If Greedy Pull Gets Nerfed, We'll Just Use Ev Trin

[MagPrime]

By the way its "affects" not "effects". Just for future reference.

 

What you are stating is not an issue with the mod itself but some of the more idiotic playerbase of this game. It will always happen even if the mod didn't exist. 

 

Join a clan and have those people help you. That's what clans are for. I thought it was common sense that recruiting chat was a cesspool but apparently you missed that memo.

So preoccupied with correcting my word choice and being snarky, totally misses the point.

 

Congrats.

[Invalid_Infinity]

So preoccupied with correcting my word choice and being snarky, totally misses the point.

 

Congrats.

Excuse me if I offended you, I just wanted to point that mistake out as it just bugged me a bit.

 

I see your point but do you see mine?

[MagPrime]

Excuse me if I offended you, I just wanted to point that mistake out as it just bugged me a bit.

 

I see your point but do you see mine?

I do. I don't agree with it, as stated above, but I do see it.

 

Thank you for taking the time to apologize and acknowledge my point.  ^.^

Edited July 7, 2015 by Noamuth

[motorfirebox]

Well then they need to overhaul the entire loot/reward system. People are going to continue camping because it's always going to be the most efficient way to get anything done until they do.

Nerfing the farming spots without fixing that core issue isn't going to make every other type of game play more appealing. If anything it's just going to make people stop playing altogether.

Indeed. I argued as much in the op.

[HAYABU5A]

now all we need is peacemaker nerf and balance is restored hueeee

[AlphaHorseman]

Gonna copy and paste what I wrote in the Community Hot Topics on July 3rd:

 

Greedy Pull:

 

The thing about Greedy Pull is that it's a symptom to the problem, not the core of it. The reason why people resort to that kind of farming is because of the Grind Walls put in place against us. It isn't just the grind, as games that have grind sometimes can manage it well. It's the Grind Walls, Time Walls, RNG Walls, and all the other walls that you put in place for us to try and vault over. When players see all the walls placed before them to try and get through/over, they're not going to be happy and play the game throughout various missions, they're going to find the quickest route to overcome the immeasurable walls placed before them.

 

You want players to play the game and be interactive, actually incentivize them by making playing the game not an endless grind, but an enjoyable experience that is rewarding to them. Don't hide the rewards behind obtrusive and oppressive walls (I'M LOOKING AT YOU, MESA GRIND WALL!), make the acquisition process of obtaining something in the game actually enjoyable and fun! Quests were a great start, they added tidbits of lore, even if the missions were the exact same that we experience throughout the game (this needs to be addressed as well), all until you threw everything behind a wait wall.

 

Then came the introduction of more mods to grind and get cores for. How do you think players are going to respond to the even more so massive grind you threw in their faces? They're going to do everything in their power to try and overcome that grind wall and make the acquisition process easier for them to overcome. Nerfing the availability of the cores wasn't the solution either, as now players are more so pushed into these tactics to try and gain sufficient supplies to level up the new mods that come in.

 

Do you really think players enjoy having to level something up after they polarize a slot with a forma? No. Having to go through all that grinding not just once, but multiple times will grate on a players' nerves. So when something like Greedy Pull comes along that can alleviate their frustrations, some players are going to resort to it. They're going to do all they can to try and get out of the rut you've placed them in, and that includes methods that you may not approve of.

 

If these problems were addressed in a more systematic way, then we wouldn't have to be talking about this. Now the problems I am referring to are the endless Grind and absurdly weighted RNG that WarFrame has, that's what needs to be fixed to be more fair to the players. To be more rewarding to those who continue to play the game, to those who stay in a mission nearly for an hour trying to get that one part only to have the weighted RNG not give them a good chance of getting it. The weighted RNG is a massive issue that infuriates players, it does not help with the experience. (I'M LOOKING AT YOU! SHELDON!)

 

Don't nerf the tools the players use, actually make the experience of playing the game more enjoyable so that the players are more exploring in their gameplays, rather than just finding the fastest way to overcome the massive grind walls you place before them.

 

Treat the core of the problem, not the symptoms of it, nor the ways players try to cure that core issue. That core is the insane amount of Walls placed before the players, it doesn't incentivize them to buy plat to overcome it, it tells them to find another game for them to enjoy. It's a simply psychological obstacle, and overlooking it will just create more problems in the future.

 

People will just resort to other tactics to get the rewards, and whatever DE does to the tools, it won't change that mentality. But, if they actually treat the core issue, which is the insurmountable grind, then things can actually improve.

[DameDameNingen]

It fascinates me that DE makes warframes like Mesa if they're against afk farming.

