EmptyDevil Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 And this isn'y your private playground where only your opinion matters ;] If I want to express mine. I'm free to do so. Oh and I can see that You're starting to lose patientce. Arguments run dry ? maybe another haters gona hate pic ? But to be more rational and civil. This is how I see whats going on on Chromas head : It's just an allegory. The one the the left is in this case a "dragon" head, cape, pelt that covers the head. The one on the right is "Chroma" head. From the side they will be kind of similliar. But one can sense that there is something off about it. Please show me where i said only my opinion matters :) Starting to lose patiences? How can you see if i'm losing patience through typing? What argument? You mean to tell me that after 290 something pages of the original thread plus this one, is where you think arguments are running dry? Anyway, me and many others have said before. We know how you see it. The sad part about you and the other Chroma haters is, that you believe dragons can only look a certain very specific way. So even if you see what we see, you claim it can't be a dragon because the snout is too long or narrow. Absolutely no ability to understand that the appearance of dragons can vary or the inability to see what could have been done to turn a dragon pelt's snout into a flamethrower. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sorez Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 What have I done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Jack.Of.Blades- Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) You missed my point entirely. One can objectively state whether the shapes presented are the same shapes from the many classic (as in pre-movies and video games) depictions of dragons of various cultures around the world. In that case, Chromas head does not have the same shapes. Does that mean Chroma cannot evoke "dragon" to the subjective mind? no. Does that mean that Chroma cannot have inspirations from any form of dragon? no. Those is different issues then what I wrote about. For clarity purpose: The long snout alone isn't the issue, Chroma has some round, bulbous extensions on the top and bottom that are not consistent with any traditional dragon aesthetic. I heard (read) you the first time. I'm not arguing that bottom jaw is not cut off or that the head isnt supposed to be a pelt. I'm saying that even if that is true the shaping doesn't match up. "You missed my point entirely. One can objectively state whether the shapes presented are the same shapes from the many classic (as in pre-movies and video games) depictions of dragons of various cultures around the world."I never stated that you couldn't objectively state that but please continue. "Chromas head does not have the same shapes."I'm not arguing if he looks like an old depiction of a dragon.I'm arguing how he resembles a dragon. "Does that mean that Chroma cannot have inspirations from any form of dragon? no. Those is different issues then what I wrote about."this part says otherwise"Chroma's head shape is not reminiscent of any dragon or sea serpent of myth.Not the western, not the asian, not the greek, not the southern hemispheres...etc.It simply isn't"which I counter argued with when does art of a dragon stop being myth because dragons in itself are steeped into myth.Also when does a dragon stop being of eastern/western when drawn by said eastern/western artist? p.s I did not see any word for "classic" depictions in that original argument but if you want to change what you said on the go to win this arguement by all means flip-flop from what you stated earlier. Edited March 12, 2015 by -Jack.Of.Blades- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tocorro Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Please show me where i said only my opinion matters :) Starting to lose patiences? How can you see if i'm losing patience through typing? What argument? You mean to tell me that after 290 something pages of the original thread plus this one, is where you think arguments are running dry? Anyway, me and many others have said before. We know how you see it. The sad part about you and the other Chroma haters is, that you believe dragons can only look a certain very specific way. So even if you see what we see, you claim it can't be a dragon because the snout is too long or narrow. Absolutely no ability to understand that the appearance of dragons can vary or the inability to see what could have been done to turn a dragon pelt's snout into a flamethrower. That is true. I can never see a dragon in a sea-horse. I won't deny it. I have a certain image of dragon, or dragons (if You like) inside my head. Chroma doesn't meet it. It's just too far of. Don't know why but I remembered now when Apple launched one of their iPhones with antena somewhere in the frame, so there were times when You had no reception while holding a phone in your hand. Jobs himslef instructed ppl that they are holding the phone the wrong way.... Hey ! it's a feature right ? Not a bad design ? ;] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmptyDevil Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 That is true. I can never see a dragon in a sea-horse. I won't deny it. I have a certain image of dragon, or dragons (if You like) inside my head. Chroma doesn't meet it. It's just too far of. Don't know why but I remembered now when Apple launched one of their iPhones with antena somewhere in the frame, so there were times when You had no reception while holding a phone in your hand. Jobs himslef instructed ppl that they are holding the phone the wrong way.... Hey ! it's a feature right ? Not a bad design ? ;] I don't follow iPhones, so i have no clue what you're talking about. I'll say that the people who were holding it wrong should have known better. Not hard to tell if your phone is right side up. Most phones nowadays don't have a visible antenna outside of it too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronyn Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) "I'm not arguing if he looks like an old depiction of a dragon.I'm arguing how he resembles a dragon. As I said, what he evokes in the subjective mind is up to each person. "Does that mean that Chroma cannot have inspirations from any form of dragon? no. Those is different issues then what I wrote about."this