High Mastery Gear

[BlutAdler]

Locking thing behind mastery rank doesn't breed elitism.. Elitist people breed elitism. People who would rather have the same things you have when they start the game regardless of how long it took you to acquire it for the hours you put into the game.. breeds elitism. 

 

I REALLY wish people would stop using that as a reason to talk down the option of giving this goddamn game a gauge of difficulty and a tenorship system. 

 

You should NOT have access to some of the best weapons when you just start the game. I'm sorry.. you shouldn't. I already dislike the fact that you can buy your way to endgame. It literally waters down the experience. And it's fueled by a bunch of insta-gratifying whiners who want everything that everyone has.

 

And no, I'm not MR18 however I put in hundreds of hours and went through a bunch of bad AND good weapons. I put a lot of time into leveling and working through nodes to get a higher mastery rank and I feel.. yes that I should have nice things and you shouldn't have the same as soon as you enter the game. 

 

Call me entitled, a brat whatever you want. It's satisfying to be rewarded for effort and time you put into something and not see it tossed aside when a new weapon/feature comes out in Warframe. It's completely RIDICULOUS that a player within a week can pay 5 dollars and get their hands on one of, if not the best, secondary in the game. 

[Chub_N_Tuck]

Locking thing behind mastery rank doesn't breed elitism.. Elitist people breed elitism. People who would rather have the same things you have when they start the game regardless of how long it took you to acquire it for the hours you put into the game.. breeds elitism.

I REALLY wish people would stop using that as a reason to talk down the option of giving this goddamn game a gauge of difficulty and a tenorship system.

You should NOT have access to some of the best weapons when you just start the game. I'm sorry.. you shouldn't. I already dislike the fact that you can buy your way to endgame. It literally waters down the experience. And it's fueled by a bunch of insta-gratifying whiners who want everything that everyone has.

Call me entitled, a brat whatever you want. It's satisfying to be rewarded for effort and time you put into something and not see it tossed aside when a new weapon/feature comes out in Warframe. It's completely RIDICULOUS that a player within a week can pay 5 dollars and get their hands on one of, if not the best, secondary in the game.

I couldn't agree more with everything you said here man! It is pretty damn ridiculous how people can access those prime gears as long as they have plat or friends helping. Call me whatever you want but people really should NOT have access to all those gears early.

I am Korean myself and I have been to Warframe forums in Korean websites. They start the game and in 2 weeks they obtained boltor prime, rhino prime and got bored using other weapons. This is so wrong...

Edited December 27, 2014 by Chuck_NoMiss

[BlutAdler]

I couldn't agree more with everything you said here man! It is pretty damn ridiculous how people can access those prime gears as long as they have plat or friends helping. Call me whatever you want but people really should NOT have access to all those gears early.

I am Korean myself and I have been to Warframe forums in Korean websites. They start the game and in 2 weeks they obtained boltor prime, rhino prime and got bored using other weapons. This is so wrong...

 

I am glad I am not the only one and I wish more and more people would come out and speak their mind about this. 

 

Like yo, I'm all for rewarding all types of players in the game but there needs to be a defined system of hierarchy in the game.. Otherwise what is the point? How many people do you see during the week doing any given node on any giving planet?

 

Everyone on is either farming rep/exp at high level interception nodes.. Dark sectors.. or boss nodes for x resource and then voids.. what happens to the rest of the nodes???

 

There are a LOT of nodes! All these weapons on the market that you can build? They could easily implement them into each node as an incentive to play the game out.. get higher mastery rank! SOMETHING. There's so much opportunity to layout player hierarchy..

[DSpite]

You know what I would say if a person that just joined my Borderlands 2 Level 50 game and told me "Hey man, I just hacked a level 50 character and some level 50 guns to try the game, that ok?".

 

I'd say "Sure. Lets go shoot stuff".

 

 

But not you guys. You guys would say "Ewww! You did not grind for weeks through the entire game three times to get all that? Well, you can't play in MY game!".

 

Shameful.

