Actually Impossible To Pay For Mod Upgrading/ducat Items. Deep Explanation Within. Please Support.

[Vaskadar]

The Ducat yields are incredibly sub-par, too for a primarily solo player (crappy ISP). I'd run 25 T1 capture runs. Most of which ended up with an excess of more Survival and Defense keys.

 

Everything Baro has given out has been straight upgrades to existing gear. It shouldn't be so obnoxious to obtain. I simply don't have the time to invest in playing for these stupid @(*()$ Prisma weapons and primed mods. This thread addresses my frustrations completely with this stupid void trader system.

 

I'm sorry DE. I love you guys, but you also create some really bad grinding situations that make people give up playing and say 'F*** it'. 

[Mirriky]

CONCLUSION: You must stop with these outrageous costs, before its too late. Fix your economy to allow people who play the game, to afford what they work hard to achieve, before you intimidate and terrify them away. 

 

I have wholeheartedly recommended warframe to about 4 of my friends, four of which have left after 15 hours saying that there is far too much grind in this game for them to find enjoyable, and I completely agree and can no longer recommend this game to anyone. My hours have cut back from 6 hours on a weekday and ~12 on a weekend to maybe 2 hours a week if that.

My spending on this game has dropped from about $300 in the first year to $40 in the 6 months after that and nothing spent since then.

 

This game is built around community, maybe not so much in ideas, but definitely around who and how many are playing with you. Scaring people off impossible grind walls is a big threat to the game, and then squeezing the ones that choose to remain only hurts them and makes them want to leave too.

 

I understand that DE doesn't want every card maxed, however it is a huge throttle to those who want to try.

And still impossible for a player like me who use to enjoy playing all night long.

[SnakeWildlife]

all of those words are a fallacy because you're basically whining that you can't 'finish' content faster than Digital Extremes puts it out.

 

You missed the entire point... If these Primed Mods and Ducat-Weapons keep coming out at the rate they are....NOBODY will be able to afford them all. It is currently draining people to ZERO and after that, POP goes the economy, and a looot of people start leaving the game.

 

Is 16 hours a day not enough?

 

Since the earliest days of beta, (where a lot of us started) it has been our goal to earn everything, collect everything, upgrade everything, scan everything, and even reach the top goal in every Event, to reach the highest account-rank. If that's not for you, thats fine! Just carry on as you are, but some of us here who have painstakingly worked to the bone who understand the games economy to it's pinnacle, need to have costs changed in order for the economy to even work. What good is giving us new Primed mods and Weapons if very soon nobody can afford them...

 

If you dont want to play the game or collect everything, thats on you, and you have no right to tell others how they should be playing, or how much. This topic doesnt even concern or involve you.

 

Game Content itself in Warframe can be completed within a couple of weeks....if your ideology after that is for me to slow down or stop playing, you must be off your nut.

 

I and so many other people, WANT to collect everything, HAVE been collecting everything and HAVE been WORKING NON STOP to achieve this...you cannot simply change the goal posts whenever a very small minority are able to ONLY climb over the wall by paying a sick amount of real life money to afford the credits and fusion core packs. That excludes everyone else from earning things in the game, including you....which is why im absolutely baffled anybody would even want to try and defend the current costs in the Warframe economy.

 

Wether youre a casual player.

Wether youre a hardcore gamer.

Wether youre a whale gamer.

 

The current costs of Fusion and Credits/Ducats in Warframe, is about to become impossible, for EVERYONE.

Unless DE looks at this, hopefully takes a veterens advice from the evidence shown, and prevent the bubbleburst.

 

The bubble bursts for people at different times, but as soon as they run out of credits, BOOM. You've hit it, and can no longer afford all ducat purchases, and have absolutely NO hope of ranking up these 10lvl mods. Welcome to the recession. And right here is where a LOT of people will quit the game.

Edited February 19, 2015 by SnakeWildlife

[MDRLOz]

You missed the entire point... If these Primed Mods and Ducat-Weapons keep coming out at the rate they are....NOBODY will be able to afford them all. It is currently draining people to ZERO and after that, POP goes the economy, and a looot of people start leaving the game.

 

Is 16 hours a day not enough?

See this is why I think there are two separate issues here. And they keep getting bundled together into one: 

1) Getting the ducats to acquire everything 

2) Maxxing everything to rank 10 

 

Now in my opinion 1) is far worse. If you miss something now you have to keep checking every time until it pops up again. What happens if you cant afford tomorrow but then miss the next time its on rotation due to being unavailable due to real life commitments. You could miss a mod or weapon for months or even years. 

