May 17Th Hot Topic: Constructive Feedback Vs Hyperbole

[BloodEmperor]

Well, three ways are

1) Make it cut down the pause before shield regen kicks in.

2) Make it give some amount/percentage of shield upon casting.

3) Make it regenerate the shield constantly on some rate.

have u seen the rate the shields deplete on eris sedna or pluto?

60! per second.......ok i let 3 enemies hit me to see what happens that almost resultet in my death....but who cares

Rhinos IS and Banshee SQ nerf were uncalled for in a update that introduced a frame that could replace the CC and could only be bought with plat

[Dako_Shark]

Because 80% damage resist isn't as good as Embers 91%, and nor is it a panic god-mode button any more, that with no more immunity to poison and disruption and no more shield regen while under it.

Hmm. Maybe they can buff it up to 90% reduction then. Just having him completely invulnerable is a bit OP, and even with the reduction it can still be used as a panic button. Just you gotta use it a bit early so you can get outta there. Though the lack of imunities can cause issues, though poison has always been an issue no matter what frame you're using. As for shield regen, maybe give it a slower shield regen then when using it rather then none at all.

Edit:

Though I'm curious, if you spec a high level vitality mod and a Armor increase mod, wouldn't that allow you to substantially buff Iron Skins efficiency? Even despite only having 80% damage reduction?

Edited May 19, 2013 by Dako_Shark

[KvotheTheArcane1]

I was actually extremely baffled at people saying that the Rhino nerf made him useless. x.x It's like, he STILL has 80% damage reduction, which no other frame has. But I think that was at the very early stages of the update. Though I don't play a Rhino, I know that 80% is still damn good. My friend maxed out Iron Skin, that was 22 seconds of invincibility which was kinda cheap. At least 80% damage reduction will keep him on his toes. =P

-snip-

 

Trinity has link which is invul, ember can get 91% DR.

 

Hmm. Maybe they can buff it up to 90% reduction then. Just having him completely invulnerable is a bit OP, and even with the reduction it can still be used as a panic button. Just you gotta use it a bit early so you can get outta there. Though the lack of imunities can cause issues, though poison has always been an issue no matter what frame you're using. As for shield regen, maybe give it a slower shield regen then when using it rather then none at all.

Edit:

Though I'm curious, if you spec a high level vitality mod and a Armor increase mod, wouldn't that allow you to substantially buff Iron Skins efficiency? Even despite only having 80% damage reduction?

no, high level enemies still chew through rhino pretty fast, 80% doesn't do a lot vs sustained damage from 3-4 guys.

 

edit:

 

A lot of people seem to only be playing Rhino for Iron Skin

Because it's his best skill, and the only thing he does good.

 

 

Unless you are one of those Warframes that gets loads of energy you should always run Flow or something else to help you with the consumption of energy.

Unless you can't find them...

 

No i dont play Rhino or any other Warframe just to use one single skill over and over.

And it's not about how one skill can be better than another is about a combination of all the skills, the stats, and what weapons you use.

You were saying how you cant stun-lock with the energy? Well how effective is Mag going to be only using Crush which is a 100 energy ability?

At level 30 she had a base of 150 so once you get that crush out..... you are done, right?

Cause what are you going to do? Take enemies shields away once? Oh you can pull 2 times which is a single target stun...which LESS effective that charge. 

Some frames use energy increasing mods better than others, because they simply have more cost effective skills. I.e. Rhino's ult stuns targets more or less, but he still has to do lots of work to kill them, and his team has to. That's fine, however for 50 less energy, you get the same result in a different way. Enemies focus you, allowing your team to shoot them while you melee/shoot them too (provided you get in between your team and the enemies.

Edited May 19, 2013 by KvotheTheArcane1

[GTG3000]

have u seen the rate the shields deplete on eris sedna or pluto?

60! per second.......ok i let 3 enemies hit me to see what happens that almost resultet in my death....but who cares

Rhinos IS and Banshee SQ nerf were uncalled for in a update that introduced a frame that could replace the CC and could only be bought with plat

 

Maybe you should try not playing an iron wall then? I never had any problem with shields while I was going through pluto... Although admittedly, Rhino is slower than Ember... 

 

The nerfs were called for, it's just that they are too severe, and have changed an entire mechanic again. I'm guessing that too many players relied on iron skin instead of keeping it as a panic button.