 

If you think so little of other people trying to have some fun in a game with ZERO consequences, you should seriously reconsider your lives.

 

The guns in this game all have to be Forma'd multiple times to unlock full potential anyway, and if your excuse is "it's too easy to level them!" well, then EVERYTHING must be easy to level, and you have destroyed your argument that MR means anything, because it's just based on leveling up a lot of things.

[Chub_N_Tuck]

You know what I would say if a person that just joined my Borderlands 2 Level 50 game and told me "Hey man, I just hacked a level 50 character and some level 50 guns to try the game, that ok?".

I'd say "Sure. Lets go shoot stuff".

But not you guys. You guys would say "Ewww! You did not grind for weeks through the entire game three times to get all that? Well, you can't play in MY game!".

Shameful.

If you think so little of other people trying to have some fun in a game with ZERO consequences, you should seriously reconsider your lives.

The guns in this game all have to be Forma'd multiple times to unlock full potential anyway, and if your excuse is "it's too easy to level them!" well, then EVERYTHING must be easy to level, and you have destroyed your argument that MR means anything, because it's just based on leveling up a lot of things.

... Nothing is mentioned about actually playing with them in game, if your comment is directed towards mine and BlutAdler's. We actually are playing with them no problem, given the circumstances and I do not have such a narrow mind.

-1 to you sir. You missed the point of the posts. It's not about discriminating people who get them early. Game's set up that way right now, it's not their fault. It's about the game's mastery rank rewards as a whole.

I understand people want quick ways to get good things but I don't agree that it should be done that way. But look, playing with the players who got those gears early and thinking that they shouldn't have such an early access to those gears are two different things.

I just want change in how prime gears are accessed, and if it's a hard call, whatever. I merely thought of a better way to get things right with mastery rank rewards. For the better of the game I love.

Edited December 28, 2014 by Chuck_NoMiss

[BlutAdler]

... Nothing is mentioned about actually playing with them in game, if your comment is directed towards mine and BlutAdler's. We actually are plying with them no problem, given the circumstances and I do not have such a narrow mind.

-1 to you sir. You missed the point of the posts. It's not about discriminating people who get them early. Game's set up that way right now, it's not their fault. It's about the game's mastery rank rewards as a whole.

I understand people want quick ways to get good things but I don't agree that it should be done that way. But look, playing with the players who got those gears early and thinking that they shouldn't have such an early access to those gears are two different things.

I just want change in how prime gears are accessed, and if it's a hard call, whatever. I merely thought of a better way to get things right with mastery rank rewards. For the better of the game I love.

Could not have said it better myself.

 

The issue lies within how the system is constructed. To be honest it's not really DE's fault either.. it's just how it happened that way. But they should really work on fixing it. A good way start to do that is by implementing better weapons/gear with a higher MR requirement. 

[na3xX]

i disagree! the balance between new player motivation and lategame/longtime player content is not fine.
For example

 

- Vault runs for new player are ridiculous... the droprates are horrible for the older mods

- Some mods u cant farm... (event mods)

- Arkane Helms (not able to get them anymore)

...

 

I think its good to get new content for longtime player! But it needs not be at the expense of other.

 

I guess we all want that the community will grow.

 

(i have all from the upper list. so dont think im a new rage kid)

Edited December 28, 2014 by na3xX

[Tyrian3k]

You know what I would say if a person that just joined my Borderlands 2 Level 50 game and told me "Hey man, I just hacked a level 50 character and some level 50 guns to try the game, that ok?".

 

I'd say "Sure. Lets go shoot stuff".

 

 

But not you guys. You guys would say "Ewww! You did not grind for weeks through the entire game three times to get all that? Well, you can't play in MY game!".

 

Shameful.

 

If you think so little of other people trying to have some fun in a game with ZERO consequences, you should seriously reconsider your lives.

 

The guns in this game all have to be Forma'd multiple times to unlock full potential anyway, and if your excuse is "it's too easy to level them!" well, then EVERYTHING must be easy to level, and you have destroyed your argument that MR means anything, because it's just based on leveling up a lot of things.