 

2) it is bad that you cannot get everything up to 10 at a reasonable pace with more mods coming. However you could get this done eventually. Its just a matter of time and effort at this point (possibly insane levels of time and effort but still time and effort). Also if you stockpiled up all the primed mods as they come and find that you really needed one in particular (due to a particular tactical alert or a raid) you could swap to level that up. 

 

However if you miss out on the chance to acquire something and that thing becomes important for whatever reason then you have no way to rectify it. 

Edited February 19, 2015 by MDRLOz

[SnakeWildlife]

See this is why I think there are two separate issues here. And they keep getting bundled together into one: 

1) Getting the ducats to acquire everything 

2) Maxxing everything to rank 10 

 

 

Yeah theyre both sides to the same coin, the Impossible Economy.

 

Ducats take a great deal of time but is (barely by most people) achievable if they dedicate themselves to it. But even with the Ducats, the millions of credits expected each 2 weeks is just not possible to reach.

 

On point 2 (again caused by the impossible economy), you cannot rank up all of these rank 10 mods to the top because theyre being released in too short period of time to be able to afford to rank them....unless, they stop releasing r10 mods and allow people the time to work to achieve it.

 

Such a thing would only be possible, if Baro Ki Teer stops selling Primed Mods.

or

Fusion Core drop rate is increased and Credit Cost to do fusion is severely reduced.

 

Without any of those 2 options coming to effect, we cannot possibly do this. There is no such time to accomplish it.

 

The problem with the current cost of Ducats on Ducat-Purchases, is that even the biggest farmers, are having their keys drained much faster than they can earn them, to be able to do this...more evidence to the 'Bubble burst' thats going to happen.

Edited February 19, 2015 by SnakeWildlife

[Yazeth]

With all the potential mods that are going to be primed, it would take more than a few years to max them out. For a casual player like me, It would be impossible to rank up all the ones I want during my lifetime. Also, Baro was suppose to be a person who rewarded us for just going into the Void (by taking junk parts). Now, people are farming for his items? Seems counterproductive. +1

[InoxMaximus]

+1

[Zrgd]

I think the OP makes a good point in that a player that "has everything" except the new stuff released. Playing 10-16hours a day and can't sustain the required credits/ducats for something that cycles every 2 weeks is a system that will eventually fail.

[MaverickZero]

Yeah theyre both sides to the same coin, the Impossible Economy.

 

Ducats take a great deal of time but is (barely by most people) achievable if they dedicate themselves to it. But even with the Ducats, the millions of credits expected each 2 weeks is just not possible to reach.

 

On point 2 (again caused by the impossible economy), you cannot rank up all of these rank 10 mods to the top because theyre being released in too short period of time to be able to afford to rank them....unless, they stop releasing r10 mods and allow people the time to work to achieve it.

 

Such a thing would only be possible, if Baro Ki Teer stops selling Primed Mods.

or

Fusion Core drop rate is increased and Credit Cost to do fusion is severely reduced.

 

Without any of those 2 options coming to effect, we cannot possibly do this. There is no such time to accomplish it.

 

The problem with the current cost of Ducats on Ducat-Purchases, is that even the biggest farmers, are having their keys drained much faster than they can earn them, to be able to do this...more evidence to the 'Bubble burst' thats going to happen.

Could instead be an upgrade to an already maxed original mod with no credit cost for buying from Baro (and cut his ducat prices in half) but add a credit fee on upgrading the mod based on how many levels (should be 5 ranks!) away from rank 10 the original is. Natural progression beats Disjointed progression. And Baro would sell 1 new rotation + 1 randomly selected old rotation. Keeps people coming back to check. Doesn't murder casuals. Doesn't make your original mods obsolete. Uses cores sunk cost from original mod.

 

Example: Continuity Rank 5 (maxed) -> Apply Primed Upgrade (pay credit fee) -> Primed Continuity Rank 5

 

Primed Continuity Rank 5  would then use fusing energy requirements of Legendary cores from Rank 1 to Rank 5 to reach Primed Continuity Rank 10 (maxed).

 

And increase the legendary core fusing energy requirements for ranks 1 to 5 so that the total is around ~100-200 Rare 5 cores.

