Warframe/weapon Slots Vod

[Krogothian]

I clearly feel they are not required in the modern Warframe. They feel like a fragment of the past that is not really needed. 

 

When it comes to this topic it is mostly speculation due to the lack of hard info on the sales of plat that correlates with plat being used primarily on slots.

 

Keep in mind I do not monetize my videos. I gain nothing from your viewership. 

 

If you have any hard actual facts to weigh out the problems with the system I would love to hear it and I will try and respond to any questions. 

[Vindictus23]

This is kind of off topic but you sound a lot like one of my professors. :s

 

But... I do somewhat agree with this. I've spent a few hundred platinum or so on slots and it does get annoying, but it also helps me clear out the crap that I keep. For example.. I never used my Karak that I got a long time ago when I was a low level, but once I needed space I ended up getting rid of it and replacing it with something I do in fact use. Now that I have a lot of slots and items, I've started to use certain frames/weapons more and I know it's good to have a variety to choose from, but it just bugs me sometimes. I haven't touched like 10-15 items in a month or so, and since I have a lot of items there's nothing really coming in that's new to my arsenal so the old stuff just keep building up. Although it would be cool for the people who didn't buy slots yet.. for the people like me and many others who did, it would just seem unfair.

[Krogothian]

~snip~

 

I don't really care if it allows the game to grow more. I would not even be mad if slots were free or purchasable with credits. I know DE will make the best call, I just want to try and bring attention to slots and how they can create problems for new players or be tedious for others. If plat sales would allow I would like to see them altered or removed. 

 

I would be happy if they just rolled them into alerts so you can build more slots. 

 

Sure hope your professor does not sound like an idiot. =/

[Vindictus23]

He's hot and has a sexy voice so dw. ;)

[Zero.No.Hikari]

Back when I started in U7 I think the two things I bought with my starter plat was taters, Then when I go Disciple Pack of Founders and all I think 200ish plat went right into slots hehe, I have about 40 WF slots and I think I have about 100 for weapons besides the starter slots.....Yeah I myself have always loved the idea of Slots and inventory.    I don't know why but it feels rewarding that I can create a Barrack of warframes and Vaults of weapons.  Also I think I may have been the first one to 4 forma a Miter back when it came out, yeah I did that when it first came out.   I think I also have a tater on AkLato......I have a problem with taters and slots......  Though I do think it also feels that way for peeps not all of us but some.   Guess it comes from playing other games where you had limited slots, there I never bought the extra stuff wasn't needed nor would it have felt rewarding enough.    Though I think a problem now is what does one use Plat on?  Cosmetics? I have all of em and still got leftover stuff.  Colors are the same and helmets aren't all that good looking.

 

I think the problem with the refund would be potatoes?  I have all of my weapons are tater'd even something like Tetra which is actually great!!  same with frames.

 

Resources? Sure but then what to use them on?

 

Keys? Same as above.

 

A problem is what do vets do with the refund if it gives them nothing for those who have everything.   It's like the new WoW feature where you can bring back a dead toon(that Titan thing must of really pushed peeps away)  Though I myself would want something like maybe Free cosmetic coupons.

 

When a new cosmetic comes out be it weapon or Frame the coupon is eligible for exchange for it.  Makes it a 1 to 1 trade.  Though for me that'd give me 140 coupons...... huh I should really not have bought so many slots back when I started

 

Yeah no scratch my idea.

[Graphx]

Good video and it something that should be brought.  The slots were in the game before the vanity items were in the game so I understand the early idea of them but now that there is skins, armor attachment, sentinel attachments,stat less helms, and I am sure there will be vanity items for the Liset eventually and kubrow accessories. Are weapons/waframe slots for plat necessary?    If DE would refund the plat I used for frames, the plat would go right back in the game for armor or the new helms that are in development. I am sure most other players would do the same.

[Xeo_Nespydonum]

I praise DE for their generosity with this game- I think it's an amazing F2P model, but the slots always have sort of bothered me since they limit what I can keep around.  I also wouldn't mind if they completely removed them with no "compensation" for those who spent plat on slots.  After all, what have the new players ever gotten,  Old players have tons of items that are nigh unobtainable at this point I think they can live with some lost plat due to a platinum model change. 

[Krogothian]

When a new cosmetic comes out be it weapon or Frame the coupon is eligible for exchange for it.  Makes it a 1 to 1 trade.  Though for me that'd give me 140 coupons...... huh I should really not have bought so many slots back when I started

 

 

I just don't think DE would want to hand out straight plat.  I was think a plat that can only be used in purchasing cosmetics, keys, cores, mats, or mods in the market would be kinda nice. But, I don't want people to feel DE is cheating them and they will typically all feel that way.