 

Building one weapon and then ranking it 4-6 times is now comparable to building and ranking up 200 weapons? Really now?

 

Not doing anything about the problem that Warframe's arsenal mostly consists of weapons that have no place in the game (also known as mastery fodder) is simply not an option. Many of those weapons can attribute their current state to the fact that everyone can just hop in and get a weapon that is better than just about anything. As I said earlier, either DE has to restrict access to some weapons so that players are required to work their way up in firepower, make every single weapon available have its place or just remove every weapon that currently does not have its place.

[BlutAdler]

i disagree! the balance between new player motivation and lategame/longtime player content is not fine.

For example

 

- Vault runs for new player are ridiculous... the droprates are horrible for the older mods

- Some mods u cant farm... (event mods)

- Arkane Helms (not able to get them anymore)

...

 

I think its good to get new content for longtime player! But it needs not be at the expense of other.

 

I guess we all want that the community will grow.

 

(i have all from the upper list. so dont think im a new rage kid)

 

In what way would you think that implementing a lock on weapons through MR would be at the expense of anyone else?

[Chaosyn]

IMO,Mastery should have passives that improve with mastery rank,and that's it.

All weapons should be available to anyone,just don't expect to be as good with it.

 

Anyone can use a 9mm....but only someone with experience is going to use it to it's full potential..and sometimes beyond.

[Chub_N_Tuck]

IMO,Mastery should have passives that improve with mastery rank,and that's it.

All weapons should be available to anyone,just don't expect to be as good with it.

 

Anyone can use a 9mm....but only someone with experience is going to use it to it's full potential..and sometimes beyond.

 

That's another good solution to it. Mastery ranks should give some sort of definite reward in game but strangely enough, it doesn't decide anything other than more trade counts and loadout slots.

 

After all that work ranking so many weapons, there should be proper rewards.

[KiteoHatto]

IMO,Mastery should have passives that improve with mastery rank,and that's it.

All weapons should be available to anyone,just don't expect to be as good with it.

 

Anyone can use a 9mm....but only someone with experience is going to use it to it's full potential..and sometimes beyond.

Soooo....anyone can use a 9mm but everyone also has access to experimental, cutting edge particle cannons too ? Why would anyone use the 9mm then ?

[Chaosyn]

Soooo....anyone can use a 9mm but everyone also has access to experimental, cutting edge particle cannons too ? Why would anyone use the 9mm then ?

Well in my OWN experience it's about whether or not I do better with the 9mm equipped or the cannon...

Maybe the 9 fires faster and is more accurate. Maybe the Particle Cannon does more damage but you have to stand still to use it...

AND there's also if people prefer 9's to cannons...

[BloodKitten]

soma prime need MR9, its not that hard to get to it with all the weapons you have at this point, not to mention frames.

[NegimaSonic]

... Nothing is mentioned about actually playing with them in game, if your comment is directed towards mine and BlutAdler's. We actually are playing with them no problem, given the circumstances and I do not have such a narrow mind.

-1 to you sir. You missed the point of the posts. It's not about discriminating people who get them early. Game's set up that way right now, it's not their fault. It's about the game's mastery rank rewards as a whole.

I understand people want quick ways to get good things but I don't agree that it should be done that way. But look, playing with the players who got those gears early and thinking that they shouldn't have such an early access to those gears are two different things.

I just want change in how prime gears are accessed, and if it's a hard call, whatever. I merely thought of a better way to get things right with mastery rank rewards. For the better of the game I love.

 

And if it is a hard call, whatever.

This game is a business. Their model is specifically BUILT for people to get quick access to gears. It's how they make money. They do have a few limitations set in place to slow or limit some instant buying things, but from a business side of things none of that is worth their time to keep restricting. This isn't your standard MMO.

 

Impulse buys are great for business, I can't say how many people just instantly buy platinum, I'm not one of those people, but I've had friends from other similarly modeled free to play games to go in, buy whatever cosmetic or item they felt they deserved from the get go. The developers of those games made money off of my friends like that, they got zilch from me. Some went on to play as many hours as me, some quit in the first week. Getting better stuff sooner =/= not playing the game a long time. But it does equal money.