 

And for rank 3 mods -> Buff the original to rank 5 before making a rank 10 version. Primed reach has too much of a difference compared to its rank 3 original mod.

Edited February 19, 2015 by MaverickZero

[ndantony]

You missed the entire point... If these Primed Mods and Ducat-Weapons keep coming out at the rate they are....NOBODY will be able to afford them all. It is currently draining people to ZERO and after that, POP goes the economy, and a looot of people start leaving the game.

Is 16 hours a day not enough?

Since the earliest days of beta, (where a lot of us started) it has been our goal to earn everything, collect everything, upgrade everything, scan everything, and even reach the top goal in every Event, to reach the highest account-rank. If that's not for you, thats fine! Just carry on as you are, but some of us here who have painstakingly worked to the bone who understand the games economy to it's pinnacle, need to have costs changed in order for the economy to even work. What good is giving us new Primed mods and Weapons if very soon nobody can afford them...

If you dont want to play the game or collect everything, thats on you, and you have no right to tell others how they should be playing, or how much. This topic doesnt even concern or involve you.

Game Content itself in Warframe can be completed within a couple of weeks....if your ideology after that is for me to slow down or stop playing, you must be off your nut.

I and so many other people, WANT to collect everything, HAVE been collecting everything and HAVE been WORKING NON STOP to achieve this...you cannot simply change the goal posts whenever a very small minority are able to ONLY climb over the wall by paying a sick amount of real life money to afford the credits and fusion core packs. That excludes everyone else from earning things in the game, including you....which is why im absolutely baffled anybody would even want to try and defend the current costs in the Warframe economy.

Wether youre a casual player.

Wether youre a hardcore gamer.

Wether youre a whale gamer.

The current costs of Fusion and Credits/Ducats in Warframe, is about to become impossible, for EVERYONE.

Unless DE looks at this, hopefully takes a veterens advice from the evidence shown, and prevent the bubbleburst.

The bubble bursts for people at different times, but as soon as they run out of credits, BOOM. You've hit it, and can no longer afford all ducat purchases, and have absolutely NO hope of ranking up these 10lvl mods. Welcome to the recession. And right here is where a LOT of people will quit the game.

I like the amount of primed mods coming out at the moment. I don't see anything is wrong with it, other than the cost of ducats for these items has been raised, for some items. But you have the community to grieve for that. I remember to have read some posts that people were still complaining that these were too cheaps and they still had too many ducats to spare, and some buying many same extra legendary mods to play around with it. It's true that people don't value what they can earn too easily. I don't blame DE for that.

16 hours a day... I don't think the majority of the community comprises of players with a large amount of hours, or 16 hours a day everyday to play Warframe. Maybe in my retirement years, I may have that much of time to spare. Otherwise, I think more players are those who have school, jobs and family priorities. Many are casual players and some have money to spend supporting the game.

However, even with my casual playstyle most of the time, playing an hour or less a day, I still have not missed collecting all of these items, primed mods and primed items, before and since the Trader's appearance, and even when the cost increased recently. There is more things wrong with a player, than the game, if he has played 16 hours a day and still not having enough ducats. Nevertheless, DE also allows us obtaining these legendary mods via trade.

Now, powering up the R10 legendary mods is a different story. They don't call these legendary for nothing. I do support feedback to have DE give us a more easy way and quickly to max these mods. Heck. I too would "poor gas over fire", too, to pressure DE to make it easier. Who wouldn't want that?! But... these are legendary mods, after all. It's hard and takes some works, but not impossible. Also, DE is still in process to add more major updates and contents to the game. More things to be seen.

Last, if you have played Warframe and come to the point to see the game at this "desperate end", maybe it's time to take a break. If it's not for you to re-evaluate your life, there are more games, including f2p, out there to play and refresh yourself. Warframe is an awesome game, free to play and support, with regular updates and new contents... but it may not be yet a game for someone to spend 16 hours a day or 6,000 hours a year.

[SnakeWildlife]

-snip-

 

Its not possible to play casually and have enough credits per <2 weeks and afford the approx 800,000 for Ducat Purchases and Millions more for thinking about upgrading any of the mods.

 

Unless you spend the platinum.....interested in how much that costs?

 

You have actually convinced me to go ahead and show you the actual mathematics of how much it would cost you, if you wanted to buy your way to keeping up with mod releases. Yeesh my brain hurts after this.

 

Here: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/74747669/TheMath.png

 

I have updated the original post to include the platinum math.

