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[DE]Drew

June 5Th: Community Hot Topics!

  

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1. Simply removing stamina is a lazy, quick-fix solution in my eyes. It invalidates a variety of mods, dismantles abilities that affect stamina, and is honestly a system that could be put to better use. The only real problem with it is that it's limiting in all the wrong ways.

 

- It doesn't actually work as a limiter for melee attacks, which shouldn't be limited anyway.

- It needlessly restricts currently obsolete types of movement.

- It limits melee blocking in such a way that it prevents the action from scaling well when it's most needed.

 

That said, stamina does have its uses. Treat it as a quickly-regenerating secondary energy bar for more powerful actions that should be somewhat limited. Like blocking, and channeling. This keeps damage/knockdown immunity for blocking in check while also helping divorce channeling from its pointless competition with Warframe abilities. 

 

The benefits channeling confers aren't enough to justify its insane energy costs given that better function is a part of most Warframe abilities. Is channeling arguably viable? Yes, but you have to go out of your way to make it so, and cater specifically to playing that way, whereas other playstyles are benefits the players can tack on without limiting themselves in some way. 

 

- Give blocking non-scaling, projectile-specific blocking that is balanced the same way at Level 1 as it is at Level 100.

- Adjust channeling costs and benefits to better suit a quickly regenerating energy pool.

 

This allows players to define "stamina" (or whatever else you want to call it) as a melee-specific resource that can be allocated either offensively or defensively depending on their builds. 

 

2. My initial reactions to the proposed Star Chart changes were allergically negative. Have you guys learned nothing about your game over the past two years? What does the playerbase hate most? Arbitrary RNG. "I know, let's add more arbitrary RNG to simply playing the game! That's sure to go over well!" Really, now?

 

The problem at hand is that you've concentrated all your worthwhile loot in a few sparsely-populated corners of your game world. I agree that the sheer number of available nodes could stand to be reduced, but it should be a simple matter of spreading out your loot more evenly. Or, you know, giving us a reason to play your game besides hunting loot

 

To make matters worse, you've shelled up behind this "nothing's set in stone" excuse that nobody buys and everybody is uneasy about. You've done this sort of thing enough times that you should know by now to be more transparent about this. You're proposing a controversial change, you know it's a controversial change, and you're still refusing to openly gather community input about it. Instead of being secretive about the whole process and waiting to unveil some meticulously-crafted master plan that nobody is really looking forward to, how about you create an official feedback thread to gather opinions and ideas? Let us know about decisions you make along the way! Keep us up to date throughout the whole process so that we know what to expect from the end-product we are presented with! 

 

You know, how about you communicate with your community

 

3. Eh. Don't like the concept of raids, can't really comment on them.

 

4. How about instead of pondering how to expand your progression system with more pointless power-creep, you actually establish a progression system in the first place? One not governed by random chance.

 

Like Level 100 in Pokemon, the actual maximum level isn't really important. The issue is that "Rank 30" isn't actually suited for use against "Level 30" enemies. At all. 

 

What you need to do is sit down and decide on a maximum level, and then make said level hold a consistent meaning across the board. Level is supposed to be an indicator of what gear is appropriate for which areas of the game, and the general threat level of the enemies we are confronted with. It currently does nothing of the sort. 

 

Give Warframes, weapons, and enemies base Rank 1 stats and maximum Rank 30 stats. Implement smooth scaling between the two. This means a Rank 30 Warframe with Rank 30 weapons will be sufficiently equipped to face Rank 30 enemies with no mods equipped. Then, reduce the overall benefit provided by mods. Mods should provide minor tweaks to the way things handle - like any proper customization system does - without making or breaking the experience one way or the other. This doesn't devalue the options available to the player through the possession of mods, but it does take some of the pressure off of newer players to obtain "mandatory" mods like damage scaling and give veteran players more room to experiment for fun. 

 

Lastly, create a clearly-defined and understandable tiering system for your weapons. Make it crystal-clear which weapons are stepping stones along the path of progression, and where they belong. This is especially important if you're going to adhere to the system of using "obsolete" weapons to craft new ones. People need to know what they should hang on to for future use.

 

However...

 

The most important thing is that you give players an option to work around your tiering system. You have already built up Warframe's arsenal around players finding weapons they like - based on handling and aesthetics - and general rule-of-cool fan service. It doesn't feel good to have your favorite gear made obsolete with time simply because the show must go on. 

 

Allow players to push their favorite weapons up through the tiers through an upgrade system that is more resource-intensive than simply upgrading to the next weapon in line. It should cost more. It should take more time. It should be grindy. It should  encourage simply sticking to the tiering progression, but it will still afford players with a strong preference the freedom of choice that is one of the few things Warframe currently still has going for it. 

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For progression after 30 i would like to see some sort of system that allows for passives on weapons or a way to boost weapon damage by like 1 point at a time or something. like how we have arcanes for warframes but for weapons. not to sure what i want there but i definitely want it. i would also like to see a way to combine 2 mods together. imagine combinding a serration and,say,an ammodrum together. but there are many catches. first the combined mods cannot exceed what they can already do. serration effect only goes to 200 or whatever and ammodrum only does 30. in order to fuse mods they have to be max rank. the new total modcap for this new mod would be the two base unranked costs together. the max rank for the new mod would be the same as the max rank for the higher possible ranked mod. in my example max rank would be 10 because serration is rank 10. furthermore it would get a RANDOM polarity. so the new mod would have the benefits of both mods and save some space. in my example the new total would be 19 instead of 23. furthermore this mod can only be used on one weapon, the one u initialy equip it on and still cannot be combined with the mods used to make it.

