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Stealth Feedback & Suggestions Thread


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punishing Stealth Killing seems like the absolute most backwards approach you could possibly manage for stealth style gameplay. It is way more difficult to stealth kill enemies than it is to walk around them unnoticed. Why not just give an overall bonus for beating the level undetected, and you get regular kill exp for stealth kills, so that if you take the extra time to actually kill people you still get some marginal amount of exp, since very few enemies will spawn.

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Bonus affinity for stealth kills with stealth weapons. melee/ Bow/Kunai and such.

 

Re-tool many missions for stealth. High reward missions for total stealth. Give negaives for being detected and such, like having a timer to suceed in a mission after an alarm is sounded,

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Ok i just watched the last live steam to find out Necro's last move will be loot the dead!? why not a nano machine graveyard that  impales things within a area on spikes made of nano machines . so why loot the dead when i have auras and mods to do that . i want my spike grave yard bring me some Vlad Tepes style  powers to Necro and not this pointless power i will not use . give me cannibalism , spike grave yard along with totem of fear to make them spread the nano spike from one target to the next . as in each spike that jets out of a targets body will spread the spike grave yard effect by hitting a near by target injecting them with nano machines that burst into more spikes! i dont want you loot the dead . 

with spike grave yard  totem of fear will help spread the effect of the last move as they run away from you.

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I think it would be cool if we could hack a terminal to "erase or hide" our signature from the enemy sensors.

Would get enemies on "suspicious" state in stead of alert and would allow us to do stealth attacks once again.

Like, we should be able to do such a thing in a cleared room with no enemies witnessing it.

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So right now we have this problem that stealth attacks don't scale in any way with the enemy level, making them woefully underpowered in higher level ranges. To combat that, I think stealth attacks should revolve around a "swing meter" mechanic usually seen in sports games like golf of baseball. They are also used in other games, but it's the sports genre where they are most prominently featured.

 

Anyway, the mechanic would work like this: Upon sneaking up behind an unaltered enemy, the familiar stealth attack dialogue pops up, but instead of just pressing the melee button and executing a standard stealth attack, keeping it pressed brings up a 'precision meter' with a needle moving back and forth along its scale. This scale determines how precise the stealth attack is and therefore the amount of damage dealt to the enemy, raging from red(almost missed) to green(guaranteed kill). The closer the needle is to the "sweet spot", visualized by the green area in the pictures, the more accurate the attack will be. Releasing the melee button will execute the stealth attack. If the sweet spot is missed, the chances of the enemy not dying from the attack increase dramatically, however the target will stagger as long as the attack was at least semi accurate, which in the images is visualized by the yellow area, allowing players to attempt a second stealth attack in the same fashion. If the target moves out of range during the aiming period, the action will be canceled.

 

The higher the enemy level is, the more narrow the sweet spot on the precision scale is, leaving less room for error and requiring the player to time their attacks more precisely.

Technically, this makes the stealth attack a damage modifier based the player's melee weapon and the enemy's heath multiplied by the accuracy of the precision meter. Assuming the health of the target is 1200 and the accuracy of the stealth attack is 92% out of a maximum 110%, the total damage dealt will be weapon damage + critical bonus + (1200*0.92). In late and endgame, this allows the base damage of your melee weapon act as a cushion for imperfect aiming, killing target even if the precision alone would not have been enough.

 

Images:

 

Low level stealth attack meter.

xNwU8uM.gif

 

Medium/High level stealth attack meter.

jbe9kBh.gif

 

 

 This is insanely awesome, but great ideas like this either go unnoticed by the devs or they just don't care. *cough*UI/hud improvements thread *cough*

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Here's a thought - and this is coming from someone who thinks stealth is cool but is completel NOT m gameplay style - for mission ideas, why not do an "escape" - sort of like a rescue mission combined with exterminate or mobile defense. Make it so not triggering an alarms and making it out without taking damage gives big bonuses. Or make alarm response troops like the 30-50 minute survival groups with level 500 mobs (yes five zero zero).

Whatever you do, make it predictable, by that I mean don't make it a nightmare mod - you have specific warframes designed around stealth and zero gameplay with stealth as so much as even an afterthought, the randomness of it cycling through as a nightmare mod makes it impractical to run and rerun nightmare mods with a stealth warframe until an actual stealth nightmare comes up. I'm cool with it, but it's kind of insulting to lure people in with the stealth aspect and then be like "LOLnope less QQ more pew pew"

All in all, like I said, personally I'm cool with never having to worry about being caught.with my pants down trying to hide (because I suck at it), but it adds a little depth and a little more variety and I'm sure many others would appreciate it.

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new request obviously
 

stealth kills must be insta kill. no doubt, no concerns. sneaking up on enemies takes alot of time. the essence of any weapon is how fast it can kill and enemy, so insta kills by stealth anim is pretty legit. i was concerned about it a bit before, but now i'm confident it's how things should be done.

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new request obviously

 

stealth kills must be insta kill. no doubt, no concerns. sneaking up on enemies takes alot of time. the essence of any weapon is how fast it can kill and enemy, so insta kills by stealth anim is pretty legit. i was concerned about it a bit before, but now i'm confident it's how things should be done.

I think, Loki and Ash shouldn't be able to do a stealth attack while invisible to don't exploit it. And heavy enemies wouldn't die by a stealth attack.

 

For now, it is the only adjusts needed to put stealth insta kill.