[Jokubas]

There's a fallacy I see in a lot of communities, and even some businesses (it doesn't usually turn out well for the latter), that since businesses need money to stay around, that the customer is under some obligation to just hand it over to them. Businesses exist because they're providing something that people want, those people become customers. In other words, the best way to make money is to make people want to give you money, rather than begging them to. The only businesses that can get away with the latter are ones that have grown so big that you take them for granted (cars, houses, Coca Cola, etc.).

 

Being hit with a limitation on your fun early on, like weapon or Warframe slots, are almost certainly bad for business in the long term. They put a bad taste in your customers' mouths before they've gotten much of an impression of you. Even if you get them to give in now, they're not going to feel good about it. You want them to look forward to their next purchase, not regretting the one they just made.

 

Now, this is a more personal theory, not one I've read studies about, but... I honestly think that limiting inventory is one of the worst things a game can do (whether they charge to expand it or not). I think it's so subconscious that most people don't realize it, but running out of inventory space is the number one reason I, at least, stop playing free-to-play games (and lots of MMOs). When I first started playing Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn, I couldn't figure out why I was enjoying myself so much. In most major ways, it's essentially just a Final Fantasy version of World of Warcraft, which I have played to death. Eventually, it hit me: the inventory. Final Fantasy XIV has a huge inventory, a key items tab, and a special "armory" for your equipment. Last I played, I was well over halfway to the level cap, and only did inventory management once, and of my own free will, not because I had hit the limit. It was liberating to actually be able to play the game, and not having to go back to town every five minutes to clear out my inventory, and fret over what I might be able to afford getting rid of or not. People want to play games when they're playing a game, not do chores.

 

Warframe gets to ignore most of that, since it's not an MMO, and has a much more limited need for inventory in the first place with the way it's designed, but it still applies overall. People don't want to use their money to get rid of an annoyance you put there on purpose. They want to use their money on something they enjoy.

[Zero.No.Hikari]

I just don't think DE would want to hand out straight plat.  I was think a plat that can only be used in purchasing cosmetics, keys, cores, mats, or mods in the market would be kinda nice. But, I don't want people to feel DE is cheating them and they will typically all feel that way.

 

You've seen peeps who cried murder when Launchers got balanced.  I think it would tear the community apart if the Slots changed.   It'd be kinda like.....When Zero(lelouche) turned on the black knights and became king of Britania, many of the Black Knights were devastated and some just wanted his head,  granted it was the plan all along but still it's something that can tear a group apart.

 

 

Or just think Sonic Boom and Sonic fandom.

 

Also I'd recommend following your own topic, just in case.

Edited September 28, 2014 by Zero.No.Hikari

[Krogothian]

~snip~

 

You surely the most eloquent person I have spoken to about this. They say a picture is worth a thousand words and you just painted one with words.

Edited September 28, 2014 by Krogothian

[Krogothian]

Also I'd recommend following your own topic, just in case.

 In case what?

[Zero.No.Hikari]

 In case what?

 

in case your topic blows up with comments and ideas/questions geared towards you.   I myself do that if I know I am saying something a bit button pushing

 

(Kinda like removing coptering and replacing it with ground and air dashes......Damn I should really not played MM Zero 1-4 before thinking of that idea)

[Krogothian]

in case your topic blows up with comments and ideas/questions geared towards you.   I myself do that if I know I am saying something a bit button pushing

 

(Kinda like removing coptering and replacing it with ground and air dashes......Damn I should really not played MM Zero 1-4 before thinking of that idea)

 

 

I just bookmark the page and hit it when I get a chance. Might as well so I don't forget though.

[Zero.No.Hikari]

I just bookmark the page and hit it when I get a chance. Might as well so I don't forget though.

Wish I could do that, my Bookmark bar is filled with different stuff ranging from anime I'm watching at the moment to Wiki's from all games I'm playing

 

Tokyo Ghoul man the show and manga are awesome, or KR Gaim if you like Cerebus Syndrome shows.......

[Jokubas]

Another thing I want to point out, that I have to disagree with you slightly on, is cosmetics.

 

It really bothers me that gamers seemed to finally, mostly fight off "pay-to-win," but one of the things it's commonly been replaced with is "pay-for-cosmetics."