 

You want to know something that'd be "better for the game you love"? Instant free access to everything, no rng, go wherever, do whatever you want.

But that kind of thing doesn't keep a game from a moderately sized company afloat.

 

 

Building one weapon and then ranking it 4-6 times is now comparable to building and ranking up 200 weapons? Really now?

 

Not doing anything about the problem that Warframe's arsenal mostly consists of weapons that have no place in the game (also known as mastery fodder) is simply not an option. Many of those weapons can attribute their current state to the fact that everyone can just hop in and get a weapon that is better than just about anything. As I said earlier, either DE has to restrict access to some weapons so that players are required to work their way up in firepower, make every single weapon available have its place or just remove every weapon that currently does not have its place.

 

Person A: Buys boltor prime and everything to do with it from MR2 (which is pretty hard but I'm just going to pretend it is). Makes that his main weapon.

Person B: Worked 400 hours in game, going through 200 weapons, still ends up using boltor prime.

 

Both end up doing the same thing, one just wasted a lot of time getting there. Now both players can awesomely repeat doing tower (insert tier and type) missions repeatedly til the next broken weapon comes out. Yay?

Or do you believe that the time I spent using the Dread, Ignis, Kohm, Sybaris, makes me shoot a boltor prime better than someone who ONLY used boltor prime. This is NOT a statement on the quality of these weapons, just a point that those guns that all perform different functions and feels. Having experience with them doesn't mean anything in the context of a single weapon.

 

Content removal directly goes against anything mastery related, if they removed a bunch of the crap weapons, we all know everyone who already used them keeps their experience, thus anyone coming up will have even harder time reaching  higher mastery ranks whereas all currently invested players get to sit nicely on their rank with no further effort. This game already benefits those who came before other players (as another user mentioned, event weapons, mods, arcane helmets).

 

I'm going off a rough guess here but I have probably 30k experience in things that are impossible or hard to get for a player starting today. It seems like a little til you realize that player has to go through even more crap to make up for that, archwings, extra sentinels, kubrow, etc.

If you remove more, that gap will widen. And you want to add in more mastery restrictions in addition to that?

 

As in the above reply, DE has to do nothing except whatever keeps the money flowing from the majority. MR locks aren't it.

[AlphaAquilae]

How many weapons do people reckon are OP without any mods? For the most part, isn't it really the mods that make weapons truly shine and be... well... beastly? Just thinking aloud - what about a system where all weapons are available to any mastery rank, but as you rank up, you get more mod slots unlocked? Someone MR2 could have the same weapon as someone MR10, but the MR10 player's weapon would pack more punch as more mods would be allowed to be equipped. So instead of just being to install a serration as MR2, someone MR10 could equip that plus a few elemental combos/critical mods/etc. There wouldn't be anything locked behind mastery walls, there is still an incentive to try out all weapons to increase mastery, and the reward of more firepower when you do level up.

[NegimaSonic]

How many weapons do people reckon are OP without any mods? For the most part, isn't it really the mods that make weapons truly shine and be... well... beastly? Just thinking aloud - what about a system where all weapons are available to any mastery rank, but as you rank up, you get more mod slots unlocked? Someone MR2 could have the same weapon as someone MR10, but the MR10 player's weapon would pack more punch as more mods would be allowed to be equipped. So instead of just being to install a serration as MR2, someone MR10 could equip that plus a few elemental combos/critical mods/etc. There wouldn't be anything locked behind mastery walls, there is still an incentive to try out all weapons to increase mastery, and the reward of more firepower when you do level up.

I think that's a possibly amazing idea. However, it'd require a lot of effort to make work because it exists on a thin line between unfair or useless.

 

It can't be MR = number of slots. Imagine any level 30 warframe with only 2 mod slots(unfair)

If everyone keeps the default 8 with the addition of more, then it'd kind of end up useless anyway.

 

Four slots might be ok with an increase every two MR levels (for example) but even that seems kind of iffy.