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Saying “so long!” to Stamina

 

I want it to be removed how I see it , it will indeed allow non stop rushing that already what we know , but ATLEAST slow frame or slow people will be able to keep running instead of walking and getting slower (while the good rusher know how to go fast and keep stamina on)

but the main problem I see is about blocking , just imagine on PVP some dude standing blocking until you fire all your bullet once you finish he take his gun on and kill you and abuse everytime (way to make anyone stop doing PVP) 

Fix would be that Block stamina have his own add'ed only while using it

 

Wish Upon a Star Chart

You're saying old Star Chart did not have function you want on it , why not simply re do it and add function? the game was running more faster at that time and being on liset does not change anything to gameplay/lore except maybe for archwing.

Actually I would'nt care if the game had some real content to give , but removing the only content it had until now , why? there is already nothing to do (for vet atleast) and you guys want to remove that

Also , you said on DevStream "RNG mission" we seriously have enought of RNG on game , soon our name ,clan , alliance , friend , game movement will be RNG to ... and 330 to 20 mission is leaving like 2 mission per planet? which probably kill the tutorial logic anyway... more detail need'ed

 

Trials

I voted full detail but well No ,when it's was release for PC we had to guess a bit , maybe solution would be 

Easy mode : full instruction -90% reward (hey instruction is not free ! )

Normal mode : current system  or maybe a bit more information 100% reward

Nightmare mode : deal with it , we're lucky to keep our mini map and lotus saying grineer incoming

 

Warframe after 30( btw you made a mistake and type Waframe) :

This question is quite hard , I would answer YES but , what it does extra? does weapon earn anything? mastery? how about old weapon that is collector ? You know braton vandal and rest , which will just make huge gap for mastery if it give any.

 

I'm for making this to 30+ , but not sure since I'm lazy to recraft old weapon to get some more mastery , and like I said people with exclusive weapon will get huge mastery boost (if it give any)

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Stamina, Solar map, Progression - no opinion on Trial since I have not play it yet being primarily a solo player due to network problem.

 

Stamina

Stamina is not working as intended since we have to use it with just about everything in melee combat - running, wallrunning, and blocking. Melee attack is somehow free of charge and you can infinitely spam it without using stamina.

- Anyone who ever play 'sword alone' style will feel that stamina becomes a burden since player has to maneuver toward the target under fire from multiple target, necessitate blocking while running which consume stamina at an alarming rate.

- There is no way to replenish stamina mid-combat which means less fluid action from one group of enemy to another (Hey, I just slice 20 your friends in half and I'm out of breath so I'm going to sit here behind the crate and regain my stamina!).

 

DE doesn't have to remove it entirely but remove it from general movement action and keep it in melee-oriented action. Make the green bar actually matters! Blocking decrease the green bar without any damage to the player or giving stamina replenishment when you kill an enemy, etc.

 

Solar map change

I have to say that this particular map is bad due to the fact that it offers too much nodes. A lot of these turned into ghost town and waste a lot of opportunity for the tileset to shine.

- Reduce number of node down to at least 'minimal' level - each planet should have one of each mission type or some should have certain mission type being exclusive to them (like Hijack). Cut down the generic ship-based tileset mission to minimal.

- Currently we have 6 Grineer tilesets (including sealab), 4 Corpus, and one infest - multiply these with 8 mission type will gives us merely 88 mission nodes. If we are going to go lore-based, the Infest always assimilate everything they touch so capture, rescue, and interception wouldn't work. Left us with 85 mission nodes. 

- That means cutting down some planets that doesn't have to exist anymore and combine assassination mission into one planet until each has his/her own tileset.

- Create a 'series' of alert which involves multiple missions of different types in multiple tilesets that culminates in a boss fight - using Warframe's asset to the fullest. These type of event could be a daily 24 hours thing to prevent players from unable accessing it. 

 

Progression

- Admittedly, I would like to see my excess EXP used in someway. It is a good incentive to continue playing with maxed frame and weapon.

- We can go with Borderlands' progression in a form of Badass rank. Increasing specific aspect of each frame and weapon with repeated usage with diminishing return after each rank.

- Or we can go with the old 'tree' to specialize each weapon and frame but that doesn't quite solve the problem due to the fact that it is finite system dealing with infinite EXP but it can be used in conjunction with Badass rank proposal. 

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Stamina should leave.

Starchart should be unique so that everytime we play its entertaining and not repetitive. I get bored with the same missions.

Trials i could care less.

Beyond 30 now i thought that was focus. And i think we should have that because earlier when i did false profit i got destroyed by 3 80lv crewmen. I hope its not just me cause dang. And if it is me i need someones help. Cause i lost all my lives. Now if it is focus then im willing to wait because i want focus to be awesome and not rushed

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I'd still like to hear more on the starchart before commenting. The devs have been very vague so far. The community is way to sensitive on the topic of change so it should'nt be rushed in for update 17. Any new system needs to be carefully picked apart and analysed to ensure it does make the game stronger.

 

I have some key points i'd like answered before expanding on my opinion of the starchart.

-How will questing work? will active quests be included in the nodes? how will this effect future freedom to replay old events and quests.

-will we have duplicate game modes in those 20 nodes? (no thanks if half the 20 missions being interceptions or hijack)

-where will archwing and new tiles fit into the new starchart

-how will levels of enemies be scaled?

-Will the rewards/drops/access be increased?

-kubrow/catbrow egg/mod farming?

-will we still have starchart alerts, invasions and faction quests?

-Could the objectives of a shrinking starchart be acheived by keeping the current starchart and form inplace?

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1. For stamina, I'd rather see it just removed from most things, but maybe not blocking (seems pretty important there for balance).

