"savage Silence" And Silence Don't Work Together... But Wait; No One Cares.

[Aktriaz]

I play a Banshee with a Silence+Melee build, so when I first saw it I got pretty exited...

 

Until I realized how useless it actually is.

 

First off, who actually uses Melee finishers? Probably the warframes who can turn invisible or "parry" on command (Ash's teleport or Valkyr's paralysis).

 

The issue with Banshee, is that Silence stuns enemies, preventing them from being parried.

 

>Activate Silence

>Run up to baddies
>Wait for their headache to pass over

>Hold Channel+Block and hope for parry

>They shoot at your sentinel instead

>*cry and give up on life*

 

Oh, did I forget to mention that? Silence makes half of the enemies decide that your pacifist Sentinel is a bigger threat, even if it's not active. Just cast it once, and people will start attacking your sentinel for the rest of the game.

 

Posted in bugs twice. Unseen both times (to my knowledge).

 

Back to my main point;

Silence and Savage Silence don't work together at all. The vanilla ability prevents the augment from being used immediately, forcing you to wait for the initial stun to pass over.

 

Here's what I would suggest to fix the core problem;

 

-Make the Stun from Silence prompt a finisher. You could make this an effect of Savage Silence or the vanilla ability. Either way, this is the only way I could see that mechanic being used effectively.

 

And some other additions to overall improve Silence's performance;

 

-Fix the "Sentinel being attacked" bug.

 

-Make Silence's stun duration effected by power strength mods.

 

==========================

Ah, hell. Why do I even bother...

No one plays Banshee, anyways.

 

This'll be another one of my Banshee topics that'll get one or two comments and the die horribly because only 13 people in the entire warframe community actually play and care about Banshee.

 

It's absurd that the most played warframes get the most love and attention.

If a warframe is underused, then shouldn't it be buffed/fixed/changed?

[S.T.M.P.D]

Oberon. Excalibur. Nekros.

 

All will be buffed in time.

[meIody-]

Oberon. Excalibur. Nekros.

 

All will be buffed in time.

Oberon already got buffed.

[(PSN)Crackle2012]

I will try to make sure this gets seen, Banshee is probably my most overall used frame besides Ash and Saryn.. who are tied.  I was not aware of these issues, but I did always think that while Silenced, anyone should be able to "stealth kill" during the "stun" animation.   I do think you can stealth kill  if you are undetected before casting silence, but this definitely leaves much to be desired for it in defense and survival missions.  I can see how the mutator would be completely and utterly useless in Survival/Defense/Interception etc...   where you don't have a chance to actually stealth.  Thank you for reporting this!!!!

Edited November 1, 2014 by (PS4)Crackle2012
Edited Typos etc..

[CelsiusPrime]

I totally agree. sometimes it surprises me  how some things get looked over like that, then I realize how big warframe actually is.

[Aktriaz]

I will try to make sure this gets seen, Banshee is probably my most overall used frame besides Ash and Saryn.. who are tied.  I was not aware of these issues, but I did always think that while Silenced, anyone should be able to "stealth kill" during the "stun" animation.   I do think you can stealth kill  if you are undetected before casting silence, but this definitely leaves much to be desired for it in defense and survival missions.  I can see how the mutator would be completely and utterly useless in Survival/Defense/Interception etc...   where you don't have a chance to actually stealth.  Thank you for reporting this!!!!

[Adaptor-Face]

knock them down with groundslam?

[VentiGlondi]

Hey, I play Banshee. I mainly focus on spamming Sonic Boom though. It's lots of fun for entire family, except for those who want to melee.

 

I gotta say, if Savage Silence turned the stun into a parry, that would be great.

It could also prolong the cc, just as Valkyr's mod does.

[Archistopheles]

who actually uses Melee finishers?

Anytime an enemy is knocked down and you attack them, that's a melee finisher. So, if you use your Savage silence, then knock them down with your melee weapon or Sonic Boom, you might have a better result.

[Noble_Cactus]

Good catch. I haven't been playing enough to get past R2 with Suda, so I can't test it. Figured it was useless right away by the description because Silence itself isn't really conducive to finishers. I like the suggestion of Being able to activate an execution on stunned enemies, though. This would make the ability useful in stealth - as well as endless - missions.

 

In that case, Savage Silence should increase the finisher damage of everyone in the squad.

[TwiceDead]

Oberon. Excalibur. Nekros.

