Why Is The Meta, Even The Meta...

[ThunderZsolt]

true things

 

please don't tell them, that the boltor sucks! how will i sell my boltor and rhino sets, then?

[Nihillian]

I love boltor prime for it's looks and damage. I love my Burston prime as it is more efficient and status/punch through combo is awesome. I LOVE my Rhino Prime because it looks awesome and has good overal skill set. And I heard no one complain about me using Rhino Prime so far while I buff em with roar or revive them after I used stomp to get them out of gank.

 

You just sound hella butt burt with your OP. unless I run T4 surv/Def I will continue to play with my boltor or amprex or any other weapon that I like using that has some decent/good damage. 

 

#allowpeopletoplaywithwhattheywantinsteadofbeingbutthurt.

 

Now, if they had a rhino/boltor/marelok combo and they sucked a lot, sure, you can be annoyed, I get annoyed by that as well (dam you early life support users!)

[MechaTails]

According to your previous posts, you can see when "noobs" are out of ammo because they switch to a melee weapon, now you suggest a melee weapon so your ammo economy survives longer survival runs. There are tons of threads of people suggesting to nerf the boltor prime because it's to strong in which you even commented and then there are threads where you say boltor prime is not that strong try xxx weapon. Your posts give people cancer, you got no idea what the hell you are talking about. You are a hypocrite.

That's why politicians keep debates short, if they go on for too long they inevitably start to contradict themselves and look bad.

And i dont know what meta is, dont care either, it just seems to cause problems.

My Banshee goes into every mission with Dual Cestra and Lecta or Furax and wrecks everything. There is no mission I havent been able to do with those weapons, and when people ask me to change gear i just leave and play solo since thats what happens 90% of the time.

[LadyScootaloo]

6deep9me.

 

On topic.

Warframe lacks the complexity for this right now.

There's just a clear lack of CERTIFIED KNOWLEDGE being spread around.

It just 'seems too easy' to do anything.

 

-shortversion-.

[Deruser]

Main loadout is usually the Braton Prime, Despair, Dakra Prime. Braton prime is just awesome, and the low fire rate helps to keep ammo efficiency in check. Even if it runs out of ammo, I can usually depend on my despair while the braton prime refills itself.

 

Main warframe is Excalibur because of his utility and balance. You can make him a damaged oriented frame or the usual cc radial blind build. I have been trying out super jump builds however just to see how it works out.

 

My playstyle of choice is trying to be a wannabe ninja and jumping around shooting things in mid air. I really hope that DE comes up with a proper system to avoid bullets and make the parkour aspect of Warframe more fluid so that we can dodge bullets more easily.

[Sixty5]

Just wait until these dps lovers find out the Tigris can dish out 7.8million burst Dps

7.8m > ~40k therefore the Tigris is the weapon

[(XBOX)ShapelessHorr0r]

Just wait until these dps lovers find out the Tigris can dish out 7.8million burst Dps

7.8m > ~40k therefore the Tigris is the weapon

I don't think you guys realize that having a big number doesn't necessarily mean the big number is being used.

[Vanguard4]

 

Because the game has never had any structure. People go get a few mods and a decent gun and, bam, Mercury and Venus can be crushed without any difficulty. This becomes their baseline because there's nothing else setting a standard. They spend the whole game operating under the self-imposed assumption that they should be in little danger and vaporize anything they look at funny.

 

Then they get to end game and they declare the ride has been a boring grind with no challenge, all damage skills are broken/UP because they don't one shot anything anymore, and all mods that aren't raw damage are "band aids" or "useless" because they have to stack pure damage and pure EHP to keep up that level of power, where they're super strong and super tough.

 

Then they go to endless and they expect to STILL be at that level of no challenge, no cover used, no team work, so invincible snowglobes, team invulnerability buffs and 60m PBAoE hard stuns + blind that goes through walls with no max targets are perfectly reasonable int heir minds. How else can they play for 60min straight vs the highest level enemies scaling upwards the whole time!?

