Warframe Ability Mods: Coming Changes

[Chad_Kroeger]

What I also find pretty cool here is that when I was getting unranked frames, I wasn't able to put all his abilities on,

then after a mission or 2, I'd have to rebuild and to check if anything new can be put in, and to decide which ability to sacrifice,

so after every game, while leveling up a frame, I'd have to stall, and ppl would wait for me, or start the timer, now it goes away,

and it's a superawesome thing leveling up warframe, and, at the same time, leveling up all abilities,

not having to FUSE them after every game xD

 

Well, anyways, I have all abilities maxed, but if I didn't - I'd think of this as an awesome upgrade too. :)

[cheniek]

Hahahaha x'D

Whoa mate, who told you that it SHOULD be this way?

Just 'cuz YOU think that it should, it doesn't make it a rule...

 

I think it was an abuse, ppl abused game possibilities,

and I think ppl are free to enjoy using other abilities - that you guys find useless...

So, no one needs to tell 'em what it SHOULD be :)

 

It's your opinion. Most skills are useless. Try to do over 1h t4 surv or 100+ waves in defense missions. You will see what SHOULD be placed :)

[Ronyn]

That is your opinion. There still is no reason to limit our options because the option being limited is something you find boring.

 

More accurately-The total options you have are being changed, not limited.

 

 

This would make most sense.

 

And it wouldn't imbalance frames. It's not like weapons where those extra slots would just be used for more damage.

How can you say it wouldn't imbalance frames?

For one there are some ten mod builds that improve important stats in a way that matters. 

For two we don't even know how augments or power improvements will affect game balance.

 

 

It's funny how people arguing against the people who complain about losing slots are the ones that don't need to adapt in the new changes in any way.

So people who feel they are gaining something from a change are happy while the people who feel they are loosing something from a change are unhappy. Of course! That's as basic as human nature gets. 

 

Seriously, if DE announced that we were getting all 4 abilities and all 10 slots we would have some folks complaining about power creep and making the game easier.

[Naftal]

Well, first of all - it's not a "limitation of options", we get 2 bonus slots... :)

 

And second, I am not arguing, but it is true that I don't need to adapt to this change, it will only benefit me...

I only ever used Formas on Aura slots, and I love playing with all abilities,

not having even 1 "worthless" ability feels like a handicap for me.

 

So, without any arguing, I'm just saying I feel like I'm getting 2 bonus slots,

I am sorry for you guys cuz you feel like 1 slot is taken away from you,

we don't have same points of view, but then again just cuz you want to play that way - doesn't mean it should be that way,

and just because you feel your options are limited, doesn't mean everyone feels that way either. :)

Not everyone uses 4 ability builds. We are not getting two bonus slots, we are losing two slots.

 

We are not only losing the two slots but mod points and forma are losing their usefulness. People who spent the most time and effort will end up with extra mod points they can't use for anything. A lot of people have also bought forma to make their frame better. They didn't buy forma to own a forma. It doesn't make sense to give us the forma back because we can't use it like we could before, during the time we got it.

[Ronyn]

It's your opinion. Most skills are useless. Try to do over 1h t4 surv or 100+ waves in defense missions. You will see what SHOULD be placed :)

Most powers being useless or sub par is the real problem here that needs to be fixed.

Obviously the developers at DE who spent all the time and effort to make those powers don't want them to be left on the shelf.

They want us to use them or they wouldn't have made them. Now they have to tune/tweak those powers to a place where they are truly worth using.

[Naftal]

So people who feel they are gaining something from a change are happy while the people who feel they are loosing something from a change are unhappy. Of course! That's as basic as human nature gets.

Yes, that is obvious. What I don't get is why the people who only gain something are arguing against the people who are losing something...

[perfectStranger]

-Snip-

 

What if I Forma’d/Polarized the 2 slots being removed?

Any Forma spent on Polarizing these 2 slots will be reimbursed.

 

What if I Forma’d/Polarized the 2 Ability slots that are staying?

If you Polarized these slots, the Polarization choice will stay. If you did not Polarize these slots, they will have a default unassigned Polarity.

 

Is there any information on how they determine which ability slot they are removing?

I mean, if we forma'd some ability slot, and then we moved them how they determine which slot is going away and eventually being reimbursed with a forma?

Edited October 19, 2014 by perfectStranger

[Ronyn]

 

Yes, that is obvious. What I don't get is why the people who only gain something are arguing against the people who are losing something...

Well I can't speak for everyone. 

But I imagine for some folks.... 

It's because they are trying to support what they feel was the intended design of the system that was being lost with the one ability builds.

It's because they have balance concerns about 10 mod slots added on to 4 abilities with augments.

[(PSN)DStealth]

I just find it boring to play a game with only one ability, I'm not enjoying it at all if I only take desecrate and can't use anything else..

Now I will have all the Nekros abilities +1 more slot for optimizing without use of any formas...

 

It's not "inexperience", it's just a really boring way to play, going thrugh a mission and spamming Molecular Prime...

