Draco Megathread

[Alphafox]

What's the point of arguing over this? They are already addressing this. Dynamic star chart will be the answer. Thu want to level fear, you need to play the game, not grind the same node.

I for one look forward to playing the game being the best way to level an item.

But grinding a node for certain people IS playing the game, it might not be interesting for you but some people actually enjoy it, is it so hard to understand?

 

Sadly, we are far from the point where farming/grinding is the best way to level.

[Chub_N_Tuck]

But grinding a node for certain people IS playing the game, it might not be interesting for you but some people actually enjoy it, is it so hard to understand?

 

Sadly, we are far from the point where farming/grinding is the best way to level.

"Best way to level" is different for everyone. There's no point in leveling fast so much to the point that you get bored. If they really do say it's fun, I really do think they have weird taste of fun, but I respect it.

[7grims]

OP is conflating cause and effect.  People will always gravitate towards the most optimal way to farm.  Mesa and gmag farming are a result of this, not the cause of it.

 

So no matter how many other idea/solutions/observations I put out there, it doesn't matter, cause there is never gonna be the 1 solution, since there is always another way to spam, and no matter how much we talk we will always confuse cause and effect...

 

Its one of the many problems, realize it.

[Burnthesteak87]

So true. A round or three of Draco is more fun than fighting Sargas Ruk 3 dozen times looking for Cells. It's not fun but neither is slower grinding... a fast grind lets me get back to the fun parts of Warframe sooner

 

 

 

How are they a problem for you? Do they (we...) disrupt your life/gameplay at all?

Sure they do, because DE must create content accodringly to their majesties and the majority.

If people abuse the game, the game will need something to react this problem.

Grind is the answer #1 to this problem, so the more you farm, the more will have I to stay after the game's standards.

Also if those players -which at one point will start to feel full of theirselves and want them to be recognized as "Veterans"- will start crying and making noise because they burned out their game faster than how it should be...

...If you follow the logic I'm sure you'll see the problem better.

Edited June 16, 2015 by Burnthesteak87

[Cephalon_Ordis]

if they remove draco, it will only be a matter of time before another node becomes the most popular. are "draco haters" going to ask them to remove that too?

 

as mogamu said: there will always be a lootcave.

 

that lootcave may be a cave of XP, or any other thing people want. but once their cave collapses. they will find the next best thing.

[Alphafox]

"Best way to level" is different for everyone. There's no point in leveling fast so much to the point that you get bored. If they really do say it's fun, I really do think they have weird taste of fun, but I respect it.

I'm sorry but.. no. There is always a best way to do something (If we are talking about efficiency) and right now Exterminate and such is just not the one.

[Husla]

If Draco goes, I can see people going to Stephano again

[DarthVader]

Play Draco get gear to rank 30 quit warframe see ya.

[7grims]

And before any of you drop bombs on me for having a Mesa icon, I play Mesa as a run and gun frame, you'd be hardpressed and surprised to, if you ever end up in a game with me, to see me use Peacemaker more than twice. Since honestly, sitting in one place while a Gmag pulls energy to you feels highly uninteractive (Not only that, with there being ways to have the game think you're still holding down left mouse click just removes it even more). Of course that's just me, but I'd like to actually be able to aim and have control and be able to move in Peacemaker. Would be that last bit needed to put Mesa as my favorite frame.

 

I salute you, there are not many players like you, just like there aren't many mag players without greedy pull.

Nowadays I get invited to a void defense/surv/etc, as soon as I see a mesa or mag, I immediately say goodbye to the squad, it has come to the point I loath and hate to see those 2 frames together.

[Rakosta_Kai]

Truthfully, it has nothing to do with Draco or the frames you mentioned...

 

It's the fact that players like the ones you mentioned do two things that they shouldn't.

 

    1. They brag about it and/or belittle or discriminate against others for not doing it. = Lack of restraint

Sheep tend to follow Rams... When younger, less seasoned or less knowledgeable players see players employ shortcuts, they think they should too.

That creates a self replicating problem.