 

It's all in the way devs see it, and if they think that players shouldn't play Terminator, standing in the open with grakata firing away, they have all rights to change it. But then other skills need tweaking.

Edited May 19, 2013 by GTG3000

[BloodEmperor]

and sth else what do u guys care if OTHER players only rely on the lest resort butto almost every frame has one of these

its not like 50% of all players are rhinos or banshees or frost or THERE ARE 13 different unique frames and i have seen only nerfs to them in the last

2 months that corrupted the uniqueness bit by bit

i have never seen such uncalled nerfes in a game like LOL where u have 100 unique heroes and its still balanced

oh sry this is a PVE i forgot nerfs for more challange go higher level for more challange but dont take the FUN away from many many players

as a main VOLT player that nerf really pi ssed me of cause things that are "situational OP" get nerfed......... soon higher ranked players will get their ping nerfed: best ping u can have in a mission is ur rank times 100 ?

Invulnerability doesnt need skill? then DPS doesnt need skill either this is a downward spiral! DE wake up pls

id say more then 10% of all players(!) would be pleased to see these unreasonable nerfs being revoked

and those who dont listen to whiners are mostly arrogant players cause this is COOP it means we have to play as a team (cheating hacking etc is not helping at all) a team is only as strong as its weakest member; that member in this community is called commUNITY and a breeze of fresh air will kill us all (personally id say 7.11.0 was part of that breeze)

Edited May 19, 2013 by BloodEmperor

[Dako_Shark]

Trinity has link which is invul, ember can get 91% DR.

 

no, high level enemies still chew through rhino pretty fast, 80% doesn't do a lot vs sustained damage from 3-4 guys.

Yeah. I heard, that's why I suggested buffing the Rhino damage reduction a bit more, like 90%-95% maybe.

High level enemies chew through anyone. =P

[KvotheTheArcane1]

Yeah. I heard, that's why I suggested buffing the Rhino damage reduction a bit more, like 90%-95% maybe.

High level enemies chew through anyone. =P

Eh increasing the damage reduction means he gets chewed down faster, and a lot of people see the iron skin as a panic button, so invul really helps them. if your shields go down, it's great to be able to pop iron skin and live instead of requiring your team to pick up the rhino (esp when the rhino was great at picking his team up)

[ArcSynder]

It's more of a psychological change than anything else. 

 

Iron skin used to be "let me run in and facetank for my team."

 

Now it's "I should try to avoid fire...but it's not as bad if I get hit." 

[Vorpalstryke]

I'd give the developers the benefit of the doubt and see how they respond to the community feedback. The patch just went out 2 days ago and it's the weekend so we won't see any fixes or changes until the end of this coming week. Patience everyone.

 

In regards to the Iron Skin issue, sure, it is a very strong ability (there is no argument there) and it kind of is an "I WIN" button but so is the ultimate ability of all the frames, some of whom can clear the whole room out with one button press. My suggestion is that they give back the complete invulnerability, move Iron Skin to the #4 ability slot so it is treated as his ultimate, increase to cost appropriately to 100 energy, and hopefully this will end all arguments about it being too cheap. At that point it will be only as spammy as the other ultimates and fewer people will complain because they can do their room clearing moves just as much as Rhino can become invulnerable. Everyone is happy.

 

At the same time, moving Radial Blast to the #2 slot, increasing the blast radius, and making it 50 energy will compensate for the low damage and encourage us to use it more as crowd control. If they make it automatically aggro things it hits, it'll be golden for tanking. Rhino Stomp would be great at slot #3 at 50 or 75 energy. Heck, they should even take the minuscule damage it deals away because it's not what we use it for anyway.

 

As for people stating that Rhino is fine without the invulnerability and that we need to adapt and play him differently, yeah you're partially correct, we do need to learn to adapt, especially if the developers decide the change is permanent. However, the problem that we Rhino users have with changing our play styles is that the reason why we chose the Rhino is because we loved that specific play style. If we wanted to run and gun, play hide and seek, or blow up entire rooms with one button press, we'd pick another frame. In fact, I play a Saryn on the side and I like her a lot. But the reason why we love the Rhino is because we love the feeling of invulnerability and being tanking gods.