It's a great thing that abilities will be a "must have" now, you don't have to use them if you don't find them usefull, BUT:

Using Forma on ability slots is just an abuse, it was never meant to be that way, and I am glad DE will make it impossible now :)

Wow some of you must have a maximised rank 99 "Narrow minded" mod installed into your bodies IRL!

 

Let's just take a look at just ONE of my Warframes (and my favourite) for an example,Ash. He is a single ability modded Warframe...yet I use 3 of his abilities....how?

 

Well there's a wonderful thing implemented in Warframe for sometime called CONFIGS. Config A for me is an solo invisible melee focused infected killing assassin with high health, Max duration Smoke screen, Rage so if I get hit, I get energy yet I gain healthy due to my rejuvenation Aura and Antitoxin for those poisonous sods as he's just used for infested missions.

 

Config B turns Ash into a Bladestorm focussed killing machine who can instant kill anyone in a T3 Exterminate (and everyone bar maybe a gunner in a T4 still need to max Blind Rage to see if this still will be true). I use this config for all exterminates.

 

Config C is my high damage dealing shuriken throwing, teleporting ninja who I use for interception missions.

 

...and that's just ONE Warframe! Look at all the possibilities that could open with all of them if people just used some imagination. 

 

To the people who have said 'single ability' Warframe players 'nerf' the game...I shout POPPYCOCK! to you lol. My Ash is form'd 7 times to accommodate this build and if anyone wants to spend that amount of time (and platinum on ability boosters) in order to gain some great results, then that should be good. Becoming powerful should be hard work...and it should pay off.

 

I'm assuming that the people who are saying that we single ability warframe players shouldn't be moaning are mostly new to 'semi-long' (can't think think of a good intermediary term to use) players . I say this because don't you think that the players that started playing this game from waaay back, played this game as 'DE intended' as some of you have stated....then did everything there was to do....then had a thought like, "Let's try playing this game a different way to continue to satisfy our interest in it"

 

Remember, some of you new players will hopefully be playing this for a long time and when something happens that will limit your options in playing or makes your time put in redundant, then we'll see how silent you are.

 

As many poster have said before me, DE please remove just 1 slot and everyone wins :-)

 

 

Life lesson that some of you may want to realise....having more options is NEVER a bad thing :-)

[Naftal]

 

 

Well I can't speak for everyone. 

But I imagine for some folks.... 

It's because they are trying to support what they feel was the intended design of the system that was being lost with the one ability builds.

It's because they have balance concerns about 10 mod slots added on to 4 abilities with augments.

 

If that was the case, you'd think they would say it, instead of. "Haha, this will surely prevent 4 spammers. DEAL WITH IT!"

[Ronyn]

Wow some of you must have a maximised rank 99 "Narrow minded" mod installed into your bodies IRL!

Glass house....

 

 

I'm assuming that the people who are saying that we single ability warframe players shouldn't be moaning are mostly new to 'semi-long' (can't think think of a good intermediary term to use) players . I say this because don't you think that the players that started playing this game from waaay back, played this game as 'DE intended' as some of you have stated....then did everything there was to do....then had a thought like, "Let's try playing this game a different way to continue to satisfy our interest in it"

OR those folks may simply have a different sense of what makes the game work long term than you do.

 

Remember, some of you new players will hopefully be playing this for a long time and when something happens that will limit your options in playing or makes your time put in redundant, then we'll see how silent you are.

Total options aren't being limited, they are being changed.

 

As many poster have said before me, DE please remove just 1 slot and everyone wins :-)

 

Except for the people who use the no power builds. Are they not part of everyone?

 

 

Life lesson that some of you may want to realise....having more options is NEVER a bad thing :-)

 

That's just not always true in game design.

[Ronyn]

If that was the case, you'd think they would say it, instead of. "Haha, this will surely prevent 4 spammers. DEAL WITH IT!"

Lot's of posts in this thread. The level of quality and clarity of message varies from post to post on both sides.

[Naftal]

With these reduced mod slots, I think DE should change aura mods again to cost mod points instead of giving them. That would help keeping Forma more relevant.

[cheniek]

Most powers being useless or sub par is the real problem here that needs to be fixed.

Obviously the developers at DE who spent all the time and effort to make those powers don't want them to be left on the shelf.

They want us to use them or they wouldn't have made them. Now they have to tune/tweak those powers to a place where they are truly worth using.

 

Fully agree. I'm not complaining or crying because they want to waste my builds. All changes were good for now and i hope this will be also. I just want to think a bit about this changing to find good solution. Maybe some skills rework? Dunno. DE has smart ideas and i know that, they again won't dissapoint us.

[djuice_]

I definitely know one build that this change is going to totally ruin... the Valkyr "no power" build where you just stack defensive mods and walk around and pewpewpew, never having to press those dreadful 1-4 keys.

[DJ_Vauban]

It still amuses me how there are still players who think that all the players who use only one power use "press 4 to win" builds.

 

There surely are not any other kind of builds than this, totally impossible, no one would ever dare thinking of taking just one CC as a "Holy sh*t"  button into the game, nuh uh.  <----This was sarcasm.

[(PSN)DStealth]

Glass house....