 

I've been telling DE we need structure for a very long time and I'm really not seeing it being taken to heart. Tacticool alerts will be a high point of the game for me personally but they also represent a half-measure that will not affect the core issue. People will consider the tacticool alerts the outlier and the existing problems with pacing and lack of reference for intended strength will continue. Meanwhile Boltor Prime remains MR2 and Soma can, AFAIK, be used at MR0 if someone buys it for plat.

 

I've been telling DE we need conditional damage and defense, rather than free stats for a very long time. DE_Steve even said he liked the idea of damage mods based on gameplay like +% damage on unaware targets or +% damage on headshots, but that was several updates ago and nothing since. Meanwhile events are giving away more and higher free stats through new mods.

 

This is the greatest weakness of the game and it needs to get fixed ASAP, before anyone else's pet issue. It's what causes people to feel like they're grinding because the total lack of risk or conditional performance makes the game a snoozefest when you just bring OP gear. It's what makes end-game bad, because everyone who reaches the end game has no idea how to play against a challenge since they've spent all their playtime as a God in OP gear. It's what makes PUG's trash as no one has any need or desire to do anything but flash through on their Zorren copter to see the mission complete screen. 

 

 

 

/rant.

 

+1 - more eloquently than I could have pinned it down.

I have heard that in some clans you start in a wing clan until you get invited to the main when you are "skilled" enough.

Currently, skill equates to the amount of time you have spent grinding mods/equipment.

[StinkyPygmy]

What can I say, somewhere along the line players started getting a hard on for stats and DPS over fun.

As soon as DPS is mentioned I kind of stop caring. Theres nothing wrong with taking all that stuff into account but when it becomes the meta and sole thing you use to determine what is and isn't good you end up missing half the picture.

 

Personally my Blind rage banshee (dem sonar multipliers)along with a sybaris built with whatever element is faction appropriate, crit build vasto (with hollow point, I know who uses that right?) and a glaive or what ever melee tickles my fancy at the time is one of my favorite builds.The few times I do end up staying for long voids it gets me really far and when I'm lucky enough to be working with a squad that can aim sonar becomes invaluable as soon as things start getting stupidly tanky and our weapons start to fall off.

 

I don't care what your theoretical DPS is,  just about any weapon in game has the potential to out perform the current flavor of the month of weapon.

 

I'm also fond of using a blind rage + fleeting sayrn which amps up venom and Miasma to godly levels (plus its really only hurts contagion and thats fine by me) plus either a status build Tigris thats element/faction appropriate with a 4 shell capacity using corrupted mods or a duel element, status build torid with multishot and a rank 4 HC to get a good spread on my shots. Oh, and a crit build (with true punishment) set of duel ichors with the appropriate elements.

 

I think a huge part of the problem is mods like hornet strike/serration exist. They shouldn't.

Not only is modding for the right elements generally more then enough to make a weapon effective (and then some) but so is learning how to use weapons and frames effectively. A lot of weapons etc in WF are already terribly unbalanced so pure dmg mods with no trade off just compound the issue. Add to that the misconception that 60+min T4 survivals is where the balancing bar is set, and what you have is a trainwreck. Theres nothing wrong with using a rhino/Boltor P if thats what you enjoy, but for the love hek pop a roar once in a while (Roar rhinos are best rhinos) and be a team player.

 

Funnily enough, the players that are obsessed with running the meta and min/maxing till their eyes bleed are also the ones that complain that the game is to easy and then kick up a fuss when something is nerfed or in some cases even when buffed.

 

TL;DR: use what is fun and learn to mod. You will never need to keep up with the meta again.

[victor_victory]

Nerf Boltor prime, people use soma. Nerf Soma, people use synapse. Nerf synapse, people use Amprex. Nerf Amprex, people use gorgon. Nerf gorgon, people use Braton.

[Zhyzak]

And this is what grates my nerves about this community.

This right here sums up what irritates me the most.

People like this.

"I dislike people that play "insert frame here" because they do what I don't like".

Do you have any idea how pathetic it sounds?

There are a lot of things that players shouldn't do because of etiquette. 

 

I.e. don't play a mirage and spam Quanta Secondary fire, unless you really gotta save people.

i.e. don't play a mirage and shake everyone's screen with Attica.

