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Warframe Ability Mods: Coming Changes


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What a great patch...

So the player will have to find an intelligent solution to an unintelligent procedure and in most cases reform his frames.

To the guys who think this patch will bring more diversity: think again.

With very few frames all abilities synergize. The rest will still be rendered useless by the use of corrupted mods.

Aslong they dont tweak the abilities too, the veteran players still will just use one or two skills mostly.

I'm looking forward to the 27 free formas I will get... put em into the bucket with the other ones.

I hope there will be two affinity boosted weekends after the patch, that'd be decent.

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I am not liking how you are going about this. In essence I am just losing a mod slot on my Frost, given that I currently have 2 ability slots forma'd and have an off-polarity mod in a third slot on half my builds. Taking away two slots does not boost customization, it reduces it.

alot of people just use 2 mod slots in a number of builds so for the most part its no change. if you use snowglobe and avalanche for defense like a majority of frost defense builds go you lose nothing at all becuse they are taking up slots that where being used up by the 2 abilities. so really in a all of the 2 power builds people lose nothing. in a 1 power build you loose one mod slot. if you used no powers and just buffed your frame youll lose 2. taking away 2 slots only reduces the customization of someone who used no abilitys and i wouldnt say it reduces custimization if anything it can vary it up a lil more. atleast a tiny bit. 

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+10000000000000

 

The 8 slot deal is full of too many problems.  It's so much better for everybody if we get the 10 slot deal.

 

Problems? like what? The only problem is losing 1 skill builds -_-.

And to be honest thats not much of a loss compared to the gains.

Edited by Lynxh
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There will be ability mod mutations for the skills of different warframes but no universally usable skill-mods by all warframes

how would you even trigger them?

You cant bind them to 1 2 3 4 so it would need to be on another button and if you would put all ability mods into your warframe you would need alot of keys

And how is the system supposed to auto-asign the new ability mods to begin wth? I mean you can allways change keybindings later but first the skills have to be mentioned in the keybinding-option screen

 

I don't have any problem having tier 1-4 universal abilities but as mentioned here:

 

Actually having 4 seperate abilities means there is more chance of having universal powers or even different ones (though unlikely to have more than 4 simultaneously).  If you think of the way they plan to do powers as specific power mod slots (like the aura one) of their own, rather than the current set up where you can actually put powers.

So you basically are getting minor (1), meduim(2), strong(3) and ultimate(4) power slots.  However with the current system the hotkey type isnt coded so a slot (as you can put them in any of the 10 slots) but coded to a specific power for a frame (eg the second power with a default bind of the 2 key, Ironskin in the case of Rhino, Radial Blind for Excalibur, Accelerant for Ember, Speed for volt, Bounce for Vauban, Terrify for Nekros and so forth).

 

The new system will actually inherantly enable DE to add new powers much more easilly (potentially of specific ranks for balance purposes).  So for example say a new universal power comes along called Cosmic Assult thats considered a medium (2) rank power. 

In the current system there is no hotkey for Cosmic Assult in any frames setup, thus making it very hard to even use with also needing to add further code to stop you equiping powers that should be mutually exclusive, (Iron Skin and the Cosmic Assult power in the case of Rhino). 

In the new system Rhino simply swaps out his Iron Skin (because it is also a medium power) and anytime you press your second power hotkey (default key being 2) you now use Cosmic Assault. 

If you were using excalibur however you would be swaping out Radial Blind for Cosmic Assult, Volt would swap out Speed, Ember would swap out Accellerant, Vauban would swap out Bounce and so forth.  However you now only need to press the hotkey for your second power reguardless of the actual power that the farme is using.

 

Having 4 slots, one for each key is perfectly fine.

 

As for my doubts on whether or not the new direction allows such things... well, all depends on whether or not DE wishes to stand by their decision and eliminate ability mods as drops. It's nice to get mutations and such in events but honestly I don't like the idea of such things being unique and event exclusive, while distributing them without them dropping normally might...