[Psiloc1n]

TL;DR: "I'm level 18, and I think that nobody should get nice things until much later in the game. Higher level players should also get more stuff, and I deserve to be treated like a god because as you know Mastery Rank determines player aptitude and knowledge."

classic forum go-er noob QQing, probably because hes MR 6 or something

[PureMalice]

I'd say it would be a good start, but limiting weapons and frames behind a larger MR wall would just blow, seriously, MR is NOT in its current state ANY indication of skill or ability, and represents nothing save farming skills or exploit use, I don't doubt for a second there's a handful out there who earned those ranks farming high end and harsh runs, but in the end if it comes down to you and 3 friends spamming ultimates and powers for 4 hours leveling up gear, why would that merit any reward or penalty? And how do you desperate those who earned it, from those who didn't without discrimination or condemnation?

I can't fault people who DO stuff like that, its one of the things making this game unique and enjoyable, and there's lots more gear out there to try, but I don't want to be forced to level Vasto, Hind or Vectis just to clear a hurdle to get to the next tier where I have no idea if I'm going to enjoy a continued grind with sub par, or uninspiring weapons.

Perhaps a testing room for gear and weapons would make that less a chore and give good incentive to push for MR, but it still feels grubby and mean to do.

Maybe MR should be what unlocks the planet systems, or lower crafting costs, increased stats or reward earnings, a skill tree? I dunno, but I agree MR DOES need a purpose and bonus to it in order to make it matter, and more of the same just doesn't work for me.

Maybe have it accumulate through the overall scores or missions completed, more points for kills, revives, reward teamwork, hell! get some extra points for the sonic speed run crowd! make mission completion time award a little boost in MR, see people forming speed run groups, I'd watch those now and then actually and itd be great fun tied into clan performance, or just some recognition to particular Tenno who truly performed well, sort of an end of month review of fastest players, most revives, most murderous bastard in the solar system, merit rewards for the individual players there.

MR needs work, and bonuses go a long way for that, don't lock content behind it, let the words Mastery Rank indicate actual skill, let the players numbers do the talking, I can assure you, you would be blown away seeing how some Vauban with Akvastos, Atterax, and Opticor managed to set a speed record, I for one would track the bastard down and demand to be shown how that was done!

[(PSN)theelix]

This aggravates me. 

Being MR11 and having played this game for thousands of hours, yet not wanting to level up worthless crap because I'd rather play with the fun stuff, this severly offends me. You have to be MR10 just to unlock Rhino prime? "The Speed boost is for the worthy" ? This is the kind of stuff that causes fights through the community. I'd probably never do a Mastery Rank test again if this becomes a thing. I'd rather play with people who want to have fun instead of people who think they deserve more just because they put more time into the game when they already have more than the people who didn't put time into the game, even more than the people who COULDN'T put time into the game and then moreso to the people who've arrived LATE to the game. 

[Speedingbus]

There is plenty of content for new players to have and zero content for any veterans of warframe to have so they definitely should introduce some high mastery weapons/content.  The newbies still have plenty of OP weapons to use so any whining would pretty much invalid. 

[(PSN)theelix]

There is plenty of content for new players to have and zero content for any veterans of warframe to have so they definitely should introduce some high mastery weapons/content.  The newbies still have plenty of OP weapons to use so any whining would pretty much invalid. 

That doesn't make ANY form of sense since as a newbie, hence the meaning of the word, they have NOTHING  and NO  EXPERIENCE along with no RESOURCES. 

As an experienced, high mastery veteran, We have arsenals to make the Grineer, Corpus, Infested and all the Syndicates crap themselves when we say "We're coming for you."

 

I don't understand why you think newbies need to be punished anymore than they do already for not having any experience, mods, know how, resources, credits, barely any plat, lack of the ability to trade until, at the very least their second day of playing, no nodes or clan to take them to tower missions, no arsenal or weapons, no kubrow or sentinels, no frames... 

