EmptyDevil Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Just to let you know. Mesa already cannot receive energy from Energy Restores or Energy Vampire while in Peacemaker. Like all channeled abilities, the only way to restore energy to her is to pickup energy orbs. Yes, they do need to nerf Gmag. Not only does it allow Mesa to AFK farm, it also allows any other AoE nuking frame to AoE farm if Mesa ever gets nerfed. So yes, gmag is a problem. Next on the list is Trinity and Energy restores though. They both promote camping almost as much as gmag. Energy restores seem fine imo, since you need to spend resources + credits to build and spam them. Trinity isn't too much of a problem since most if not all channeled abilities don't benefit from EV. I agree that GMag definitely needs something done with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakosta_Kai Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 I see a lot of comments on these forums and in this thread viewing the GMag change as an attack on camping. It isn't... Greedy Pull forces camping on the squad regardless of what the other members in the squad may want to do. If you want/need your drops you have to be standing by Mag to get them.... That's not fair. For that reason, and the fact that many players with Greedy Pull exercise no restraint on it's use, it needs to be changed. That's not an attack on camping as it's an entirely valid playstyle... Camping should be a tactic, just not the only tactic. When GMag is involved, it's the only tactic you are allowed to have. I view the fact that it will likely negatively affect Mesa spamming Peacemaker as a happy side-effect since many Mesa users aren't showing that much restraint themselves. I will say that while I was completely against the notion of a Peacemaker re-work before, some of the ideas thrown out in the forums actually sound better, more balanced, and a lot more fun than the current version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torsoreaper Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Nerf energy pickups, nerf GMag energy pulling, nerf Trinity, nerf Limbo, nerf energy syphon, nerf efficiency mods, nerf energy restores, nerf Sahasa energy orbs on dig rng, and that should cover it. GG campers? This is basically what is going to happen in the forums, maybe just not in that order. When people realize nerfing GP doesn't stop anything, they will cry to nerf trin. When people use energy cookies they will cry to nerf the cookies. When they nerf the cookies and it doesn't stop anything they will cry to nerf the efficiency mods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aggh Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 (edited) Take the aimbot off Peacemaker and have it make Mesa a turret you have to aim yourself (and probably up the damage to make up for that). Or if removing the aimbot isn't an option, make it so that mesa only aimbots on a cone in front of her that players will have to aim instead of the massive 360 aoe that she has right now. Then go ahead with greedy pull nerf they talked about where mag will only pull her own instance drops. Bam. Gmag+mesa afk farming done for. I see a lot of comments on these forums and in this thread viewing the GMag change as an attack on camping. It isn't... Greedy Pull forces camping on the squad regardless of what the other members in the squad may want to do. If you want/need your drops you have to be standing by Mag to get them.... That's not fair. For that reason, and the fact that many players with Greedy Pull exercise no restraint on it's use, it needs to be changed. That's not an attack on camping as it's an entirely valid playstyle... Camping should be a tactic, just not the only tactic. When GMag is involved, it's the only tactic you are allowed to have. I view the fact that it will likely negatively affect Mesa spamming Peacemaker as a happy side-effect since many Mesa users aren't showing that much restraint themselves. I will say that while I was completely against the notion of a Peacemaker re-work before, some of the ideas thrown out in the forums actually sound better, more balanced, and a lot more fun than the current version. Eh, it doesn't really force you to camp. Just copter back and forth for energy pickups every now and then. Edited July 2, 2015 by Aggh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Lorewalker1022 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 No. If you don't want Mesa to use energy orbs that are not a result of her kills then fine. But to not allow her to use energy restoration too, I'm against that. I don't mind not using the energy orbs, but if I don't want to move across the map to collect energy I shouldn't be forced to. I've built 250 energy restores just for that very reason, so I don't have to count on anybody's kills for energy orbs or have to move half way across the map to re-up on energy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TennoPain Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Started to hate word NERF because of this game Damage has already been done (we have too many noobs who are now HIGH master ranks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TennoPain Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Browku. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CruelCrow Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 (edited) >Limbo with Trin >Trin on Peacemaker Um, what? Never mentioned Trin, and Mesa doesn't get energy from EV while her ult is active. My point is that it's ridiculously easy to just substitute GMag for something else. Even if ever 'frame compatible with Draco is merged to hell, you can just go to Kappa or something. You can laugh all you want. Not really sure what you thought you accomplished there. Edited July 2, 2015 by CruelCrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monybags33 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Peacemaker just needs a rework. It shouldn't be a stationary channeling ability in the first place. Looks like she will be the next one too have a 4th like Excal but with guns by the looks of it, I'm all in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AoiiToori Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Um, what? Never mentioned Trin, and Mesa doesn't get energy from EV while her ult is active. My point is that it's ridiculously easy to just substitute GMag for something else. Even if ever 'frame compatible with Draco is merged to hell, you can just go to Kappa or something. You can laugh all you want. Not really sure what you thought you accomplished there. Whoops, I misread Mirage for Trin. Either way anything is better than a macrofest. What's your point exactly anyway, you want Gmag not nerfed? So you don't want anything changed and have it stay the same? If the macro/camping stays the same when DE decides to change Greedy Pull, what exactly are you trying to advocate for? For no change? Side note: IMO, a frame's augment shouldn't be their main feature. The fact that Mag isn't even called Mag anymore is bleh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Pumba315 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 The way I would fix Mesa's ultimate is to change how it works. I would change it so it allows her to run around with her peacemakers out, she can 'hipfire' at target if she desires, possibly with an increase crit chance/crit damage or increased fire rate. Alternatively, she can ADS her peacemakers, and