 

We all deserve to enjoy playing the game the way we want to play, right? It's like if you played Ash or Loki and was told that your stealth is nerfed and only hides you from enemies 80% of the time. Wouldn't you be a little upset with the change? Sure you can adapt too, but it reduces the effectiveness of your frame and makes the ability kinda mediocre. Every frame is a different snowflake. Each one has its strengths and weaknesses. If you don't think one fits your way of playing, you are free to play a different frame. But to tell me that my opinion or the way I prefer to play is wrong makes you a troll and rather small-minded. I don't tell Volts not to hit their ultimates or Excaliburs to stop Slash and Dashing or Radial Javelin. I do get a little jealous at their effectiveness sometimes but if I wanted to, I can go play those frames too. I am glad that the new Vaughban frame seems to be very effective with skills that are useful and powerful. I am happy they did not nerf Trinity and allowed her to keep her infinite invulnerability loop. I am sad they nerfed/bugged Banshee's ultimate and hope the developers fix it ASAP. They are strong allies on the playing field and I am happy to play with strong, effective allies especially on the higher levels.

 

Be happy with your own chosen frame and spend your energy making suggestions on how to improve him/her. Don't troll and clamor for nerfs of everyone else's frame just to make yourself feel better about your choice in frames or your own play style. And if you don't play a Rhino or have never tried him, please refrain from complaining about him because you obviously have NO idea on how slow and sluggish he handles compared to the other frames or how weak his other abilities feel for their cost. Respect your fellow Tenno and remain positive and constructive and hopefully the developers will listen and try to accommodate and be generous to everyone. Remember, Warframe is a co-op game! That which makes one member of the team strong makes the whole team stronger!

[BigSchmexy]

My rhino has high level flow streamline and continuity I generally run with a team with 4 energy siphons I generally get 5 sometimes 6 uses of IS in a row and I only do that if I'm on high level defense and without really good damage dealing abilities I only slow down ancients and heavies until my team can spare someone to help me IS was a situational skill good for reviving or drawing agrro without worrying you'd go down right next to the boss or go down trying to revive someone. As a lot of people have already said full immunity at a higher cost and/or a lower duration would be fine.

[torngasoak]

hello,

All has already been said to rhino.
I was just making a post to express my displeasure and say that it is useless.

[PolarCamel]

What happened to the suggestions D:

It's turning back into that other thread!

 

So I suggested a change way back on page 15 about Iron Skin having some effect of Metal Mario (Mario64 and Super Smash Brothers fans know).

I'd like to bring it up again.

 

It would be something like this while he is in Iron Skin mode:

 

+Invincible

+Powers up his other skills in range and damage

+Shields regenerate

(+Stronger Melee)

 

-Slower moving

-Increase the Energy use to 75

-No more wall climbing/running

-Maxed skill is only 10s duration

(-Cool down time)

[BloodEmperor]

I'd give the developers the benefit of the doubt and see how they respond to the community feedback. The patch just went out 2 days ago and it's the weekend so we won't see any fixes or changes until the end of this coming week. Patience everyone.

 

In regards to the Iron Skin issue, sure, it is a very strong ability (there is no argument there) and it kind of is an "I WIN" button but so is the ultimate ability of all the frames, some of whom can clear the whole room out with one button press. My suggestion is that they give back the complete invulnerability, move Iron Skin to the #4 ability slot so it is treated as his ultimate, increase to cost appropriately to 100 energy, and hopefully this will end all arguments about it being too cheap. At that point it will be only as spammy as the other ultimates and fewer people will complain because they can do their room clearing moves just as much as Rhino can become invulnerable. Everyone is happy.

 

At the same time, moving Radial Blast to the #2 slot, increasing the blast radius, and making it 50 energy will compensate for the low damage and encourage us to use it more as crowd control. If they make it automatically aggro things it hits, it'll be golden for tanking. Rhino Stomp would be great at slot #3 at 50 or 75 energy. Heck, they should even take the minuscule damage it deals away because it's not what we use it for anyway.

 

As for people stating that Rhino is fine without the invulnerability and that we need to adapt and play him differently, yeah you're partially correct, we do need to learn to adapt, especially if the developers decide the change is permanent. However, the problem that we Rhino users have with changing our play styles is that the reason why we chose the Rhino is because we loved that specific play style. If we wanted to run and gun, play hide and seek, or blow up entire rooms with one button press, we'd pick another frame. In fact, I play a Saryn on the side and I like her a lot. But the reason why we love the Rhino is because we love the feeling of invulnerability and being tanking gods.

