Is It Just Me, Or Has Directional Melee Made Excalibur's Super Jump Completely Redundant?

[And_Now_I_Dance]

Super Jump has always been kind of an odd duck, and generally considered pretty meh for an ability, but now even its mobility niche has been taken away from it.  Directional melee is better in almost all circumstances, and it's something that all frames have access to.  Don't get me wrong, I love the mechanic, I just think that Super Jump needs to be replaced now.  It serves almost zero purpose, which I think puts Excalibur at a pretty significant disadvantage compared to other frames.

 

I feel like with the improvements DE has made to it, they want to make it some sort of survivability tool, but its upgrades were not very substantial, and frankly, odd.  The stun to enemies directly around you would be nice, if not for the extremely tiny radius and the fact you're floating through the air and invisible while they're stunned.  The invisibility just feels strange, and doesn't really accomplish a whole lot.  The duration is extremely short, and while you can combine it with a slash dash in mid air to extend the duration and make a quick getaway, this is still an EXTREMELY weak stealth mechanic when compared to other frames that have similar abilities.  Plus, he already has one of the best emergency panic buttons in the game in Radial Blind.

 

I think, if you want to give Excalibur another survivability tool, you shouldn't try and shoehorn it into Super Jump.  Give him something new!  Some ideas off the top of my head.

 

Radial Shield: Summon an ethereal skana blade that orbits around Excalibur, with another blade added at each rank.  The blades deal damage to nearbye enemies, and will deflect bullets.  Not as foolproof as Zephyr's wind shield because the blades must focus on whatever they're deflecting, and can be overwhelmed by multiple enemies. 

 

Overcharge: Excalibur explodes with a burst of energy (Think the scene from the intro where Lotus overcharged your frame to combat the effects of the Askaris).  All nearbye enemies are blown backward, and Excalibur's next ability is empowered (Increased range, duration, and power).  Although really, the options for this bonus effect are limitless.  He could take reduced damage for a short duration.  Doesn't consume stamina for a set duration.  It could stealth him! (In loving memory of super jump)

 

Radial Impact: The closest thing to the old Super Jump.  Excalibur leaps into the air, becoming immune to damage and drawing the fire of all nearbye enemies.  As Excalibur comes crashing back down to earth, he releases an AoE shockwave that will either briefly stun or ragdoll enemies, based on how much damage he absorbed.  In the worst case scenario it accomplishes just as much as the current Super Jump, but in most cases should provide some valuable team utility.

 

Of course, I may just be missing the value of the current Super Jump.  If I am, I would love to hear other peoples opinions and how they're maximizing its use.

Edited October 31, 2014 by And_Now_I_Dance

[SquirmyBurrito]

Can't they be stacked?

[HollowExistence]

they can but it is still useless

[SquirmyBurrito]

they can but it is still useless

 

Do you remain invisible when combing the two? Or does it end as soon as you melee?

[GreyEnneract]

Yes it made it useless.

Excalibur changes are on the way anyway.

[Rekkou]

You can go up with directional melee?

[And_Now_I_Dance]

You can go up with directional melee?

 

You can!  It reaches almost the exact same height Super Jump does.

[Rekkou]

You can!  It reaches almost the exact same height Super Jump does.

 

First time i knew this, gonna try it

[Photon95]

First off, don't touch my super jump! Secondly, there are a few things to consider with jump vs aerial. Jump doesn't require you to aim, and won't interrupt reloads, as a result, jump becomes a surprisingly useful "oh $#!+" button in fire fights. Aerial attacks do allow more controlled movement, and can close gaps easier than super jump. And lets not forget the invisibility effect of jump. Why not try jumping and using the stealth multiplier you just got on an attack from above? ;)

[EchoesOfRain]

You can go up with directional melee?

 

yup, can reach areas like the ledges in ODD with this

[And_Now_I_Dance]

First off, don't touch my super jump! Secondly, there are a few things to consider with jump vs aerial. Jump doesn't require you to aim, and won't interrupt reloads, as a result, jump becomes a surprisingly useful "oh $#!+" button in fire fights. Aerial attacks do allow more controlled movement, and can close gaps easier than super jump. And lets not forget the invisibility effect of jump. Why not try jumping and using the stealth multiplier you just got on an attack from above? ;)

 

Problem is, as an "Oh S#&$!" button it's woefully underpowered compared to almost every other ability in the game, even Excalibur's own.  He already has a much better "Oh S#&$!" button in Radial Blind that also provides extremely powerful team support.  As a stealth enabler it's awkward to use and limited in application, and looks silly to boot.

 

I will be the first to admit I don't have any experience in using it as an option for safely reloading.  I tend to play Excalibur as a melee exclusive frame.  If this aspect of the skill is powerful enough that the community wouldn't want it changed I would fully admit to being mistaken.

[DiabolusUrsus]

Problem is, as an "Oh S#&$!" button it's woefully underpowered compared to almost every other ability in the game, even Excalibur's own.  He already has a much better "Oh S#&$!" button in Radial Blind that also provides extremely powerful team support.  As a stealth enabler it's awkward to use and limited in application, and looks silly to boot.