 

All will be buffed in time.

Oberon is fine. 

[Azamagon]

Yeah, I had a feeling that augment was gonna have its issues. Not surprised

Oberon is fine. 

Nope, he is not. He kinda... works, but he is far from fine:

 

* Smite is decent

* Hallowed Ground's armor bonus is absolutely useless for anyone but Valkyr

* Renewal is wonky as heck with using orbs, but also be a toggle and stopping for everyone when someone get full health / stops for an individual when he/she gets hurt etc etc. Renewal is simply broken.

* Reckoning is decent too, but it still has the stupid requirement to KILL with it to get the orbs (should just debuff them so a kill X seconds after being lifted by Reckoning has a chance to spawn the orb) and the requirement to NOT KILL to get the miniscule blinding effect.

[Noble_Cactus]

Yeah, I had a feeling that augment was gonna have its issues. Not surprised

Nope, he is not. He kinda... works, but he is far from fine:

 

* Smite is decent

* Hallowed Ground's armor bonus is absolutely useless for anyone but Valkyr

* Renewal is wonky as heck with using orbs, but also be a toggle and stopping for everyone when someone get full health / stops for an individual when he/she gets hurt etc etc. Renewal is simply broken.

* Reckoning is decent too, but it still has the stupid requirement to KILL with it to get the orbs (should just debuff them so a kill X seconds after being lifted by Reckoning has a chance to spawn the orb) and the requirement to NOT KILL to get the miniscule blinding effect.

 

Off topic: Renewal is a strange case. There's no reason for it to be a toggled ability because it has three different parts: The initial heal, the HoT, and the travel time of the orbs themselves. Heck, I'm still not completely sure how it works. Does turning Renewal off during the orb part make the orbs disappear? If not, do they still do the initial heal? Very strange. I say remove the toggle and let it function as-is; it's already inferior to Blessing in almost every way. The status effect removal and bleedout reduction components are also wonky, because you have to wait for the full HoT to finish for the former and the latter doesn't even seem to work. Renewal should 'purge' the status effect as it's active, meaning that it makes the status timer count down much quicker without actually making slasj/fire/toxin DoTs do more damage in that amount of time.

 

Hallowed Ground should spawn in a circle around Oberon and provide a slow HoT, along with a general damage reduction instead of an armor buff. I understand the armor buff was meant for Oberon to take advantage of his new armor stat, but it's useless for any frame in the lower armor brackets. Which happens to be the majority of the cast. As a bonus, maybe slow enemies that enter the field.

 

Dunno what to do about Reckoning since it's a hodgepodge of like three different abilities now. It works, but it's still not interesting.

Edited November 2, 2014 by Noble_Cactus

[TwiceDead]

Yeah, I had a feeling that augment was gonna have its issues. Not surprised

Nope, he is not. He kinda... works, but he is far from fine:

 

* Smite is decent

* Hallowed Ground's armor bonus is absolutely useless for anyone but Valkyr

* Renewal is wonky as heck with using orbs, but also be a toggle and stopping for everyone when someone get full health / stops for an individual when he/she gets hurt etc etc. Renewal is simply broken.

* Reckoning is decent too, but it still has the stupid requirement to KILL with it to get the orbs (should just debuff them so a kill X seconds after being lifted by Reckoning has a chance to spawn the orb) and the requirement to NOT KILL to get the miniscule blinding effect.

Personally I don't use hallowed ground for the armor buff, it's just a bonus. The proc purging is the reason I use it. 

Renewal works as it should, at least all the times I've used it. It's not a toggle-ability though, you activate it once, it lasts for a while, and then you can cast it again sometime later. I can't deactivate it once I've cast it so I don't think it's toggle-able... Doesn't make sense. It's strange. 

Reckoning is fine. I agree on the requirement to kill your opponents to get health orbs though, that seems... Strange. 

 

I don't see any problems with Oberon at the moment, he is just average. Nothing spectacular, but can still contribute quite efficiently through the use of his abilities. 

 

I realize I've gone very much off-topic... My bad. 

Edited November 2, 2014 by TwiceDead

[Aktriaz]

I think that's enough Oberon for today...

[Monolake]

So another useless augmentation ... might make a list for DE to fix

[Almalos]

There are a lot of useless augmentations. I just recently got into banshee and she is actually pretty enjoyable. I was excited there was an augmentation for it but when I saw it I felt like it was a horrible idea. It seems like I'm right.

