Nyx Feels Incomplete To Me...

[CapedBaldy]

Nyx needs a rework? Nyx? What a difference a year makes.

Considering the massive amount of changes Absorb went through that made it weaker in terms of synergy compared to the old Absorb's damage potential, the infested defensive changes and the accuracy changes, I wouldn't be too surprised. She barely got anything out of her buff and nerfs save for slightly improved mobility at the cost of damage potential, team synergy, energy cost, trolling potential, clumsy working mechanics. Mind control got a few nice changes, but the skill itself doesn't actually work well due to AI problems which kind of necessitates juggling between mobs and having to execute them quickly once they go derping around and not actually actively engaging or drawing aggro.

[(PSN)WiiConquered]

Considering the massive amount of changes Absorb went through that made it weaker in terms of synergy compared to the old Absorb's damage potential, the infested defensive changes and the accuracy changes, I wouldn't be too surprised. She barely got anything out of her buff and nerfs save for slightly improved mobility at the cost of damage potential, team synergy, energy cost, trolling potential, clumsy working mechanics. Mind control got a few nice changes, but the skill itself doesn't actually work well due to AI problems which kind of necessitates juggling between mobs and having to execute them quickly once they go derping around and not actually actively engaging or drawing aggro.

Her old Absorb chaining was something that wasn't done much in practice; it simply wasn't feasible. Absorb's energy changes are very difficult to notice IMO, and the fact that it is cancelable at any time more than makes up for it. It's only a net loss for pod defense, and that's a boring way to play anyway. Mind control is better (but as you said, AI does dampen it), Psychic bolts are still awful, and Chaos hasn't changed. To me that's a net gain. The only thing that needs to be changed is Psychic bolts. I would make it Pacifying bolts at base except with a permanent disarm or 25 energy cost (if it's not 25 energy already--I rarely use it so I don't know). But her other powers work well together, fit the theme well, and play well.

[tripletriple]

Nyx definitely needs a rework. 

[ThePresident777]

WTF?  DE gutted Nyx too?

[Blazer-X]

OP, I suspect is balking at Nyx's playSTYLE. She is an incredibly smooth, laid back play experience; a utility field general. Volt is my first love, a kinetic, frenetic Utility ASSAULT frame, but I've quickly come to realize that Nyx can do things individually and within a team that few frames can.

 

I agree with this. Nyx is meant to be very laid back in her playstyle and not exactly the "run into the middle of the enemy lines and decimate them" kind of frame, which actually fits the description of the other frames OP have mentioned (Rhino, Nova, and even Loki when running with Invis and Disarm).

 

Now, obviously, our mileage may vary. But I've had much more success surviving as Nyx than I do with most other frames and its also one of the most fun frames I have, simply because I don't have to be running in front of the enemy all day. 

[Sloan441]

Nothing wrong with Nyx. She's still one of the most powerful 'frames in the game and she's never a bad answer for any question you might ask in Warframe.

 

If you are seeing otherwise, you're doing it wrong.

 

Oh, and psychic bolts is kinda handy for picking off those annoying orokin drones. It's pretty good for that...up to a point.

[(PSN)WiiConquered]

Nothing wrong with Nyx. She's still one of the most powerful 'frames in the game and she's never a bad answer for any question you might ask in Warframe.

 

If you are seeing otherwise, you're doing it wrong.

 

Oh, and psychic bolts is kinda handy for picking off those annoying orokin drones. It's pretty good for that...up to a point.

AKA psychic bolts is kind of handy if you're playing melee only on a fragile frame or too lazy to aim...

I agree otherwise though.