part says otherwise"Chroma's head shape is not reminiscent of any dragon or sea serpent of myth.Not the western, not the asian, not the greek, not the southern hemispheres...etc.It simply isn't" There is no contradiction. Inspiration being from something, and the end result having the same shaping aren't the same thing. Example: many of the professional people who design the bodies for cars often sight things like "the curves of a beautiful woman" or "the stance of a jungle cat" as their inspiration. Did those things inspire their design? yep. Does the resulting car actually share the shapes of a woman or a tiger? no. At lest not directly. "which I counter argued with when does art of a dragon stop being myth because dragons in itself are steeped into myth.Also when does a dragon stop being of eastern/western when drawn by said eastern/western artist? Again, the context is in relation to the classic (pre-movies and games) depictions..... p.s I did not see any word for "classic" depictions in that original argument but if you want to change what you said on the go to win this arguement by all means flip-flop from what you stated earlier. I apologize, I have been having this discussion for days now and I mistakenly thought it was clear by now what I was referring to. Hopefully it is clear now. Edited March 12, 2015 by Ronyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Takatashi Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 People are just refusing to try seeing it as anything else now, because that will make them wrong and nobody wants to admit that they are wrong, especially on the internet. If you still can't see the resemblance that its a pelt over the head then there is no helping you. The pelt clearly assimilated with Chroma'a armor and thats how it gives him powers =_= You are right. Zephyr does look more like a dragon than Chroma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiteoHatto Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Don't get us, as ignorants. We see the helmet, and the faceplate. We just disagree that wahtever is covering ir from the top was once a dragon. And if it was, it must have been a sick one ;) Oh, and why the hell does it have a tounge sticking out ??? That "tongue" is a tip of Chroma's actual helmet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Jack.Of.Blades- Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 That is true. I can never see a dragon in a sea-horse. I won't deny it. I have a certain image of dragon, or dragons (if You like) inside my head. Chroma doesn't meet it. It's just too far of. Don't know why but I remembered now when Apple launched one of their iPhones with antena somewhere in the frame, so there were times when You had no reception while holding a phone in your hand. Jobs himslef instructed ppl that they are holding the phone the wrong way.... Hey ! it's a feature right ? Not a bad design ? ;] "That is true. I can never see a dragon in a sea-horse. I won't deny it."No part of what emptyDevil said did he/she imply that you can see how a sea-horse looks like a dragon unless that's your way of making a witty insult?very mature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Takatashi Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 That "tongue" is a tip of Chroma's actual helmet. actualy that "tongue" is a pair of rabbit teeth http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140426141735/looneytunes/images/9/95/287065-171332-bugs-bunny.jpg PS: The linked image still looks more like a dragon than Chroma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tocorro Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) Yeah, there is no helping you people anymore. I think this would be a proper proportion of Chromas head to Zephyr's one : And yeah, that's a Leafy Sea Dragon on top :) Poorly made in paint at that (for what I'm sorry) :) Edited March 12, 2015 by tocorro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiteoHatto Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
immolator1001 Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 DE said it'll be a "lucky dragon" hopefully its a nice mix of support and damage, maybe even enemy debuff. Think we'll finally get 100% element resistance with him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Jack.Of.Blades- Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) As I said, what he evokes in the subjective mind is up to each person. There is no contradiction. Inspiration being from something, and the end result having the same shaping aren't the same thing. Example: many of the professional people who design the bodies for cars often sight things like "the curves of a beautiful woman" or "the stance of a jungle cat" as their inspiration. Did those things inspire their design? yep. Does the resulting car actually share the shapes of a woman or a tiger? no. At lest not directly. Again, the context is in relation to the classic (pre-movies and games) depictions..... I apologize, I have been having this discussion for days now and I mistakenly thought it was clear by now what I was referring to. Hopefully it is clear now. "There is no contradiction." stating that ""Does that mean that Chroma cannot have inspirations from any form of dragon? no." and have stated in the original post"Chroma's head shape is not reminiscent of any dragon or sea serpent of myth."which I argued that dragons in itself are of myth,implying a contradiction between the two statements. "I apologize, I have been having this discussion for days now and I mistakenly thought it was clear by now what I was referring to. Hopefully it is clear now."so you have been arguing about classic drawings of dragons instead of the general eastern/western dragons artists draw?I doubt you were that clear in past posts. btw just out of curiosity sense you imply "classic" could you argue that the dragon from the avatar the last air bender which in itself is considered a classic wouldn't apply that http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/avatar/images/1/13/Dragons_firebending.png/revision/20101227020211 isn't a classic depiction of a dragon? Edited March 12, 2015 by -Jack.Of.Blades- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tocorro Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) -snip- Yes I know it's a face plate. I rotate the pic to have a comparison to Zephyr's head with that piece of