Seen This On Reddit

[Z_Stinger]

don't get mad at DE, it's not their fault, remember Perfect World Entertaiment bought more than the 50% of warframe meaning that DE have their hands tied to what Perfect world ask for em.

If you've ever play'd any Perfect world "Free to play" they all have the same grinding (either pay or spend 99 hours getting to one point), any stealth nerf that have been added is to ensure that grind. Cuz of that DE may have intentionally "miss place them"

[W00Die]

Wow. So so many "I want everything and want that now!" whine.

 

Also

And make no progress.

No. What has to happen is that "playing for fun" has to become a viable way to get stuff.

Been playing for fun since U9. MR14 and going.

 

Also 2

don't get mad at DE, it's not their fault, remember Perfect World Entertaiment bought more than the 50% of warframe meaning that DE have their hands tied to what Perfect world ask for em.

If you've ever play'd any Perfect world "Free to play" they all have the same grinding (either pay or spend 99 hours getting to one point), any stealth nerf that have been added is to ensure that grind. Cuz of that DE may have intentionally "miss place them"

That's an interesting point.

[Liminal]

Also

Been playing for fun since U9. MR14 and going.

What does that matter? I've been here since U5. "Playing for fun" (ie: not farming something specific) still gets me nowhere.

 

Perfect World Entertaiment bought more than the 50% of warframe 

No they didn't. They only have outstanding stocks.

[(PSN)SofeSNBR]

Wow. So so many "I want everything and want that now!" whine.

 

No this is not whine, but legit points what is wrong. False promises, Stealth nerfs etc.  This is support in its own way. Many of us, who ppl like you call "whiners" are here to support. Many of us have supported DE in past, either buying plat or PA or both. Many of us wants Warframe to succeed, and wants it to be great game. Many of us, dont post threads like these in order to bash DE because its cool, but address issues and perhaps give wake up call. 

 

These threads are not made because hate or what your type of guys want to call it, whine. But they are made because passion(at least these civil ones are) As ppl want to adress that way things are going, are alarming. We are worried, as many saw potential in warframe, only to see that potential might end up wasted due bad decisions, poor communication etc.

[CheckYourSix]

Problem isnt waiting time and grind existance, its the fact that with every update they are making it longer and/or more grindy.

Back in u6 we simply had to kill the boss, get 3 parts craft them(12h) and then craft frame itself(3days), majority of weapons could be bought for credits, then with u7 many of starting weapons needed to be crafted,

u8 introduced clantech which needs additional resources and 3 days waiting for anything you want to get and voids which werent that bad at that time.

u9 introduced rare void drops with some parts having 0.52% chance for drop

u10 introduced nekros requiring 2 additional keys before you can farm him.

u11 introduced oxium to make players grind again since veterans had S#&$ton of every other material

u12 introduced tenno lab and with it 6 days of waiting for clantech frames

u13 introduced hydroid, everyone probably remembers coordinates so theres no point in explaining and t4 keys which drop only from interception.

u14 introduced mirage, instead of grind additional 24h of waiting were introduced

u15 introduced archwing where literally every weapon requires parts, then introduced tellerium again because ppl had S#&$ton of everything else.

u16 introduced chroma which is not only additional 24h timewall, but also requires parts from other frames which need to be farmed and built(12h)

 

for past 10 updates de makes it harder to get stuff for free and ppl are getting fed up with it.

i havent even mentioned syndicates and void trader which are nothing but pure grind. 

 

If de was so poor that they needed to worsen grind, why were they able to release all of that new content, making grind worse wasnt requirment, it was pure greed.

 

 

I have no problem with introducing new grinds at all. Adding a long grind to get a new warframe? I'm all for that and don't care about that.

 

Changing the way things were done previously to make them harder to obtain I do not agree with at all.

[r110platinum]

Yes, DE please think about this. The long grind is the fundamental issue for me, not the "press 4 to win" or "Vivers" of the game. If the game weren't so grind heavy to begin with, I think people would be a little more receptive of nerfs for the sake of balance.

[Derikel]

I'll come back to this game regularly when it finally understands that what it needs is fixes to get it out of the beta stage, not dlc. From what I can tell, this game will forever remain in beta, because no one (players and devs alike) seems to treat it as such.