 

If all you guys are freaking worried about are people who buy everything, why don't we just make it timed or limited within a Mastery how many frames/weapons you can buy within one Mastery? 

Say, you can only buy half of your Mastery Rank worth of things with your plat in fully built items. 

Or how about we get rid of the plat system all together? I mean, if you can't buy anything in the game because it's at too high a MR rank, what's your incentive to buy plat at all or, for that matter, play the game? 

 

I'd understand if you guys were talking about a simple program to increase things innately as per having a higher Mastery Rank... But what you guys are talking about is withholding content from people which is NOT ok. 

[Kuva_Kebab]

That doesn't make ANY form of sense since as a newbie, hence the meaning of the word, they have NOTHING  and NO  EXPERIENCE along with no RESOURCES. 

As an experienced, high mastery veteran, We have arsenals to make the Grineer, Corpus, Infested and all the Syndicates crap themselves when we say "We're coming for you."

 

I don't understand why you think newbies need to be punished anymore than they do already for not having any experience, mods, know how, resources, credits, barely any plat, lack of the ability to trade until, at the very least their second day of playing, no nodes or clan to take them to tower missions, no arsenal or weapons, no kubrow or sentinels, no frames... 

 

If all you guys are freaking worried about are people who buy everything, why don't we just make it timed or limited within a Mastery how many frames/weapons you can buy within one Mastery? 

Say, you can only buy half of your Mastery Rank worth of things with your plat in fully built items. 

Or how about we get rid of the plat system all together? I mean, if you can't buy anything in the game because it's at too high a MR rank, what's your incentive to buy plat at all or, for that matter, play the game? 

 

I'd understand if you guys were talking about a simple program to increase things innately as per having a higher Mastery Rank... But what you guys are talking about is withholding content from people which is NOT ok. 

 

I think the issue people have is that there is literally no reason to rank up. I just kind of passively rank up now at MR14 because there's no point working for it, there's no reason at all to care about having a higher mastery rank.

 

 

this severly offends me

 

If talk about giving veterans something to be proud of offends you, you might be in the wrong place.

[Morec0]

Disagree with locking things behind mastery rank.  It breeds elitism and shelters new players from any knowledge that higher ranks might be able to offer.

 

It's not a matter of completely discounting the idea or incentive behind progression, it's just that mastery rank is fundamentally flawed as a litmus to do it with.

 

This ^

 

loadout slots locked behind mastery rank,  Cosmeticseven, those are all great and fine and provide good incentive to go through mastery rank, WEAPONS and whatnot that are the CORE of gameplay?

 

NO, that's a HORRIBLE idea.

[Chub_N_Tuck]

And if it is a hard call, whatever.

This game is a business. Their model is specifically BUILT for people to get quick access to gears. It's how they make money. They do have a few limitations set in place to slow or limit some instant buying things, but from a business side of things none of that is worth their time to keep restricting. This isn't your standard MMO.

 

This isn't our standard MMO? Please. I have been to a lot of F2P but pay2win games and this isn't even close to any of that model. Putting master rank restriction won't even make it pay2win either, since most of the fusion cores that take to upgrade mods are so easily obtained, and  none of the mods are exclusive with real money. So many "F2P" games are huge business, if you have not noticed. This is what's been done, and DE is doing it the different AND the right way.

 

Take Nexon games for example. Vindictus and Mabinogi. Any "endgame" stats and weapon upgrades are only purchased through real money and this has been abused by Nexon for years. The company is the biggest, if not, one of the biggest gaming company in Korea right now. I know how this gaming business is important to DE, but give me a break here. I don't really understand your sentence where I bolded. How does none of that matter to them? Keeping a restriction like master rank is something that will test the patience of the players themselves, and it's upto them to buy the prime access or not.

 

What I am suggesting is Mastery rank rewards. This prime gear mr lock is one of the many things that can be done. What I'm saying is, if that is too much to ask, that will be the end of it. I'm suggesting a more diverse reward for ranking mastery rank. There can be other ways to reward people because right now those rewards are really lackluster to go for. 

Edited December 28, 2014 by Chuck_NoMiss