Stealth And Ai System Broken Beyond Belief

[Mama_Sasha]

Dhraks and their Masters are seemingly psychic, I swear these guys just come out of nowhere despite not a single other enemy being aware of your presence. Thankfully they're melee enemies so they can usually be dealt with silently and without alerting anyone else, but it's still pretty annoying.

 

Otherwise it doesn't seem to occur with most other enemies, but just recently I had a Scorpion suddenly no where I was for no reason whatsoever, knocking me down while some other Grineer knew to ring up the alarm through the power of telepathy.

Seems that the Grineer Commanders have given their troops some new kind of training lol

[DrunkenMoken]

I have this happen almost half the time I play. I major in stealth for most of my frames because I'm squishy at max rank for some odd reason. And this bug always gets me killed or very badly damaged. It's especially bad on the spy missions as I will have just dealt with the last enemy in my way and one walks in through the door shooting and activating the alarm. Wouldn't have even been in the actual mission rooms either, just a random Grineer or Corpus from outside.

[Mama_Sasha]

Did another test Post-Update 16.9

If you remain undetected for a certain amont of time in the same room (its random on how much time it is), the enemies in the same room suddenly knows your existance.

 

Also, since update 16.9, The Drakk master and his pig dogs has become bolder than ever. 7 times out of 10 he come siwht his pig dogs. Luckly so far, he doesnt alert the other grineer, but if DE fixes that so he does alert them, we can kiss Stealth goodbye (unless they make a rework on stealth system).

[Aratir]

You are trying to play a way that is non existent in the game: stealth...

So unless they implement it you have to play the only way its meant to, by killing everything and using aoe skill spams.

[WolvenEdge]

Are you serious, Aratir?

Stealth is a large enough part of many players' gameplay that it deserves as much of a system. If you truly believe that

you have to play the only way its meant to, by killing everything and using aoe skill spams

then why is there a stealth system in the first place? Why are there alarms or even a detection system? Why is stealth rewarded with bonus experience? Why is the Tenno lore based around being a lethal shade, and what lore we have states that most in the system go their entire lives believing we're some kind of propaganda myth?

Stealth is supposed to be part of our arsenal, and at least one of our mastery tests reflects this. If you're not willing to use it, fine, but saying that it has no part of the game and saying the equivalent of 'you're not playing it right' in response is going a fair ways over the line. Honestly, players like you are the reason I went solo, and the game has become so much more fun for me as a result.

 

A bugged system is a bugged system. I'm quite tired of having some Grineer spot my Excalibur when I'm behind cover, and suddenly everyone knows where I am and someone they had neither time nor chance to communicate with has tripped the alarm, even if I managed to kill the one who spotted me before he got a single shot off. I get the idea of paranoia and radio comms, but this is ridiculous. On top of that, I can understand the Drakks having a rough idea of where I might be by scent, but having them instantly know exactly where I am the instant they spawn is far more than ridiculous.
I for one am eagerly awaiting Stealth 2.0.

[Mama_Sasha]

Are you serious, Aratir?

Stealth is a large enough part of many players' gameplay that it deserves as much of a system. If you truly believe that

then why is there a stealth system in the first place? Why are there alarms or even a detection system? Why is stealth rewarded with bonus experience? Why is the Tenno lore based around being a lethal shade, and what lore we have states that most in the system go their entire lives believing we're some kind of propaganda myth?

Stealth is supposed to be part of our arsenal, and at least one of our mastery tests reflects this. If you're not willing to use it, fine, but saying that it has no part of the game and saying the equivalent of 'you're not playing it right' in response is going a fair ways over the line. Honestly, players like you are the reason I went solo, and the game has become so much more fun for me as a result.

Well it seems that the Lore is false, since acording to the player base, the Tenno are space pirates greedy for loot who blow everything up in spectacular explosions and dressing themsevles in gleaming atires and colors.

 

Or maybe  us people who do stealth, are the true Tenno, while the crazy gunners and greedy farmers are the space pirates with

a tenno skin.

 

That is one of the reaons why i also play solo, as playing stealth with people online are impossible, as their impatience doesnt reflect the lore.

Edited July 11, 2015 by Cebius

[Mama_Sasha]

Well well....another update to report. Seems that this current hotfix added something more anoying, or its just my luck.

Seems that the Drakk Masters have the ability to sound the alarm, and since they know your existance 8 out of 10 times upon starting a mission, it make stealth impossible.

[WolvenEdge]

Yeah... and they alert other Grineer now too. -w- While not impossible, it just made doing anything stealthily a whole lot harder.

 

Come on, DE, please plans for Stealth 2.0?

 

As for 'space pirates who blow everything up ...', yeah. That's just... argh. It's lore vs. the community here, and I'm going with the lore, because I'm really not all that enamored of much of the community for the very reasons stated. I'm driven to wonder if Microsoft was right about the vast majority of players when they insulted their supporters in Banjo Kazooie; Nuts and Bolts. "Collecting things is boring, and far too slow. Players today just want to shoot things."

I hope for better. ;w;

[Lord_Xenon]

Fufu drahk master! Noone know my present, but those drahks found me! And then due my carrier shotgun all other arround too. Those really need a fix, because it's ridiculous that they can track you down from 100m+ without any alarm was triggered/anyone of the enemy ever had contact to me(not even stealhkills).

[Mama_Sasha]

Fufu drahk master! Noone know my present, but those drahks found me! And then due my carrier shotgun all other arround too. Those really need a fix, because it's ridiculous that they can track you down from 100m+ without any alarm was triggered/anyone of the enemy ever had contact to me(not even stealhkills).