 

2. For the star chart, see number 4, because I think these two issues could play into each other.

 

3. For the trials, I think hints or no hints is kind of pointless. There were guides out within the day or next day when the first trial dropped, so I don't think it really matters. From that perspective, some mild indication to help less motivated people out with completing the mission would be good, cause then it makes public groups more viable.

 

4. I think the star chart's main problem isn't the number of nodes, but it's the lack of incentive to play those missions that aren't endless. They're ghost towns because players don't need to play them for anything. And to be fair, some of the missions types are a little bland (especially starchart sabotage compared to void sabotage).

 

I think it would be a good idea to make some unique resources drop on each planet, and these resources could go into crafting perks for a weapon or frame. And maybe you can only add these craft-able perks to a weapon/warframe a total of 50 times and only when it's at level 30, but it's up to you to decide how you spread them out (and each planet drops components for specific stats). Just as an example:

 

Let's say Neptune drops the following fictional resources for perk-crafting, in the following ways:

-MOA Cervo-------Sabotage

-Bursa Sheild------Deception

-Ospray Engine---Capture

 

The MOA Cervo could be used to increase firing rate of a Primary by .01 point.

The Bursa Sheild could be used to increase warframe armor by 1 point.

The Ospray Engine could be used to increase Sentinel sheilds by 1 point.

 

Maybe Ceres drops these things:

 

-Scorpion Blade-----Sabotage

-Drahk Tooth--------Deception

-Bombard Armor----Capture

 

The Scorpion Blade could be used to increase the attack of a Grineer Melee weapon by .05 point.

The Drahk Tooth could be used to increase the attack of a Kubrow by .05 point.

Bombard Armor could be used to increase knock down resistance by 1 point.

 

We'd also need crafting requirements where you'd need multiples of each new resource. Maybe 10 Scorpion Blades, 200 Detonite Samples, and 3000 Ferrite for example. Now there's a reason to play sabotage on Ceres, since there's a chance for that end of mission reward to give a scorpion blade and you want to power up your Dual Cleavers.

 

Either way, this gives players a way to customize their weapons in non-game-breaking ways and a reason to play more of the star chart. This kind of system would probably wind up using most of the nodes we have now, since there's all kinds of stats that could be increased in specific ways.

 

 

Outside of that, I'd say the focus system where you can do little passive bonuses for things is also cool. Getting enough affinity gives you a point to spend on upgrading small passive stats like sliding, sprint speed, and maybe even base energy pool. In that case, you could give each warframe their own cap to those points. Or you could use those points on Aura slots or utility slots and then focus on the incremental buffs. This could also mean I might want 2 Nekros' for example, so I can build a tanky one, and maybe one that's more offensive.

 

I'd say either way, the extra system should be pretty a la cart, but also limited. Maybe there's a pool of 25 Focus perks to choose from per Warframe/Weapon, but you can only build up 5 or 10.

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Stamina: 

Remove entirely from archwing, makes no sense since we using some jetpack.

Remove from melee attacks, we can keep using without any stamina...

Fix how blocking and stamina drain works, its rly bad in this game, need major change

 

Solar Map:

I agree with reducing drastically the number of nodes, to make it much easier to find games and enjoyable, but if it isnt rewarding no one will play it still.

 

Leveling past 30:

I would love to have some expensive and hard skill or perk tree for your favourite gear, would make playing much more enjoyable and unique to your choices. Still im not hyped, im pretty sure will be useless just like syndicate mods, seriously disapointed...Our efforts for those crap mods that arent worthy at all a mod slot, most of them!

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My only real gripe with any of these topics is stamina, all the others are topics I'd like to see more in game action with to see if it would work.

 

Concerning stamina, start with its complete removal then change how the velocity feels with sprinting and other mechanics. Using Frost or any of the other "slower" frames feels like i can never get past a jog and even looks somewhat like that. And the fast frames feels almost too relaxed and clunky speeding in an unnatural way.

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Stamina

 

Yes, it should go. It does not serve any purpose except being a nuisance to the movement. As for infinite blocking when stamina is removed, it won't be OP. Because we get shot from every direction and we can block bullets from forward only.

 

Star-Chart

 

I am pretty skeptical about 20 nodes idea, tbh. In this regard, I will just quote myself from another thread -

 

Ok,so here is my suggestion. I really hope this does not go unnoticed(though I will probably send a link to DERebecca).

 

This is based on the types of missions we have as of now.

 

We have the following missions as of now -

Assassination , Capture , Crossfire , Deception , Defense , Excavation , Exterminate , Hijack , Interception , Mobile Defense , Rescue , Sabotage , Spy , Survival. A total of 14 missions.

 

Now,if we try to have one node on each planet for each type of mission,we will end up with around 190 nodes(196 minus a few non-boss nodes on a few planets).

 

Idea 1 (Planet based idea) -

(This idea is based on the assumption that each planet will eventually have a different tileset when Warframe is released.)

 

-Each different planet should have one node of the missions which are popular(and also,if it fits in that tillset,like no survivals on open tilesets).

 

-We can have a poll to see the top 5 or 6 game modes that the community loves.

AFAIK, Defense ,  Exterminate , Interception , Rescue , Spy and Survival/Excavation(Since it's either one of the 2) are the most popular game modes. So, total of 84 nodes here.

 

-Now,add 12 Boss nodes(excluding Lephantis, Mutalist Alad V and Phorid since they either need keys or are timed invasions).

 

-Then, add 10 more nodes scattered over 14 planets that will have the less popular missions like deception,capture and sabotage.

 

- 5 Archwing nodes and 9 Dark Sector nodes.

 

That's a total of 120 nodes.

 

Idea 2 (Tileset based idea) -

(This idea is based on the assumption that a few planets will have same tilesets). Also,this idea seems better,IMO.