Edited by Probta16
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I like the ideas presented in this thread, but something else that would be amazing is mods that do better for stealth players. For example there are radar mods, that I'm aware of, but what stealth players would realy benifit from is a mod that also showed the feild of vision of the enemies within their radars area of effect. I play stealth just becuase its fun. Seeing bonuses like those presented as the first post would be amazing, but I think that a mod like the one I mentioned would also be incredibly useful.

-Cheers

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Let me start like this. I played Oblivion, where most of the caves were also made with randomly matched tiles and now when think of it, I ask myself why was I amaused even though? Here are some things that cane to my mind:

 

1. Killing every enemy was meaningfull – there was 1-2 enemies in a room (about 7 at most) and there was a constant nmber of them in a cave. In WF it looks similar untill someone sounds the allarm. After this, You get surrounded by mobs. It is rather hard to get killed by them untill 3 or more high lv mobs comes. What do You do? – press 4 and kill what’s left, just like mowing the lawn – You don’t feel joy when You aim well, only frustration or nothing at all.

 

2. There were shadows – usualy the first thing I level up in crpg’s is sneaking. I can’t do it in WF, I can’t turn off the lights, nor cut the wires of a controll panel. The only place where I can hide is under Shade’s cloak. (btw, shade can cloak You endlessly, but he does only when he sees an enemy that is 5 meters away). There is no purpose to position Yourself before You pull the trigger.

 

3. High level mobs – In Oblivion the enemies were scaled to Your level, but as I wrote earlier, the first skill I usually level up is sneaking in shaddows, and that means my damage output was quite low. There where enemies that I couldn’t kill, but I was able to go pass them with my sneaking skill. I miss this in WF – the enemies are ment to be killed. Ok, there is the bullet-sponge problem and hard-to-kill enemies, but wher You are on a defence mission You must kill every single of them – ther is no option to acchieve the goal some other way, like luring them away and close the door.

 

4. Urge to kill fast – I remember a boss fight, in a dark room, in Oblivion. I when i shot at him, he run in my direction just to find out I’m not there anymore – I could play with him like that. In WF I need to kill enemies fast or else they’ll cause the alarm – I hate that, because I tried to go undetected through a map recently, and I missed one mob who saw me and turned on the alarm. After that I didn’t even care to kill anyone – just russhed to the goal. Why can’t we just disable the alarm? We are so high-tech but we have no viruses? Oh, c’mon!

 

5. Just shoot them! – In Whitcher 2 You were able to kill enemies by throwing them off the cliffs and their loot stayed where they were standing before. In WF we HAD such an option, but now the enemies are comming back, so You need to shoot them or ult them. If things will go further this way, we may end up in a “here, lemme pull that trigger for you” situation. What is more, I think Loki should be able to switch teleport in mid-air to place somebody over the edge

Edited by Nitrobudyn
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I still liked how you could search bodies in the Metal Gear games. Would be nice if we could do that, and maybe have it yield MORE ammo than normal kills and opening storage containers.

 

Also would be nice to grab enemies without actually killing them. I don't know why, but I just want to be able to do something like that.

Also would be cool to be able to throw them off cliffs and stuff for instakills.

Maybe throw them off of some other cliffs, then other enemies will patrol and find the body, alert the other guards, then all of them will come around the corpse for a few minutes. That gives you time to take them all out or sneak into the next room.

 

STEALTH REWARD SYSTEM (end mission bonus)

if person completed whole mission undetected he recieve good xp + credits bonus wih penalties based on:
1) amount of enemies killed.
 

 

NOPE NOPE NOPE. In my opinion, TRUE stealth doesn't involve killing. Stealth is ONLY for when you have no other choice, or if you can't find a better path. There are a lot of games that reward you for not killing OR alerting enemies.

 

Basically, true stealth is being a ghost. Getting the objective done without being seen and without doing anything to anything that is not the objective.

 

 

2) decrease the amount of spawning enemies while undetected

 

+1 +1 +1

And also, we need them to improve the patrol AI. I kind of find being in stealth immersing, but it's easily broken when a Grineer decides to walk into a wall or something.

Also would be nice if enemies were alerted if you missed and an arrow flew right by their head, and if other enemies noticed other Grineer getting killed.

 

20) if you come to boss room undetected, boss stands alone.

 

I can't fully agree with this. I mean, there should be some enemies that you should clear before engaging the boss or killing the boss in one shot. Maybe some standing around him like in Vor/Kril/Hek's room because there are some places to take cover near the boss.

Edited by Xievie
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I don't agree with being unable to kill alerted enemies even if you can Shade-cloak to sneak up on them. I would prefer the Crysis style where even after the enemy is alerted, you can still do backstab as long as you get in their rear. An alternative is like Assassin's Creed where you can backstab enemies that are distracted by your allies, even after open combat starts.

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I'd like to see improvement in the range of stealth killing : something you really have to be close enought to lick the ennemies to kill him.

I also think that your sentinel should stay behind your back and stay quiet when you are crouching.

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I think we need some separate mission type for stealth - where you have to be invisible to get more rewards in the end. And enemies should be much stronger in these missions, so players won't fight them, but run away instead. This way DE wont have to rebalance all existing missions and we still het a place to be silent and invisible.

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I think we need some separate mission type for stealth - where you have to be invisible to get more rewards in the end. And enemies should be much stronger in these missions, so players won't fight them, but run away instead. This way DE wont have to rebalance all existing missions and we still het a place to be silent and invisible.

DE said that they were talking about it. But now i don't know if they give up of this idea.

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