Stealth Feedback & Suggestions Thread

[AuroraSonicBoom]

Well, there's some basic guidelines that take stealth play from being a poor, frustrating gimmick(FarCry 3 anyone?) and make it a fun and rewarding experience.

 

1. Let the player try to sneak past an obstacle as often as he wants.

2. Let the player reset the state of the map/mob easily(shutting off alarms, setting off alarms remotely to distract)

3. Don't force the player into long downtimes after a failed stealth attempt(always give him options to recover status quo more quickly)

4. Give the player numerous tools to make sneaking past obstacles easier but not required(i.e. sentinel mod showing enemy FoV like a camera, gecko mod to ceiling-walk, turn off lights)

5. Reward stealth play equally or slightly better than run&gun

[Xievie]

It makes no sense if I miss a silent weapon and an enemy doesn't notice. You know, why is there an arrow sticking in the wall a foot away from your head?

[JustDont]

I didn't read the whole thread, so pardon me if I'm repeating stuff already said.

 

The CORE (like, no matter what else you do, it's not going to be better unless you fix it) problem of stealth gameplay is that it is simply not rewarding as much as non-stealth gameplay.

 

So, until these two approaches start to give similar rewards -- stealth will be only as good as self-imposed challenge. There were ideas about giving bonus exp and bonus credits, but that's useless (who needs credits anyway?). Unless stealth missions start giving away bonus mods -- because, you know, you could mow down those respawning 100500 grineer/corpus/infested mobs and get quite a few mods instead of playing stealthy and getting just credits.

 

The breakdown is as follows:

1) Credits: stealth players should supposedly receive a bonus, but non-stealth explorers will get more credits due to mob drops and searching every nook and cranny;

2) Exp: stealth players should supposedly receive a bonus, but non-stealth players will get WAY more exp because they'll kill tons of mobs;

3) Mods: stealth players won't get any, non-stealth players will get some (or even a lot of).

4) Time taken: "stuff obtained per 1 minute" factor will be MUCH higher for non-stealth players, plus they have a freedom of choice whether to rush or not to rush. Stealth players must take the slow, non-rewarding approach.

Edited June 27, 2013 by JustDont

[arch111]

Could the mission type be selectable?

In the beginning you vote, covert or assault.

The map is built with this in mind.

That way stealth is given.

[Psychotoxin]

Could the mission type be selectable?

In the beginning you vote, covert or assault.

The map is built with this in mind.

That way stealth is given.

 

with 4 votes it`s not really a question of voting... and what would it be if 2 people said stealth and 2 said "gun! kill! blood!"...? would the mission have 50% of stealth based tiles, and 50% or run-gun-fun tiles?

[arch111]

um i see your point there. A mission selection then. The host descides the type.

[Psychotoxin]

um i see your point there. A mission selection then. The host descides the type.

 

but then the host can only do that with friends... that wont work on a PUG... since the PUGer`s who`d want to run/gun would hate the host for taking stealth and vice versa...

P.S. i`m in no way trying to discourage you, since the idea is a good one, just needs refinement... :)

Edited June 27, 2013 by Psychotoxin

[arch111]

Hmm, 2 map tilesets of the same location.

1 is nornal. The other dedicated stealth mission

and clear objectives and rewards for stealth, so mant good ideas here on that.

This way, a gunner do not enter the covert tileset, because he will add not enter benefit.

The problems you pointed out will all melt away with dedicated missions.

As an adition i would love meelee and silent weaponry only allowed. Thats something else thou. :

:)

[Psychotoxin]

well that`s better... a bit clearer as well... :) still, it`s not like this does much... at least not until DE notice this... :D

[Xorpheus]

It could always become weapon locked, only people with 2 or more stealth weapons could join randomly, and they would have to select a stealth mission search which would mean they are looking for the same game play, and a kick button for host would solve the trolls. =D

If they added half the stuff from the main post suggestions it would be totally viable. No?

[Makeshift]

all you need is a checkbox or a seperate option under the online drop down. Online. Stealth online. Invite only. Private. Solo. Stealth solo.

 

no need for locks, or a search or anything. people will be matched according to this choice

 

(not that i dont want a search...incorporating steams server selection would make me very happy. im just saying its not needed for this.)

