Pvp 2.0 And Balance Vs Halos Pvp

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

I really hope that pvp 2.0 in warframe can compare with halo and its balance of rock/paper/scissors or better said shotgun/sniper/assault rifle.

 

What do you guys think how balanced warframes pvp will be?

Edited March 18, 2015 by -Jack.Of.Blades-

[-Hyperion-]

I hope it's not that simplistic. Hopefully it'll come down to more than just having the better/worse weapon.

 

I'm looking forward to it though. Seems like the PvP team is working pretty hard on it.

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

I hope it's not that simplistic. Hopefully it'll come down to more than just having the better/worse weapon.

 

I'm looking forward to it though. Seems like the PvP team is working pretty hard on it.

Agreed like I don't want to see a guy with a shotgun out gunning a guy with a braton at medium range.

[xFayt]

2 problems with this.  Halo's weapons were made for the intent on balance when faced against one weapon with another.  Warframe's weapons were not.  It would mean having to force stats on weapons, forcing builds that were once there to either be gone entirely, or very nerfed.  The other problem is how Warframe differs from Halo in terms of "suits."  Halo has a number of powers, but will limit players to one only.  Warframe has a multitude of suits with 4 powers, each being very different, and each being better in certain situations.  If you really wanted to compare Warframe and Halo in terms of PvP, you should keep in mind how Rhino's Iron Skin and Ash's Shuriken behave.

[Rakshal]

I doubt it will be that, I just hope for a bit of balance.

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

Oh god please not halo. It's a one time thing, halo should be halo and halo should be exclusive to halo. Lets the devs make warframe play like warframe that defines it as warframe.

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

2 problems with this.  Halo's weapons were made for the intent on balance when faced against one weapon with another.  Warframe's weapons were not.  It would mean having to force stats on weapons, forcing builds that were once there to either be gone entirely, or very nerfed.  The other problem is how Warframe differs from Halo in terms of "suits."  Halo has a number of powers, but will limit players to one only.  Warframe has a multitude of suits with 4 powers, each being very different, and each being better in certain situations.  If you really wanted to compare Warframe and Halo in terms of PvP, you should keep in mind how Rhino's Iron Skin and Ash's Shuriken behave.

Was mostly speaking of guns but what's not to say rhino is the rock and ash is the scissors?

 

Oh god please not halo. It's a one time thing, halo should be halo and halo should be exclusive to halo. Lets the devs make warframe play like warframe that defines it as warframe.

just talking about halo's balance don't worry.

Edited March 18, 2015 by -Jack.Of.Blades-

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

Was mostly speaking of guns but what's not to say rhino is the rock and ash is the scissors?

 

just talking about halo's balance don't worry.

Well thats the thing, each halo had a different variation of that "rock/paper/scissor" balance and  each game was different in terms of balance,

[xFayt]

As far as I'm concerned, this game doesn't have much balance between the guns since the decision between Karak and Soma is an easy one to make.  Each type of weapon has their low performers and their high performers.  If you really wanted balance, then you'd have to either limit the amount of guns that are taken in, or have all the guns on a similar playing field, which would mean a MK1 Braton would have a similar chance at succeeding in PvP against a Soma Prime or a Boltor Prime.  With how many guns there are in this game, you'll have to do one or the other.

Edited March 18, 2015 by xFayt

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

Well thats the thing, each halo had a different variation of that "rock/paper/scissor" balance and  each game was different in terms of balance,

I'm confused what your point is no offense 0_0?is it that halo 2s pistols are more OP then halo 3s? in which case I have problems seeing how that pertains to the "don't make warframe balanced like halo" argument 0_0.

 

As far as I'm concerned, this game doesn't have much balance between the guns since the decision between Karak and Soma is an easy one to make.  Each type of weapon has their low performers and their high performers.  If you really wanted balance, then you'd have to either limit the amount of guns that are taken in, or have all the guns on a similar playing field, which would mean a MK1 Braton would have a similar chance at succeeding in PvP against a Soma Prime or a Boltor Prime.  With how many guns there are in this game, you'll have to do one or the other.

that's kinda what I would hope for like soma and boltor that they would be relatively the same because lets face it the change to crits for pvp with only headshots it would make the soma's high crit chance useless .

Edited March 18, 2015 by -Jack.Of.Blades-

[Morec0]

2 problems with this.  Halo's weapons were made for the intent on balance when faced against one weapon with another.  Warframe's weapons were not.  It would mean having to force stats on weapons, forcing builds that were once there to either be gone entirely, or very nerfed.  The other problem is how Warframe differs from Halo in terms of "suits."  Halo has a number of powers, but will limit players to one only.  Warframe has a multitude of suits with 4 powers, each being very different, and each being better in certain situations.  If you really wanted to compare Warframe and Halo in terms of PvP, you should keep in mind how Rhino's Iron Skin and Ash's Shuriken behave.

 

This is basically how it's working, is it not? Certain weapons and frames aren't available, certain mods aren't available. It was redesigned from the ground up with PvP and PvP only in mind as its own separate thing.

[xFayt]

This is basically how it's working, is it not? Certain weapons and frames aren't available, certain mods aren't available. It was redesigned from the ground up with PvP and PvP only in mind as its own separate thing.

 

I haven't looked at PvP 2.0 yet, so I don't know what DE has in mind for it.  Just shelling out the problems of PvP in general in Warframe.

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

I haven't looked at PvP 2.0 yet, so I don't know what DE has in mind for it.  Just shelling out the problems of PvP in general in Warframe.

make sure to read up on pvp 2.0 before commented on pvp 2.0 no offense 0_0 it makes for awkward moments.

