Banshee Nerf Is.. Well, Pretty Dumb.

[nyiinx]

Heya!
So the Banshee used to be my favourite frame and so on
The Sound Quake nerf is actually pretty terrible.
Every frame has their ultimate ability that basically saves them during tight spots 
Frost has Avalanche, Excali has Radial Javelin and so on.

With the new nerf, I can no longer run into the middle of a crowd of mobs and attempt to wipe them out.
Even with the new damage buff (not that I noticed until someone informed me) my Banshee dies before even completing the skill. 

A 100 energy suicide button

This makes Banshee really really useless in defense
and pretty much in any high level map


This is sad.
:c

(Edit: WHAT?! BANSHEE'S QUAKE DOESN'T STAGGER AND DOES REDUCED DAMAGE! WHAT IS THIS *cries*)

I still love you Banshee, I just.. don't have any use for you now :c

Edited May 18, 2013 by Nyiinx

[Heruactic]

i second this. im a crybaby for banshee nerf. mostly just the invincibility part.

[Locksauce]

A 100 energy suicide button

 

Exactly what it is now.

[nyiinx]

It makes me sad.
:c

I MEAN COME ON
Banshee was never a great frame to begin with, medium health, medium armor, medium damage skills.
Medium functionality in general, but I loved it anyway because it had 2 redeeming qualities

1. Knockdown
2. Soundquake

bfjkdbsjkgdh

[Sayoka]

Not sure if it's a nerf or a bug....

[nyiinx]

It does appear to be a really bad bug, huh.

[Otaiken]

The information that Rhino is bugged got out rather quickly. Nothing on Banshee so far though.  Let's hope it's because there's not that many Banshees running around. We have to be loud :D

[crow-k]

But polite. I just realized I am no longer invincibul for the 4 seconds I am rooted in place and none of the mobs were staggered for more than  a brief moment. I do hope this was  bug. If not, Well, there are other warframes I like. Just none as good at keeping mobs off the damn pod >< (still love #1 though ^^) 2 is damn good also. They can take 4, give back invulberable and cut the distance in 1/2 for all i care, its the utility that I loved it for.

Edited May 18, 2013 by crow-k

[crow-k]

sted Today, 12:51 PM

The Time is 4:48 PM, I review the Update Notes, wondering how the changes to Banshee and Rhino will be received. The reaction to the changes to the Hek and Gorgon just a few weeks ago are still fresh in my mind, but I remember that we did receive quality feedback. This feedback allowed us to tweak the balance changes. I hope everyone else remembers this rollercoaster as well as I do.

But, back to today:

4:49 PM hits and the Patch Notes Post and Update 7.11.0 went live.

4:54 PM hits, the first “HOLY RHINO NERF” appears. I think, it’s only been 5 minutes, there is no way they could have loaded the game, played several levels, and produced feedback.

4:55 PM hits, another post (this time 6 minutes after original post) saying how we ruined Rhino!

4:56 PM hits and BAM another post!Now I am quite certain that it is all initial reactions at this point. I think to myself and sadly there is nothing I can take from these posts to a designer to make changes with. I go off into a daydream, picturing myself walking into Scott’s office and saying:

“Our Community is really reacting strongly to this Rhino change”– Me
“Oh! We just wanted to invite challenge into his play style, I think 100% invincibility was a little strong, what does the community suggest?” Scott
“Suggest? Hold on, let me check… oh. Nothing, actually, they just wanted to let us know that we ruined him and are doomed.”

For hours this continues, few posts emerge that provide constructive ideas, I savour those. More emerge on how this is the beginning of the end. Doom is nigh.

Then, after about 4 hours, we start getting somewhere. I assume this is because people have actually put the new changes to the test instead of just reacting to the notes. I start being able to grasp at underlying issues to bring up with the team.

So, I present to you Tenno a current list of what I’ll be taking to the Design Table:

-People wonder if the reaction is this strong to one OP ability, maybe the other abilities could use a buff! Let’s review!
- Holy S&@* where is his knockback immunity? (This is a bug, it SHOULD be there.)
- People want to know why the Nerf? Why not make stuff harder? What is being prioritized?
- Trinity is now “a better tank.” What does this mean for the overall balance of the frames?
- As Thor, a community mod, has summarized: "In essence, people seem concerned that what's happening is things are getting balanced towards an even, but weak, playing field". What are your thoughts on that?
- Not on the topic of Rhino, but Banshee not being invulnerable during Soundquake, can we talk about that?