My suggestion would be to have a stealth damage thing going on for it, the savage silence would allow silence to be truly savage in this way. It's kind of like a radial blind that follows you but the enemy sees you. it would be more worth it in my opinion but it may be overkill.

[TaylorsContraction]

PUTTING THIS IN BIG LETTERS FOR OP:

AS WAS STATED ALREADY, YOU CAN KNOCK FOES DOWN WITH SONIC BOOM, THEN PROCEED TO EXECUTE YOUR FINISHER.

 

TL:DR IT WORKS JUST FINE, OP JUST DOESN'T WANT TO USE HER FULL KIT FOR SOME REASON

[Dogoframe]

IF THE MOD WORKS WELL WITH SONIC BOOM WHY THE KUBROW WOULD YOU GIVE IT TO SILENCE INSTEAD?

[Aktriaz]

PUTTING THIS IN BIG LETTERS FOR OP:

AS WAS STATED ALREADY, YOU CAN KNOCK FOES DOWN WITH SONIC BOOM, THEN PROCEED TO EXECUTE YOUR FINISHER.

 

TL:DR IT WORKS JUST FINE, OP JUST DOESN'T WANT TO USE HER FULL KIT FOR SOME REASON

Yeah, sure, it "works", but why waste all that time casting Silence, running up to people and casting Sonic Boom, then chase them down again JUST to get a use out of this mod I spent several months farming Cephalon Suda for?

 

Just freaking melee spam and they'll die faster.

 

DO YOU GET IT? I PUT ALL CAPS SO YOU LOOK AT IT.

[Paradoxbomb]

Meh, while it would be nice if Savage Silence allowed you to perform melee finishers on enemies that are stunned, I still question how useful it'd actually be. During stealth you can just perform a stealth attack which tends to OHKO most enemies in a similar manner anyway, and in active combat you'll probably only have time to do a finisher on a handful of enemies given the stun time only lasts so long and those finisher animations take a second or two to perform.

 

Personally I think Silence is fine as is and that the augment is just flat out mediocre, and I would've simply preferred an augment to one of Banshee's other skills (like an augment to Sonic Boom that suspends them in the air for a second or two or something like that).

[Aktriaz]

Meh, while it would be nice if Savage Silence allowed you to perform melee finishers on enemies that are stunned, I still question how useful it'd actually be. During stealth you can just perform a stealth attack which tends to OHKO most enemies in a similar manner anyway, and in active combat you'll probably only have time to do a finisher on a handful of enemies given the stun time only lasts so long and those finisher animations take a second or two to perform.

 

Personally I think Silence is fine as is and that the augment is just flat out mediocre, and I would've simply preferred an augment to one of Banshee's other skills (like an augment to Sonic Boom that suspends them in the air for a second or two or something like that).

Finishers are capable of doing some pretty decent damage, so the way I see it is that Silence could be used to prioritize a beefier enemy while stunning others during the animation.

 

I also did suggest Silence's stun duration be affected by power strength to go along with this.

 

The issue is, Banshee's other abilities are pretty solid as they are. Silence is rather mediocre at, well... everything. Some more love for this ability is much needed.

[Noble_Cactus]

Silence is actually pretty decent at what it does. Very versatile ability that allows you to escape certain situations unharmed or grants you the initiative when you enter the room/when new enemies enter the room. I'd actually liked to have seen an augment for Sound Quake, since that is her most boring ability imo. I also loathe how the toggle has made Banshee into a "Sound Quake in one place for half an hour" frame on Defense and Excavation missions, but I suppose that's a topic for another thread.

Edited November 2, 2014 by Noble_Cactus

[Aktriaz]

Silence is actually pretty decent at what it does. Very versatile ability that allows you to escape certain situations unharmed or grants you the initiative when you enter the room/when new enemies enter the room. I'd actually liked to have seen an augment for Sound Quake, since that is her most boring ability imo. I also loathe how the toggle has made Banshee into a "Sound Quake in one place for half an hour" frame on Defense and Excavation missions, but I suppose that's a topic for another thread.

Yes, Silence is decent, but there are other abilities that can accomplish the same goal with less cost and/or risk. Hell, it's my most used ability on Banshee, with my entire build around it.

 

The problem with Sound Quake is it's rotten at it's core. No augment could make it any more fresh; it's a grade-A panic button, and it will always be.

Silence, however, has a lot of room for change and improvement, so that's why I made this thread.