arch111 Posted October 5, 2014 Author Share Posted October 5, 2014 you are over thinking it a bit but who cares theses frames are cool I would love to have mission where you have to play as the lotus frameI know I am :). But it's a hot topic for alot of players. And a fun project.I too would like to don the Lotus frame some day :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch111 Posted October 5, 2014 Author Share Posted October 5, 2014 When looking at the head of Valkyr, front and rear, I see that the greenish armor did not connect into tip at the top rear, but instead may have ended in two protruding tips with space between them. If so, then what covered the head between those protruding tips? I suppose its either the grey metallic material or more of the greenish armor. Basically that is what Bastet is though, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampirePirate Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Actualy it's unclear what "original" refers to. https://warframe.com/game/warframes "Forged in the labs of the Zanuka project, the original Valkyr was subject to cruel experiments, leaving her scarred, angry and frighteningly adept at killing." "Remnants of the bonds that restrained the original Valkyr during her time in 'the lab'. A reminder to never forget the torment." The problem is that one could easily read this in two different ways. Either: 1. The original Valkyr, refers to the one who escaped from Corpus experiments. Meaning she is the original to many replicas we use right now. Similar to how there once was an original Mirage who died fighting the Sentients. The wording actualy points more towards this. Or: 2. The original Valkyr refers to the version of the Warframe which existed before the Corpus experiments, that changed her into the new version we have now. So there is some legit thinking behind his interpretation. Though i agree that all bits of information more point towards Valkyr being an escapd "prisoner" rather than escaped "creation", which would point towards a pre-experiment version existing. Valkyr has no detail that would speak for a creation of the Corpus and the restraints wouldn't have been so messily inserted, but rather build into the Warframe itself. Also the Zanuka project and other informations make it clear that the Corpus do not have the knowledge on how to create Warframes. The problem with knowing what "the original" is meant to be, is also that DE has not yet made it clear what exactly the player represents (many different Tenno or one with multiple Warframes) and if multiple Warframes of the same type can exist at the same time. The prologe story for example would imply that we are all just ONE hero Tenno, each of us not being a different individual but an alternate version of the same character, who for gameplay sake exist at the same time. Ala Dark Souls. So confusion of description is something that comes easily. Actually, they did make it clear in an explanation made by Steve in a devstream. (I do not remember which one. Perhaps I will search for it.) In that devstream, the question was whether there will be character names and faces to the warframes. Steve said no, and it is because they want us to see that anyone of any gender or race can be a Tenno/warframe, and this is why they have no voices or certain identities for those warframes. They also stressed that every Tenno is human; there are humans inside each of the warframes. For some reason, after U14, people desire to believe different and come up with all kinds of false ideas. The Devs said that the player is simply a person playing the warframes. Were people get the idea that the player is the Tenno or the player is the warframe is beyond me. Maybe the interactive dialogue from both Lotus and Vor? (It is possible that the devs changed their minds on what they are doing with the lore and are now doing something else. No one knows for sure yet.) Anyway, it is clear by the small bit of lore provided, that Valkyr was a warframe/Tenno that was captured and then tortured and experimented with. By deductive reasoning, we can all assume Valkyr looked different from the way she does now. Different meaning complete, not missing armor and having technology brutally bonded to her body. That much is clear. Why people are talking so much about Valkyr Prime when we don't have the true and complete Valkyr is strange to me, but due to the pattern of releases I think people want something new rather than a remake of the same warframe. With the concept of the player being a Tenno, I say look at the device you use to switch warframes and notice the energy-like effect surrounding the warframes. With knowing that there will be an additional place where we park our ships soon, I would suspect that the playership or Liset is able to teleport in and out whatever warframe is elected to do the next mission or occupy the ship. Realistically, I believe the devs had a great idea and did not consider the confusion between player, Tenno, ship, and warframes used, and because of that, they are now trying to figure out how to explain what they have done by coming up with the right lore to make believable and acceptable. Overall, I don't think any of this matters. It's just a game. In my opinion, however, it would be nice to have an "Original Valkyr" -- before she was captured