 

I know. DE complains about 'Homer's drinky bird' ability spam and then release a frame that doesn't even require a drinky bird, and can be 'played' by a piece of sticky tape.

[Bibliothekar]

Have you forgotten the stealth nerf that happened to drops just recently? They don't stay around for you to grab them till the end of the round.

This primarily affects ammo drops and orbs. I haven't seen a single mod or resource vanish so far, only the stuff that lies around en masse anyway.

 

By the way its "affects" not "effects". Just for future reference.

Depends on what you want to say. If you want to be smart, better check your facts first.

"The intended effect of the situation I effected was to effectively affect his affect".

Completely correct sentence, and it even makes sense. :D

 

It fascinates me that DE makes warframes like Mesa if they're against afk farming.

They could make it into something similar to Exalted Blade. Allow Mesa to move, drop the auto-targeting (or maybe only auto-target enemies within a certain, not-moddable range) and the ability might be even better.

Edited July 7, 2015 by Bibliothekar

[mr_kitty1337]

Gonna copy and paste what I wrote in the Community Hot Topics on July 3rd:

 

Greedy Pull:

 

The thing about Greedy Pull is that it's a symptom to the problem, not the core of it. The reason why people resort to that kind of farming is because of the Grind Walls put in place against us. It isn't just the grind, as games that have grind sometimes can manage it well. It's the Grind Walls, Time Walls, RNG Walls, and all the other walls that you put in place for us to try and vault over. When players see all the walls placed before them to try and get through/over, they're not going to be happy and play the game throughout various missions, they're going to find the quickest route to overcome the immeasurable walls placed before them.

 

You want players to play the game and be interactive, actually incentivize them by making playing the game not an endless grind, but an enjoyable experience that is rewarding to them. Don't hide the rewards behind obtrusive and oppressive walls (I'M LOOKING AT YOU, MESA GRIND WALL!), make the acquisition process of obtaining something in the game actually enjoyable and fun! Quests were a great start, they added tidbits of lore, even if the missions were the exact same that we experience throughout the game (this needs to be addressed as well), all until you threw everything behind a wait wall.

 

Then came the introduction of more mods to grind and get cores for. How do you think players are going to respond to the even more so massive grind you threw in their faces? They're going to do everything in their power to try and overcome that grind wall and make the acquisition process easier for them to overcome. Nerfing the availability of the cores wasn't the solution either, as now players are more so pushed into these tactics to try and gain sufficient supplies to level up the new mods that come in.

 

Do you really think players enjoy having to level something up after they polarize a slot with a forma? No. Having to go through all that grinding not just once, but multiple times will grate on a players' nerves. So when something like Greedy Pull comes along that can alleviate their frustrations, some players are going to resort to it. They're going to do all they can to try and get out of the rut you've placed them in, and that includes methods that you may not approve of.

 

If these problems were addressed in a more systematic way, then we wouldn't have to be talking about this. Now the problems I am referring to are the endless Grind and absurdly weighted RNG that WarFrame has, that's what needs to be fixed to be more fair to the players. To be more rewarding to those who continue to play the game, to those who stay in a mission nearly for an hour trying to get that one part only to have the weighted RNG not give them a good chance of getting it. The weighted RNG is a massive issue that infuriates players, it does not help with the experience. (I'M LOOKING AT YOU! SHELDON!)

 

Don't nerf the tools the players use, actually make the experience of playing the game more enjoyable so that the players are more exploring in their gameplays, rather than just finding the fastest way to overcome the massive grind walls you place before them.

 

Treat the core of the problem, not the symptoms of it, nor the ways players try to cure that core issue. That core is the insane amount of Walls placed before the players, it doesn't incentivize them to buy plat to overcome it, it tells them to find another game for them to enjoy. It's a simply psychological obstacle, and overlooking it will just create more problems in the future.

 

People will just resort to other tactics to get the rewards, and whatever DE does to the tools, it won't change that mentality. But, if they actually treat the core issue, which is the insurmountable grind, then things can actually improve.

 

1 hour to level a weapon 0 -> 30 at most, such grind xD

Clearly the people here have never played Korean games.

Edited July 7, 2015 by mr_kitty1337

[f3llyn]

1 hour to level a weapon 0 -> 30 at most, such grind xD

Clearly the people here have never played Korean games.

 

At draco maybe. But then you have to forma it 3-6 times to make it useful. So it's not just 1 hour then is it?

 

Rinse and repeat x 200.

[KenseiOmega]

At draco maybe. But then you have to forma it 3-6 times to make it useful. So it's not just 1 hour then is it?

 

Rinse and repeat x 200.

