A Max Streamline And Fleeting Expertise Should Increase Power Efficiency By 190%. So Why Capped It At 175%?

[(XBOX)YoAlaskaDude]

Its been bugging me for some time now. I just don't like the fact that we get a capped power efficiency but we still suffer the full penalty of -60% duration from Fleeting Expertise. If you're going to keep the cap at least fix Fleeting Expertise so we don't get a major duration lost (maybe +45% Efficiency -45% Duration).

Edited May 28, 2015 by (XB1)ThatAlaskanDude

[zerogear5]

I believe this is to prevent breaking the game. I do agree we need more corrupt mods with different + and -.

[StinkyPygmy]

Because there is literally no reason you could need more then 175%. Even thats almost redundent.

[Saraphys]

Because some first, second, and third abilities which are used already cost as little as 10 energy to cast with just 160%, if you allow for higher numbers then 175% efficency, some abilities practically become free to cast.

[DeMeritus]

Because if they gave 190% instead of 175% power efficiency, then... ummm...  because... errr...  Uh... balance... and ummm...

 

Honestly, I kind of think it was just an arbitrary choice on the part of some of the developers early on, which hasn't really been revised since.  Probably ones who don't actually play the game on a regular basis.

[DiabolusUrsus]

^ This.

The devs have to put up at least some facade about being concerned with game balance. 

[(XBOX)YoAlaskaDude]

Because some first, second, and third abilities which are used already cost as little as 10 energy to cast with just 160%, if you allow for higher numbers then 175% efficency, some abilities practically become free to cast.

 

I know full well that efficiency of 190% would make most abilities cost next to nothing. I'm just saying that if DE are gonna keep it at 175% then they should fix the stat on Fleeting so we don't get a full duration loss.

[Abelarde-EGT-]

It's to prevent that anyone ever can get over 100% energy cost reduction. Fleeting+Streamling gives already 90%, so if there is an option to gain at least additional 10% (like loki's arcane essence helmet), all abilities would be without cost (or maybe you would even gain energy per cast)

[(PSN)JiggaJazz]

I know full well that efficiency of 190% would make most abilities cost next to nothing. I'm just saying that if DE are gonna keep it at 175% then they should fix the stat on Fleeting so we don't get a full duration loss.

You're right we should have 175% efficient with with only like 20% duration loss so that the duration loss means absolutely nothing and we can spam ALL abilities rather than just ultimates more easily.

/sarcasm

[(XBOX)YoAlaskaDude]

You're right we should have 175% efficient with with only like 20% duration loss so that the duration loss means absolutely nothing and we can spam ALL abilities rather than just ultimates more easily.

/sarcasm

 

I was thinking on the line of -45% duration lost like my first post said...

[Kletse]

Farm/buy a 2nd fleeting expertise.. fuse it to +40 -40.. done

[kitsu]

Here is a thought, why not just make a 2 rank stream line so thats a perfect 75% or here, even better, make a 4 rank fleeting so its at 40% instead of the full 60% and combine that with streamline, going up to 70%.

 

Your not locked to one maxed mod, you can grab more and rank those to what ever level you need.

 

Personally I found having a half rank fleeting at 30% and a full rank is perfect for most if not all needs with all warframes.

[Jaysus41]

Once Primed Streamline gets released, builds will get turned on their head. with that maxed you would only need a rank 1 Fleeting Expertise to reach max efficiency. that means only a 20% reduction to duration.

 

I've got a legendary core with its name on it.

 

Baro comes tomorrow... fingers crossed

Edited May 28, 2015 by Jaysus41

[Naqel]

Once Primed Streamline gets released...

 

You assume DE is incompetent enough to continue releasing mods that break their already broken game...

 

 

...You would be correct in that assumption.

[(XBOX)YoAlaskaDude]

Here is a thought, why not just make a 2 rank stream line so thats a perfect 75% or here, even better, make a 4 rank fleeting so its at 40% instead of the full 60% and combine that with streamline, going up to 70%.

 

Your not locked to one maxed mod, you can grab more and rank those to what ever level you need.

 

Personally I found having a half rank fleeting at 30% and a full rank is perfect for most if not all needs with all warframes.

 

 

Farm/buy a 2nd fleeting expertise.. fuse it to +40 -40.. done

 

Thanks for the suggestion! Really wish I thought of that before posting my rant.

[Jaysus41]

You assume DE is incompetent enough to continue releasing mods that break their already broken game...

 

 

...You would be correct in that assumption.

 

It wouldnt be that big of a boon. a fair few frames rely on lower duration so they can spam abilities faster (see Chaos Nyx) or the abilities a player is gearing for doesnt benefit or benefits insignificantly (see Desecrate Nekros, Snow Globe Frost, and IS Rhino) and then theres miasma saryn which would actually be a detriment to have more duration.