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

I'm confused what your point is no offense 0_0?is it that halo 2s pistols are more OP then halo 3s? in which case I have problems seeing how that pertains to the "don't make warframe balanced like halo" argument 0_0.

Well lets say.

Halo Combat Evloved: Where Pistols dominated and rifles destroyed.

 

In halo 2 there was the addition of precision weapons so essentially the guy with the better strafe and aim would win. But the auto weapons were almost at the same level and had a comfortable place. But no matter what, the weapon that took the most skill would have the edge.

 

Halo 3 Same thing but there was a nerf to autos making precision weapons more prominent.

 

In halo 1-3 there was more aggressive play, this is because once in contact with another player you could not escape. Power weapons were in a nice place.

 

Halo:Reach was a balance between conservative/aggressive game play. Once again precision weapons won, but pistols had somewhat of a hierarchy as well.

 

Then the Halo Modern Solider Warfrare. Where play is completely conservative, the weapons with the least skill are more rewarding, and the power weapons were overpowered beyond belief. (Do not make it like this)

 

There needs to be a gap of skill in warframe, it needs to promote aggressive game play since most shooters focus on conservative. Weapons that take more skill to use should be more rewarding. but to make it like halo, would just make it unoriginal.

Edited March 18, 2015 by DrOP_

[xFayt]

Well lets say.

Halo Combat Evloved: Where Pistols dominated and rifles destroyed.

 

In halo 2 there was the addition of precision weapons so essentially the guy with the better strafe and aim would win. But the auto weapons were almost at the same level and had a comfortable place. But no matter what, the weapon that took the most skill would have the edge.

 

Halo 3 Same thing but there was a nerf to autos making precision weapons more prominent.

 

In halo 1-3 there was more aggressive play, this is because once in contact with another player you could not escape. Power weapons were in a nice place.

 

Halo:Reach was a balance between conservative/aggressive game play. Once again precision weapons won, but pistols had somewhat of a hierarchy as well.

 

Then the Halo Modern Solider Warfrare. Where play is completely conservative, the weapons with the least skill are more rewarding, and the power weapons were overpowered beyond belief. (Do not make it like this)

 

There needs to be a gap of skill in warframe, it needs to promote aggressive game play since most shooters focus on conservative. Weapons that take more skill to use should be more rewarding. but to make it like halo, would just make it unoriginal.

 

Instead of using the entire series, let's stick with in general.  Nothing too specific.  Remember, this is one game.  We don't have to compare an entire series to it.

 

Edit: Now that I've actually read it, you're talking about how the PvP will flow.  With how this game is, and how much damage the weapons suggested do against a bare naked warframe, I'd say it's sufficient to say that how you play will severely affect the outcome.  For example, place 2 Excals in a small map, one using a Braton, and the other using a Paris.  Obviously, the Braton has the advantage as it is a hitscan, but Paris has the damage advantage.  Since I'm sure both players will be very mobile, Braton will be able to constantly shoot the other due to it being an assault rifle.  The other Excal might not be able to, but it can capitalize on when the Braton Excal lands, since it'll force him into a path that the Paris Excal knows he will take.

Edited March 18, 2015 by xFayt

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

-snip-

"There needs to be a gap of skill in warframe, it needs to promote aggressive game play since most shooters focus on conservative. Weapons that take more skill to use should be more rewarding. but to make it like halo, would just make it unoriginal."I still forget to see your point how balancing a game makes it unoriginal.

 

also this post on halo 2 guns balance is agreeing with what I'm trying to say"the weapon that took the most skill would have the edge."

 

from the part saying "warframe balanced like halo is unoriginal" "warframe,it needs to promote aggressive game play since most shooters focus on conservative. Weapons that take more skill to use should be more rewarding."this agrees on what I'm going for,more calculated trades shotgun vs assault right+close range=shotgun wins or better yet sniper rifle vs shotgun+headshot with sniper=sniper wins with skill,

Edited March 18, 2015 by -Jack.Of.Blades-

[vaugahn]

2 problems with this.  Halo's weapons were made for the intent on balance when faced against one weapon with another.  Warframe's weapons were not.  It would mean having to force stats on weapons, forcing builds that were once there to either be gone entirely, or very nerfed.  

 

That's the whole point of PvP 2.0, making weapons suitable for a competitive environment. 

[xFayt]

That's the whole point of PvP 2.0, making weapons suitable for a competitive environment. 

 

I do hope you read the entire thread.

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

That's the whole point of PvP 2.0, making weapons suitable for a competitive environment. 

indeed he stated he didn't read up much on pvp 2.0

Edited March 18, 2015 by -Jack.Of.Blades-

[vaugahn]

I do hope you read the entire thread.

indeed he stated he didn't read up much on pvp 2.0 XD

 

I had just started at the top when I posted that. Oops.

[-Jack.Of.Blades-]

I had just started at the top when I posted that. Oops.

No worries it happens.

[xbone]

2 problems with this.  Halo's weapons were made for the intent on balance when faced against one weapon with another.  Warframe's weapons were not.  It would mean having to force stats on weapons, forcing builds that were once there to either be gone entirely, or very nerfed.  The other problem is how Warframe differs from Halo in terms of "suits."  Halo has a number of powers, but will limit players to one only.  Warframe has a multitude of suits with 4 powers, each being very different, and each being better in certain situations.  If you really wanted to compare Warframe and Halo in terms of PvP, you should keep in mind how Rhino's Iron Skin and Ash's Shuriken behave.

there will be pvp accepted weapons and mods,and they said some waframe abilities will behave differently on pvp 2.0