 

    2. They use those same tactics in venues where they shouldn't. = Lack of restraint

No one really cares so much about Draco, Mag, Gmag, Miasma spam...  They care about how their own gameplay experience is impacted.

When your actions impact other players in an unpredicted manner, you ask for those actions to be examine and they may be forcibly modified by the powers that be as a result.

 

Everyone else wants to actually enjoy the content while players like those described above trivialize it.

That, in itself, wouldn't be so bad...

But those same players seem to want to have an audience while they do so. That audience is typically unwilling.

 

I can argue against nerfs until I am blue in the face (and probably have)... The arguments tend to pale in comparison to the negative experiences players inflict on each other.

[7grims]

No. I don't even touch Draco, but I run Fleeting on all of my frames. Powers are fun.

 

That moment when you realize, I do the same, and yet I wrote this tread.

[-InV-igo95862]

Instead of trying to nerf loot caves why not make other parts of game be as rewarding?

 

 

If you remmeber stealth xp multipliers were "fixed" and no longer give you any sizeable bonus. Why not make it as they were when first introduced? (you could have level up weapon in 3-4 missions)

 

 

 

 

 If you run spy missions, you can rank your gears fast as well.

 

 

This was also "fixed". (less xp and one less reward) I used to run them but now I only run Draco.

Edited June 16, 2015 by igo95862

[Hypernaut1]

if they remove draco, it will only be a matter of time before another node becomes the most popular. are "draco haters" going to ask them to remove that too?

as mogamu said: there will always be a lootcave.

that lootcave may be a cave of XP, or any other thing people want. but once their cave collapses. they will find the next best thing.

Like I said before, dynamic star chart should fix this. It may resemble the way syndicate rep works in that the most lucrative way to earn rep is by doing missions, and not grinding one thing-

I look forward to this so much

Edited June 16, 2015 by Hypernaut1

[torsoreaper]

If draco "ruins the game" can someone explain how?  I started getting back into warframe in about February, didn't even know Draco existed, never knew egate existed, never ran any of those grind tiles.  I have every frame except vauban, I'm MR 10 I think or something like that, have 90% of the star chart open, have run every type of void mission, have prime weapons, prime frames, corrupted mods, etc....  I have enjoyed a broad variety of the game and have never felt the people grinding away on Draco have hurt me in any way.  In fact, I finally ran draco for the first time ever on Saturday to get my Quanta Vandal to level 30 after its 3rd forma (the first 2 forma I lvl'd in the void).

 

How does draco ruin anything for anyone?

 

The following answers are not acceptible: "It ruins the game", "it's exploitative", "it's not how it should be", "it's not fair"  Please answer with HOW it ruins the game for people who don't run Draco.

 

It seems to me that the only problem with loot caves is that people complain about loot caves, DE nerfs something to fix it, and then the people who complain are now screwed because their favorite ability or mod got nerfed and they didn't even loot cave to begin with.  But if people would just let everyone play the way they want to play, DE wouldn't be under pressure to go changing a ton of abilities or mods and everyone can just be happy.

[FroHD]

People want to lvl faster and dont go on other missions anymore. void and draco is all i see in recruiting now.

[nmuaddib]

Truthfully, it has nothing to do with Draco or the frames you mentioned...

 

It's the fact that players like the ones you mentioned do two things that they shouldn't.

 

    1. They brag about it and/or belittle or discriminate against others for not doing it. = Lack of restraint

Sheep tend to follow Rams... When younger, less seasoned or less knowledgeable players see players employ shortcuts, they think they should too.

That creates a self replicating problem.

 

    2. They use those same tactics in venues where they shouldn't. = Lack of restraint

No one really cares so much about Draco, Mag, Gmag, Miasma spam...  They care about how their own gameplay experience is impacted.

When your actions impact other players in an unpredicted manner, you ask for those actions to be examine and they may be forcibly modified by the powers that be as a result.

 

Everyone else wants to actually enjoy the content while players like those described above trivialize it.

That, in itself, wouldn't be so bad...

But those same players seem to want to have an audience while they do so. That audience is typically unwilling.