This list is not final, and it doesn’t guarantee changes, but it will serve a purpose.

TL;DR? No - Please read it. Really. I really think if you’ve made a post about Rhino you NEED TO READ THIS. IF you don’t care about Rhino, carry on.

P.S: Scotty you’ll probably read this before I bring it to your office, so be prepared!

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/46101-may-17th-hot-topic-constructive-feedback-vs-hyperbole/

 

So, the immune to stagger is a bug and will be fixed. Rhino is fine for people who can adapt to change and improve their real skill. It s a big change but I think a majority of the players can be impartial enough to realize why this is not the world ender so many seem to think it is. Also, she mentioned someone asking why not make the game harder instead of nerfing (for example) Iron Skin. I would like to ask the community how can you make something hard enough to hurt an invulnerable character and not really screw everyone who is not invulnerable capable? 

[Edai_X369]

OK.. Banshee is nerfed. Update 8 coming. New levels/ mission focus on Corpus. Volt appears. OMG ,nerf Volt please. He did 5k on Corpus and we did not get ANY KILLS.

 

Even now on Kappa , Volt is better on killing grineers than Banshee.

[Enomilli]

OK.. Banshee is nerfed. Update 8 coming. New levels/ mission focus on Corpus. Volt appears. OMG ,nerf Volt please. He did 5k on Corpus and we did not get ANY KILLS.

 

Even now on Kappa , Volt is better on killing grineers than Banshee.

Banshee is Pre-U7 Ember now...

 

She only does decent damage on light infested...

 

My Sound Quake could barely kill the Lancers on Kappa...

 

Banshee is just...

 

She cannot even stagger Ancients...so you can get disrupted while doing your ultimate...

[DivineBovine]

MY QUEEN WHAT HAVE THEY DONE TO US ;3;

[Enomilli]

MY QUEEN WHAT HAVE THEY DONE TO US ;3;

BOVINE....I JUST DON'T KNOW...I MEAN I MAIN SARYN BUT...I LIKED BANSHEE TOO...

 

WE ARE RARE ENOUGH AS BANSHEE AS IT IS...AND NOW...OMG THIS IS NOT KAWAII!!!

[Tick410]

Well they did the same to Volt. Volt's Ultimate used to have Invincibility, but now I get destroyed when using it. Its pointless now. This has to be worst update ever!

[Enomilli]

Well they did the same to Volt. Volt's Ultimate used to have Invincibility, but now I get destroyed when using it. Its pointless now. This has to be worst update ever!

Making the panic button worthless since 2013.

[Shion963]

Every frame has their ultimate ability that basically saves them during tight spots.

With the new nerf, I can no longer run into the middle of a crowd of mobs and attempt to wipe them out.

 

Panic Button =/= running into a crowd to AOE.

 

I just wish that Silence made imposes a limit to gunshot's sound. I used SIlence on one part of the room, enemies on the other side gets alerted because they weren't covered in the debuff range, and therefore heard the sounds :/

[Infrared]

It must be reconsidered by DE! I got my Banshee today (around 3 hours and a half ago), and I'm already falling in love with her, while already died 2 times using Sound Quake >_>

Please we want it back!

[TheSweetyMan]

I honestly think this is the worst update.

First of all the Devs need to return the Banshee to its original power. Sure its power has been buffed but I've also noticed that they've massively decreased the range of her Sonic Quake, which is what makes the Banshee's Uber stand out the most. It's a total mistake to make any warframe's uber make them the most vulnerable, basically making it a kamikaze ability.

 

Yes, i have mentioned that the Banshee deserves this extansive (and OP to some) ability, for one reason in particular. The Devs mentioned something in that the real game (or some future update, I can't remember) that people will no longer be able to buy their warframes/weapons with Platinum (at least the stronger ones) but will have to actually gather materials and blueprints for them. Nerfing the Banshee is uncalled for because the Banshee is basicaly the most hardest and tedious warframe to farm for (Says the wiki, the comments on the wiki, the number of comments on the wiki, and personal experience). If it's the hardest (or one of the hardest) warframe's to farm for, it deserves to have something stronger than most warframes. No one's gonna want to spend endless hours for something that's a piece of crap.

[Heimdallr]

Man... the range and invulnerable nerf is horrible man... like the comments posted above you'd die while casting an animation heavy sound quake which is absurd compared to saryn's miasma.

 

Saryn just moves into crowds, casts and moves on whereas others like frost, rhino, banshee, volt might as well say ALMOST all has longer animation times than that of saryn.