[CapedBaldy]

Her old Absorb chaining was something that wasn't done much in practice; it simply wasn't feasible. Absorb's energy changes are very difficult to notice IMO, and the fact that it is cancelable at any time more than makes up for it. It's only a net loss for pod defense, and that's a boring way to play anyway. Mind control is better (but as you said, AI does dampen it), Psychic bolts are still awful, and Chaos hasn't changed. To me that's a net gain. The only thing that needs to be changed is Psychic bolts. I would make it Pacifying bolts at base except with a permanent disarm or 25 energy cost (if it's not 25 energy already--I rarely use it so I don't know). But her other powers work well together, fit the theme well, and play well.

Absorb Chaining wasn't done much, but pumping damage into absorb was something done a lot and absorb chaining was actually quite doable. Changing damage into magnetic hurt her a lot too. Energy changes can become noticeable when you're getting shot by an ally, which was one of the main ways to make good use of Absorb, rather than relying on the comparatively low damage of enemy mobs. Anything that is level 50 and above means that the energy changes probably will be noticeable, but since it's now magnetic damage, it's scaling potential was hit hard against Grineer and Void. It's buffed against Corpus, yea, but those guys have Nullifiers and Infested have the damage reduction auras. You need a lot of energy for it to do any damage and you need to suck up a lot more damage than before for it to do good damage against high levels. Sure, you can do corrosive projection and stuff like that to bypass armour, but that argument can be made for nearly anything related to Grineer and Void anyway. The damage aspect of it was completely butchered and nerfed into the ground and all we got was some little mobility buff.

 

It's still a nice invulnerability and knockdown tool, but to use any of the damage aspects on anything say... Raid? You need a lot of energy, perhaps a bit too much.

 

It's still not weak when you compare it to something like Avalanche or World of Fire, but it still was a net loss for Nyx who got a workaround on some poorly functioning ability as compensation. All players really asked for was just to be able to prematurely end Absorb, but devs decided to make Absorb overpowered and now after all the energy changes Nyx's absorb ended up probably worse than before.

 

Anyway, Nyx could really use some tweaks and interesting new augments (since Loki got Irradiating Disarm which infringes on Nyx territory which makes allies safer since no guns) to open up new modding options that don't involve 'hurr durr negative duration and range on Chaos so you can circumvent unable to recast' or at least make her play more elegantly. For starters, put up a total damage absorbed counter instead of a counter that resets (i can't even tell whether the total damage resets, in-game experiences say yes, wiki says no) so players can monitor their Absorb better and there will be less confusion overall. Make the AI of the absorbed target more aggressive or draw aggro from players. Make sure her abilities are intuitive and actually work elegantly. Make the abilities actually work (not clumsily) and then we can work from there.

Edited May 27, 2015 by CapedBaldy

[DelialFallen]

As several people mentioned already, Nyx is fine.  Granted Psychic Bolts need a buff but all the other abilities are excellent.

 

They do each require their own build to be used effectively and the fact that not all her abilities can perform stellarly in a single build is much more indicative of a well thought out frame rather than something necessitating a general buff.

 

She's my go-to frame for the hardest solo stuff in the game and for long, long survivals and defense.

[maimus]

Nyx is not Broken, granted Boltsneed a buff. DE have made is so she is not OP in the fact you cant re cast, giving Nyx a "chink in her armour" but I believe that keeps her on a level playing field.

 

it is so like saying Mesa is broke because she cant move whilst using her Peacemaker power. Mesa's "chink in her armour" is being static duing this power. 

Edited May 27, 2015 by maimus

[Eyeless]

I don't get why everyone insists on loading all their frames with corrupted mods, on quite a few they simply aren't necessary, not every frame needs to be specialized for just one or two skills. 

 

Some of my frames don't have negatives in ANY of their stats because a more vanilla build offers much more versatility and thus I survive longer in a bad situation than my buddies who mod for sheer specialization. But that's just me, I usually prefer versatile builds over only being good for one or two frames, it's why I always cringe when even a single skill on any of the frames I play is lacking something, I like being able to use everything. 

 

 

On to this thread in and of itself, what is wrong with you people? Why so much venom and spite at the original poster? Most of you didn't even notice the point of this thread fly right over your heads or are more set on arguing than contributing and seeing what the OP is saying. 