 

So, to further reduce the number of nodes,this approach can be taken. We have a total of 10 tilesets(including to be released underwater tileset).

 

-Each different tileset should have one node of the missions which are popular(and also,if it fits in that tillset,like no survivals on open tilesets).

 

-We can have a poll to see the top 5 or 6 game modes that the community loves.

AFAIK, Defense ,  Exterminate , Interception , Rescue , Spy and Survival/Excavation(Since it's either one of the 2) are the most popular game modes. So, total of 60 nodes here.

 

-Now,add 12 Boss nodes(excluding Lephantis, Mutalist Alad V and Phorid since they either need keys or are timed invasions).

 

-Then, add 10 more nodes scattered over 14 planets that will have the less popular missions like deception,capture and sabotage.

 

-5 Archwing nodes and 8 Dark Sector nodes.

 

That's 95 nodes.

 

Alternate Idea for Dark Sector Nodes -

 

To further reduce the amount of nodes,incorporate Dark sector into normal nodes,like Nightmare mode.

How does that work?

Well,we have a choice -

1. Play regular mission

2. Play Dark Sector

 

Now,when we select "Play Dark Sector", we will been shown a new cut-scene of our Liset entering in a Solar rail and then being transported/teleported to the dark sector mission. Much like the cut-scene of how Normandy is teleported by the Mass-Relays in Mass Effect.

 

That would reduce the number of nodes to -

111 nodes in the first case.

87 nodes in the second case.

 

 

Conclusion -

 

I am not sure how 20 nodes can be a thing. That effectively means 1 normal mission node per planet. 3 Archwing node and 3 Dark Sector node. That's it?!

I would request DE to share more on what they are planning. The community might come up with better ideas. After all, this game is in BETA,right?

 

If that is the case,Warframe might become way more boring. Because if timed-mission is introduced,that would mean I can not do a type of mission I want to do in a certain tileset.

 

Reducing redundant nodes is a good thing,but limiting player choices to this extent will be very bad for Warframe.

 

Even after all this wall of text,if DE is hell-bent on introducing timed missions,please reduce the RNG grind. Make sure that things are obtainable within a sane timeframe. Mainly because you are effectively introducing an extra layer of timewall in front of the already bad RNG grindwall.

 

 

Trials

 

I am not sure. For me, I don't need any instructions. I like to figure things out myself. But we have to take into consideration about what others think as well. So, I wouldn't mind even if little hints are given.

Having said that, I have to say that Trials don't really feel like raids. It just feels like multi-leveled mission, which I like actually. But it is not really hard.

 

Warframe after 30

 

I feel Focus system would have been great in this regard. I can't say much if we are not provided with what the devs are planning.

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Saying “so long!” to Stamina

The pros and cons of stamina have been in various hot topics for a long time. The source threads for this topic offer some opinions about the recently announced changes, and what they’ll mean for various aspects of Warframe. The following excerpt is from the Devstream 53 overview:
During our revamp of Parkour 2.0 we've been keeping a close eye on how Stamina plays into player movement -- what works and what doesn't. To find what works, we’re currently experimenting with: not having Stamina in-game, fixed distance leaps, blocking, and many other mechanics. It's our ultimate goal to ensure Parkour 2.0 gives players the same empowered feeling our current movement 'features' allow for. That means everyone should expect a change to Stamina, as well.
 
The change to Stamina is still a work in progress, but assuming it does get removed, what changes and/or mechanics would you like to see implemented instead? How would you change Mods and effects that currently rely on Stamina? Do you think Stamina has value? If you had the choice, would you modify it instead of removing it? What do you think the benefits to removing stamina are, if any? Please, post your thoughts/comments/ideas in this thread. 
 
Source threads:
 
 
Trials
The Trials are finally on all platforms, so we’re able to discuss them now with the community at large. The source thread for this hot topic suggests that the Trials ought to have more instructions to help guide players. What do you think? Are the Trials too mysterious? Should they have more instructions? Do you think they are too easy to figure out? Should they be more vague/complex? Post your opinion in this thread.  
 
Source thread:
 
 

 

Stamina:

 
I wrote about the removal stamina a very long time ago. So long ago the topic is long since archived. My suggestion was that you replace stamina with a noise system. Warframe already has a very tentative noise system, but it could have such glorious potential. A system that doesn't punish our speed but encourages us to move slower if we want to be quiet.
 
Here's the thread if anyone wants to read the original suggestion. This change would also require an additional enemy awareness state. Right now we have: Not alerted and alerted. What we would need is: Not alerted, suspicious, Alerted.

 

Trials:

 

I had planned to make a post regarding trials, but I guess this will do for a soapbox ;)

 

If the trials are meant to be a test of everything a top end player should know about in warframe then it has failed in this regard. It has failed in the most frustrating way: mechanically. The trials use a number of mechanics that are unique to only the trials. This isn't a bad thing necessarily, but the complete lack of explanation regarding so many of them is a really poor choice.

 

New Mechanics 1st stage:

 

Pressure pads to open doors

 

This is a perfect example of new mechanic introduced in the trials in a good way. You can see that you have activated it when it is stood upon. You can see the door it affects, you can see what happens when someone else steps on a pad and off it. Nothing was told and everything was easily understandable through gameplay.

 

 

The bomb

 

Bad, bad, bad. Nearly every part of this is bad. It's the only pickup we've ever had that drains energy. It's the only pickup that gets automatically dropped when we run out of energy. It's the only pickup that's health degrades when not held. It's the only pickup that requires us to manually drop it. It's only object that doesn't want us to run.

