata. 

 

 

With your build, you're going to get about 10% corrosive proc chance, which means you'll need around 40 bullets to strip off a heavy gunner's armor. In a long survival run, you'll probably need a whole clip of 60 rounds to kill a lvl 70 heavy gunner. Coupled with the bad ammo economy of Grakata, guaranteed to run out of ammo in 5 minutes. 

[Quizel]

 

With your build, you're going to get about 10% corrosive proc chance, which means you'll need around 40 bullets to strip off a heavy gunner's armor. In a long survival run, you'll probably need a whole clip of 60 rounds to kill a lvl 70 heavy gunner. Coupled with the bad ammo economy of Grakata, guaranteed to run out of ammo in 5 minutes. 

Shhhhh. Let them have their moment :D. But yeah, spread sheet says 14% corrosive proc chance / bullet or 2.8 corrosive procs per sec. At full armor a corrupted heavy gunner would take estimated 326 dmg/shot. With the armor nearly completely removed, it'd be doing 1400 dmg/shot. With the armor completely removed, because it'd loose the corrosive dmg bonus to ferrite, the build would be doing about 1000 dmg/shot (not sure how many procs this takes to happen, anyone know? Does it change depending on how much armor the target has?). 

 

Anyway, assuming all the armor doesn't get removed ever and you're not going for head shots, I'd estimate it'd take about  50-60 ammo or 2.5-3 sec to deal 41k'ish dmg to a lvl 70 gunner. This does also assume that all bullets hit the target (the weapon does spray violently with HC >.>). So I agree with elele's estimate that it'd take a full clip. Ofcourse, if the player missed too much they'd experience the nasty reload time of 2.4 sec >.>.

 

Now a similar build with Soma shows about 0.75 corrosive procs per sec. It does ~500dmg/shot against full armor lvl 70 HG and 2250dmg/shot with nearly no armor. I'd estimate it'd take about 60-75 ammo or 4-5sec to deal 41k'ish dmg.  

 

Looks like my full theory craft supports OP post in the void and against grineer, however, the more ppl rocking corrosive projection, the less appealing the grakata becomes from a pure offensive perspective. I think as long as 2 ppl (didn't use spreadsheet to check this) use corrosive projection, Soma would perform as good.  Against any other targets w/o armor, Soma would perform better (not including cc' procs here).

 

And as elele also mentioned, the Grakata goes through ammo way too quick -about 3 ammo packs to take down this lvl 70 HG. Soma isn't much better and is actually worse in the given example >.>. With that said, I wouldn't recommend either weapon and seriously question why someone would bother theory crafting @endgame w/o x4 CP lols. Quizel seriously has issues.

 

 

 

 

Edited September 4, 2014 by Quizel

[Qhresh]

 

Prehaps there is a wepeon called the amprex that has guarenteed elecricity damage changable by mods also glaxion also dual ichors.

[PlayGooYa]

Goes to Warframe Builder and builds crit/status Grakata and finds . . . 12k burst dps.

 

What.

I'm going to disagree with everybody who says Grakata is underrated. It's rated exactly where it belongs. There are much better status weapons with much higher sustained/burst dps.

[Azawarau]

Goes to Warframe Builder and builds crit/status Grakata and finds . . . 12k burst dps.

 

What.

I'm going to disagree with everybody who says Grakata is underrated. It's rated exactly where it belongs. There are much better status weapons with much higher sustained/burst dps.

You missed alot of the point of the thread

[PlayGooYa]

You missed alot of the point of the thread

 

Pretty sure I haven't.

This isn't merely the Grataka Club for Grakata Enthusiasts, which I don't have a problem with.

The OP made it pretty clear in his opening post and title. Grakata is being directly compared to Soma.

 

The general tone of the thread is that Grakata is this overlooked dark horse that'll match/outperform the Soma! (Sticking it to the Man!)

This is followed by a lot of posters, including myself, pointing out exactly why this isn't the case.

When most people say something is underrated, that usually means the weapon is unpopular for a reason which is being overlooked.

 

The reasons in summary:

 

1) There are better status weapons. To name a few: Amprex, Akmagnus and Marelok. You'll note that two of those weapons are very much not underrated. They have comparable or better status chances and overwhelmingly better damage (and therefore better ammo efficiency).

2) Soma still outperforms the Grakata for everything not Endless mission.

3) Soma still outperforms Grakata at Endless Thing with Corrosive Projection. Something I had overlooked until it was mentioned. But it's a fair one, because all extraordinary measures are valid when it comes to Endless Anything.

 

I've caved on getting on the Marelok (mine is building) because two of the dual-stat mods will bring it up to 94% status chance per trigger pull. On top of achieving an average of 5000 to 7000 damage per shot, depending on whether I'm running Seeker for punch-through.

 

I already have an Amprex I use as an Infested-Killer and am beginning to favor the Gas+Electricity procs on it. The procs add half-again damage as an AOE effect. So I'm starting to like it a little better over corrosive, as the procs are useless against Infested.

 

So it's not like I'm unfamiliar with this whole status schtick. I've been looking at a lot of weapons for that purpose alone. And that's probably the main reason I even looked at this thread at all. 

Edited September 4, 2014 by PlayGooYa

[Azawarau]

Grakata is near on par wwith the soma on non endless as well

 

Most of the star chart youll be tapping your fire to save ammo

 

Somewhere around 35-45? the soma probably wins out but the grakata takes over soon after

[Gahrzerkire]

*Chants silently in the distance* Grakata Wraith Grakata Wraith Grakata Wraith

[Dasmir]

*Chants silently in the distance* Grakata Wraith Grakata Wraith Grakata Wraith

 

De will release all tenno weapon wraith version first becouse having primes isnt enought

Edited September 4, 2014 by Dasmir

[vleessjuu]

Grakata was my first weapon I took seriously and I loved it. But in the end, it still felt kinda limiting. The high proc chance is really nice, but you end up getting a lot of useless physical procs (only impact procs are worth anything at all, if you ask me) and really not so many elemental procs.