 

Why is it okay for a frame to need a specific set of mods to shine when their powers should work fine right out of the box and maxed at 30? 

 

This is the problem, without corrupted mods Nyx's powers are not fine and so those who have her before they can get their grubby mitts on them will be working with a broken half functional tool kit. You're taking a set of 'Eh' powers and making them into 'Usable' when they should be 'Usable' at max rank on their own. Mods just add filler to accentuate our own way to play the frame. 

 

Contrary to popular belief by this community however, not EVERY frame needs a set of corrupted mods and a single gimped ability to function. But god forbid if you can't spam everything on a dime to death.  !@#$ ! 

 

As for what I personally would like to see Nyx get: 

 

Mind Control: I feel like just mind controlling an enemy that wasn't designed to harm its brethren is lackluster, as is it's damage output and reliability as a controlled ally. It's a gimmick power and only useful when a healing unit or snow globe eximus is around. 

Make it's current augment baseline so we have a reliable ally that can potentially kick &#! and take names. 

 

Psychic Bolts: Could this just get replaced? It only works on two targets with it's augment that makes it semi-usable and even that's iffy. I'm not sure what we'd replace this with though.

If nothing else make the augment for it baseline and much more reliable. 

 

Chaos: Instead of leaving it or making it recastable just have it so that enemies that enter it's range are put under it's effects anyway, perhaps in an aura that radiates from Nyx herself like Banshee's silence. 

 

Absorb: Buff it's base range to something comparable to maybe a Bastille with Stretch's radius. Seems fair since it's an Ult and it'd be way more reliable. 

 

My opinions so try not to beat me over the head with them like rabid animals. 

[Marthrym]

She needs help. Badly. Not just because her last "balance" pass was horrendously done, but because she's been slowly falling behind with time, new mechanics being introduced, new enemies, how more and more are less and less affected. But then again the same can be said for other frames... though I care far more about her than any other, Nyx is my all-time favourite.

 

Mind control would be good if most builds didn't kill duration to compensate for Chaos' rather immense weaknesses.

 

Psychic bolts? worst ability in this game so far. Pointless bolts is much more fitting. Get rid of that insult to the Goddess Nyx already.

 

Chaos is her actual 4 as far as I'm concerned, especially after the debacle with Absorb. Unfortunately, making the best out of this ability means you have to cripple power duration and strength to be able to cast it more often, which in turn kills Mind control and Absorb. A shame really.

 

Absorb only serves as a cheap knockdown tool when facing "high level" enemies (that dear broken scaling DE seems to love so much.... *sigh*), no matter how much efficiency you put on Nyx, energy is better spent using Chaos in most cases, because of the 2 seconds stun that acts just the same way the knockdown does, with the added confusion effect behind and the better range. It's more a protection bubble before that point, in case you need to recharge you shields or cover teammates who won't play trolls with you (so very unlikely...), magnetic damage being rather underwhelming in most cases, especially with efficiency builds once again killing Power strength.

 

I still play her just as much as before, which probably helped me realize just how much she has suffered this past year and a half. Still my go-to frame however, no way I'm letting DE take her away from me no matter how much they try.

Edited May 27, 2015 by Marthrym

[MartianJellyfish]

She needs help. Badly. Not just because her last "balance" pass was horrendously done, but because she's been slowly falling behind with time, new mechanics being introduced, new enemies, how more and more are less and less affected. But then again the same can be said for other frames...

 

This is an interesting point. At times I feel that some of the older frames (e.g. Frost, Excalibur, Ember, Nyx) are becoming a bit obsolete in sight of the recent changes being added into the game, and maybe that's why so many players are calling for reworks.

[(PSN)JiggaJazz]

So chaos isn't good anymore because you can't recast it?

You don't NEED negative duration for chaos, that just seems to be the opinion of many here.