 

Draining energy would be fine if there was something to draw attention to it. Our UI is spread out to the four corners of the screen, unless we have a reason to check one of our corners most of the time we don't, because it takes our eyes off the action. if picking this item up gave say the visual effect of a magnetic proc, you can be sure as hell we'd have glanced at shields and energy to see what happened.

 

Being forced to drop the bomb when out of energy makes sense, except players don't seem to understand why they suddenly drop it. Players waste time trying to pick it back up preventing others from doing so. Easy way to stop this is if you pick the bomb up without energy it hurts you, flash of light from the bomb or something and damage will encourage people with no energy not to pick it up in a visceral way.

 

Bomb Health degradation when not held, Honestly I'd like to see this in a normal mission; maybe sabotage. It doesn't need to be explained in the trial and we would have the background scenario required to simply understand this mechanic.

 

Manually requiring dropping is just completely bad. There isn't a drop key so you have to switch your weapon to trigger a drop and while long term players know this, confusion stems from the lack of a place to put the bomb. Every other pickup in the game requires us to drop it in a specific labelled location. So when it comes time to drop the bomb: that is what everybody looks for. the special drop location that says drop or place. There isn't one and I've seen 2-3 bombs wasted looking for it.

 

Fast movement affecting the bomb negatively, in a high level mission and as a hidden mechanic, is annoying not challenging. This game moves fast, punishing players for moving at a fast past with unstated consequences is bad.

 

 

Multiple Consoles requiring to be hacked to activate things

 

This isn't actually a bad mechanic, what is bad: there's no visual feedback. You hack a console and nothing happens. Nothing happens at the console, nothing happens on the pipes, nothing happens on the poison pump. What should or could happen: console nothing happens. Pipes leading to consoles glow lightly once hacked the pipes stop glowing. At the poison pump the shield should fluctuate like it was hit with a magnetic procc.

 

 

New Mechanics 2nd Stage:

 

Death pads:

 

Probably the single most annoying feature of trials. It's not the death that is annoying it's the lack of information that it's coming. You are guaranteed to kill at least one person because of this (normally the same person at least a few times) This also exists no where else in game to teach us. Very simple solution: when we step on the wrong pad have the pad turn bright red for a second or two before killing us. Bam we have warning and when we die it's not a "WTF" moment it's an "oh, that's what that means I should pay more attention".

 

The murder death of everyone standing on the pads because the wrong pad was stepped on. This is just cruel. You have no control over your own life, you are stuck standing on a pad being both bored and stressed out at the same time then bam! Someone else get's knocked off or screws up and you are near instantly dead. That's just a cheap mechanic. Again, have the pad flash red for a second or two. That way if we are paying attention we can actively participate in our survival.

 

 

New Mechanics 3rd Stage:

shock rails

 

The shock rails. These... these were just pure frustration. A brand new mechanic that can kill us and has out of sight mechanics to disable the rails. Plus the massive damage to the fomorian core. At the very least cabling could be run from the shock rail to the pads to draw attention to their existence.

 

I also find it strange that the shock rail damages both us and the core in the standard version. I would have thought that would be reserved for Nightmare. That might just be a personal bias though.

 

 

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Spotted this in my Notifications, still took nearly an hour to view it this time... Recurring issue with you, Drew...

 

Stamina

 

The question I've seen most asked about this has just been "What will happen to Chroma if Stamina's removed?"

Elemental Ward on a Toxic Chroma build allows the player to cement an infinite-blocking build, in order to compete with the benefits the other Wards... and Steve/Rebecca thought the player asking meant resistances.

 

In Archwing, the suggestion to remove of stamina has seen a unanimously positive response, but outside of that... it's a grey area, mostly depending on what will be done to blocking in response.

 

Star Chart

 

So what I last heard is, the Star Chart is going to shrink to about ~20 missions which will rotate on a daily basis, in an attempt to eliminate the dozen superfluous nodes per planet.

 

My question is, what makes this any different from alerts? If what's offered as a Defense mission for a few hours becomes a Capture later, and a Rescue after that? If there's a possibility of not seeing a node of appropriate level with replay value for days?

 

Will this change how you can access boss missions, and thereby access to Warframes or unique weapons like Miter and Regor's eventual drops? Will grinding for a single frame be comparable to Vauban, or at least Nyx (eg "Ambulas hasn't been here in a week")?

How will this impact Invasions and Outbreaks, or Syndicate alerts, with fewer nodes for them to spread across? How will this affect allocation of Dark Sectors, once the armistice is over? How will this impact searching for specific enemies when grinding for mods, or Sanctuary targets? How will this affect Quests like Mirage's, where the specific name of a node is relevant to continue?

 

The main problem I can see with this system, it increases RNG in what has previously been an otherwise static system. I'm less worried about the reduction of player choice in where your lootcave is (eg "Oh no, Draco's gone, I guess I'll have to do something fun for rep instead"), so much as completely eliminating real choices (eg "Oh great, my options today are various repetitive sabotages, deceptions and mobile defenses, RIP player favorites.").

 

Trials

 

From what I remember, the learning curve for trials is... pretty high. I remember trying to run one the first week it was out and nobody knew what to do during Phase 1; dispense battery, carry it and then... what? Were we supposed to protect the injector, and OH GOD THAT'S A LOT OF MANICS?

 

Personally, I think we should be able to get some hints as we're going along as far as where we're supposed to go, but it shouldn't be totally spelled out for us unless we're taking a long time - otherwise, there's no real satisfaction in doing it if we're just reading from the instruction manual.

Bonus points if they're designed going forward to give us more options to complete a given task, rather than just one way we need to be perfectly railroaded along.

 

Warframe After 30

 

I think there's less issue with our gear stopping at Rank 30, so much as with enemy scaling continuing so far past it. The merits of flat damage skills versus weapons relative to enemy scaling has been an ongoing debate for a while.