dragon on top of it. And I know that outlined in green there is some creature covering the top. I can see that too. It just doesn't look alright to me. It's way to long and way to narrow. It looks like a cap made of human sized leafy sea dragon, or gharial head. Edited March 12, 2015 by tocorro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Jack.Of.Blades- Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) Yea that's what I was thinking as well :D.GJ with showing it in the pic though I am suborn in belief that it isn't a pelt XD and more like a full dragon helm because I also think that warframes aren't required to have face plates in the traditional sense of medieval Knight Helms. Edited March 12, 2015 by -Jack.Of.Blades- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hayzemet Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 How many people attended TennoLive? because that surely isn't the whole community. Remember DE has roughly 14 million players if correct. So the few that were there and the few on the forums throwing a hissy fit aren't the majority. You'd need to ask a lot more players that don't even visit the forums to know the real majority. There is something called statistics... and they are vastly used... Anyway I do like the design, but no one can argue agaist the fact that most, yes MOST, of the people think he is damn ugly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiteoHatto Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) Yes I know it's a face plate. I rotate the pic to have a comparison to Zephyr's head with that piece of dragon on top of it. And I know that outlined in green there is some creature covering the top. I can see that too. It just doesn't look alright to me. It's way to long and way to narrow. It looks like a cap made of human sized leafy sea dragon. Or gharial. We don't know what dragons look like in warframe universe, but its not fair to not see them as dragons just because they don't have scales. Yet, we don't have any problem accepting dhraks, kubrows and those sea creature things found in the codex. Why can't you just open your view a little to see how DE added a their own mutated twist to things ? Just because it's a small fire-breating futuristic creature its not a dragon anymore because it doesn't have scales and is not the size of a building ? Really ? Edited March 12, 2015 by kiteohatto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aroran_Svitskna Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 i like the design of Chroma but its the damn helmet it just.... it doesnt "feel" like a dragon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RahuHordika Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 There is something called statistics... and they are vastly used... Anyway I do like the design, but no one can argue agaist the fact that most, yes MOST, of the people think he is damn ugly Then please by all means, do show us these statistics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Jack.Of.Blades- Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 i like the design of Chroma but its the damn helmet it just.... it doesnt "feel" like a dragon Nothing wrong with not liking the helm,Hopefully the alt helm is to your pleasing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Pengu_Imperialus Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 Then please by all means, do show us these statistics. To quote, "There are lies, damn lies, and statistics." lol. No one will be able to even pretend to know the true, and wider, community reaction till it goes on sell. So, I have no idea why someone would say "I have statistics that proove it's the worst thing ever". I personally like it. It's atypical and ugly in a great way. Also it breathes fire so it's a dragon or at least has a dragon subclass so close enough for a space ninja. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tocorro Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) Then please by all means, do show us these statistics. Sample of statistic on 1st page. It's the Poll. Large enough sample of community, based on what we got from there You can be sure that adding more ppl to it won't change proportions much. So 24% like him, 24& says "meh", 47% says "ugly". and it's over 1900 votes. That is a good statistic. I don't follow iPhones, so i have no clue what you're talking about. I'll say that the people who were holding it wrong should have known better. Not hard to tell if your phone is right side up. Most phones nowadays don't have a visible antenna outside of it too. Well it was a funny thing. It's not that people were holding it incorectly. Or upside down. They were using it normally. Apple enginerees screwd up. Ppl were using it normally. And CEO of Apple told them they're doing it wrong. See for yourslef. Does that guy holding it wrong ? How do You hold Your phone then ? :) Edited March 12, 2015 by tocorro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmptyDevil Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 There is something called statistics... and they are vastly used... Anyway I do like the design, but no one can argue agaist the fact that most, yes MOST, of the people think he is damn ugly Yea something called statistics and that you aren't using them. You can not use an extremely small sample to get accurate statistics for 14 million people. This is basically what is going on with Chroma's snout for the unimaginative. This. Plus. This. Equals this. But why does his snout look so cylindrical? Tell me how his flamethrower won't burn his face off if it wasn't cylindrical. Go build yourself a flamethrower with the bottom of the accelerant spewing nozzle cut away and explain why it's nearly setting you on fire. Basically the top part of the dragon's snout is wrapped around to complete the nozzle. That is probably why people see a seahorse when it's obviously a dragon. Inability to deconstruct and reconstruct what they are looking at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiteoHatto Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 (edited) Just because something doesn't look exactly as you normally picture it, does not mean it's not that thing. That's like saying that this is not a bear because it lacks fur. Edited March 12, 2015 by kiteohatto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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