Do I also believe negative duration is the way to go? Yes, yes I do but that's my opinion. You can argue that you don't need negative duration and can sit in absorb if you need to until chaos wears off.

Psychic bolts need a fix and that is obvious.

Mind control is amazing.

It seems like people are complaining because they believe you NEED negative duration for chaos and this is probably because it was deemed an op ability when it was recastable and because of this belief people are stating that her abilities conflict.

Yes I understand absorb was changed a lot too but I guess that's just my opinion, nyx is really good still.

[(XBOX)BluAina]

She feels good to me except physic bolts maybe I just haven't found a use for em

[.Re-light.]

Sorry OP, can't agree.

 

All mods are there to be used.

 

    Nyx abilities beside physic bolts are all amazing.. You can find your own ideal Chaos duration, play her right, and she is one of the toughest frames that don't completely trivializes enemies, to die.

 

 Building her is also so damn simple, range, duration, efficiency that there is room for a lot (actually all, including qt and p flow) of defensive mods.

 

I don't play her much for the same reason I don't play Ira.Dis. Loki anymore, it makes the game a bit too easy for me.

 

  Outside the Physic bolts she is in my opinion in a perfect state.

 

Try not using a single corrupted mod, or max mods for that mater on other frames and guess what, they will all feel weak and incomplete.

[.Re-light.]

     By the way, Chaos range is bigger then what you see on paper. Even the default one will pull aggro from you in a much wider radius because enemies not effected by it will still aim at the ones that are.

 

  Once you put Stretch and Overextended on her, she becomes the Captain of the battlefield, no matter the size of the map.

[xNegikunx]

I have to agree.  There is just no defending Psychic Bolts, it's a godawful 2 ability.  Mind Control gets gimped because Chaos lasts too long without negative duration, not to mention the enemy AI sometimes just runs around doing nothing.  Irradiating Disarm almost completely overshadows Chaos, it radiation procs, it disarms, and it's recastable.  Don't get me wrong, I love Chaos on Nyx and it does have a slight range advantage over Loki, but you're telling me Loki gets all those added benefits and we can't even get a recastable Chaos?

 

Absorb is in a good place, besides the fact that my max range Absorb is somehow failing to protect excavators.

[Ironlixivium]

Ok, I see many...many...opinions here, mostly not wanting a buff for nyx. As you so pleasantly requested I did more testing with her and found that negative duration chaos sucks, due to it's long cast (1/12 of it's duration like this, wtf.) but I will say that max range absorb is good. Thing is though, I'd rather they give it a fixed 25m range (unable to be effected by range) because I feel like it should have that range already, but I don't think it should be able to go higher.

 

Also, I know someone will come in here talking about it, don't worry, I'll give you my response right now:chaos sphere is really bad (I'm sorry DE) because not only is it duration based, so it throws off your whole "negative duration" thing, but it's only 50% of the duration AND it shrinks! Please, DE, make it 100% or make the sphere not shrink, otherwise this is useless :/

 

Edit: clarification

 

Addition:

This was written mid mission, so I'll make it quick. enemies under chaos still shoot at me sometimes, so no, it's not the best cc. Nova's makes it so they can only fire one bullet ever second or two, so its not hard to just walk out of los while you enjoy a sandwich ('cause thats how slow they are). My suggestion for chaos sphere would be to have it shrink at a set speed, cause my max range nyx (you know, the one you need to make absorb work) casts chaos, then the sphere shrinks so fast there's no way they could actually run into the sphere. (so it only effects enemies that spawn into it :/ )

 

TL;DR: so many replies that nyx is fine as is, so just pretend I put one of them here, and: absorb should have its range fixed at max (24m, just put it at 25) AND, chaos still sucks, I literally just used it on a heavy (who was sorrounded by teammates I might add) who proceeded to shoot the defense pod. I realize some of you may be thinking it's because I was absorbing and that increases aggro, no, I was standing near the defense pod watching the enemies (and replying to chat). So yeah, chaos is the best cc? LOL, NOPE. Any other cc would've prevented this. :/