 
 

 

At any rate, I thought "Post-30 progression" was the point of the Focus system...?

^This. Pretty much covers all my thoughts on the matter.

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Stamina:

 

Its really nothing but an annoyance as it is currently, I wouldn't miss it if it was gone.  Although for archwing, maybe keep it in the form of overheating rather than stamina, but its fine if it just goes away there too. 

 

Solar map:

 

I am not exactly looking at the proposed changes with any fondness.  There is far to much potential to make things MUCH worse.  All resources and bosses etc need to be as available as they are now.

 

Trials:

 

Let us figure it out, its a trial after all, its not supposed to just be handed to us. 

 

Progression beyond 30:

 

Yes, it would be nice.  I suppose they could work the Focus system into this, and finally give us it after promising it for a year and getting no where. 

 

This guys post about it I agree with, with regards to progress beyond 30.  As well as the current enemy scaling:

 

 

Warframe After 30

 

I think there's less issue with our gear stopping at Rank 30, so much as with enemy scaling continuing so far past it. The merits of flat damage skills versus weapons relative to enemy scaling has been an ongoing debate for a while.

 

At any rate, I thought "Post-30 progression" was the point of the Focus system...?

 

I admit, at this point I am getting bitter about the focus system.  Tired of it being promised and nothing happening or it gets cannibalized.  This would be a great opportunity to finally deliver it. 

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Stamina

Good riddance. Remove it entirely.

 

Stamina affects sprinting, but not air melee or coptering which means it has no effect on mobility for veteran players and only punishes newbies. It does not affect melee strikes since you can still swing your weapon even without having any in reserve. Theoretically influences wall running, but I can't off hand remember the last time I ran out of stamina trying to perform a wall run. The only thing that stamina really strongly affects right now is put an upper limit on how long you can block damage with your melee weapon, but it's designed in a way that it doesn't scale in any kind of useful way. The higher level the enemy i.e. the more you would actually care about blocking their attacks, the less you can actually do it because the stamina cost is based on damage.

 

Melee blocking will need some kind of rework to prevent players from blocking indefinitely, but that could just as easily be a time-based thing.  Maybe fast weapons can establish a block faster, but bigger weapons can hold a block for longer.  Green Chroma will also need something else.

 

Star chart

Or really the "nav chart" since there's only one star on it. Too many mission nodes right now, very difficult for new players to find people to clear with. Very little differentiation from one to the other aside from level. I'm hopeful that condensing the map into fewer choices will result in higher player density per selectable option and make it easier to actually get a game going.

 

As far as what I would like to see: A "landing zone" for each planet. This is an area kind of like a relay, where you can have a bunch of players in a common area. Think of bunkers, camouflaged outposts, trenches, undocumented machine spaces on ships. Each landing zone would have commanders that give missions. Every landing zone would have an alert that rolls over on an hourly basis with increased rewards, plus a handful of other missions that might roll over weekly or possibly after invasions, tac alerts, or infestation outbreaks.. "Craftable missions"  should be a thing where players can earn the right to play the enemy of their choosing on a mission type of their choosing, if they are active enough on the planet in question. Opens the way for new story telling as well, with refugees, mercenaries, procurers etc trying to meet with the Tenno or calling out to them in passing. Hire companions, receive praise from people you've rescued, get intel on upcoming special loot drops. Lots of possibilities.

 

Trials

I think some degee of complexity and obfuscation is fine. Many games with this kind of content rely on players to figure out or research how to finish the mission. There's a satisfaction to "knowing stuff".

 

 

Life after 30

We already have after-30 progression in the form of Forma.

 

If that's not enough for people, consider having it be that after reaching 30, a warframe or weapon might slowly unlock new augment slots. In the case of Warframes that would literally be augments for abilities, while for weapons that can be purely utility stuff like increased magazine size or faster reload. I'll call it Paragon levels for the sake of discussion. For Warframes this will make increasing amounts of sense in the future since DE has stated they want to ultimately have multiple augments per each ability, and for weapons it opens up the potential of arcane-like enhancements in the future (e.g. "Cannot be disarmed while using this weapon", "Chance to regain energy on head shots", "50% damage reflected to attacker when knocked down with this melee weapon" etc etc). Plus people would be a LOT more interested in utility modifiers if they didn't have to sacrifice damage, since damage output functions as a level cap on where you can use a weapon.

 

The method of unlocking these new slots should be to actually use the item in question, completing challenges, getting kills etc. Absolutely no passive leveling should be allowed for this kind of Paragon-level advancement. If you want to make it really special:  Only one frame and one weapon for each slot is allowed to be Paragon. You can advance your favorite weapon to even crazier heights, but only your favoritest of favorites.

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One thing I think we need to help with player numbers is to consider removing the region locks or at least merging a few of them. Half the time I find I can connect better to people in other regions than in my own because of individual peoples internet.

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Stamina:  I say remove it unless you have a better way of implementing it (considering parkour 2.0), but I'm more in favor of removing it.  However, what will happen to all stamina based mods and warframe powers that involve stamina?

 

Solar Map: I would not mind if there are changes or revamps, but I think what everyone wants (including me) is more interaction with the current map.  Instead of being a rotating ting of planets, it should probably be an actual solar map again, like what you would expect from a science fiction movie.   I don't know what the devs are capable of, but what if we can actually pilot our ships to where ever we would like to go in the solar system in real-time?  And then upon reaching a planet or asteroid or whatever in space, we can manually select and go to whatever location in real-time and drop off our warframes there.  For example, Mercury has ten different spots to visit.  I would have to fly to mercury and actually orbit the planet, physically go to that particular spot on the planet and drop my warframe there.  Then the mission starts.  This sort of reminds me of Mass Effect, but even that game was a bit lackluster yet headed in the right direction.  I would suggest a more 3-D approach rather than a near two-dimensional map.  Let us feel like we have more control and like we are immersed in the universe.  Let us pilot our ships!  Having the many nodes provided currently would not be so bad if the map mode was more interactive.  Having only 20 nodes total would be boring and limit player choice.  We rather have more immersion (or at least I would want it), if we could do more with all the node available currently.