Now I'm ranking my Amprex and I can tear through whole groups of enemies and get elemental procs without them being diluted by physical ones. I honestly wouldn't really consider going back to the Grakata after the Amprex. Maybe if an improved Grakata is released, but not sooner.

[noveltyhero]

Ok, I have some questions.

What does status chance actually do?

Ideal build for Grakata?

[notionphil]

We really need a Grakata Wraith. i.e. x3 crit damage multiplier and 30% status chance and crit. +5 more general damage points. i love that weapon so hard.

 

Adding a Grakata Wraith would defeat the entire purpose of the Grakata.

 

Grakata is the thinking man's machine gun. It has more drawbacks than the Soma but can be lovingly crafted to excel past the obvious choice.

 

A Grakata Wraith as a straight-up upgrade would mean that all the Soma/Boltor Prime users would migrate to the new meta, and there would be no hope, no choice. Just a game full of people using the Grakata Wraith.

 

At least now, there are 3 primary machine guns which are capable of dealing a ton of damage in slightly different ways. Keep it that way. Or add more choices. Not a "correct answer".

 

#stop_the_power_creep

[Quizel]

1) There are better status weapons. To name a few: Amprex, Akmagnus and Marelok. You'll note that two of those weapons are very much not underrated. They have comparable or better status chances and overwhelmingly better damage (and therefore better ammo efficiency).

2) Soma still outperforms the Grakata for everything not Endless mission.

Just some thoughts:

1) Well, amprex has high status chance per sec, but  low status chance per ammo consumed. A better way of looking at it is that the amprex has a status chance of 1% with RoF of 20 making it 20%chance/sec. Grakata is 20% per bullet and RoF of 20 -> estimated 400%proc_chance_per_sec or rather ~4procs/sec.

2) Personally I don't like the slow'ish wind up of Soma. Grakata has instant burst giving it more control over the situation. It's hard to quantify that sort of thing.

 

As i said earlier, not a soma or grakata fan or any weapon that burns through ammo faster than ignis. They can be fun niche weapons for the children to play with but don't belong in a matured  players endgame arsenal. ;)  JK about that, WF endgame for me isn't just about equipping weapons that perform the best, but rather, weapons the player enjoys the most. 

Edited September 4, 2014 by Quizel

[notionphil]

Grakata was my first weapon I took seriously and I loved it. But in the end, it still felt kinda limiting. The high proc chance is really nice, but you end up getting a lot of useless physical procs (only impact procs are worth anything at all, if you ask me) and really not so many elemental procs.

Now I'm ranking my Amprex and I can tear through whole groups of enemies and get elemental procs without them being diluted by physical ones. I honestly wouldn't really consider going back to the Grakata after the Amprex. Maybe if an improved Grakata is released, but not sooner.

 

The thing to consider is that you can build your Grakata so that about half of the procs deal additional damage. Forget utility for a second and just think about DPS.

 

Here's a rough number way to look at it.

 

Many procs such as toxic, slash, fire, elec can increase the damage of a single shot anywhere from 50% to 150% (over time). Imagine for a second that 80% of your shots proc, and 1/2 of those are damage procs.

 

Thus 40% of your shots deal an average of 100% bonus damage due to procs. Thats an addl 50% bonus damage that's not listed on the arsenal.

 

12k DPS? More like up to 18k of fun. Now, remember on top of that, you're ALSO constantly stunning, shocking and knocking your target around.

 

Couple that with a stabilizer mod and you're about to have a good day.

Edited September 4, 2014 by notionphil

[Quizel]

12k DPS? More like up to 18k of fun. Couple that with a stabilizer mod and you're about to have a good day.

Well, you sacrifice dmg mods to get proc chance up. Damaging procs are in a bad place right now tbh. At the very least if they ignored armor they could be somewhat useful, but as is, you sacrifice too much (best elemental dmg type) to get proc elemental dmg types. Nobody wants to wait around 6-8 sec fora proc to do it's full dmg. Dump a few more bullets into ur target and be done with it.

Armor type was not specified. 

 

Weapon 2 (purple graph) should be depicting what you're talking about. Base dmg ignoring procs is ~8.5k and with procs is 12k or ~30% more dps that is often ignored in calculations. For single target, toxic and heat procs of course would be better than the given example.

 

Edit: Okay I entered reload time as 2.0 instead of 2.4. making adjustments Done

Edited September 4, 2014 by Quizel

[Vaskadar]

5-forma Grakata user here. I paired it up with a highly ammo efficient hand cannon you all know as the Brakk. I don't bring the Brakk out often, but the Grakata is  my mainstay for a lot of T3+ missions.

[notionphil]

Well, you sacrifice dmg mods to get proc chance up. Damaging procs are in a bad place right now tbh. At the very least if they ignored armor they could be somewhat useful, but as is, you sacrifice too much (best elemental dmg type) to get proc elemental dmg types. Nobody wants to wait around 6-8 sec fora proc to do it's full dmg. Dump a few more bullets into ur target and be done with it.

 

Unless you have a full forma'd build, you are saving many mod spots by using ele+status.

 

I'm not suggesting waiting for procs, I'm referring to "optimal theoretical DPS", which is a myth anyway. Unless you're on late wave in which case, yes, you are really getting these procs out.