 

We all deserve to enjoy playing the game the way we want to play, right? It's like if you played Ash or Loki and was told that your stealth is nerfed and only hides you from enemies 80% of the time. Wouldn't you be a little upset with the change? Sure you can adapt too, but it reduces the effectiveness of your frame and makes the ability kinda mediocre. Every frame is a different snowflake. Each one has its strengths and weaknesses. If you don't think one fits your way of playing, you are free to play a different frame. But to tell me that my opinion or the way I prefer to play is wrong makes you a troll and rather small-minded. I don't tell Volts not to hit their ultimates or Excaliburs to stop Slash and Dashing or Radial Javelin. I do get a little jealous at their effectiveness sometimes but if I wanted to, I can go play those frames too. I am glad that the new Vaughban frame seems to be very effective with skills that are useful and powerful. I am happy they did not nerf Trinity and allowed her to keep her infinite invulnerability loop. I am sad they nerfed/bugged Banshee's ultimate and hope the developers fix it ASAP. They are strong allies on the playing field and I am happy to play with strong, effective allies especially on the higher levels.

 

Be happy with your own chosen frame and spend your energy making suggestions on how to improve him/her. Don't troll and clamor for nerfs of everyone else's frame just to make yourself feel better about your choice in frames or your own play style. And if you don't play a Rhino or have never tried him, please refrain from complaining about him because you obviously have NO idea on how slow and sluggish he handles compared to the other frames or how weak his other abilities feel for their cost. Respect your fellow Tenno and remain positive and constructive and hopefully the developers will listen and try to accommodate and be generous to everyone. Remember, Warframe is a co-op game! That which makes one member of the team strong makes the whole team stronger!

heres someone who took the time to formally summarize everything all complainers wanted to say THANK YOU VERY MUCH

i couldnt get into the mood to do this

[Yincosare]

Be happy with your own chosen frame and spend your energy making suggestions on how to improve him/her. Don't troll and clamor for nerfs of everyone else's frame just to make yourself feel better about your choice in frames or your own play style. And if you don't play a Rhino or have never tried him, please refrain from complaining about him because you obviously have NO idea on how slow and sluggish he handles compared to the other frames or how weak his other abilities feel for their cost. Respect your fellow Tenno and remain positive and constructive and hopefully the developers will listen and try to accommodate and be generous to everyone. Remember, Warframe is a co-op game! That which makes one member of the team strong makes the whole team stronger!

This. I cant believe there are lots of jealous and competitive people in a PvE game. >_<

I mean. Clearly, the old Rhino was a team asset in that he can clearly be that person who would charge through thick and thin and take all the enemy just so that his team mates could then SAFELY shoot down all the enemies. Oooooor. He could be that one person who would not hesitate to save you even if you are laying there far away from the team, with only your handgun/s on hand and being surrounded by an entire swarm of enemies, even if it clearly was your fault you got into that situation. Those were his ONLY use for the team. Those were the only excuses why people would forgive teaming up with a slow &amp;#&#33; frame such as him. With him right now, Rhino players would not do such foolishness. So why would a team get a substandard teammate such as him, when clearly there are other frames around that can do all of those which he can not(or cannot do anymore), specially since squads are restricted to just 4 members? For the cosmetic value of having a macho frame made of complete iron stand around and shooting like everyone else? Clearly, teams would see him as a liability, and would prefer other frames(unless that Rhino guy is a friend or clanmate lol)

I do guess that maybe for some people, seeing someone tank the entire enemy army FOR THE ENTIRE TEAM'S WELFARE and taking no damage in the process is quite annoying. It wont be fair for them if some people can do this thing better than they can. I guess their train of thought is like "You take damage while Rhino doesn't? That's unfair! Everyone must take damage and die even if I can clear entire rooms of enemies while Rhino does not." I guess some people in this world are really that competitive. Rhino players don't even complain if they cant get the highest kills on an online mission, as long as the mission would be completed. >_<

If you guys cant stand seeing someone better at you than something, then play Solo. God. Everyone knows how Rhino used to be useful for the team, unlike now. But I guess those competitive people who squeal OP are quite happy that Rhino can no longer tank all the enemies FOR THE TEAM now, are they? Finally, their so-called God(Who apparently cant do lots of damage and now can't even tank) has been pulled down from the heavens and now it's their time to shine and be on the spotlight.