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Stamina

 

Remove it. It limits us.

Why do you think people copter? Because they can't sprint forever.

Dodges and slides should be short and fast, while sprinting should be the long-distance, marathon choice of movement.

 

Solar Map

 

I don't know much about what's going to happen with the star chart, but I know what's currently wrong with it:

It's not worth playing all those nodes.

Make sure each node provides something unique to it, and make sure each node is REWARDING enough (for repeated runs too). 

People ask for taxis because it's boring and unrewarding to complete the star chart. Add a one-time reward for completing each node, each planet, and the whole star chart. Make completing it MEAN something.

 

Trials

 

I don't play them. Not worth it.

 

Progression System

 

Wasn't FOCUS supposed to be that?

 

Yes, I would like to use my maxed gear, but no, not to level that gear even further. It's powerful enough as it is.

I want to use it to level my TENNO.

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God damn! It took DE TWO AND A HALF YEARS to figure out that stamina is completely useless! Maybe they'll realise how much of a bad game design Nullifiers were in a next few years?

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solar map: 

 

each tile set should have one of each mission type, which should grow with each new tile set.

 

 

stamina:

 

be gone ye green devil bar!!!

 

 

progression beyond thirty:

 

are you talking mastery rank too?

 

i mean.. if i got mastery for each time a weapon was leveled (which sounds more like mastery than use for a short period of time and be done with it) id be happy. If bonuses came with that, id be happier. 

 

this is a big can of worms in lieu of mastery rank, forma, catalyst/reactors, limited/extra mod slots..  

 

 

Im sure there is a billion threads in fan concepts that would help those 'dead at thirty' items be better. the question and intent is too vague without knowing exactly what you want us to clarify/conceptualize.

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stamina: remove it, give people who ranked thir stamina mods some fusion cores.

 

progression: have upgrades that add permanent aura like stats to your frame. like you can add health regen, energy regen and etc etc to your warframe, make them way weaker than aura mods, something like 1+ health regen or 0.2 energy regen, make each upgrade have less effect than the upgrade before it.

ie: health regen upgrades adds, 1+, 0.75+, 0.5+, 0.25 for their upgrades for a total of 2 health regen after you maxed the health upgrades. same for other upgrades.

they could come up with offensive, defensive and supportive upgrades to cover all playstyles.

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Stamina

Good riddance. Remove it entirely.

 

Stamina affects sprinting, but not air melee or coptering which means it has no effect on mobility for veteran players and only punishes newbies. It does not affect melee strikes since you can still swing your weapon even without having any in reserve. Theoretically influences wall running, but I can't off hand remember the last time I ran out of stamina trying to perform a wall run. The only thing that stamina really strongly affects right now is put an upper limit on how long you can block damage with your melee weapon, but it's designed in a way that it doesn't scale in any kind of useful way. The higher level the enemy i.e. the more you would actually care about blocking their attacks, the less you can actually do it because the stamina cost is based on damage.

 

Melee blocking will need some kind of rework to prevent players from blocking indefinitely, but that could just as easily be a time-based thing.  Maybe fast weapons can establish a block faster, but bigger weapons can hold a block for longer.  Green Chroma will also need something else.

 

Star chart

Or really the "nav chart" since there's only one star on it. Too many mission nodes right now, very difficult for new players to find people to clear with. Very little differentiation from one to the other aside from level. I'm hopeful that condensing the map into fewer choices will result in higher player density per selectable option and make it easier to actually get a game going.

 

As far as what I would like to see: A "landing zone" for each planet. This is an area kind of like a relay, where you can have a bunch of players in a common area. Think of bunkers, camouflaged outposts, trenches, undocumented machine spaces on ships. Each landing zone would have commanders that give missions. Every landing zone would have an alert that rolls over on an hourly basis with increased rewards, plus a handful of other missions that might roll over weekly or possibly after invasions, tac alerts, or infestation outbreaks.. "Craftable missions"  should be a thing where players can earn the right to play the enemy of their choosing on a mission type of their choosing, if they are active enough on the planet in question. Opens the way for new story telling as well, with refugees, mercenaries, procurers etc trying to meet with the Tenno or calling out to them in passing. Hire companions, receive praise from people you've rescued, get intel on upcoming special loot drops. Lots of possibilities.

 

Trials

I think some degee of complexity and obfuscation is fine. Many games with this kind of content rely on players to figure out or research how to finish the mission. There's a satisfaction to "knowing stuff".

 

 

Life after 30

We already have after-30 progression in the form of Forma.

 

If that's not enough for people, consider having it be that after reaching 30, a warframe or weapon might slowly unlock new augment slots. In the case of Warframes that would literally be augments for abilities, while for weapons that can be purely utility stuff like increased magazine size or faster reload. I'll call it Paragon levels for the sake of discussion. For Warframes this will make increasing amounts of sense in the future since DE has stated they want to ultimately have multiple augments per each ability, and for weapons it opens up the potential of arcane-like enhancements in the future (e.g. "Cannot be disarmed while using this weapon", "Chance to regain energy on head shots", "50% damage reflected to attacker when knocked down with this melee weapon" etc etc). Plus people would be a LOT more interested in utility modifiers if they didn't have to sacrifice damage, since damage output functions as a level cap on where you can use a weapon.