 

Not to whine but this is slightly too much on the developer's end as i don't see how viable would banshee be compared to other class with only sonar and sonic boom left 'useful' to banshee users not to mention the armor, speed, vitality and shield on banshee makes her harder to survive compared to the other classes as she has no other means to draw fire let alone take it in a bunch of mobs.

[Mercathin]

I am mixed, on one hand, yes it was a bit to adjust to, but it really was a no risk all reward skill before.

 

On the other, it encourages more team focused effort to use well, which I support.

 

I am curious how this all will play out myself.

[SilentCynic]

Unfortunately, Banshee is now pretty nonviable. She already had only two strong abilities (Sonic Boom is handy, but not really a game changer, especially when compared to things like Slash Dash.), and now DE's kicked her ult in the face, twice.

 

The damage nerf is one thing, and while I definitely don't agree with it, it's better than turning an already frail frame into a sitting duck.  Ultimate abilities, I thought, are supposed to be big and powerful and impressive. They're not supposed to just offer your enemies a stationary target that tickles them a bit.

 

This Sound Quake double-nerf, combined with the horrendous polarity slots on Banshee, makes it really hard to enjoy playing this class.

 

I would suggest:

 

A) Make her invulnerable while using it.

B) Strike a balance. You can't really leave a frame with an ability that does little damage over a small AoE. I feel it should equalize somewhat.

C) Please, for the love of whatever deity you deign worthy, fix her polarities, or at least change polarities on existing mods. There are two V mods, and one of them is totally useless on Banshee, due to the affected skill being underwhelming (Silence. I don't count SQ, since Continuity just evened the damage out over the duration; more ticks, less damage per tick.)

 

EDIT:

 

On the other, it encourages more team focused effort to use well, which I support.

 

 

The problem with that reasoning is solo play.

Edited May 18, 2013 by SilentCynic

[Heimdallr]

With the market full of other video games with the lack in content it's already killing this game.

 

Since with each update you (developers) kept introducing nerfs after nerfs (Hek and Gorgon being the most eventful) i don't know why and how this game is going to keep players 'tuned' into it. Some might have a more positive look on all these nerfs and disagree with me on the nerf but in the long term run what i'm looking is is further and further nerfs into other frames, guns, swords, skills and whatnots going by the trend.

 

On a side note, Mercathin, please kindly take note that a minority of players SOLO the game and if you're not gonna cater to them don't make the solo option available if skills like sound quake should be more tactically used in teams.

 

Keep up with the nerfs you're going to have 1 less parasite (me) playing it no more.

[Edai_X369]

Maybe Banshee is now easy to obtain and many people are using it. I did with my Clan using 3 Banshees and 1 Saryn and it pretty much easy to get to wave 25 in infected defense mission on Europa. Sonar is consider to be the OP skill because it x4 of your damage but it didn't affect other players benefits so they don't really "consider" it to be OP. The hardest enemy in game is Ancients. it took whole magazine to kill an Ancient lv 60 but with Sonar ,its only about 1/4 .

 

As for pugs, they demand kills.They want to kill on Kappa ( most of nerfing requests come from this ) . I saw lots of topic like " Banshee needs a nerf,I don't get any exp, KILLS." . All the exp is share when your fellow kills enemy plus your personal kill. I play Banshee a lots and only get about 5-7k exp for weapons and around 35 - 45k exp for warframe.

[ZWarhammer]

I personally don't mind this fix, no you can't go ulting 24/7 with banshee you have to consider how much you can endure and when esp if you only build power increasing mods.

Seriously it was a bit too much before, 1 banshee ult used to wipe the whole screen and with mods she could do it 3/4 times it's like a free i win button that saps all exp from your team.

[Mercathin]

A point I overlooked, being primarily a group player.

 

I suppose what role did sound quake play in solo? I really am not sure myself.

 

I am theorizing that a combination of enemy radar mods. Since I heard sonar alerts enemies, and all enemies are alert already in mp because no one doesn't shoot on sight. Using sound quakes ignore wall feature would will have some use, but be less of a 'pocket nuke' that I, and some other banshees use it as.

 

I'll have to play some solo with the frame to try I guess.

 

Thank you for bring solo up, I did overlook it as pointed out.

 

EDIT:I would like a polarity switch as well however, as I would feel her more able to play up her stealth side better. This is just wishful thinking.

Edited May 18, 2013 by Mercathin