Concern About Ability Removal

[Imaru]

So as we all know, abilities will soon be removed from the drop tables (yay!) but this causes me some concern. During the devstream when they confirmed this (the most recent one. 38?) they said that players would need to either trade for duplicates of the mods or build/buy the warframe again to get the mods again. That would be all well and good, with one exception.

Mirage.

Why is Mirage a problem here? You can't get more than one of her without platinum. Since you can't repeat quests yet, once you get Mirage through the quest, you can't get her again unless you want to buy her. If for some reason (like a tactical alert or a conclave match) you want to use one of her mods unranked, but you maxed them all, you need to purchase her to get the mods.

Opinions? Please discuss.

Edited October 13, 2014 by Imaru12

[Ov3rd0se]

Why does it matter? Why should I care? I use all the abilties at max rank anyway.

[PandemicLegions]

Why does it matter? Why should I care? I use all the abilties at max rank anyway.

 

Because many advanced builds require a little more thought then throwing a bunch of maxed mods at a frame and seeing if it works.

 

And as far as the OP, I don't understand why all abilities don't just cost 2-5p to buy from the market. It would serve as an excellent platinum sink and would solve the issue completely.

Edited October 10, 2014 by PandemicLegions

[Ov3rd0se]

Really? Enlighten me on this then. Why would you NOT use a max rank mod? Too lazy to polarize?

[Elvang]

Supposedly DE is considering implementing a way to derank mods at cost.

 

Really? Enlighten me on this then. Why would you NOT use a max rank mod? Too lazy to polarize?

 

Occasionally, a build is more effective with the lower ranked mod than a higher one, for example if you want lower durations. Another reason would be that it'd allow you to mod a warframe more quickly/frequently while ranking it.

Edited October 10, 2014 by Elvang

[Imaru]

Why does it matter? Why should I care? I use all the abilties at max rank anyway.

"If for some reason you want to use one of her mods unranked..."

I never said you should care. I was just voicing my concerns.

As for why it mattered, frames like trinity. Blessing is now a mod that works well at max rank or unranked. If trinity came from a non repeatable quest, you would need to buy her again just to get the mods back to unranked. This means you are out some 200+ platinum for 4 mods. Does that not seem like a problem to you?

[Ov3rd0se]

Nope it doesn't. If it works well either way, just keep it maxed anyway. Who cares?

[Eric1738]

we should be allowed to adjust mod rank freely once maxed. i hardly see any problem of that.

[Imaru]

Nope it doesn't. If it works well either way, just keep it maxed anyway. Who cares?

As someone who doesn't play trinity much (at all) I speak on what I have heard from other players. At low rank, blessing will heal less but lasts less time, so it is spammable. Maxed, blessing will heal more but also lasts longer, keeping damage reduction around longer but can't be recast as often.

[Neah]

Maybe 1 of two things might help imo : 

 

1. Allow the under-clocking / over-clocking of Ability mods 

2. Allow duplication of Ability mods at cost (more than the selling price, obviously)

[vaugahn]

As someone who doesn't play trinity much (at all) I speak on what I have heard from other players. At low rank, blessing will heal less but lasts less time, so it is spammable. Maxed, blessing will heal more but also lasts longer, keeping damage reduction around longer but can't be recast as often.

 

That's no longer applicable. 

[Somedude1000]

My biggest problem with this? Market crash

 

 

Once ability mods are removed,t heres a higher tendency for drops of rares. While this is good, it will also potentially negatively affect the market. What i'm even more worried about is that the solution will to be nerfing the drops of rares, at which point we are left with the same mod rarity, but now we don't even have the fusion fuel ability mods...

[Imaru]

That's no longer applicable.

Oh? As I said, I don't play trinity. How does it work now?

[Neah]

As someone who doesn't play trinity much (at all) I speak on what I have heard from other players. At low rank, blessing will heal less but lasts less time, so it is spammable. Maxed, blessing will heal more but also lasts longer, keeping damage reduction around longer but can't be recast as often.

A recent update fixed the problem. See : https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/308432-hotfix-1461/?hl=trinity (fix)

                                                                 https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/307792-update-1460/  (heal value change)

 

Trinity:

 

• Trinity's Blessing is now recastable while passive damage reduction is active. This means you no longer need to wait for your Duration timers to expire before being able to recast Blessing.

 

• Trinity's Blessing now heals 40/50/75/80% health and shields based on Mod rank. The percentage can also be increased by strength mods.

Edited October 10, 2014 by Neah

[vaugahn]

Oh? As I said, I don't play trinity. How does it work now?

 

It no longer heals to full, but you can spam it.