 

The method of unlocking these new slots should be to actually use the item in question, completing challenges, getting kills etc. Absolutely no passive leveling should be allowed for this kind of Paragon-level advancement. If you want to make it really special:  Only one frame and one weapon for each slot is allowed to be Paragon. You can advance your favorite weapon to even crazier heights, but only your favoritest of favorites.

 

 

interesting read. some of it i feel isnt very warframe like.. but still mentions a depth of character that the game currently lacks.

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STAMINA

 

Honestly, it's the only topic I care about right now. To quote an influential man who has done more for this star system than, perhaps, any other; 

"I hate that %!@$ing green bar." 

The big concern with removing stamina seems to be what will happen with blocking; several people think it will result in the maneuver becoming a bit overpowered, although I would argue that at the moment it is completely arbitrary as you can't block enemies who can actually hurt you long enough for it to make a difference. This makes it very difficult for anyone outside of a selective group of Warframes to even take advantage of the melee 2.0 system as it's very suicidal for most Warframes. Unless your name is 'Ash' 'Loki' or 'Valkyr', or you are coating the entire play-field in boring crowd control powers you really can't utilize melee safely or to its' full potential. 

Personally, I'd be fine with just removing stamina entirely and letting blocking be an action we can do indefinitely. We are still vulnerable from attacks made at our back or sides, and we would still be vulnerable from elemental aoe effects such as missiles, toxins, napalms, etc. Finally, you can't attack and block at the same time, so at some point you will need to be vulnerable if you plan on actually completing any missions. Blocking will help melee players close gaps that ranged players don't have too, and give melee players a much needed degree of survival they are desperately lacking. 

 

If DE feels that some kind of resource must be attached to the action, I would strongly urge that that resource is not influenced by enemy damage, 'less it wind up being as useless as it is currently. A simple blocking meter that depletes the longer you hold down the button until your character automatically lowers their guard would be ideal. Perhaps some existing mods would go towards increasing the length of time that you can keep up your guard. 

 

*EDIT: the upcoming return of charge attacks will likely need some kind of system to keep the rest of what we do in melee relevant. I personally like the idea of building up your combo meter spends your charge attack in some kind of glorious damage orgy of pain, with the charge attack becoming more fantastic the higher we build the combo before unleashing it upon the poor stupid Grineer who happen to be in my path. Skillful execution of melee combos (or panicked flailing) would be rewarded with something devastating to finish it off with. Gives the entire system a sense of synergy it's never really had. 

 

Life After Level 30

 

Where is my focus system these days? Is it still being devoured like some divine cuisine of ideas? 

Simply adding more ranks won't really change anything; it's entirely possible to max out our guns with Forma as it is. What we're really sore on is mod-slots; anything that DE adds is generally neglected as it's very difficult for players to fit in anything that is new. At the same time, just giving us more mod-slots won't really work either because we're only going to put them towards things that make our ult-crowd-control spam more powerful. 

 

I keep thinking something like the 'bad-!' system from Borderlands 2 might make a good stand-in for the Focus system. Essentially as you gain EXP at rank 30 (on your warframe only), you would get tokens that let you increase the basic attributes of that Warframe. More Health, More Shields, More Energy, Energy Regen, Health Regen, Shield Regen, Gun Accuracy, Gun Damage, Melee Reach, Melee Damage, Reload Speed. The increases would be very very slight, and there would be a maximum on how much EXP you could get in a given day to discourage *cough* certain mission types from being exploited. Like a Syndicate for your EXP. DE could put a cap on these amounts with adjustments as the playerbase starts capping things out, or they could be really... daring? dumb? A bit of both? and let them grow infinitely, with the playerbase chipping away at decimal increases. 

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Waframe after 30

 

a would like to level weapon above rank 30

 

Trials

Law of retribution neeeds remove all puzzles   to make  less easy for new comers

am talking mostly about second part of raid

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Im always looking forward to the next hot topic because it gives insight into the possiblities of the future of warframe.

Stamina definitely needs a rework of some kind, warframes in general have far too little stamina or it just goes away after 5 rounds are shot from the enemy.

The 30+ is interesting. Just cosmetics i feel would give too little incentive but i like where its going.

The main thing that caught my eye about this hot topic however was the trials instruction. Its perfect as it is, leave it up to the players to figure out, because after the first week, its almost entirely common knowledge. These trials are supposed to be end game and challenging. Do not put more hints or instruction into the trials, many players who play this content want the challenge, and not to be spoon fed to us. If anything, more killing would be nice since at the moment, you can go through a trial without having to really kill anything aside from the 5 bomb guys and Vay hek in the final part.

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How do you feel about Stamina in Warframe?

What ever does end up happening it should NOT be a nerf to what we can do now (like stamina determining damage on melee should never EVER happen)

 

What is your initial opinion of the proposed Solar Map changes?

I want to see the Devs go completely bonkers on the new starchart. Void is going to disappear as a "planet", now how do we add it back in? a cool way i can see that happening is on each planet there is a node where we "borrow" the enemies gate to go to the void, as a side mission. the bad part about this idea is that i can get tedious. we get reduced to 4 keys, T1 - T4 keys. we then can select between the different missions (where the planet can decide what type and what tower we have access to)

 

How much instruction do you think Trials should provide to players?

More and more when the players are using more time to complete the said task.

 

Do you think there should be a progression system that goes higher than 30?

To me this is what focus should be. stuff like more efficient formas (starts at rank X instead of rank 0), lower consumable craft time (forma, catalysts, reactors, specters, rare resources etc), maybe even small bulk crafting.

the frames and weapons capping out at 30 is fine, as maxing them completely is not a long road.

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