Edited May 27, 2015 by Ironlixivium

[(PSN)WiiConquered]

Ok, I see many...many...opinions here, mostly not wanting a buff for nyx. As you so pleasantly requested I did more testing with her and found that negative duration chaos sucks, due to it's long cast (1/12 of it's duration like this, wtf.) but I will say that max range absorb is good. Thing is though, I'd rather they give it a fixed 25m range (unable to be effected by range) because I feel like it should have that range already, but I don't think it should be able to go higher.

 

Also, I know someone will come in here talking about it, don't worry, I'll give you my response right now:chaos sphere is really bad (I'm sorry DE) because not only is it duration based, so it throws off your whole "negative duration" thing, but it's only 50% of the duration AND it shrinks! Please, DE, make it 100% or make the sphere not shrink, otherwise this is useless :/

 

Edit: clarification

 

Addition:

This was written mid mission, so I'll make it quick. enemies under chaos still shoot at me sometimes, so no, it's not the best cc. Nova's makes it so they can only fire one bullet ever second or two, so its not hard to just walk out of los while you enjoy a sandwich ('cause thats how slow they are). My suggestion for chaos sphere would be to have it shrink at a set speed, cause my max range nyx (you know, the one you need to make absorb work) casts chaos, then the sphere shrinks so fast there's no way they could actually run into the sphere. (so it only effects enemies that spawn into it :/ )

 

TL;DR: so many replies that nyx is fine as is, so just pretend I put one of them here, and: absorb should have its range fixed at max (24m, just put it at 25) AND, chaos still sucks, I literally just used it on a heavy (who was sorrounded by teammates I might add) who proceeded to shoot the defense pod. I realize some of you may be thinking it's because I was absorbing and that increases aggro, no, I was standing near the defense pod watching the enemies (and replying to chat). So yeah, chaos is the best cc? LOL, NOPE. Any other cc would've prevented this. :/

The thing with Chaos CC is no, it's not an M-Prime or Bastille lobotomize your enemy type deal, and it has drawbacks, but when used at the right time it is immensely effective, and only has become moreso as enemies have become stronger (save Nullifiers). Now, a properly timed Chaos can give you a Toxic Eximi armor-ignore poisoning enemies for 30 seconds (I still hate them though), it can give you a fire eximus to blast away all your opposition, it can give you a swarm of Corrupted Butchers to hack everything to death, and it can give you Corrupted Bombards that your enemies have no hope of dodging.

But you also have to use it at the right time. If you hit the button at a bad time when there are three enemies in front of you, you're going to spend 30 second hunting one of them down.

This is the same with Mind Control. If you waste it on any random soldier you'll be disappointed. But you can turn a healing ancient into your personal Trinity complete with 90% DR, you can make one gunner or one bombard a giant support unit, you can make a sapping osprey murder battalions of Corpus.

Absorb is just the glue that keeps Nyx from being one-dimensional. If you're caught in a bad position where Chaos alone won't save you, you can use absorb, blast back everyone, and then use Chaos after. Granted, it's range could use an increase.

And Psychic Bolts is terrible.

[Ironlixivium]

The thing with Chaos CC is no, it's not an M-Prime or Bastille lobotomize your enemy type deal, and it has drawbacks, but when used at the right time it is immensely effective, and only has become moreso as enemies have become stronger (save Nullifiers). Now, a properly timed Chaos can give you a Toxic Eximi armor-ignore poisoning enemies for 30 seconds (I still hate them though), it can give you a fire eximus to blast away all your opposition, it can give you a swarm of Corrupted Butchers to hack everything to death, and it can give you Corrupted Bombards that your enemies have no hope of dodging.

But you also have to use it at the right time. If you hit the button at a bad time when there are three enemies in front of you, you're going to spend 30 second hunting one of them down.