and experimented on, (but lore-wise, that may not make any sense.) Also it would be nice to have a Prime version of the "Original Valkyr". I think everyone would appreciate this most, especially if she is granted a new set of powers unlike the ones granted to the current tortured Valkyr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Othergrunty Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 I suppose its either the grey metallic material or more of the greenish armor. Basically that is what Bastet is though, right? I would also go with grey metalic armor. This way the two halves of the helmet are seperated and as you point out, would resemble the bastet helmet. Which reminds me. Has anyone of you wondered what the helmet on the back of her head might have looked like? Maybe she had some decorations there. Maybe she actualy had something like a Halo there and the Corpus neck restraint is almost like a mockery of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampirePirate Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 I suppose its either the grey metallic material or more of the greenish armor. Basically that is what Bastet is though, right? Possibly, but I always thought the Bastet was just some fun alternative helmet, just like the ones for Vauban, Nova, Ash, and so on. There's no reason to speculate on those helmets so why do so with the Bastet? We can only go by the original look when Valkyr was introduced to the game. If you do that, you will see no resemblance between the default helmet and the Bastet, because the default helmet has scales. Sort of like scaled armor or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampirePirate Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 I would also go with grey metalic armor. This way the two halves of the helmet are seperated and as you point out, would resemble the bastet helmet. Which reminds me. Has anyone of you wondered what the helmet on the back of her head might have looked like? Maybe she had some decorations there. Maybe she actualy had something like a Halo there and the Corpus neck restraint is almost like a mockery of it. I thought that was part of the device that restrained her. When she broke out of it, it came with her because that was the part still bonded to her. Sort of like a runaway dog that broke his chain. The chain is still there as part of the collar because he can't remove it. (I think it would have been nice if we saw a video of her escape.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Othergrunty Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 (edited) I thought that was part of the device that restrained her. When she broke out of it, it came with her because that was the part still bonded to her. Sort of like a runaway dog that broke his chain. The chain is still there as part of the collar because he can't remove it. (I think it would have been nice if we saw a video of her escape.) That's indeed her neck restraint, which she most likely broke off when she escaped. What i actuay meant (as in speculating about her original appearance) was that she could have had some kind of halo like part on the back of her helmet originaly. But the Corpus removed it (which now leaves the back of her under helmet exposed) and since the broken off head restraints resemble it, it's kept on the Warframe as kind of a memory to the original removed halo. Also yes, it would be definelty welcome to see how the original Valkyr escaped "The Lab". Heck that's actualy a nice idea for a Quest. Imagine exploring a Corpus lab that has been devestated with claw marks everywhere. With holograms occasionaly looping showing her take down enemies. I always thought Valkyr is partialy an homage to Wolverine when he escaped Weapon X. So that would fit. Actually, they did make it clear in an explanation made by Steve in a devstream. (...) You don't have to look it up. I actualy clearly remember Steve's statement. Yes he stated that they don't want to unmask the Tenno because they prefer for each person to have their own idea of how the Tenno look underneath those helmets. The idea that each player is one Tenno, most likely comes from the fact that the marketing for Warframe regulary refers to the player as Tenno. As in "We now have 8 million Tenno. HURRAY!!!" So of course players get the idea that each Tenno = each player. Meaning every player represents a single Tenno in the Warframe universe. Which in turn leads to the confusion we see in threads like these. Especialy when we now have a story involving one hero Tenno going through a journey, but which every player goes through. I sometimes get the feeling the devs never fully decided on the backstory or lore of things yet. They just decided on a basic idea of what things are and then let their concept people go crazy on stuff. So everything could still turn out completely different from what we expect and even from what they hinted at during devstreams. This makes good food for speculation, but not a good basis for arguments. As for Valkyr. I think there is potential for 4 different Warframes in her story. "Prime Original Valkyr" -> "Original Valkyr" -> "Changed Valkyr" (current) -> Enhanced Valkyr (counterpart to the originals prime). Edited October 5, 2014 by Othergrunty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentMobius Posted