 

I will be the first to admit I don't have any experience in using it as an option for safely reloading.  I tend to play Excalibur as a melee exclusive frame.  If this aspect of the skill is powerful enough that the community wouldn't want it changed I would fully admit to being mistaken.

It's a 10-energy skill, give it a break. Let's look at Super Jump in a little more depth:

1. It's the cheapest skill in the game to cast, even more so if you're using max efficiency.

2. It affords quick movement, a short stun, and invisibility. This makes it, in my opinion, the absolute best engagement-breaking skill available at the moment. It stops target locks like Ash's Smokescreen, and moves you away from incoming AOE projectiles.

3. It makes an excellent combination with Radial Blind. Blind was changed so that it requires line of sight on the enemy to work. One really easy way to get line of sight is to place yourself at a higher vantage point. Super Jump gives you an on-demand vantage point. 

 

The only gripe I have with Super Jump now is that it can't be cast mid-air. 

[SquirmyBurrito]

1. It's the cheapest skill in the game to cast, even more so if you're using max efficiency.

 

Paralysis is actually cheaper than Super Jump.

[Hayzemet]

My favorite frame is excalibur, Superjump is  quite good and fun, but it is up, its a fact, and the invicibility mechanic is plain dumb, why on earth would excalibur only activate his invicibility while jumping, i mean really? it was a bad choice, bad bad, bad choice, if you want to escape a fight, you dont, cause you have radial blind.

 

My saying is that they should stop being so stubborn with the whole " we wont change nothing, we better add some more features, but superjump stays" i mean it gives 0 personality to the frame, and it now serves little purpose, excalibur has huge potential, all of the frames do, but the devs have this paradigm, i know its tru. They have made the same mistakes over and over again like why on earth does the trinity agument gives chance to drop energy, I mean energy vampire is there i have infinite energy. They really should get out of the walls and go nuts with abilities, more utility more impact idk . im mad.

Edited October 31, 2014 by Hayzemet

[And_Now_I_Dance]

It's a 10-energy skill, give it a break. Let's look at Super Jump in a little more depth:

1. It's the cheapest skill in the game to cast, even more so if you're using max efficiency.

2. It affords quick movement, a short stun, and invisibility. This makes it, in my opinion, the absolute best engagement-breaking skill available at the moment. It stops target locks like Ash's Smokescreen, and moves you away from incoming AOE projectiles.

3. It makes an excellent combination with Radial Blind. Blind was changed so that it requires line of sight on the enemy to work. One really easy way to get line of sight is to place yourself at a higher vantage point. Super Jump gives you an on-demand vantage point. 

 

The only gripe I have with Super Jump now is that it can't be cast mid-air. 

 

I really can't agree with it being the best engagement breaker.  It's awkward to use and situational.  You're still susceptible to crossfire throughout the duration, and the ability doesn't really move you that far.  Using it in conjunction with Slash Dash can cover some ground, but at this point the energy difference between it and Radial Blind is minimal, and Radial Blind is a MUCH more powerful choice for an engagement breaker.

[MichaelSD]

they can but it is still useless

 

+1, it is still a gimmicky power of minimal use.

[Archangelzz]

Super Jump has always been kind of an odd duck, and generally considered pretty meh for an ability, but now even its mobility niche has been taken away from it.  Directional melee is better in almost all circumstances, and it's something that all frames have access to.  Don't get me wrong, I love the mechanic, I just think that Super Jump needs to be replaced now.  It serves almost zero purpose, which I think puts Excalibur at a pretty significant disadvantage compared to other frames.

 

I feel like with the improvements DE has made to it, they want to make it some sort of survivability tool, but its upgrades were not very substantial, and frankly, odd.  The stun to enemies directly around you would be nice, if not for the extremely tiny radius and the fact you're floating through the air and invisible while they're stunned.  The invisibility just feels strange, and doesn't really accomplish a whole lot.  The duration is extremely short, and while you can combine it with a slash dash in mid air to extend the duration and make a quick getaway, this is still an EXTREMELY weak stealth mechanic when compared to other frames that have similar abilities.  Plus, he already has one of the best emergency panic buttons in the game in Radial Blind.

 

I think, if you want to give Excalibur another survivability tool, you shouldn't try and shoehorn it into Super Jump.  Give him something new!  Some ideas off the top of my head.

 

Radial Shield: Summon an ethereal skana blade that orbits around Excalibur, with another blade added at each rank.  The blades deal damage to nearbye enemies, and will deflect bullets.  Not as foolproof as Zephyr's wind shield because the blades must focus on whatever they're deflecting, and can be overwhelmed by multiple enemies. 