Ah hell, I'm just tired to think I guess. Maybe some other time. :)

 

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There are so many unused mods that actually make the game more fun and rewarding to play with. We should be gaining slots for them, not losing slots we already had access to. Most of my builds will see no gain/loss as I build nearly every frame for 2 abilities, but this is such a waste of a perfect opportunity to increase diversity.

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How about trowing the sript out the air lock and simply remove abilities from the drop tables, letting us keep the 10 slots?

 

I understand DE likes to reinvent the wheel, if there is a new resource then we need to hunt it, if there is a new key, they force us to play a specific mission, if a specific enemy already gave eveything we need, DE simply introduces something to make us battle that enemy again.

 

Now, the 1 ability players will need to reforma some warframes, i have the feeling the script will remove the D polarity where i have redirection and i need forma to fix that, we will need to apply forma to be weaker than before.

Why not let us keep 10 slots, for someone who likes to reinvent the wheel this is the best course of action, new players will need extra formas (up to 4) to maximize the builds.

You don't take anything, you simply give more room and players will buy and farm forma eventually, everybody wins, even the 1 ability players will most likely forma that extra slot to become more powerfull.

 

Everybody wins, including DE

 

By having 8 slots you will:

 - anoy the 1 ability or 0 ability players (regrinding)

 - run a script that had to be worked on

 - give forma when the goal in the game seems to be to take forma from players (less polarity in weapons, weapons require forma to be built, forma to build dojo rooms)

 - you won't give motivation to players to farm or buy forma.

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There are so many unused mods that actually make the game more fun and rewarding to play with. We should be gaining slots for them, not losing slots we already had access to. Most of my builds will see no gain/loss as I build nearly every frame for 2 abilities, but this is such a waste of a perfect opportunity to increase diversity.

I totally agree. It would be cool to take fun mods along you otherwise leave behind.

And so brings the end of one trick pony builds.

Thank you DE, now ill have reason to use all my powers. :D

No need for sacrificing now

You really think so?

Nothing will change. Specialists will stay and don't forget it's those specialists that give sleepwalkers a good time in places like Sechura, ODD, ODA and survival maps.

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There is no gain with this change at all.  Players can already slot all 4 abilities if they want.  If it were worth doing so, they would.  But they don't because most of the abilities become useless very very fast.  That will never change because ability damage does not scale with enemy level and because DE does not "balance" past level 40.  Abilities that become useless are a low level game at best.  By the time you level them up, they are already surpassed by better abilities.

 

High drain mods that drive forma, and boo$$ter$, the corrupted mods, push you to using less than 4 abilities because they narrowly focus on one or two abilities.  Plus, you can do fine at low levels without corrupted mods, which is where a lot of the abilities that people do not bother with can be useful.  Corrupted mods are a high level game and a lot of the abilities that people do not bother using are a low level game at best.

 

And, another aspect to this is the issue of having to make choices and not being able to have it all, of having trade offs.  We already have to make trade offs.  We trade the effectiveness of one ability for the effectiveness of another.  All this change does is make us carry useless abilities around, whether those abilities are inherently useless or made useless by mod selection or made useless by enemy level.  Carrying a useless ability around does not translate into using it.  What is the point of an ability if you don't use it?  What is the point of a mechanism that affords you useless abilities under any circumstance?

 

This "all 4 abilities" idea is another anachronistic RPG idea that never made any sense anyway.  It was an advance for Warframe to not have imported it earlier, to have tacitly rejected it.  Importing it now is a step backward because of all the problems with it that we have listed.

 

The way to make all abilities useful is to provide them with a context in which they succeed.  Expecting everything to be useful all the time limits diversity because "all the time" is not multiple contexts, it's just one context, one mission, one faction, one tiny little game.  And, it runs counter to the idea of having trade offs.  And if you have trade offs then you have useless abilities, at least contextually.   But if you have useless abilities then you will not want to use them so you will not want to carry them so the benefit of this change is not existent.

 

The proposed change is a solution in search of a problem.  But, there will be problems caused by this change which are resolved by having 10 mod slots not 8.

 

With 10 mod slots, time and boosters spent forma-ing are not wasted and no one ends up with the extra mod points problem because fewer slots equals less drain which makes forma'ed slots useless.