[Elvang]

My biggest problem with this? Market crash

 

 

Once ability mods are removed,t heres a higher tendency for drops of rares. While this is good, it will also potentially negatively affect the market. What i'm even more worried about is that the solution will to be nerfing the drops of rares, at which point we are left with the same mod rarity, but now we don't even have the fusion fuel ability mods...

I don't think you have to worry about that. As it is, I rarely see rare drops. Removing ability mods isn't going to make a huge difference, as looking at my own list of rare abilities, I see very few duplicates above a count of 3 or 4.

 

EDIT: Going through the codex, in most cases where it'd matter its simply removing one rare drop from a list 3-5 long. Most of the common enemies are just going from 2 rare drops to a single rare fusion core drop.

Edited October 10, 2014 by Elvang

[taiiat]

extra copies of Warframe Abilities for Platinum.... i'd prefer Credits or some other method of obtaining, but if i could buy an extra copy of all 4 Warframe Abilities for a Warframe for a few Platinum...i'd get over it.

 

 

still, people don't understand Weighted Chances, removing Warframe Abilities will not make anything else more likely to drop. not by a significant margin anyways, removing other choices might make all other options occur 1% more often in a sample size of 500.

 

 

so it was fine as it was, and the change from this will be almost completely unnoticable. you'll just get other Mods instead, and have too many of those.

[Semshol]

There are NO advanced builds that require unranked ability mods. Everything is all maxed, all the time.

 

If you have a 'pro build' that requires an unranked ability mod. Please show it to me and I will offer you a suitably powerful alternative. Trinity does not count for this discussion anymore.

 

If I fail to create a better build, you will get a cookie.

Edited October 10, 2014 by Semshol

[Somedude1000]

I don't think you have to worry about that. As it is, I rarely see rare drops. Removing ability mods isn't going to make a huge difference, as looking at my own list of rare abilities, I see very few duplicates above a count of 3 or 4.

 

EDIT: Going through the codex, in most cases where it'd matter its simply removing one rare drop from a list 3-5 long. Most of the common enemies are just going from 2 rare drops to a single rare fusion core drop.

 

I guess so, perhaps i was overthinking it

[Imaru]

There are NO advanced builds that require unranked ability mods. Everything is all maxed, all the time.

 

If you have a 'pro build' that requires an unranked ability mod. Please show it to me and I will offer you a suitably powerful alternative. Trinity does not count for this discussion anymore.

 

If I fail to create a better build, you will get a cookie.

-sigh- What part of "If FOR SOME REASON YOU WANT TO USE ONE OF HER MODS UNRANKED..." is so hard for you people to understand? I'm not saying it is in any way better to use an unranked ability mod. I am saying that if you em want to use one, you shouldn't need to pay platinum for it.

[(PSN)D4rk50ul-v2]

They also said in U16 power mods would be irrelevant so I theory crafted a bit.

Powers will be placed on a skill tree, the basic versions of each will be unlocked from the start. Earning levels of focus will allow you to add effects to them to tailor builds to you liking.

I assume health, shields, weapon damage, armor, multistage, and other "must have mods" will also be included in this setup so the mod slots can finally be used for making unique builds and not just having the same cards on every gun/frame.

None of that is confirmed, just seemed like something DE would do based on all the comments over the past devstreams.

Edited October 10, 2014 by (PS4)D4rk50ul-v2

[Semshol]

-sigh- What part of "If FOR SOME REASON YOU WANT TO USE ONE OF HER MODS UNRANKED..." is so hard for you people to understand? I'm not saying it is in any way better to use an unranked ability mod. I am saying that if you em want to use one, you shouldn't need to pay platinum for it.

 

It's hard to understand, because...why would you want to gimp yourself and use an unranked ability?

 

It makes no sense whatsoever.

[Imaru]

It's hard to understand, because...why would you want to gimp yourself and use an unranked ability?

 

It makes no sense whatsoever.

This isn't a matter of better vs worse. This is a matter of you may want to have a duration based skill last less time than it would when maxed. Miasma, for example, benefits from reduced duration. Have it unranked and it lasts even less time. Do your damage faster. I'm not saying it is better, I am saying you shouldn't need to buy the warframe again just to try the mods at a lower level.

[Neah]

It's hard to understand, because...why would you want to gimp yourself and use an unranked ability?

 

It makes no sense whatsoever.

Personal preference. 

 

Also, unranked "1" abilities cost 0 power to equip.

[TMHowler]

This isn't a matter of better vs worse. This is a matter of you may want to have a duration based skill last less time than it would when maxed. Miasma, for example, benefits from reduced duration. Have it unranked and it lasts even less time. Do your damage faster. I'm not saying it is better, I am saying you shouldn't need to buy the warframe again just to try the mods at a lower level.

Fleeting expertise not enough for ya?