[ndantony]

Its not possible to play casually and have enough credits per weeks and afford the approx 800,000 for Ducat Purchases and Millions more for thinking about upgrading any of the mods.

Unless you spend the platinum.....interested in how much that costs?

You have actually convinced me to go ahead and show you the actual mathematics of how much it would cost you, if you wanted to buy your way to keeping up with mod releases. Yeesh my brain hurts after this.

Here: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/74747669/TheMath.png

I have updated the original post to include the platinum math.

800,000 ducats every 2 weeks?? Ok. I don't think I need to prove anything then.

[SnakeWildlife]

800,000 ducats every 2 weeks?? Ok. I don't think I need to prove anything then.

800,000 credits. What game are you playing? Remember as well as 1100 ducats approx, they also cost credits.

[Kasarian]

approx 800,000 for Ducat Purchases

 

800,000 ducats every 2 weeks?? Ok. I don't think I need to prove anything then.

 

800k for buying stuff with ducats not for ducats themselves.

[ndantony]

800,000 credits. What game are you playing? Remember as well as 1100 ducats approx, they also cost credits.

So, you are complaining also because you cannot afford 800,000 credits (or too many credits required) for every 2 two weeks, even though you have played 16 hours a day??

[taiiat]

-snip-

so to sum it up, yes, you're complaining that you have too much of a goal in the game.

it's on the Player if they decide to sell both of their legs and one arm to afford an action in a game that is by far not necessary.

i am literally only hearing "i can't outpace the release speed of things in the game and get bored and complain about it, so i'm going to complain about it.".

sure, maybe a few Players that are incapable of managing their own wallet will leave. but i would certainly hope that most Players are capable of balancing their Checkbook and never jumping off the deep end.

[SnakeWildlife]

So, you are complaining also because you cannot afford 800,000 credits (or too many credits required) for every 2 two weeks, even though you have played 16 hours a day??

 

No the majority of the community +1ing this topic are complaining because you need over 1400 Fusion cores, 4 Million Credits per <2 weeks which is not possible without thousands of £/$ spent every 2 weeks on credit/fusion core bundles.  Please PROPERLY READ the OP before you jump into this. No offense but this isnt a simple problem and you are (many times) misreading the entire thing.

 

The 1100 Ducats (approx) although expensive and takes a great deal of keys and time is obtainable, the rest however, is IMPOSSIBLE.

Edited February 19, 2015 by SnakeWildlife

[Onisa]

It also all comes down to the game's infamous RNG. If RNGesius smiles upon you it's possible to keep up with the content and make slow progress towards ranking those mods up. However if you haven't sacrificed your baker's dozen of virgin mourning doves this lunar cycle there's a decent chance you won't be able to keep up. And a potentially two year cycle is not an acceptable amount of time for a second shot. For all any of us know the game will be dead and gone by then.

[exaCel]

Thank you SnakeWildlife for taking the time to post something to this effect. While I believe that "impossible" is a rather harsh term to use in this case (unrealistic is more accurate), the wall of time required to acquire high-tier weapons, armour, and gear is severely off-putting to many players.

 

I think that Digital Extremes should at least look over your arguments. You make several excellent points that I believe need to be addressed. While I do not play Warframe nearly as much as you do, I have been noticing the significant amount of time and effort required to do seemingly simple tasks in this game. It has only been increasing since Baro Ki'Teer was implemented (not that I'm against the idea of his implementation).

[ndantony]

No the majority of the community +1ing this topic are complaining because you need over 1400 Fusion cores, 4 Million Credits per <2 weeks

....

The 1100 Ducats (approx) although expensive and takes a great deal of keys and time is obtainable, the rest however, is IMPOSSIBLE.

No. YOU "need"! And that right there, what you just wrote, says everything about your argument and what you are basing on. Yes. I would agree too. Very depressing way of spending your life.

[SnakeWildlife]

No. YOU "need"! And that right there, what you just wrote, says everything about your argument and what you are basing on. Yes. I would agree too. Very depressing way of spending your life.

 

I can see you dont really understand the point, and hold some kind of grudge over people who want to earn most things in this game.

 

I strongly suggest you exit this topic, because it does not effect you.   Because it does not effect you, you dont need to post.

 

I am happy with my life playing Warframe, so much so, that i want it improve it and support it.  If you dont, thats your problem, there are other games. You arent reading the topic properly before you post, you arent contributing to a proper debate, and clearly just have some kind of issue with people who want to enjoy all of the content.