 

DE, if you're going to go down this route, you may as well reduce the problems with it, not increase them.

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say the mods are arranged

1 2 3 4 5

6 7 8 9 10

and i removed ability slot 6 and put a v polarity

and say DE tries to remove the column with 1 and 6

if i swap polarity of 6 with 4 (which has no polarity) would that save me from having to forma my warframe again?

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I tried your removed 2 slots on a few of my frames and quite simply there is no combinations+ abilities that will handle missions like Palus on pluto. sorry for the new jacks who will suffer when they reach that planet.  this is a very unwise decision and this change will hurt everyone. maybe i'll try to continue using your product after this change and that's a strong maybe.

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I am not liking how you are going about this. In essence I am just losing a mod slot on my Frost, given that I currently have 2 ability slots forma'd and have an off-polarity mod in a third slot on half my builds. Taking away two slots does not boost customization, it reduces it.

Totally agree, removing those two slots kind of negates the whole point of this change. Two extra slots doesn't give enough options. Some builds only use two out of their 4 abilities in essence they just lose slots  and thats a straight up nerf. They should really just give us the 4 extra slots from removing the abilities instead of the two.

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Personally, instead of bickering about what could happen, post your builds to see how it actually works.  I bet most of you will have 2 wasted forma if you have invested at least 2-3.  These now-wasted forma will not be refunded and you will be stuck using mods with the matching polarity, limiting your future build even more.  Trust me, veteran players are screwed by this update, especially if DE is releasing additional high-ranking mods because the polarities may not match the 5-7 polarized slots you will have in your build.

 

Try this:  1) Post your current build.  2) Remove two ability slots and the corresponding ability mods.  3) Make the remaining 2 ability slots neutral or have them keep the current non-ability polarity(ies).  4) Post this new build that uses only 8 slots.

 

Let's see exactly how this change works instead of guessing.

 

For reference, here are my results... Current build using 8-slot method = http://goo.gl/Ft0kJ4 and the same mods in an updated 8-slot build = http://goo.gl/cNC60n .  As you can see I have gone from needing a 3-forma build to a 1-forma build (aura slot).  Unfortunately I will not be refunded any forma and will be left with 13 unused mod points.  DE wasted both my time and forma if this change proceeds as is, and this is only 1 of my frames (I have 10+).  Truth is... if you have 2-3 forma invested, 1-2 of those will be wasted but not refunded.  DE is literally screwing us.

Edited by (PS4)Hiero_Glyph
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Finally! God no idea how long I've been waiting for the abilities to be innate and not actual mods <3 Thank you DE! 

 

This is an amazing change (one I kinda thought would never happen, but I was hoping one day it would!) Ohhhh! man can't want to see what new builds people could use now with slots not burdened with the issue of having to either host a ability or regular mod.

 

But on a more serious note....

 

It REALLY sucks we lose 2 slots (probably cause of balancing purposes) I do agree though that losing the two kinda does hinder us. I personally use a build where my frost has 8 regular mods and 2 abilities sloted, now get rid of those two ability mods and what do I get...nothing I'll still have the same build seeing as we won't be getting those 2 slots were losing out on more possibilities at modding.

 

So if anything the only flaw I see with this change is the fact we lose 2 slots, and honestly for the people who don't use abilities and go for using all 10 slots to put in mods other then abilities (people probably do it since it is possible within the system just takes time and forma), your hurting those people even more with that change.

 

So if anything please reconsider this one aspect of the change.

Edited by Bestfly
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I have taken a screenshot of every warframe i posess - which is all of them - including the excaliber prime. Most of my warframes have from 1 to 6 forma on them - removing either none to 3 ability slots. As I stated before, some abilities are multually exclusive of each other desecrate - shadows of the dead. Desecrate is range and not duration, shadows of the dead i duration and strength in order to have 17 shadows lasting for 63 seconds. In the current build - this won't happen with the new build. Also, I mentioned before that tey should provide something like www.warframe-builder.com in order for us to look at the changes they are proposing. As annoying the hell out of the vetran players is not the way to go as they normally provide guidance for the lower mastery and a taxi service for them to get stuff they will not be able to get for a while.

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