 

In a competitive shooter or something, yeah, it's ridiculous if you put up some really powerful weapon on your store, meaning you essentially have to play in order to truly play. But, the thing is, I'm a very artistically-minded person. Making it where all cosmetics are behind a pay wall, is essentially the same thing for me. Why is it okay to charge artistic people but not competitive people?

 

I mean, obviously, you can't just make exceptions for every demographic, I get that. The funny thing is, though, buying a more powerful weapon for real money actually makes some sense to me (even if I'm not okay with it). On other hand, even as a person who cares about aesthetics, I never spend real money on virtual cosmetics. That's ridiculous to me. The only Warframe clothing I've spent money on was a real life t-shirt in their merchandise store.

 

And yes, I understand that they have to make money somehow in order to keep the game running. But if I don't believe in the ways they make that money, then I'm not going to feel sympathy if they can't keep it up. Business is a compromise between people who want something and people who can provide it. It only works when both sides have an equal say. What's the point of a business selling something nobody wants?

 

It comes up a lot with free-to-play games. People act like free-to-play is some generous charity on the part of businesses you should occasionally donate to in thanks. Go look up any article about free-to-play games written from the perspective of the businesses. Free-to-play is set up to make them more money. Where do you think they get that money from? The gaming industry had no problem existing in the days of $50 boxes and no DLC. That extra money isn't the line between food and starving for the company (maybe for some devs, but that would be because of greed above them, not the business model itself ;P).

 

I'm not being anti-business or anti-capitalism here, I'm just trying to be a bit educational. And that wasn't really directed toward Digital Extremes either. So far Warframe has been one of the least intrusive cash shop games I've ever played. I love Warframe. I said all of that because I just don't want legitimate debates about business models being dismissed because of common misconceptions. I want the days of one-time box prices back because I honestly just find it really stressful wondering about whether or not I'll have to pay for something cool in the future and how much it will be, not because I'm formulating plans to get as much content from developers as I can for no money.

 

Tying back to the beginning of my post, I just want a selection of free cosmetics (there can still be paid cosmetics). They can still be earned, like a syandana you unlock after beating a certain boss. And that actually kinda ties into my previous post as well. I'm much more likely to put more money in when I'm having fun and wanting to put more money in. I'm not going to give money to a company that I feel is scamming me (I bought the t-shirt because I wanted to support the game and don't feel Digital Extremes is that bad, but I chose something real because I still think spending real money on virtual clothes is silly).

 

You surely the most eloquent person I have spoken to about this. They say a picture is worth a thousand words and you just painted one with words.

Thanks, I usually avoid talking about it too much because it's a really polarizing topic for some, but I really wanted to back you up.

 

I read one time that actual business schools teach similar concepts, but for some reason the popular expectation has been skewed in a weird way that manages to hurt both customers and businesses. I have seen previous free-to-play games go down in flames while both company and diehard fan are stubbornly holding on to those misconceptions even as they lose everything to them.

 

I don't want to see that happen to Warframe. It doesn't really feel in danger of it at the moment, but it doesn't hurt to be preventative, since there are still things that could be better.

Edited September 28, 2014 by Jokubas

[Krogothian]

~snip~

 

I agree with you almost entirely; however, I spend money on cosmetic items and other essentially worthless virtual items. 

[FrackingBiscuit]

You make very good points when you bring up the Torid and new cosmetics.  There's no incentive to keep a weapon that isn't the very best; build, max, sell.  It used to be reasonable because there wasn't much to spend money on in Warframe; having to buy slots was like paying to unlock more of the game, which wasn't unreasonable.  But now with so many new cosmetic items, it's not so necessary anymore.  If we didn't have to decide what weapons to keep and what weapons to sell, maybe we'd feel more incentive to go back and power-up some weapons that aren't the very best but that at the end of the day we just like.

 

I made the same point in another thread about colors pickers, arguing that Classic should be unlocked with credits and that Classic Saturated and Gamme (desaturated) should be available for 50p.  Pricing color pickers at 75p forces people to spend at least $5 on the game to buy one, which made sense when they were the meat and potatoes of cosmetics.  Now with all the new Syandanas and cosmetic armor sets, color pickers aren't the be-all end-all.  Maybe basic color pickers should be made more accessible so they can compete with and enhance the other cosmetics we all want to buy.