 

Also, vetrans are not looking for a challenge anymore; if they did give us one, we'll adapt too damn quickly. We are looking for more ENGAGING gameplay to keep us coming back. One-hit killing bulletsponges and grind/time walls are not what we are looking for.

 

+1 dude

 

but I fear even DE have no freaking clue where this beta game is heading.

[tinyranitar]

This is my thought on the matter. It's not like we like Draco/Viver, it's fun gameplay doesn't reward us. I don't ask for reward to be handed immidiately, I just want it to be handed at a reasonable pace.

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/423437-de-you-are-doing-it-wrong

[SirDraco]

You sir, have hit the nail on the head. One caviot however, as an avid Excal Prime user, I feared the nerf to Radial Javelin, however I did not notice much of a difference, if any so I was pleasantly surprised about that.

[Mandingy]

Honestly, i think DE should just ignore those that turn themselves into zombies, and focus on how to balance other things. If people want to be boring, generic, farming robots, let them. They'll only cause burnout for themselves, and to be perfectly frank, i'll be happy if people like that quit the game. Why? Well first off, i dont have many friends that play this game, so a lot of my time is spent either solo or with randoms. That being said, there are over 200 total weapons in this game, with around 20 warframes, and there is a ridiculous amount of people that run around with only what they've been told are the "best" weapons and warframes. To each his own i guess, but its just so stale and boring.

Now this is partially DE's fault for 1) overbuffing certain weapons *cough* synoid; and 2) leaving said overbuffed weapons and other "OP" weapons untouched for long periods of time. Obviously they cant nerf everything to the ground, and not every weapon was intended for lategame, but when the community continues to spread arbitrary numbers from WFBuilder like an infection, it starts this whole pandemic of pay2win, and turns 50% of the community into one-trick ponies. People complain that things are too powerful, or not powerful enough. Said things get adjusted, and people complain. The synoid is a prime example. Its DPS is basically the same, it just had its ammo economy nerfed. Big deal, welcome to the Flux Rifle pre-damage 2.0. But lo and behold, people everywhere are complaining about it, but really, what veteran player DIDN'T see this coming? Tactical Potato even mentioned it in his video on the synoid, and bam, it happened.

DE just really needs to think more about the changes they make, because when theu nerf things like excalibur, while keeping the b.s. grineer bleed procs and accuracy, it severely limits the choices when it comes to various missions. I refuse to run high level grineer missions solo, even with my 4 forma saryn using regenerative molt, because my 1300 hp and energy pool cant keep up with the absurd amount of slash procs.

[RS219]

Major nerfs to weapons (synoid gammacor)

 

Don't forget the Kohm, damage falloff has ruined my favourite gun. What am I supposed to use for a reliable damage dealer now? Boltor/Soma Prime? Screw that noise.

 

I moved over to Warframe from Path of Exile, where the devs there at Grinding Gear Games have a severe fetish for their nerf sledgehammer. Nerf player abilities, nerf legendary weapons, nerf player stats, nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf. All this while buffing enemies further and adding more and more chaos damage (just like toxin, bypasses shields BUT players have an innate exceedingly negative resistance to it) environmental hazards, up to initially slapping on infinite-use Vaal gems on their rogue exiles (imagine if you had to kill 40 enemies to use your pre-nerf Radial Javelin, and then the Stalker spawns and simply spams aforementioned pre-nerf Radial Javelin until you're dead... assuming you don't get 1shot even with high health/shields/armour).

 

It got horribly frustrating for me at the end, and I remember one reddit user asking if PoE was secretly a social experiment designed to see what the breaking point is for a dedicated gamer.

 

But you know what? GGG at least had the decency to meticulously announce every single change they made. From every nerf to buff and so on. Or at least that's how it feels according to my rose-tinted glasses, people complaining about stealth nerfs to drop rates there are usually countered by people who are rolling in loot so their RNGesus just has to be alot more fickle.

 

But I digress, I think DE is capable of better than these horrid "stealth nerfs". How about actually discussing these things with the community instead of silently making the change without any warning or announcement and then getting blown over by the inevitable rage? Isn't that like... what... lighting a stick of dynamite and then covering your ears while sitting next to it, thinking that if you don't hear the explosion you'll be 100% unscathed?