 

It is not pathetic to have things you dislike. What is pathetic is that people have to feel this way, because there is no soft etiquette amongst players that ask them to make for a smooth gaming experience for others.

^ Thank you, Semshol. I wasn't hating on all Mirages, so much as making an observation that many aren't very mindful or courteous to their teammates in certain ways, and that many who choose that frame fall prey to the same "rushing lone wolf DPS-machine syndrome" that usually plagues Rhino players. Not that that's always the case, of course.

But by all means, Ailissa, call people pathetic for having an opinion you disagree with.

[-Ozymandias-]

Call me elitist if you want, but Semshol has some valid points right here.

 

I had some clan members that didn't last 2 weeks playing the game because they went straight to farm Rhino prime and Boltor prime...now, im not complaining about it, everyone can play the way they want, hell the first warframe i built was Rhino.

What i'm trying to say is, if people get bored of the game, it's their fault, they made it boring by not trying something else.

It is also kinda DE's fault for not giving the Boltor Prime a high mastery rank requirement...but i see threads everyday where people complain about how "boring" or "samey" this game is when we have TONS of weapons and options, if you don't switch to something else because "it's not viable" "it's not on the top dps weapons" "youtube says its crap" then don't complain about the game, unless you are playing a long t4 survival or defense you can use literaly anything and still one shot anything.

Everytime a new weapon is released i see people saying "it's crap" "Boltor Prime/Brakk > this weapon" because idk why they expect that every new weapon HAS to be OP.

If you enjoy using your Boltor and Rhino all the time and on every mission you play even on mercury then that's totally fine, but don't come to the forums later claiming the game is boring or samey.

 

Many times ive joined public games and even tho im MR17 ive been told "why are you using that weapon?" "X weapon is better" "why wouldnt you use X weapon?" "why you use Dread instead of Paris prime?" "why are you using that warframe?"

and even tho id like to say: because i f**ng want to!, i always try to explain people why X weapon or X warframe is good/viable. But as soon as they come up with the boring DPS rule i know the best thing to do is just play and let them talk, because it's a lost fight.

Funny thing is i end up being the top damage dealer...weak spots bro, accuracy, headshots, procs, they do matter.

Edited September 29, 2014 by -HB-Angainor

[ROXXXY]

I use rhino but not prime or boltor prime because everytime I play a games must have a challenge when I play or I get bored. It's was like me when I first fought Phorid and thought that he was weak since all I had to do was stand on a rock and he couldn't get me. Even with his missile things.

[LordMelvin]

My Personal Meta: 

 

Frost Prime (Beefcake Build - All Stamina mods, Maxed Shields, Armor, HP)

Braton Prime or Latron Prime

Lex Prime or Twin Gremlins

Scindo Prime or Dual Kamas

 

Although I can't really say I have a "meta" per se since I change my loadout on a per mission basis. I rarely use the same weapon twice in a row unless I'm leveling it. Out of the 40 or so weapons I've kept in my arsenal I can safely say that I actually use all of them at least once a week.

[Adaptor-Face]

the meta exists because people dont want to think for themselves.

 

 

ROUGH MATH AHEAD!!!!!!!!111one

 Boltor prime with 1k dmg per bullet, and i will enjoy my phage with 9k damage per bullet.

With the total ammo pool of each weapon being 620 for boltor P and 160 for phage, the phage gets 820k extra damage before needing to pick up ANY ammo. This is because one ammo pickup on the phage is 180k dmg and on the boltor P its a measly 20k. 

[Monolake]

Did a few void 40m survivals with nothing but ash, and pangolin swords.

 

I remember when Hek's were meta.

Could easily push 1hr+ T4S with 4 competent Ashes, just to laugh at noobs who still think Ash is useless. 

 

 

Also Im sick of seeing word meta misused. its a metagame in dota clones cause its a strategy of picking and couterpicking. In this game its just a perpetuated trend and going for the best weapons. There is nothing meta about it when you use the most op guns or when noobs believe Rhino is the best cause IronSkin is virtual immunity at low levels.