 

I can argue against nerfs until I am blue in the face (and probably have)... The arguments tend to pale in comparison to the negative experiences players inflict on each other.

 

So you are saying that everybody that plays Draco falls under your labels? And that they do nothing else in the game? Just trying to make some sense of your post...

[Kestral9999]

That would be really bad for support frames like Trinity.

There is also the problem of funny way how affinity is shared between weapons, but if you removed that it would force everyone to go back to Earth to swing their rank 0 sword at stuff.

First, I never said get rid of experience share completely, it just needs to be reworked. If you're using a gun and enemies are dying near you you'd still get experience for said weapon, just not nearly as much as you would if you actually killed them with the weapon. I realize that's how the current system works, it's just too rewarding for not using the weapon at all.

Second, so that would legitimize lower end content? Oh noez.

Edited June 16, 2015 by Kestral9999

[Alphafox]

People want to lvl faster and dont go on other missions anymore. void and draco is all i see in recruiting now.

Let me rephrase that for you.

 

Other missions are unrewarding, limited by the amount of mobs and limited because they simply don't scale I could add that they are simply uninteresting too (but that would just be my opinion).

 

People are don't want to level faster just to level faster. They want to level faster because it the only freaking way to progress in this game. You want to forma? Level that weapon again. You want to get another mastery rank? Level those frames and weapons.

If the game had a decent progression system this would not be a issue. Sadly we are in Warframe where half baked content is "better" than anything fully built.

Edited June 16, 2015 by Alphafox

[Chaya_Sar]

I hope its gone with new star chart change.

[7grims]

The real solution is to play the game like you prefer and stop trying to tell everybody else how to play

 

Already had allot of ppl just saying "no" and not adding nothing to the coversation

Allot of ppl just sugesting I'm ignorant and that I'm john snow xD

Already had allot of ppl proving me wrong, and I just have to shut up and deal with it.

 

Yet, ppl who just comment "its mah play style, let me do what i want" or say "dun like it dont play" just like you did, are the very tenno skoom of the forums.

You dont let ppl discuss, nor you understand the problems, nor you are willing to start to admit the game needs to be improved.

 

So just dont come to the forums, ever.

[-InV-igo95862]

Like I said before, dynamic star chart should fix this.

 

It won't fix anything. People will still run most rewarding nodes other others.

[Husla]

People think being efficient is bad and will ruin this game. They want you to get levels by playing mindlessly hour by hour, day by day, week by week until they see fit.

 

These are the players that will ruin the game more than anyone else.

[MagPrime]

I don't know how it ruins the game, I've been having no issues.  Sure, my weapons get leveled a bit slower and I'm actually learning the tiles as well as finding cute little loot rooms, but nothing is being ruined.

 

From what I've seen, the biggest complaint is that new players are going there and aren't learning basic game play, team work or even how to utilize their 'frames effectively in a non-farming situation, and it's making a negative impact on others enjoyment of missions that require those things.

[Siekier]

If Draco goes, I can see people going to Stephano again

Yep, then it'll be "omg nerf Stephano", then people will move on to other location and it'll be "omg nerf XYZ"

 

People will always look for the most efficient way of progression, especially in a game that's reliant on grinding.

It's not exploiting - they're not glitching the game etc. They're simply using the right frames, synergizing them with each other to achieve highest grinding efficiency possible.

Using the right tools for the right task is one of the foundations of progression, I don't see why Draco farmers are hated so much for utilizing this strategy. Why are they considered worse than those "mlg l33t pro only my way of playing the game is right u skrub" when they're simply trying to maximize their gains?

[torsoreaper]

People want to lvl faster and dont go on other missions anymore. void and draco is all i see in recruiting now.

 

I appreciate your answer.  I can understand this because it's like archwing.  No matter how many people on the forums say archwing is amazing, nobody is ever on archwing which makes it very difficult to solo the higher missions.  I think the reason nobody is on any of the star chart though is that the only point in playing those missions is to unlock them in case of alert.  I unlocked most of the star chart with 1 friend of mine, otherwise I would have been soloing.  Not sure if this is really draco's fault or just that there's no reward at all for playing a random tile.