October 6, 2014 Share Posted October 6, 2014 The idea that each player is one Tenno, most likely comes from the fact that the marketing for Warframe regulary refers to the player as Tenno. As in "We now have 8 million Tenno. HURRAY!!!" So of course players get the idea that each Tenno = each player. Meaning every player represents a single Tenno in the Warframe universe. Which in turn leads to the confusion we see in threads like these. Especialy when we now have a story involving one hero Tenno going through a journey, but which every player goes through. I think it's more that every single story reference and game mechanic assumes a single persistent POV. Death marks, Map progress, Mastery, Weapon ownership, Equipment building, Invasion Battle pay, Event progression, Quest progression. All single POV The repeated statement on dev streams that "Warframes are gear" also helps. In fact the _only_ suggestion that there is one Tenno per Warframe is a vague inference in two codex entries. I think it's less about confusion and more about people having personal issues about their character inhabiting a femme-form Warframe. It that wasn't an issue I doubt people would even give it a second thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch111 Posted October 6, 2014 Author Share Posted October 6, 2014 So I have done: * plating * Lotus * scales * Valkyrie One suggestion is a heavy asymmetric Rhinoesque frame. The other (mine) is to mirror Loki abd make them a pair. Of course, I still can do Prime, or totally change the theme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch111 Posted October 6, 2014 Author Share Posted October 6, 2014 I think it's more that every single story reference and game mechanic assumes a single persistent POV. Death marks, Map progress, Mastery, Weapon ownership, Equipment building, Invasion Battle pay, Event progression, Quest progression. All single POV The repeated statement on dev streams that "Warframes are gear" also helps. In fact the _only_ suggestion that there is one Tenno per Warframe is a vague inference in two codex entries. I think it's less about confusion and more about people having personal issues about their character inhabiting a femme-form Warframe. It that wasn't an issue I doubt people would even give it a second thought. I agree. Funny thing; I actually got challenged to do a male Valkyr. Still havent touched it, but I will soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampirePirate Posted October 6, 2014 Share Posted October 6, 2014 For some reason I see the current Valkyr with a tail. How interesting would it be if the current one had a tail and it sways while she walks and sprints and fights? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch111 Posted October 6, 2014 Author Share Posted October 6, 2014 You mean like a syandana? Well I don't know. It's either cool or silly, and I don't think the devs will go for it. Do you? If so, just how would it look, like a part of the armor or energy trail maby, like we see in so many helms and things now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampirePirate Posted October 6, 2014 Share Posted October 6, 2014 You mean like a syandana? Well I don't know. It's either cool or silly, and I don't think the devs will go for it. Do you? If so, just how would it look, like a part of the armor or energy trail maby, like we see in so many helms and things now. I don't know how it would look. maybe silly. Lots of anime have catgirls and they all look silly to me. It would not be armor though, but it would add to the feline appeal she already has. That's kind of what I was thinking, but it was just a thought. Not something I care much about. I know for sure the devs won't go for that either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Othergrunty Posted October 6, 2014 Share Posted October 6, 2014 (edited) *snips* Yeah that could be a reason for it being an issue. When i started with this game i kinda used an MMORPG mindset towards thinking of the Warframes. In many of those you can create multiple characters, in order to potentialy have one character for each class. So you weren't permanently stuck on the healer or the tank class for the entirety of the game. Buying new slots in order to have more Warframes also reminded me to other titles were you had to purchase slots for new characters. I simply assumed this was the case here. Each Warframe you build comes with a new Tenno inside. Multiple Warframes of the same type being different Tenno but with the same character traits. Actualy with the reveal of how the first Tenno came to be and somewhat inspired by the cartoon Star Wars: The Clone Wars, one could even speculate that each Warframe is used by a clone of one of the original Tenno. So they all have the basic personality but constantly evolve into different ways. Speculating is fun. Like i said it's just an idea and i'm pretty sure the ultimate reveal will be something completely different, making me look like a fool. Ha ha. I don't know how it would look. maybe silly. Lots of anime have catgirls and they all look silly to me. It would not be armor though, but it would add to the feline appeal she already has. That's kind of what I was thinking, but it was just a thought. Not something I care much about. I know for sure the devs won't go for that