This is the same with Mind Control. If you waste it on any random soldier you'll be disappointed. But you can turn a healing ancient into your personal Trinity complete with 90% DR, you can make one gunner or one bombard a giant support unit, you can make a sapping osprey murder battalions of Corpus.

Absorb is just the glue that keeps Nyx from being one-dimensional. If you're caught in a bad position where Chaos alone won't save you, you can use absorb, blast back everyone, and then use Chaos after. Granted, it's range could use an increase.

And Psychic Bolts is terrible.

 

Sorry, the chaos stuff was for people here that insisted chaos is the single greatest cc in the game, then insisted I go try it. In a way, they're kinda the reason I reviewed it so harshly (by putting it up to the standard of "greatest cc") By the way, thanks for helping be describe how I feel about nyx. She's just shy of one dimensional. As you said, absorb is what keeps her from being one dimensional. when playing her I have this constant feel as if I'm using everything as a last resort. THIS is what I want fixed about nyx. Other frames have last resorts and attack abilities, nyx's are combined, with her last resort being the same thing she attacks with, resulting in this constant bottom-of-the-barrel feeling. Thanks for helping me realize that. 

 

I still think chaos could use a buff though, probably to be recastable but only renew timers (not cc new units) or, as I said in the OP, (and someone said in a post earlier) be like bastille, effecting any new targets that enter the radius. (and staying that way for the remainder of the duration)

[(PSN)WiiConquered]

Sorry, the chaos stuff was for people here that insisted chaos is the single greatest cc in the game, then insisted I go try it. In a way, they're kinda the reason I reviewed it so harshly (by putting it up to the standard of "greatest cc") By the way, thanks for helping be describe how I feel about nyx. She's just shy of one dimensional. As you said, absorb is what keeps her from being one dimensional. when playing her I have this constant feel as if I'm using everything as a last resort. THIS is what I want fixed about nyx. Other frames have last resorts and attack abilities, nyx's are combined, with her last resort being the same thing she attacks with, resulting in this constant bottom-of-the-barrel feeling. Thanks for helping me realize that. 

 

I still think chaos could use a buff though, probably to be recastable but only renew timers (not cc new units) or, as I said in the OP, (and someone said in a post earlier) be like bastille, effecting any new targets that enter the radius. (and staying that way for the remainder of the duration)

I still maintain that the way to go is making a change to Psychic Bolts--they need SOMETHING. Maybe they could cause enemies to inflict self-damage or something. But part of why Nyx feels like she's missing something is because she has one utterly worthless power.

[climatiseur]

Also, I know someone will come in here talking about it, don't worry, I'll give you my response right now:chaos sphere is really bad (I'm sorry DE) because not only is it duration based, so it throws off your whole "negative duration" thing, but it's only 50% of the duration AND it shrinks! Please, DE, make it 100% or make the sphere not shrink, otherwise this is useless :/

 

Even if it is full duration and won't shrink, it is still useless. As you mentioned, enemies outside the range already see the affected enemies as Nyx, Thus they were already affected somehow. They won't just ignoring the affected enemies and run inside the mysterious sphere to see what it actually does. If anything, the sphere should expand.

[UNO168]

Fixing broken abilities by adding even more broken augments. way to go DE

[Ironlixivium]

I still maintain that the way to go is making a change to Psychic Bolts--they need SOMETHING. Maybe they could cause enemies to inflict self-damage or something. But part of why Nyx feels like she's missing something is because she has one utterly worthless power.

 

     I agree, psychic bolts to a completely different ability. Actually, I think it might not just be the fact that she has one useless ability, but how mind control is basically a mini chaos. The reason I think this is because nova also has a useless ability, (null star) but she doesn't feel even half as one-dimensional. I think nyx needs something more reliable. Currently the only things she can do reliably is to make one enemy not shoot her, and to become invincible.