 

Edit: Just read the latest hotfix. While there's no announced fix for the Kohm, the nerfs to Rhino in PvP (decaying iron skin, no more arcane vanguard) was sorely needed. There's nothing wrong with a nerf now and then as long as it's properly done is what I'm saying, not when it's a hamfisted attempt at "balance" that then gets quietly passed into the next patch without a word.

Edited March 24, 2015 by RS219

[AlphaHorseman]

OP, I agree with everything you've stated except for the "using our powers judiciously" part, but that's because I'm a caster and I love using all my powers whenever I have them available to me.

 

But other than that, +1.

[(PSN)Borengar629]

I don't feel like DE actually plays this game, and who can blame them? If you worked in a pizza shop you might get tired of pizza.

 

NEVER. Pizza ftw!!!

[Raithon07]

Wow, so much butthurt. Sounds like he didn't even read the patch notes if he isn't even aware of the Excal changes.

 

Also doesn't want to play the game longer than an hour per day or something? You can gain rep by doing anything and everything, it doesn't require draco farming, and never did.

Even though im pretty sure your trolling, i do see some constructive issues pointed out in your post!

DE's rather poor method of conveying changes or even comunicating with us (the community) as a whole. no snubs at Rebbeca or Megan tho they seem to be doing the best they can with what they have. and have openly come out and admited confsuion themselves and better explained changes than other devs in the past.

 

Oh and btw he the redditer did say its possible to do these things. JUST NOT IN A TIMELY OR REASONABLE MANNER. in witch going to school full time id have to agree with.(and also say because of the randomness of RNG that tasks can take anywhere from 5 mins to 4 hours of gameplay.)

[Tyreuzs]

OP, I agree with everything you've stated except for the "using our powers judiciously" part, but that's because I'm a caster and I love using all my powers whenever I have them available to me.

 

But other than that, +1.

What he is talking about is e.g. saryns ultimate, which can be spammed continously to kill all nearby enemys, which takes the challenge out of plenty gamemodes.

[CheckYourSix]

Don't forget the Kohm, damage falloff has ruined my favourite gun. What am I supposed to use for a reliable damage dealer now? Boltor/Soma Prime? Screw that noise.

 

I moved over to Warframe from Path of Exile, where the devs there at Grinding Gear Games have a severe fetish for their nerf sledgehammer. Nerf player abilities, nerf legendary weapons, nerf player stats, nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf nerf. All this while buffing enemies further and adding more and more chaos damage (just like toxin, bypasses shields BUT players have an innate exceedingly negative resistance to it) environmental hazards, up to initially slapping on infinite-use Vaal gems on their rogue exiles (imagine if you had to kill 40 enemies to use your pre-nerf Radial Javelin, and then the Stalker spawns and simply spams aforementioned pre-nerf Radial Javelin until you're dead... assuming you don't get 1shot even with high health/shields/armour).

 

It got horribly frustrating for me at the end, and I remember one reddit user asking if PoE was secretly a social experiment designed to see what the breaking point is for a dedicated gamer.

 

But you know what? GGG at least had the decency to meticulously announce every single change they made. From every nerf to buff and so on. Or at least that's how it feels according to my rose-tinted glasses, people complaining about stealth nerfs to drop rates there are usually countered by people who are rolling in loot so their RNGesus just has to be alot more fickle.

 

But I digress, I think DE is capable of better than these horrid "stealth nerfs". How about actually discussing these things with the community instead of silently making the change without any warning or announcement and then getting blown over by the inevitable rage? Isn't that like... what... lighting a stick of dynamite and then covering your ears while sitting next to it, thinking that if you don't hear the explosion you'll be 100% unscathed?

 

Edit: Just read the latest hotfix. While there's no announced fix for the Kohm, the nerfs to Rhino in PvP (decaying iron skin, no more arcane vanguard) was sorely needed. There's nothing wrong with a nerf now and then as long as it's properly done is what I'm saying, not when it's a hamfisted attempt at "balance" that then gets quietly passed into the next patch without a word.

 

HAHAHA I quit PoE long before any of those nerfs. They were on that sliding trend and I glad I got before that. I still had problems with stuns causing mini disconnects and then getting your character insta-gibbed.

 

Really dumb.