Uuuuuh no you don't. What are you using that's requiring that much of your time? I've seen some Youtube vids where guys did that to like a Mk 1 Braton for lols but otherwise....We have officially reached the part of the discussion where people are pulling stuff out of their butt to make their point by any means necessary. Facts and reality be damned.

Edited July 7, 2015 by KenseiOmega

[f3llyn]

 

Uuuuuh no you don't. What are you using that's requiring that much of your time? I've seen some Youtube vids where guys did that to like a Mk 1 Braton for lols but otherwise....We have officially reached the part of the discussion where people are pulling stuff out of their butt to make their point by any means necessary. Facts and reality be damned.

 

Everything? I like using a wide variety of frames and weapons? And I know I'm not the only one.

 

It's not pulling stuff out of my butt, it's how people play the game and it's just about the only real "end game" this game has.

 

If you aren't putting multiple forma on your weapons that makes you the oddity, not me.

Edited July 7, 2015 by f3llyn

[gizol333]

Changes:

• Mag’s Greedy Pull Augment will now only draw in items for Mag.

 

[Ofbac]

I don't think they are nerfing it just because of Draco though. I thought they said something about it being used 4x more than any other ability in the game. I think that's the real reason they planning to change it, because of the stunning amount of overuse, not just because of it's effects/Draco. 

 

This is a false argument though.  Sure it's handy to point and say "Because...  NUMBERS!"

 

Most gmags in those mesa camps pull 5 times as much as they need to, in fact they pull so much it's actually inefficient to the mesa as the mesa picks up an orb every time they drop power 1 point below max.

 

Take away gmag and what...  nekros will shoot to the top of the charts with desecrate.  Does that mean we should rush right out and nef Desecrate?

 

How many times a day a power gets used is no clear indication of it's under/over poweredness.  Just a false argument that bolsters a decisions already made and helps provide sound bites to the users who don't think for themselves.

Edited July 7, 2015 by Ofbac

[Gr3vi3R]

People started to use Trinity yet?

Edited July 7, 2015 by Gr3vi3R

[Ofbac]

People returned to using Trinity yet?

 

FTFY

[gizol333]

People started to use Trinity yet?

I do believe that i have seen at least 14 people hosting Draco asking for EV Trinity+Mesa+Frost.

[egypt]

trin could be nerfed as well.. you know...

[Bibliothekar]

trin could be nerfed as well.. you know...

I find it hard to believe that Trinity, in her current state, can be nerfed any more without making her unattractive to play.

[f3llyn]

I find it hard to believe that Trinity, in her current state, can be nerfed any more without making her unattractive to play.

 

You underestimate DE.

[f3llyn]

This is a false argument though.  Sure it's handy to point and say "Because...  NUMBERS!"

 

Most gmags in those mesa camps pull 5 times as much as they need to, in fact they pull so much it's actually inefficient to the mesa as the mesa picks up an orb every time they drop power 1 point below max.

 

Take away gmag and what...  nekros will shoot to the top of the charts with desecrate.  Does that mean we should rush right out and nef Desecrate?

 

How many times a day a power gets used is no clear indication of it's under/over poweredness.  Just a false argument that bolsters a decisions already made and helps provide sound bites to the users who don't think for themselves.

 

Exactly, i spammed the living hell out of it just because I could. I even took the mod that speeds up how fast frame abilities were cast.

 

So if an ability goes from the most used to rarely, if ever used does that mean it should be buffed? Because that's what is going to happen to mag with her pull ability.

[(XBOX)ShapelessHorr0r]

I've been brainstorming some solutions to the current lack if Gpull . Add to it if you can. Much appreciated:

I suppose I'll just redo what I said in another thread - that got lost somehow.

-Trinity obviously

-Heard good things about Limbo

-Energy plates of course

-alternating CC frames (see below 1)

-Technically Nekros but not sure

-Slow Nova + Loki (see below 2)

-Vauban if you get a choke point (see below 3)

I'll post others as I think of them.

1) take two CC frames, they simply alternate when one of them runs out of energy

Prime flow maybe?

2) Slow the crap out of enemies and disarm them, so everyone can go collect energy outside the Frost's bubble.

3) Survival has great choke points where you can camp. This makes up for Votex's lack of range.

ALSO THIS:

"Treat the core of the problem, not the symptoms of it, nor the ways players try to cure that core issue. That core is the insane amount of Walls placed before the players, it doesn't incentivize them to buy plat to overcome it, it tells them to find another game for them to enjoy. It's a simply psychological obstacle, and overlooking it will just create more problems in the future."

Edited July 7, 2015 by (XB1)ShapelessHorr0r