Edited June 27, 2013 by Makeshift

[Gigatron-Prime]

When was the last time DE said anything about stealth? I want my stealth!!

 

 

That would increase this games longevity by alot and raise the fun factor.

[arch111]

Imsure i read sonewhere that devs are giving some love to stealth.

Can someone please confirm this.

[Gigatron-Prime]

Imsure i read sonewhere that devs are giving some love to stealth.

Can someone please confirm this.

Better yet can DE please confirm this?

[Probta16]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/55421-update-8-related-work/

 

Scroll down to general and you will see something about stealth.

 

Also the last livestream contains one minute about stealth.

Edited June 28, 2013 by Probta16

[arch111]

Ok read it. We will soon find out how much they have time to do.

[PretzelBear]

Being able to hide in the shadows if map provides and also tranquilizing weapons for Heavy units. Another idea a new trap weapon where you can step up small traps with trip wire.

Also more stealth kill animations, having the same animation will get extremely repetitive. These animations could just be made for the Daggers and  Glaive weapons since I don't think anyone will go into a stealth mission with a Gram or anything big and silly. Some examples of extra animations.

1) Chocking the enemy.
2) Breaking their neck.
3) Stabbing in the lower back and covering mouth.

Am sure you can think of many more!

[LordxTempest]

Okay didn't read all the posts but Stealth is when you Solo and in Online go bananas,lol. One thing that does annoy me is when it sometime gives you an objective like 10 stealth kills it pops up on a defense mission or on an Online game that RNG needs some tweaking to suit the missions objectives. And just maybe add awards or trophies ppl like those for some reason :) ,

[arch111]

I want to add i read in another thread that once you are

spotted the ai will allways know where you are.

If real missions like these are to happen, a alert timer must be applied to enemies.

I assume, de, this is now on the todo list?

Besides this, the ability to climb the ceiling and hang there tp ambush and stay hidden would be a huge plus and not to mych work to umplement.

Your thoughts?

[SFkenny]

Ceiling clinging would be a huge pain in the &#! to implement, make no mistake. You'd basically have to add ways that frames can defy the map's gravity while preforming animations. I maintain that it would be a nifty feature to have, but it's far more likely that we'll wind up using the upcoming grappling hook feature to get up high and avoid enemy sightlines.

[arch111]

Actually what I thought DE would make use of was the existing wallrun and climb-features.

To have objects in game that is "sticky" to allow players to hang on to it, it has been voiced that we should be able to hang onto edges.

 

But maby you are right. Maby this is not needed, perhaps include more small shelves and alcoves to sit on? Like in Prince of Persia.

[Nitrobudyn]

Um, how about a new stealth + rush mission type?

The goal would have some amount (cash/ health/ resources). The amount remains until you are detected, then it starts to get lower and lower. That means, when you are undetected you have whole the time in the world to explore the location, but after you get detected you need to rush to the goal because if the amount reaches zero the mission is failed.

This way it really pays off to go stealth :)

[Thaumatos]

I think stealth could be tweaked and better adapted as a stand-alone mission objective. Like sabotage, defense, exterminate, etc. All players going in would understand the objective is stealth and the map would be setup specifically for stealth instead of its usual highly randomized, stealth-unfriendly method.

You start the mission as either an escape from a planet/ship or as a standard infiltration objective. If you're seen, you fail. There would have to be a few ground rules for these missions though:

* Always start in an empty room

* No mobs patrol to start area

* Fixed number of mobs (like exterminate only less)

* Clear indication of mobs attempting alert

These missions would be more easily rushed, but also more easily failed. They would not return nearly the same rate of credits as longer missions either.

[LilDisaster]

I don't agree with more bonus XP for a stealth approach, it suggests that stealth is the "correct" way to play. I do agree with making stealth more viable though, but don't make it so stealth is the hands down statistically best approach.

I especially agree with point #6, it would be a great motivator for stealth, but in that case there should be an XP bonus to balance out what you'd lose for not fighting waves of enemies.

However, it is unfair for people who have 'tank' Warframes like Rhino because being stealthy is very hard with them and one would rather just jump in and take everyone on.

[ScytheDoom]

i like this, i think stealth gameplay should be more rewarding for the time and effort put in.