 

 

OR those folks may simply have a different sense of what makes the game work long term than you do.

 

Total options aren't being limited, they are being changed.

 

Except for the people who use the no power builds. Are they not part of everyone?

 

 

That's just not always true in game design.

 

 

errr....so  on one hand you state "Total options aren't being limited, they are being changed." Then, when I ask for DE to remove just 1 slot you then say "Except for the people who use the no power builds. Are they not part of everyone?"  ??

 

Either you acknowledge that the options ARE being limited for some players or not which is it? If players who are using 'no ability build slots' were to lose one slot like I suggested would make them be 'limited' to 10 slots and wouldn't be fair...how does making them only have 9 slots not limit them...or is my basic math off? 

 

If DE could keep all 11 slots, Ill be happy with that, but if they HAVE to take off slots, I'd rather 1 than two.

[xenozid]

for arguments sake i went through my frames and checked which ones'd buffed/nerfd or not affected...most are unaffected (the typical 2-skill frames), a handfull buffed for gaining either a useful ability that wouldn't fit or extra mod slot(namely banshee, trinity, nyx, loki & saryn) and only 2 suffer (nekro & excal) BUT all of them have an excess of mod points averaging ~12. in conclusion most builds would have been possible with 0-1 forma instead of 3-5 which i actually spent...this huge overinvestment isn't compensated with forma alone! this brings me back to a solution which has been brought up again and again: keep all 10 mod slots! everyone thats ok with the current situation gains even more free mod space yay! and all the overinvesters keep their edge as the newer players just now start formaing their newly gained slots.

[Ronyn]

.---

 

I said "Total options aren't being limited, they are being changed"

because we currently have 10 slots that we can fit with either mods or powers.

New system will offer 8 slots for mods, 4 powers, plus the additional options from the new power augment system.

Even the people who prefer 1 or 0 power builds and are loosing some mod slots....

they still gain the powers and the augments whether they like that stuff or not.

Hence: Not simply limit, not simply an increase. There is both loss and gain. CHANGE.

 

I said "what about the people who use no abilities, are they not part of everyone"..

because you said " remove 1 slot and everyone wins".

See, it's still true that options have been changed.

But as it with all change some folks will be happy and others will not be.

[Naftal]

I said "Total options aren't being limited, they are being changed"

because we currently have 10 slots that we can fit with either mods or powers.

New system will offer 8 slots for mods, 4 powers, plus the additional options from the new power augment system.

Even the people who prefer 1 or 0 power builds and are loosing some mod slots....

they still gain the powers and the augments whether they like that stuff or not.

Hence: Not simply limit, not simply an increase. There is both loss and gain. CHANGE.

 

I said "what about the people who use no abilities, are they not part of everyone"..

because you said " remove 1 slot and everyone wins".

See, it's still true that options have been changed.

But as it with all change some folks will be happy and others will not be.

The new system will offer us 8 slots and FORCE us with 4 abilities. It is obviously limiting our choices.

[Ronyn]

The new system will offer us 8 slots and FORCE us with 4 abilities. It is obviously limiting our choices.

Is the whole gain AND loose concept getting lost in here? 

1:You loose two slots>less options.

2:You gain the augment system.>more options.

3: You are forced to have all four powers> Whether that forcing is a gain or loss in options depends on whether the person previously used the 0,1,2,3 or 4 power builds.

 

Objectively speaking-That would be classified as a change in total options.

Edited October 19, 2014 by Ronyn

[Naftal]

Is the whole gain AND loose concept getting lost in here? 

1:You loose two slots>less options.

2:You gain the augment system.>more options.

3: You are forced to have all four powers> Whether that forcing is a gain or loss in options depends on whether the person previously used the 0,1,2,3 or 4 power builds.

 

Objectively speaking-That would be classified as a change in total options.

You can classify the overall update as you please. They are still limiting our options.

 

EDIT: Also, did they say they are going to give multiple different augments to choose from for all abilities?

Edited October 19, 2014 by Naftal

[Ronyn]

You can classify the overall update as you please. They are still limiting our options.

 

EDIT: Also, did they say they are going to give multiple different augments to choose from for all abilities?

That first line is BS, but that Edit brings up a very good question.

So before I continue I have to ask: Do you want to have a real conversation or not?

[Naftal]

That first line is BS, but that Edit brings up a very good question.

So before I continue I have to ask: Do you want to have a real conversation or not?

The first line isn't BS. Even if they are giving us some new options, they are limiting other options. I'm talking about those options they are limiting.

 

Your third point is subjective, it may or may not give more options depending on the player. Your second point is speculation, you don't even know if that will give us more options.

 

Objectively speaking, we only know that we are losing options (your #1 point) and that you may or may not get more options with the ability mods.

 

EDIT: Actually, objectively speaking, the forced abilities are never more options. It is always less options, even if someone decided to not use those options right now.

Edited October 19, 2014 by Naftal

[Inez]

Would still like to know if they are just gonna lop off the two rightmost ability slots.

 

And if so, why can't they just move any forma'd polarities over into blank slots instead of giving us forma?