either. You know. I had to rember that cave woman from Chrono Trigger Ayla. Her clothes were made of fur, which still included the tail part and she was using that as a kind of scarf. The tail was still so long that it reached her tighs. When she moved it often looked like she had a tail, without being in place of one. Looking at the Kara helmet i think a bundle of cables could work to that effect. Maybe as another part of her original restraints that got torn off. Edited October 6, 2014 by Othergrunty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch111 Posted October 6, 2014 Author Share Posted October 6, 2014 ^ see, now you are talking of the current Valkyr, then it works fine. However before she ever met Alad she were free from restraints and had a whole warframe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perfectStranger Posted October 7, 2014 Share Posted October 7, 2014 For some reason I see the current Valkyr with a tail. How interesting would it be if the current one had a tail and it sways while she walks and sprints and fights? Something like this? https://imgur.com/Dut7hPv Get an Atterax, swing it, activate Hysteria before the swing ends, boom, you've got a tail, meow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch111 Posted October 7, 2014 Author Share Posted October 7, 2014 Letting you know, I made a new model based on the in-game Valkyr. Will keep going from here. Any thoughts you like to share? Any thing you would like me to try? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch111 Posted October 9, 2014 Author Share Posted October 9, 2014 LOKI & VAL MASHUP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilentMobius Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 Yeah that could be a reason for it being an issue. When i started with this game i kinda used an MMORPG mindset towards thinking of the Warframes. In many of those you can create multiple characters, in order to potentialy have one character for each class. So you weren't permanently stuck on the healer or the tank class for the entirety of the game. Buying new slots in order to have more Warframes also reminded me to other titles were you had to purchase slots for new characters. I simply assumed this was the case here. Each Warframe you build comes with a new Tenno inside. Multiple Warframes of the same type being different Tenno but with the same character traits. Interesting because I came here with an MMO mindset, and in MMOs if you have a separate character you have separate inventories, progress tracks, xp tracks, mission tracks and a character select screen. And you _never_ use one character to literally build another in MMOs. In Warframe you have none of that and the current Warframe is switched in the same screen as weapons and consumables. All of that screams single character to me. I mean what is the definition of a character? Surely the story-progression and XP track right? That's the mechanic than MMOs use to indicate "character progress", same in Warframe except we only get one character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VampirePirate Posted October 9, 2014 Share Posted October 9, 2014 (edited) Something like this? https://imgur.com/Dut7hPv Get an Atterax, swing it, activate Hysteria before the swing ends, boom, you've got a tail, meow! LOL. I heard about this but I have not seen it. Letting you know, I made a new model based on the in-game Valkyr. Will keep going from here. Any thoughts you like to share? Any thing you would like me to try? That's nice. I like it. LOKI & VAL MASHUP Interesting. Edited October 9, 2014 by VampirePirate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch111 Posted October 9, 2014 Author Share Posted October 9, 2014 What's really interesting to me is how well both model and texture conformed to Valkyrs much slimmer shapes. I litterally shaved off Lokis body, tweaked it a little, but I realized I could leave it pretty much un-altered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboDoge Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 Green one is quite nice design. Loki one is BLASPHEMY!BURN THE HERETIC! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch111 Posted October 10, 2014 Author Share Posted October 10, 2014 Green one is quite nice design. Loki one is BLASPHEMY! BURN THE HERETIC! As a Loki main, I get that. Though Northern Valkyr warrior godesses and trixter Gods of Misschief need to stick together. This was an experiment due to their common Valhalla origins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboDoge Posted October 10, 2014 Share Posted October 10, 2014 As a Loki main, I get that. Though Northern Valkyr warrior godesses and trixter Gods of Misschief need to stick together. This was an experiment due to their common Valhalla origins. Try using Loki Prime model for this. As Loki was created by Lotus, and Valkyr might be more connected to the Prime version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch111 Posted October 27, 2014 Author Share Posted October 27, 2014 Would be awesome to get the community feedback on where to take Valkyr. Should she be buff, and badass? Or angelic and ornate? Anyways this is a rough wip. Ignore the details, this is early in the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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