On a gameplay standpoint, it makes stealth pointless as there is no immersion because of this problem.

This problem has infact existed since in the old days of warframe, though there was no Drakk Master nor his dogs existed, but enemies knew of your existance was still there, and i have been playing long before Damage 2.0 even was a thing.

 

Consider how uninterested people are, we wont see any fix of this anytime soon, but i want to keep my hopes up. One can sadly only dream it seems.

[ZoMbi656]

Yeah, wait 5 years more, when DE already stops doing their useless things, like now, and start thinking about basic elements for games.

[Lord_Xenon]

Today again twice Drahk suddenly appear next to me with summoned drahk = lost stealh. Especially useful in a nightmare spy mission. Don't need to mention, that vault was triggered + after going outside I was fast dead?

[BoompigXD]

You sure your not getting spotted? I can confirm that Drahk Master is psychic but he doesn't alert other Grineer for some reason but if it's any other Grineer, remember that if your spotted once, even if they don't fire a shot and don't set off the alarms, every enemy within a 15 mile radius will know where you are because Psychic powers or something, makes stealth really hard.

 

Although sometimes I seem to be spotted even when only showing an inch of my Waframe

[Mama_Sasha]

You sure your not getting spotted? I can confirm that Drahk Master is psychic but he doesn't alert other Grineer for some reason but if it's any other Grineer, remember that if your spotted once, even if they don't fire a shot and don't set off the alarms, every enemy within a 15 mile radius will know where you are because Psychic powers or something, makes stealth really hard.

 

Although sometimes I seem to be spotted even when only showing an inch of my Waframe

I am very sure. I have done alot of tests.

I dont even need to be spotted either.

[Lord_Xenon]

Drahk hunt you sometimes from the start of mission - without even having any contact till it(even standing ill for a while from the start...).

Then now 20m+ away enemies sometimes becoming aggro looking just in your direction - before U17 it was less then 15m needed for that to see you...

Encountering sometimes alarm is off, but still new enemies spawn to hunt you - funny inside of a corpus vault...

[Mama_Sasha]

Drahk hunt you sometimes from the start of mission - without even having any contact till it(even standing ill for a while from the start...).

Then now 20m+ away enemies sometimes becoming aggro looking just in your direction - before U17 it was less then 15m needed for that to see you...

Encountering sometimes alarm is off, but still new enemies spawn to hunt you - funny inside of a corpus vault...

Good thing that the Drakk doenst alarm his fellow Grineer so far, and if they fixed that later in a hotfix, we can kiss stealth goodbye.

What we really need though, is a stealth 2.0.

[Lord_Xenon]

Good thing that the Drakk doenst alarm his fellow Grineer so far, and if they fixed that later in a hotfix, we can kiss stealth goodbye.

What we really need though, is a stealth 2.0.

 

This isn't useful either. I'm running with aggro Carrier and so his shotgun alarm the Grineer around as fast as the Drahk running next to me. And I don't want to go only melee/non attacking Sentinel just for such broken enemies.

[Mama_Sasha]

This isn't useful either. I'm running with aggro Carrier and so his shotgun alarm the Grineer around as fast as the Drahk running next to me. And I don't want to go only melee/non attacking Sentinel just for such broken enemies.

To bad that shotguns dont have silencer mods (like Hush), so that sentinal weapons such as sweeper can get silenced.

What is really needed though, is that their Ai to be reworked so that they dont have like being psychic.

[Lord_Xenon]

To bad that shotguns dont have silencer mods (like Hush), so that sentinal weapons such as sweeper can get silenced.

What is really needed though, is that their Ai to be reworked so that they dont have like being psychic.

 

Even if a silencer exist, I wouldn't use it just to counter a flawed/broken coded AI.

[Mama_Sasha]

Even if a silencer exist, I wouldn't use it just to counter a flawed/broken coded AI.

Indeed. Like i said, we need atleast some rework on the Ai.

[WolvenEdge]

Good thing that the Drakk doenst alarm his fellow Grineer so far, and if they fixed that later in a hotfix, we can kiss stealth goodbye.

What we really need though, is a stealth 2.0.

 

So you're saying that a stealth rework wouldn't help you because you don't play stealth? -w- Helpful.

[Mama_Sasha]

So you're saying that a stealth rework wouldn't help you because you don't play stealth? -w- Helpful.

I always love playing stealth, may it be slow or fast, but due to how the enemeis are somehow psychic, its difficult.

What i meant about the drakk themselves is that, if DE fixes so that if the drakk and his dogs sees you, but havent fixed their psychic, it would make stealth alot harder, or impossible.

 

Unless you quoted the worng person, please do tell if you did or not.

[Kaotyke]

I asked that we were given a widow of opportunity to kill the enemy that spots you, make animations of them looking startled for a second or 2 before the others are alerted.

 

The Rollers seem to be able to find you from ludicrous places, I was at a top of an elevador in Uranus, looking down on them and a Roller just saw me while the other Grineer didnt? If you want an angle, I was almost at 80º up and front of the Roller and above about 20 meters and it SAW me!

[DrunkenMoken]

I asked that we were given a widow of opportunity to kill the enemy that spots you, make animations of them looking startled for a second or 2 before the others are alerted.

 

The Rollers seem to be able to find you from ludicrous places, I was at a top of an elevador in Uranus, looking down on them and a Roller just saw me while the other Grineer didnt? If you want an angle, I was almost at 80º up and front of the Roller and above about 20 meters and it SAW me!

 

 

I still don't understand how rollers "see" at all

[Kaotyke]

I still don't understand how rollers "see" at all

EXACTLY!