pressing the 'fire' button while aiming marks a target unit (and specifically marks the body part selected). While a target is marked, peacemakers will auto-aim at the marked target if it is within range to do so. Allow up to two marked targets per rank in Peacemaker (meaning 0 marked targets at rank 0, 2 at rank 1, 4 at rank 2, and 6 at rank 3). Targets marked have a designated priority in the order of their marking. Peacemaker will auto-aim at the first marked target, if it's within range, and switch to the net target in an ascending order based on LoS and whether or not it's within range of the ability. However, reduce the auto-aim of the Peacemaker significantly (as it can now be used to hipfire when not auto-aiming or a target is not within range). It would give Mesa a more 'Read Dead' style ultimate, which I think would be a lot of fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LODESAMONEY Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Peacemaker needs to be reworked so that the player has to control it manually. Instead of channeling it, make it so that you have to hit a button prompt at the right time for the ability to continue, or for Mesa to shoot and kill a legal target while the ability is active. This would make the ability skill-based, highly skilled Mesa's would still be in demand, and deadweight would gradually be weeded out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakosta_Kai Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Eh, it doesn't really force you to camp. Just copter back and forth back to camp for energy pickups, mods, and ammo every now and then. FTFY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Mesa's PeaceMaker and greedy pull do not need a nerf, THEY NEED A REWORK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aggh Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 (edited) FTFY Oh no, you have to copter over to a single location every now and then for drops instead of going around the map making sure you didn't miss anything. Darn. That's terrible isn't it? Ohwaititsnot. It's not camping btw since you're not staying in that single location the whole time. Edited July 2, 2015 by Aggh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LODESAMONEY Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Oh no, you have to copter over to a single location every now and then for drops instead of going around the map making sure you didn't miss anything. Darn. That's terrible isn't it? Ohwaititsnot. It's not camping btw since you're not staying in that single location the whole time. Then that Mesa is doing it wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aggh Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 (edited) Then that Mesa is doing it wrong. The discussion in the post you're responding to was about gmag forcing camping, not about whether mesa should be camping. Even then though, having a mobile mesa can help to clean up spawns faster so you don't have to wait for mobs to run into a stationary mesa's los. It's not afk farming and not always as resource efficient, but it is faster. Edited July 2, 2015 by Aggh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malacronious Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Mesa's PeaceMaker and greedy pull do not need a nerf, THEY NEED A REWORK. Mmm, mmm. I do declare. I agree with this statement. I have used nerf in the past but I think rework sounds like a much better word for what needs to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LODESAMONEY Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 The discussion in the post you're responding to was about gmag forcing camping, not about whether mesa should be camping. Even then though, having a mobile mesa can help to clean up spawns faster so you don't have to wait for mobs to run into a stationary mesa's los. It's not afk farming and not always as resource efficient, but it is faster. If the Gmag is doing it wrong, then the Mesa is doing it wrong by partying with that Gmag in the first place. But that's the meat of the problem. Honestly, if Greedy Pull gets reworked, what's to stop people from kicking Gmag to the curb and bringing EV Trins instead as the new meta? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CruelCrow Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 (edited) Whoops, I misread Mirage for Trin. Either way anything is better than a macrofest. What's your point exactly anyway, you want Gmag not nerfed? So you don't want anything changed and have it stay the same? If the macro/camping stays the same when DE decides to change Greedy Pull, what exactly are you trying to advocate for? For no change? Side note: IMO, a frame's augment shouldn't be their main feature. The fact that Mag isn't even called Mag anymore is bleh. I'm not saying GMag needs or doesn't need a nerf. I'm honestly neutral, I think the DC should have picked something better in the first place(I swear they don't have any foresight) but it's actually a pretty cool ability when it's not used for camping/farming.With that in mind, I definitely acknowledge the problem- I'm just saying that this isn't the fix. What needs to be changed is affinity/resources gain, and possibly the ranking system. I would even argue for a rework of endless missions. Nerfing stuff is just a bandage fix. This community is pretty exploitative of the game mechanics- although everything DE does just adds fuel to the fire. Not that I can blame the players- the game is set up that way. Edited July 3, 2015 by CruelCrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Pumba315 Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 I honestly don't think Greedy Pull needs a nerf at all. I think the ability is fine. Greedy Pull is just symptom of the problem being AFK farming, not the problem itself. If Greedy Pull gets nerfed, the community will just find another way to farm, nerfing it won't solve any problem what-so-ever. Honestly though, I don't know why people feel the need to farm so much in this game. I mean, it's not like you're playing Destiny or many other games that have way worse grinds to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eidolon_Slayer Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Just prevent energy pickups during peacemaker. Solved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aggh Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 If the Gmag is doing it wrong, then the Mesa is doing it wrong by partying with that Gmag in the first place. But that's the meat of the problem. Honestly, if Greedy Pull gets reworked, what's to stop people from kicking Gmag to the curb and bringing EV Trins instead as the new meta? Mesa doesn't get energy from EV while using peacemaker so it would still kill afk farming even if doesn't kill camping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evanescent Posted July 3, 2015 Author Share Posted July 3, 2015 Just prevent energy pickups during peacemaker. Solved. It becomes inconsistent with other channeled abilities which require pickups to remain viable, which makes for a glaring inconsistency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eidolon_Slayer Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 It becomes inconsistent with other channeled abilities which require pickups to remain viable, which makes for a glaring inconsistency. Then nerf it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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