 

I also quit City of Heroes when they did the massive nerf hammer on everything. Hell same with FFIV. Actually pretty much any game that decides to swing massive nerf hammers I quit eventually. It takes all the fun out of the game when the developers take something "fun" even if overpowered and make it useless. It's one thing to make it a game a bit harder, or tweak stuff down by inches, but massive nerf sledge hammers are never fun.

[A.T.R.A.]

so when making a game the first step is creating immersion 

create something to draw that player in 

in this case warframes go to attention puller was flying alien space ninjas with zap zap guns

 

step 2 is a story 

... why the F*** are there flying space ninjas? and wtf are they doing? 

well its taken DE 2 years to give us 1 paragraph as to why and thats really just the stalkers lore imo

 

step 3 (sadly) ... the graphics

sadly its become mandatory for a game to have super pretty graphics if its to do well these days because of little kids having the biggest pull on their parents wallets and the biggest impact on a gaming company 

same goes for honestly ALOT of adults who dont give a S#&$ to do research and just buy off of what they see in a screenshot then complain later 

and DE does a pretty decent job at keeping the game pretty 

 

step 4 length 

now step 4 is pretty dam hard to get right 

you would think with all this tech and man power that creating a game that lasts a long time wouldnt be so dam hard i mean look at dragon age it did very well and you (well i at least) didnt have to farm or grind a single thing in that game and it lasted me 100 hours straight 

 

now is grind bad? nope.  BUT  there is a line between good and bad grind a very easily seen line that only money can turn invisible

and warframe seems to be trying to cut that line so we dont see it and keep playing and paying to keep them alive

sadly thats not how it works DE

 

first off grinding should not take longer then 1 or 2 days of FULL and i mean hours and hours of grind to just get 1 single item

seriously a total of 8 hours in t3 surv since volt prime came out and not even 1 nova or volt piece to be seen 

and thats where i say you are breaking the line 

 

pretty much imagine it this way

when Warframe came out it was like a nice new working desk with plenty of file space and spot to put up your decorations 

.... skip ahead almost 10 updates

and now when want to get S#&$ done you have to open every drawer shifting through all the S#&$ you think you may need down the road so you dont scrap it but you really want to because its in the way of of what you want at the moment 

and as time goes on 

that junk gets bigger and bigger

 

 

the length of a game is effected by every single aspect of everything in the game

bad scripting causing a glitch? extra 10min because loading times and restarting the game and going through the menu to load your last save maybe more because now you didnt hit a checkpoint and have to redo the boss again so + 15-20min

or in warframes case

i need to go kill lephantis to get nekros sooooo

let me go farm keys to then go buy a BP to craft another key to be able to go fight the boss

but hey you dont have the right warframe or a strong enough one or a weapon able to kill 

now that you wasted that key congrats go do it all again but before you attempt it one more time go farm XP and maybe even a whole other warframe able to tank that dmg or a whole other gun able to actualy hurt the boss 

 

and this is all to get 1 warframe thats meant to farm other places to grind more warframes and weapons to get mastery fodder to get what you really want 

but by that time you already have done pretty much everything in the game and have all the planets unlocked and the only reason you have to keep playing is leaderboard bragging rights

 

 

and now with ignorant players thinking their ideas will actually bring more to the game its just increasing the amount of nothing there is to do turning this into a collect em all game

pretty much a really violent pokemon game in space

 

Now if DE reads anything on the forums at all or not 

the primary objective for saving a game from falling like warframe is currently is to flood with ideas thats not just (oh this would be a cool warframe) or (ooooo chainsaw hands as a weapon must make it now!)

flood the forums with content ideas centered around either a story with a track to keep that doesnt require a grind OR with side S#&$ that doesnt require grinding either 

PvP is good for this because you dont have to grind out a fixed set of tools that you cant change and are already available 

 

but other than that everything is now an anoying grind in warframe and ive been playing warframe since u9 on pc 

and ive tried to submit ideas many times for new content but no matter how thought out it is they never took it 

 

point is 

i honestly think that if warframe doesnt get something actually new to it soon all of its vets will leave and its player base will be made of constantly new players that dont know the pain of a 3hour t3 macro farm for nothing 

it saddens me but its the truth at this point

 

 

 

 

TL:DR

blah blah blah blah blah more blah

another blah

to @(*()$ grindy

blah 

give better ideas

blah

 

 

(sorry for ALL the imstakes in this post im half asleep and wanted to say this before i forgot)

[AlphaHorseman]

What he is talking about is e.g. saryns ultimate, which can be spammed continously to kill all nearby enemys, which takes the challenge out of plenty gamemodes.