[Lord.Finster]

I play Rhino a lot. It's my favourite frame because I love how he looks. I would play the guy even if no abilities existed in this game because he looks badass. Concerning the basic stats: I gain +150% armour, +50% shields and +10% shield recharge in exchange for -20% sprint speed. I think that's great because it gives me the edge over other frames in long-term engagements! And Frost makes good company, since he's got the same stats.

Rhino's skills are a bonus on top of this.

 

My Rhino is lvl 30, supercharged and I maxed all his abilities and have them constantly equipped, btw.

 

So here are my suggestion for the rework:

 

Rhino Charge:

I haven't used this skill for a month or longer because it gets you in unrecoverable situations and its damage output is very unreliable and on higher levels negligible. It's also non-iconic since it looks too much like Excaliburs Slash Dash. An uninspired knockoff. Some people like to use it as an opener for a big fight, I only use it as an escape tool if I don't have enough energy for Iron Skin.

IMO this skill needs to change the most or go completely.

Complete Rework:

Make it a single target ability. Once triggered Rhino will charge that target (animation like Volt Speed, not like Excalibur), knocking it down or stunning it for 5 seconds and doing 500 or more blunt damage (ignoring armour). If this kills the enemy, the corpse should fly across the room in a satisfying way or completely disintegrate into pulp (unless it's a boss). It will not affect any bystanders. Cost will be 25 Energy.

 

Iron Skin:

Belive it or not it's actually fine like this. Rhino is now back to being a ninja and not a sumo anymore. You can't play him like an idiot, you must use tactics and sometimes even cover. You're teammates must also stop being idiots because you can't save them in every situation. Let Mag and Trinity get people out of danger, it's their job! Anyway, I find myself being challenged by the game again and appreciate the DEVs intentions on this one.

Tweak:

Immunity to knockback, stun and stagger is essential, as is the ability to combine it with power mods for increased effectiveness (like Ember). Immunity to toxin and energy drain is not necessary. I want a challenge.

 

Radial Blast:

Pulverizes low-level enemies, Ospreys and Rollers effectively. Good against Infested swarming you, otherwise useless.  I find myself using this a lot on lower levels, where it's more reliable than Rhino Charge. At higher levels it's completely worthless, though. It can buy you some essential seconds by knockng Ancients to the ground but that's it. For 75 energy, it's overpriced.

Buff:

More damage, larger AoE, stronger knockback. Ignores armour. Straight and simple. This should be a smaller version of other warfames ultimate nuke.

 

Rhino Stomp:

I rarely use it, except when being swarmed by VERY high level enemies. Only the most desperate situations need this and those come in high lvl defense missions. When I see 10 ancients running at my team, I know they can't deal with it and will get wiped. 9 crucial seconds allows my team to reposition itself, reload  and use their nukes and weapons to full effect. Truth is, if the game was harder, I'd use this skill more often. It's practically bullet time for your team and it has a good range. As is, this is a mostly easy game and most of the time this skill can't be used very effectively, which is why most players do not equip it. Two solutions for this. Either/or:

Reduce cost:

Since Rhino doesn't get any kills from this, his altruism should pay off. Reduce cost to 75. You can use it more often and your team will love you. Yes, this would mean that Rhino doesn't have a 100 energy skill, as an overall buff you could give him either 150 base health or a base melee damage modifier of +10% (this would be unique).

Additional effect:

For the duration of the power Rhino gains a damage bonus in melee (up to +100%) or, as an alternative, enemies affected by the power could take double damage in general.

 

Overall balance:

Hardcounters are always bad since they can be exploited like crazy and promote linear and ultimately boring gameplay.

Invulnerabilites of any sort simply shouldn't exist in any game. These includes invulnerabilities during cast animations for all warframes, not just Banshee. I see no reason why this should be the case. No ultimate nuke should be a panic button if the game wants to promote tactical awareness. True, it makes you feel like a god for 3 seconds but is this really the thing the Devs want to promote? Every warframe has the means via agility and acrobatics to get exactly where they want to be. Banshees ult can even be used from behind cover since it doesn't need a line of sight.

Suggestion:

Remove all casting animation damage immunities in general. Immunity to knockback or stun during cast is fine though.

Change all damage immunity powers to a high damage mitigation at the highest level (including Link and Snow Globe).