 

If you just want to create confilct> theres the door.

Edited February 19, 2015 by SnakeWildlife

[EversorNinja]

Yes, this is ridiculous. But if you don't want to grind all that, then don't. I am a completionist myself, but long ago I realized that I'd be a lot happier if I was a completionist about Monster Hunter, Metroid, KotOR, etc. and just play Warframe when an update launches. Because of that, I've really started enjoying video games again

 

I am happy with my life playing Warframe, so much so, that i want it improve it and support it.  If you dont, thats your problem, there are other games. 

 

Well I only read the first post, looks like my point is not original in this thread. Just ignore me

Edited February 19, 2015 by EversorNinja

[CY13ERPUNK]

Again, the point went right over your head.

 

I don't want to/can't say "shutup" on the forums... but boy if I could. The Primed mods WERE a long grind, and a reasonably lengthed long-term goal before the droprate nerf. I literally cannot stress that enough. Moving them out of the Void was good, yes. But a drop rate of 25% considering the ever-increasing amount of R10's that are coming into the game, is not good. This isn't about being a completionist (atleast for me, it isn't), it's about having reasonable and obtainable goals in the game. Now you cannot farm R5 cores (which was fun for me, and not some "mindless task I did that felt like a job") without it just feeling like blatant gambling and a waste of time.

 

Also, don't group me in with the "NEED EVERYTHING IMMA COMPLETIONIST" group of people. I don't care about that stuff - hell, I've been playing for 9 months, but I'm still MR8. I take this game slowly, and play how I want for fun because I'm the type of person who gets burnt out easily. That being said, I'm still not going to purposely let myself pass the opportunity to get stronger (Primed mods), and I don't want to feel like I'm not progressing at all (need R5's to level up Primed mods). So, you should see why I don't like this change. I don't want to constantly grind, and I want to play how I like. Before I couldn't reasonably max Primed mods within a few months, which was fine; I just got them to Rank 8. But now, I can't even level them up at all. 

 

man, its like you just cant see the forest for the trees....

 

i get it, you think the grind is too much

 

sry i disagree and i think your arguments and the OP are completely off-base 

 

I see a lot of people commenting "you don't NEED to have every mod and item"

 

Well, that isn't the point, the point is that I WANT them, and I should be able to obtain them without struggling.

 

 

+1 to OP, the cred costs NEED to go down

 

haha, well kudos to this person, at least you have to gall to just come out and say it =P

 

this is the fundamental problem with the OP's argument, of which so many of us disagree, it's all about WANT (thus the entire argument breaks down into a whiny : 'but i want it' cry)

 

bottom line, anyone in favor of the OP is doing so becuz they want to have the primed mods and/or whatev 'power' is associated for less effort

 

while myself I think the 1million trading credit is a bit harsh for the primed mods (i think a reasonable six figures would have been enough), i completely disagree that the primed mods should require less fusion/creds to rank up and im completely fine with DE introducing them as they have

 

the reason that the primed mods are released at the rate that they are and why they cost so much to rank up is to reduce the gross # of players who are capable of having/maxing all of them, they've been priced to be a rare commodity that not everyone can attain/afford, this is not rocket science ppl

[SnakeWildlife]

-snipped message-

man, its like you just cant see the forest for the trees....

 

it's all about WANT (thus the entire argument breaks down into a whiny : 'but i want it' cry)

 

i completely disagree that the primed mods should require less fusion/creds to rank up and im completely fine with DE introducing them as they have

 

 

Man where is the -1 button on this forum.

[ndantony]

I can see you dont really understand the point, and hold some kind of grudge over people who want to earn most things in this game.

I strongly suggest you exit this topic, because it does not effect you. Because it does not effect you, you dont need to post.

I am happy with my life playing Warframe, so much so, that i want it improve it and support it. If you dont, thats your problem, there are other games. You arent reading the topic properly before you post, you arent contributing to a proper debate, and clearly just have some kind of issue with people who want to enjoy all of the content.

If you just want to create confilct> theres the door.

Nice twisting, even just comparing that post to your OP. Also, whenever people have pointed out to you about your narrowed assumption, the flaws of your thinking and logics, you balked back that the topic doesn't concern them and suggest them to leave. Now, you even try to paint yourself as a passion player and want to support Warframe; that it is not you who has grudge, but that I have grudge against your success. LOL.

Fittingly snake, I would said.