 

Overcharge: Excalibur explodes with a burst of energy (Think the scene from the intro where Lotus overcharged your frame to combat the effects of the Askaris).  All nearbye enemies are blown backward, and Excalibur's next ability is empowered (Increased range, duration, and power).  Although really, the options for this bonus effect are limitless.  He could take reduced damage for a short duration.  Doesn't consume stamina for a set duration.  It could stealth him! (In loving memory of super jump)

 

Radial Impact: The closest thing to the old Super Jump.  Excalibur leaps into the air, becoming immune to damage and drawing the fire of all nearbye enemies.  As Excalibur comes crashing back down to earth, he releases an AoE shockwave that will either briefly stun or ragdoll enemies, based on how much damage he absorbed.  In the worst case scenario it accomplishes just as much as the current Super Jump, but in most cases should provide some valuable team utility.

 

Of course, I may just be missing the value of the current Super Jump.  If I am, I would love to hear other peoples opinions and how they're maximizing its use.

Your radial impact idea is in fact already doable in game simply by using super jump combined with the heavy impact mod which can only really be used with super jump. Also if I am being honest there are numerous uses for super jump you just have to be smart enough to figure em out. Take it from a veteran who has been playing Excalibur since day one of closed beta and has beaten and or unlocked the entire galaxy map using only Excalibur. I have been using Excalibur and its abilities since this game started so I think I know a little bit about how to use him and his abilities. While your ideas are interesting they would be much better suited for swappable/interchangeable powers.

Edited November 1, 2014 by Archangelzz

[SIDESTRE4M]

You can!  It reaches almost the exact same height Super Jump does.

 

It does not, unless you don't equip mods for strength.

[Azawarau]

For travel almost

 

Luckily super jump is only 10 energy so its not as bad as the other travel powers

 

Super jump s surprisingly useful for actual combat though as a panic or repositioning tool

[Gelkor]

It does not, unless you don't equip mods for strength.

 

At a certain point with max strength mods SJ almost becomes so potent it's unwieldy tbh.  Still awesome tho.

[shut]

ITT: People who haven't used super jump and directional melee in succession.

 

Directional melee "replaces" Super Jump in the same way that it "replaces" coptering-- i.e. it doesn't. You're only at a disadvantage if you refuse to use them together.

 

 

Sincerely,

 

 

 

- a satisfied Excalibur main who can outmaneuver his teammates just as easily as prior to the update. (Seriously. Super Jump's biggest buff in this update was the introduction of directional melee.)

Edited November 1, 2014 by SortaRandom

[Azawarau]

ITT: People who haven't used super jump and directional melee in succession.

 

Directional melee "replaces" Super Jump in the same way that it "replaces" coptering-- i.e. it doesn't. You're only at a disadvantage if you refuse to use them together.

 

 

Sincerely,

 

 

 

- a satisfied Excalibur main who can outmaneuver his teammates just as easily as prior to the update. (Seriously. Super Jump's biggest buff in this update was the introduction of directional melee.)

Theres near no area ive wanted to get to fast that air attacks couldnt get me to but super jump could

 

Its not useful for mobility

[shut]

Theres near no area ive wanted to get to fast that air attacks couldnt get me to but super jump could

 

Its not useful for mobility

 

You're only at a disadvantage if you refuse to use them together.

 

 

Obviously there aren't many spots where only Super Jump is helpful but Air Slashes aren't, because they give roughly the same height at base and the latter is noticeably faster. But there are numerous spots littered across every tileset that can only be accessed by using both (meaning that only frames like Nova, Zephyr, Valkyr, and now Excal can access them with extreme ease). Even if you can't find any of them, that doesn't make SJ objectively "useless for mobility"; you only know for sure that it fits that description for you.

 

I'm running a pure-melee Excal (where mobility is an absolute must if you want to be effective in a team) using a non-coptering weapon. Super Jump and Air Slashes are the bread and butter of my gameplay.

Edited November 1, 2014 by SortaRandom

[Azawarau]

Obviously there aren't many spots where only Super Jump is helpful but Air Slashes aren't, because they give roughly the same height at base and the latter is noticeably faster. But there are numerous spots littered across every tileset that can only be accessed by using both (meaning that only frames like Nova, Zephyr, Valkyr, and now Excal can access them with extreme ease). Even if you can't find any of them, that doesn't make SJ objectively "useless for mobility"; you only know for sure that it fits that description for you.

 

I'm running a pure-melee Excal (where mobility is an absolute must if you want to be effective in a team) using a non-coptering weapon. Super Jump and Air Slashes are the bread and butter of my gameplay.

Youre using subjectivity and broad examples for your argument and acting like im the one doing the same

 

Ill give you an example then

 

 

This is with max blind rage,fleeting, and intensify and its not much higher and not limiting your movement afterwards

 

And this is being forgiving considering aerial attacks can go diagonally and arent nearly as limited in use (ceilings will get in your way)

 

Now unless you have something to show for super jump having regular use as far as mobility is concerned VS air attacks id suggest you sit down and kindly replace your pacifier in your mouth

[shut]

-snip-

 

Dude. I'm not saying that Super Jump is "better than / just as good as Air Slashes" or anything of the sort. Hell, I said the exact opposite in the first line of my post that you just quoted.

Read my posts more closely, please. You're missing my point entirely.

Edited November 2, 2014 by SortaRandom