Sure it will make the game a little harder to play but it will also mean that players cannot exploit enemy AI as well as they do now.

Or, if the devs actually want to retain invulnerable mechanics they should all be handled in the same fashion for all warframes, thereby invalidating the changes to Rhino and Banshee. All I'm asking for as a player is a coherent and consequent solution to this discrepancy.

In short: Immunities either for everyone or noone.

 

UI:

I fully expect the background changes for market and foundry to be a temporary thing and to be replaced once U8 comes out. I'm sure we will have proper backgrounds that fit our dojos soon to come.

 

Market changes:

We, the players, know what you are trying to do here. You are trying to artificially lengthen the game experience by slowing down the pace for new players to a longer grind for the cool equipment. Very bad move.

To be honest, I fully understand that you need more credit sinks but I thought they were coming with the dojos or by simply increasing the regular prices for guns. Making them blueprints can make sense under certain conditions but the material costs are hilarious. Especially for the newbies who still want to determine if they actually like the game. You are really building a wall here.

Suggestion: Tone down the material costs for weapons, esp. Alloys. In general, don't turn money grinds into material grinds without changing the drop rates! If this is your way to promote exploring levels and reduce the rushing problem you did a bad job on communicating this intention. Also it doesn't fix the problem at all. Ppl. will play even more defense missions now.

 

The rest:

I realized you renamed Reach to Stretch. Don't like it but that's just personal preference.

Stalker now has a Paris with uniquely designed arrows. Nice one! I was really surpised when I looked like a porcupine after the fight. :D

Excellent job on the rest in general, guys!

[GrayFox]

That Doesn't tell anybody anything... are you literally saying Each war frame should have a trash ability. that is borderline useless? That doesn't make any damn sense.

 

 DE fielded a frame that's well balanced from the get go

 

Is Tesla OP? Not really even if you field them in large numbers -and don't crash- The Damage which isn't all that great once you reach mid level enemies- is still one enemy at a time and they only have so many shots.

 

Launch pad is just good clean fun especially if you use it offensively.

 

Bastille is a good Stun and is excellent for downed party members

 

And Vortex is a nice choke point ultimate which is balanced by it's range.

 

it doesn't tell anything anybody...

 

Look at it this way:

 

Rhino: an old warframe, that has issues with tanking vs trinity and frost, gets apparently "screwed" with this update

Vauban: a new warframe that was released with the said update, and as you elaborately described, well balanced from the get go, even solidifying the thought it is, in fact, a warframe that has all 4 abilities useful. 

 

I'm NOT saying each warframe SHOULD HAVE a "trash" ability, but the reality is there are, even the dev's know about the feedback about certain skills, but why oh bloody why would there be an urgent need to change Iron Skin, when there are other skills that should be made up to par, if not viable to us and, you're taking it completely in a different light, I'm mentioning Vauban in relation to this Rhino fiasco as:

1) if it was possible to have all 4 warframe abilities to be up to par to each other, why not all, in this case for rhino, as MANY have been clamoring about rhino, his 3 other skills are not desirable to use. It's only Iron Skin that was viable then, and it gets nerfed now, basically, as I believe you've read already, almost every one of the post here shouts "What's left to like about Rhino now?" I do play Rhino, and I do know why people expressed their sentiments as they have been doing so, not to get my piss so up high, I do play a decent range of WF's (Loki, Ash, Excal, Banshee, Rhino, Vauban) with 400+ energy, man can you churn out a S#&amp;&#036;load of tesla's and even zap the S#&amp;&#036; out of mobs and still have a few energy left. Now compare that to Rhino, slow movement speed for taking cover (there would be situations that not even rush mod can supplement this) with a low energy pool and the nerfed IS, I won't take a lame rebuttal "you may suck as rhino you know", I'm speaking objectively here, personal preferences aside, with the recent update, Rhino got it hard, even banshee at that.

2) I'm just pointing out something quirky here, A wf gets "screwed" and a new wf (not OP but might as well be in again, the right hands, as much as how people got creative with Trinity, it will be)

 

Ok, if that doesn't tell anybody, I rest my case

[[DE]Rebecca]

Thank you everyone for the amazing feedback, we are going to change Rhino and will look to this thread for the balance suggestions we need. I am locking this thread to make room for the next Hot Topic list: https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/47095-may-19th-hot-feedback-topics/