Oh I know that, but I'm a guy that likes using all his powers whenever I want to and I have the available energy for them. Spamming powers (notice I put an "s" to emphasize that I do use most/all of my powers on frames), is completely fine for me because it fits my play style as a caster, no matter the frame I use.

 

So long as there isn't something that limits my ability to use powers other than the restrictions that we already have, I'm in full support of the OP's post found on Reddit.

[Redhux]

Unfortunately i don't see DEVs playing the game.

 

I don't see DEVs formating weapons.

 

I don't see DEVs farming mods and fusion cores.

 

I don't see DEVs farming the parts of a frame/ prime/ etc.

 

I never saw Rebecca or Megan play a T4 for 20 mins nor playing on a planet after... Jupiter. (Really yes...)

 

 

 

So, to be honest, i doubt (actually i'm sure.) they really understand the change they make in the game.

 

They just hears the whinners that felt a ressentment in a game and felt themselves inferior or whatever the reason.

 

"Oh that's unfair, a guy having 500 munitions of a Rocket Launcher that can destroy many ennemies at once, i feel myself butthurted!"

 

"Oh that's not cool, a guy killing many ennemies at once with an ability, it shouldn't be like that! It is unfair!"

 

 

 

The way it is going will be a TASTELESS game where any frames and any weapons are similar and then have just a cosmetic difference.

 

 

That's not what many players want.

 

 

Since it is a BETA, i don't see WHERE is the problem to have GROTESQUE weaponry and frame, IT IS FUN DAMN IT.

 

 

If i wanted a "standard" game i would go play BattleField or any classic fps game.

 

 

WarFrame is supposed to be fresh air with new concepts that transcend the usual standards.

 

 

Not another copy of any game.

 

 

 

Bah.

[Tyreuzs]

Unfortunately i don't see DEVs playing the game.

 

I don't see DEVs formating weapons.

 

I don't see DEVs farming mods and fusion cores.

 

I don't see DEVs farming the parts of a frame/ prime/ etc.

 

I never saw Rebecca or Megan play a T4 for 20 mins nor playing on a planet after... Jupiter. (Really yes...)

 

 

 

So, to be honest, i doubt (actually i'm sure.) they really understand the change they make in the game.

 

They just hears the whinners that felt a ressentment in a game and felt themselves inferior or whatever the reason.

 

Currently DE spends time on the game instead of in the game...

 

I actually tried during primetime to go into a mission where they are and spam my ult with saryn to make them clear how unbalanced their game is..

 

_____________

btw: that was my 400. post ^-^!

Edited April 11, 2015 by Tyreuzs

[Spindle99]

It never ceases to amaze me that players will put hundreds or thousands of hours into a game and yet not understand how the game works or why they play it for hundreds or thousands of hours. 

 

Baffles me how blind people can be.

[Bazookagofer]

I am really confused where this game is headed. Progression is out of whack. There is an immense power creep but then DE decides to not have a clearly defined tiering system.(Boltor Prime MR2 anyone?) And even if they want vertical progression... why add hundreds of weapons no one will use anyway? Why must there be hordes of enemies? What were they thinking with Nullies completely countering low RoF weapons? What are they thinking in general because there are so much screwed up things it hurts...

[BlizzardMamba]

The problem is that there is sth like endless missions. There is no such thing as OP in a PVE game with limitless content, yet DE starts nerfing things... why ? They should introduce a levelcap like lvl 100 and adjust weapons accordingly. Of course there should be a tiering system like boltor prime > boltor and braton prime > braton > mk1.... But there has to be a focus point for the "balancing" so I -could- use the Braton Prime instead of Amprex etc. There is no high level content in the game bc there is no high level. There was no reason to nerf the S.Gammacor without any reference how it should perform, 

The only solid progression the game has is the modding system and there are many ppl who do not like that either... 

 

I agree with most of what was said before pertaining time and grindwalls, and esp. the course the game is taking.