 

Basically it used to be that you either paid for slots (which essentially let you play the game more), or you pay for cosmetics (which let you look the way you want).  There weren't many cosmetic options so making us pay for slots was the only way to make sure we kept buying platinum.  But now with there being so many cosmetics and with more and more coming out and with upcoming additions like animation packs, we're spending more and more plat on these items and finding it harder to buy slots.  So we'll keep building, maxing, and selling weapons and not spending plat on the potatoes and Forma for them, because it's just not a priority to keep around weapons that don't beat the numbers game.

 

I'm especially noticing this problem with Warframe slots for new players.  Just a few days ago I made an alt account because I wanted to see what it's like to be new these days, since I've got over 800 hours on my main account.  Naturally this means that things will be a little skewed because I'm not prepared to spend money on an alt account when I've already spent so much on my main (and please, don't ask me how much, it hurts to think about).  

You start with one open Warframe slot.  You finish the tutorial and you've unlocked Earth, Venus, and Mercury.  Earth has no boss node, Mercury has Vor who drops the Cronus and Seer, and Venus has the Jackal who drops Rhino blueprints.  Smash your face into Jackal hopefully less than ten times and you'll have the three parts for Rhino.

 

The Chassis and Systems can be built with resources farmed on the first three worlds.  But the helmet needs a Neural Sensors and the main BP needs an Orokin Cell; this means going to Jupiter to fight Alad V and Saturn to fight Sargas Ruk, respectively, for the best chance of getting one of these items.  You might be lucky and end up finding them before you reach the boss node; for me I got four Orokin Cells on a 25 minute survival just before reaching Tethis, which having put in 800+ hours already I can say is an absolute fluke - an outlier that should be ignored.  For Neural Sensors I had to fight Alad V a few times.

 

So a new player is setting out to build his Rhino; he's probably replaced all his starting weapons with new ones and still has a few weapon slots open, and playing with a Frame and six weapons can easily bring him to MR2 in two or three days so  he can build his Rhino as soon as the three components are finished.  But as he was farming Orokin Cells and Neural Sensors, he was also getting Valkyr and Ember components.  And if he was farming Gallium on Mars to build his second or even third set of weapons, he's also probably got Mag components.  Three other Warframes which are already difficult and time-consuming to build because of how long it takes to farm materials, how many boss runs you have to do to get their components, all the credits you have to save up to buy their BPs and build them and the 3.5 day minimum build time - and to top it all off, if he builds that Rhino he worked to hard to get, he wont have a slot for the Mag, Valkyr, or Ember.  The only way he can get all the new Frames he sees is if he picked Mag as his starter and spends 40p of his starting 50p on two inventory slots; which means no Reactors, no Catalysts, no Syandana, no armor.  And chances are by the time he realizes he needs another slot, he's already bought one of the above.

 

Maybe this is his incentive to spend five bucks and buy all the slots he needs; and maybe this is where the general frustration of Warframe's inventory system begins.

[noveltyhero]

I think that mastery ranks should reward with more slots so you have this limited freedom of expanding your arsenal but if you really want to go all out just buy slots :/

[ArgonTheFox]

I do think slots need looking at, because it immediately locks out new players, if they aren't willing to pay for slots, as for a long time, new players don't have stuff to sell on the trading post to make their own platinum.

 

I said it when I first joined Warframe, and I still believe it. This game is pay to play with a free trial. The only reason I am able to play is because I buy platinum. The trading system in this game is so dysfunctional, ive been unable to ever sell any items, just due to the complexity and time required to do so. Its much less of a headache to just buy the slots, but not everyone has that luxury.

 

Weapon slots either need their price tag removing, or the trading post needs revising so new players can use it.

[Krogothian]

I think that mastery ranks should reward with more slots so you have this limited freedom of expanding your arsenal but if you really want to go all out just buy slots :/

 

That would have to award more than one slot per mastery. You need more weapons and frames to level up each time. 

 

 

I do think slots need looking at, because it immediately locks out new players, if they aren't willing to pay for slots, as for a long time, new players don't have stuff to sell on the trading post to make their own platinum.

 

I said it when I first joined Warframe, and I still believe it. This game is pay to play with a free trial. The only reason I am able to play is because I buy platinum. The trading system in this game is so dysfunctional, ive been unable to ever sell any items, just due to the complexity and time required to do so. Its much less of a headache to just buy the slots, but not everyone has that luxury.

 

Weapon slots either need their price tag removing, or the trading post needs revising so new players can use it.

 

If the trading gets a rework it is not that big of an issue in my eyes. I am not a new player though, and new players inherently have an issue with slots as a pay-gate.