 

off the top of my head, the frames that would benefit the most would be:

 

MP nova with increased range

 

Invis Loki with more sneaky time (most builds dont have Fleeting anyway)

 

Blessing Trinity with more dmg reduction buff time (but would need more time between casts)

 

Sonar Banshee with more Sonar time (but would be spammed anyway so it kinda defeats the purpose)

 

and any Zephyr with faster, longer tailwinds... but trust me, unless you plan on going into orbit you dont need more than a little.

Edited May 28, 2015 by Jaysus41

[Dunkingmachine]

It wouldnt be that big of a boon. a fair few frames rely on lower duration so they can spam abilities faster (see Chaos Nyx) or the abilities a player is gearing for doesnt benefit or benefits insignificantly (see Desecrate Nekros, Snow Globe Frost, and IS Rhino) and then theres miasma saryn which would actually be a detriment to have more duration.

 

off the top of my head, the frames that would benefit the most would be:

 

MP nova with increased range

 

Invis Loki with more sneaky time (most builds dont have Fleeting anyway)

 

Blessing Trinity with more dmg reduction buff time (but would need more time between casts)

 

Sonar Banshee with more Sonar time (but would be spammed anyway so it kinda defeats the purpose)

 

and any Zephyr with faster, longer tailwinds... but trust me, unless you plan on going into orbit you dont need more than a little.

 

People are looking at Primed Streamline completely wrong, assuming we would just replace Fleeting. The real problem starts when they get stacked, when 25% more efficiency would allow 5 more ranks of blind rage = +45% power damage while retaining maximum efficiency, significantly raising the power of nuker frames already used in endgame content (Saryn, Mesa), ultimately nerfing game content as a whole.

[H3dsh0t]

People are looking at Primed Streamline completely wrong, assuming we would just replace Fleeting. The real problem starts when they get stacked, when 25% more efficiency would allow 5 more ranks of blind rage = +45% power damage while retaining maximum efficiency, significantly raising the power of nuker frames already used in endgame content (Saryn, Mesa), ultimately nerfing game content as a whole.

 

Pretty much this in a nutshell. Quite frankly I think Primed Streamline was there to troll the dataminers. The way energy efficiency ingame works is already more than it needs to be, hence why we've ended up with the 4 to win dilemma, and I think DE know that introducing primed streamline or raising the power efficiency cap would be terrible for the game.

[Dawnstrider]

Because if they gave 190% instead of 175% power efficiency, then... ummm...  because... errr...  Uh... balance... and ummm...

 

Honestly, I kind of think it was just an arbitrary choice on the part of some of the developers early on, which hasn't really been revised since.  Probably ones who don't actually play the game on a regular basis.

 

 

Lets just make abilities not cost anything while we're at it. That'll fix the ability spam

[Leuca]

^ This.

The devs have to put up at least some facade about being concerned with game balance. 

lol the shade of this post

[VentiGlondi]

Even 75% is too much

[Renegade343]

Actually, it is capped at 75%, meaning that for an ability that needs energy with its original cost x, then with 75% Efficiency, that means the ability now needs (1 - 0.75)x = 0.25x, meaning that the ability can be cast for a quarter of its original cost. 

 

If it were to be capped at 175%, then that means the ability will be (1 - 1.75)x = -0.75x, meaning that the ability, when cast, will not only be free, but will also give out three quarters of its original cost to the player. 

Edited May 28, 2015 by Renegade343

[MayPeX]

Actually, it is capped at 75%, meaning that for an ability that needs energy with its original cost x, then with 75% Efficiency, that means the ability now needs (1 - 0.75)x = 0.25x, meaning that the ability can be cast for a quarter of its original cost. 

 

If it were to be capped at 175%, then that means the ability will be (1 - 1.75)x = -0.75x, meaning that the ability, when cast, will not only be free, but will also give out three quarters of its original cost to the player. 

 

You know what we mean, there's no need to point this out.

[Dunkingmachine]

Actually, it is capped at 75%, meaning that for an ability that needs energy with its original cost x, then with 75% Efficiency, that means the ability now needs (1 - 0.75)x = 0.25x, meaning that the ability can be cast for a quarter of its original cost. 

 

If it were to be capped at 175%, then that means the ability will be (1 - 1.75)x = -0.75x, meaning that the ability, when cast, will not only be free, but will also give out three quarters of its original cost to the player. 

 

It shows 175% in the game so naturally that's what players would refer to. Everybody knows what's really meant.

[Tsukinoki]

They cap it at 175% for two reasons:
Obstensibly balance, so that you can't get abilities that are free, or even give energy, on certain frames.  Because if you could get the efficiency to 190% through mods then the Arcane Essence Loki helmet, Arcane Chorus Banshee helmet, or the Arcane Vespa Nyx helmet would allow those three frames to reach 200% efficiency.

And secondly, while the efficiency is capped at 175% it gives you some wiggle room with blind rage.  Because with a R2 blind rage you would still have the efficiency cap (190 - 15 = 175).  If they ever do release primed streamline you could get higher ranks with blind rage while staying at or above the maximum efficiency, because while it wont reduce costs past 175%, the negative effiency affects its full amount, not just the capped amount.