Edited September 29, 2014 by Monolake

[HoakinBlackforge]

Current problem in warframe:

 

^ Power = Skill V

[Oranji]

I actually prefer that most people are using boltor prime cuz I always wanted to make them think that their S#&$ is the best then after mission im ranked at most kills with my usual loadout of amprex/dread, hikou prime, dual ichor, ^_^

[Deccode]

I always wanted to make them think that their S#&$ is the best then after mission im ranked at most kills with my usual loadout of amprex/dread, hikou prime, dual ichor, ^_^

I'm always ahead of the squad with my usual loadout aswell specially when using the archwings in t4 survivals. What do you mean they are not released yet? 

[(XBOX)ShapelessHorr0r]

the meta exists because people dont want to think for themselves.

 

 

ROUGH MATH AHEAD!!!!!!!!111one

 Boltor prime with 1k dmg per bullet, and i will enjoy my phage with 9k damage per bullet.

With the total ammo pool of each weapon being 620 for boltor P and 160 for phage, the phage gets 820k extra damage before needing to pick up ANY ammo. This is because one ammo pickup on the phage is 180k dmg and on the boltor P its a measly 20k.

Which enemies need more than 5k damage?

[Semshol]

Wow, my thread is still going. Much love.

 

Anyway, to the guys that said I was contradicting myself. No I wasn't, primary, secondary and melee are supposed to work in harmony, under ideal conditions.

 

People who run out of ammo, often don't bring a viable secondary or melee, thus making them 'noobs'. You can try to find flaws in me, but poking me doesn't make the game better. If you believe i'm wrong, show it through action, by teaching those around you about what a good weapon can do.

 

You'd be surprised how many people don't know about the viability of the AkStilettos, especially because it is hit-scan + has great status proc. The Braton Prime is usually overlooked because of its lower damage than the Boltor Prime, but I actually find it works really nice on my banshee when I combine it with Sonar, because I don't have to aim exactly at the spot each time I pull the trigger. These are the kinds of synergies that people discover through actually testing and enjoying a weapon. Yet many Tenno are not availing themselves to that because:

 

- When someone points out their God-tier sucks, he or she is called elitist and told: "People can play how they want" - I respect this sentiment, but when someone is wrong, you should tell them in a calm manner about the alternatives that exist. If they choose not to accept it, you don't have to get mad, BUT the seed is planted.

 

- The best players are quiet. They come to play the game and enjoy it, they don't post on the forums and their load-outs and style remain a secret. You can only copy it if you observe their play-style very closely and then copy it...like Kakashi :D. I used to be a loud vocal Rhino, then I started copying styles and now I'm on the other side of the fence where I can see there is more to life than Iron Skin, Roar and Stomp. Which, to the rhino defenders are viable tools, but there are other frames that do the same thing, just a lot better i.e. Nova's M. Prime, Banshee's Sonar, you get the gist of it. I won't say Rhinos are useless, but there are so many other options to choose from that it just seems to a little silly to home in on Rhino who is a jack of all trades but master of none. I mean we're in a four-man team because each player has a unique role to play. Otherwise DE would make just one frame and we'd all roll with that.

[Adaptor-Face]

Which enemies need more than 5k damage?

 

 

A good part of the phage is that you can use 0.1 ammo at lower levels.And in high level survival/defense it is always fun to see Boltor prime barely damaging at the heavy gunner while my phage takes big chunks of their health each tick. 

[Adaptor-Face]

EDIT: WP Internet connection

Edited September 29, 2014 by Adaptor-Face

[Chub_N_Tuck]

Yeah, people do suggest which weapon is better than which but we all have our opinions just like you do.

 

People will always do that and there's nothing we can do about it.

 

They do not decide the meta; in fact, in a game like this, there can be no meta in terms of weapons.

 

It's just popularity and effectiveness.

 

I can say for a fact that there is no weapon that does not work in missions unless it's level 50+ and/or modded horribly.

 

It doesn't matter AT ALL what weapons people use and it is the way it always been. 

 

also just wanted to say, keep it short and simple. Otherwise my attention span doesn't last.

Edited September 29, 2014 by GaiaNyix

[Leland_Gaunt]

This is still going?

 

Fabulous.