Jump to content
  • 0

Ash's Rising Storm Augment - A Study


Sci_Ant
 Share

Question

So I like to play Ash every once in a while when I just want to kill stuff and for it to look cool. XD

 

With the recent release of Ash Prime I went back to re-evaluate my Bladestorm build and thought I could use Rising Storm since I have never used it before. So I tried to do some research on how it worked, on the forums and online, but could not get conclusive answers and wanted to see for myself how it would work in practice so I did couple of tests that I would like to share here.

 

Basic info about the combo multiplier from the wiki is here >

Combo Counter

Each successful consecutive melee hit against enemies with a Melee weapon equipped within a short period of time will start a Combo Counter that appears above the weapon UI, which tracks how many hits have been performed. Once a certain number of consecutive hits have been made, a Damage Multiplier will be given to the Melee weapon, increasing the weapon's overall damage. The Damage Multiplier increases as larger consecutive hit counts are achieved, allowing for greater damage against larger numbers of tougher enemies. The Combo Counter resets if no enemies are hit after 3 seconds.

The Damage Multiplier starts at 1.5X the weapon's base damage after five consecutive hits. The multiplier is increased by +.5X after achieving three times the number of hits of the previous multiplier, i.e. 15 consecutive hits yield a 2X Damage Multiplier, 45 consecutive hits yield 2.5X Damage, 135 hits yield 3X Damage, 405 hits yield 3.5x etc.

 

Currently there no known limit to the Damage Multiplier, thus it's theoretically possible to attain massive damage multiplier numbers of 5X or more. In practice, the number of possible consecutive hits is limited by the number of enemies, their durability, and the player's skill at connecting combos to other enemies.

 

Ash's Blade Storm contributes to the Combo Counter, allowing it to start and chain Combo hits.

 

Valkyr's Hysteria and Excalibur's Exalted Blade also utilize the Combo Counter, allowing their damage output to increase with consecutive attacks.

 

Despite its name, the Combo Counter should not be confused with the Combos performed using Stance Mods. The Combo Counter will count all melee attacks performed while equipping Melee weapons, including stealth attacks.

 

The Combo Counter appears to count attacks performed while having Primary or Secondary weapons equipped.

 

Immediately switching to a melee weapon within 4 seconds will show the amount of hits performed before the switch.

 

Melee hits against objects, like Mining Equipment, do not count towards the Combo Counter.

 

The Combo Counter does not increase the damage of prompted stealth attacks or prompted finisher attacks.

 

 

RISING STORM ONLY WITH BLADESTORM

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

FIRST TEST

 

This was to determine whether the melee combo multiplier affected Bladestorm when a melee weapon was not equipped. So I did 2 tests, one without a melee and one with a melee equipped.

 

In both tests I get the same damage numbers :

2216 = 1 x damage at first strike

3324 = 1.5 x damage after a few strikes

4432 = 2 x damage after even more strikes

 

The damage in both the videos correspond meaning that the combo counter works for Bladestorm regardless of whether a melee weapon is equipped or not.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

SECOND TEST

 

This was to test the duration of the combo counter when I had Rising Storm equipped. The build used was 67 % power duration and 200 % power strength.

 

The last damage after reaching 45 strikes is 9983 or almost 10k which is in line with the expected value. The combo multiplier lasts around 4 seconds, the expected value of 3 x 2 x 0.67 = 4 seconds.

 

This means that Rising Storm is affected by Duration mods and will give 6 seconds only with 100 % base power duration.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

THIRD TEST

 

This was to see if Bladestorm is affected by stealth multipliers or not. I spawned a few Butchers, let them go into non alert state, then attacked them while invisible. The build used was 185 % power strength to give 3700 damage per strike. I also went ingame to make sure and luckily got a Stealth kills mini objective to prove it was not affected by stealth without a doubt.

 

The damage observed on the first few strikes in both videos is 3694 or almost 3700, the expected value.

 

This means that invisibility or stealth multipliers do not affect Bladestorm.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

FINAL BUILD

 

So I made a build for Rising Storm as follows >

h9K8doQ.jpg

 

Tested this build in the Sim and in game to get the following results >

5G7yHkH.jpg

32pJjB6.jpg

 

Managed to easily reach 139 x combo with 3 x damage multiplier after around 3 Bladestorm's in a Grineer defense and 182 x combo with many chained Bladestorms when there were many enemies in T3 defense.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CONCULSIONS (TL;DR) :

 

1. Rising Storm and combo multiplier works regardless of whether a melee weapon is equipped or not.

2. Rising Storm augment is affected by duration mods after applying the 100 % increase (only for negative or base duration).

 

Therefore, Rising Storm Duration for negative or base power duration = 6 x (Power duration/100)

 

3. Invisibility or stealth multipliers do not affect Bladestorm damage.

 

Advantages of using Rising Storm with Bladestorm:

 

1. To keep the Bladestorm damage at a high multiplier like 2.5 x or 3 x at all times for Bladestorm spammers. This means that after increasing the combo multiplier from a first Bladestorm, it will apply the increased damage directly on the first enemy in the next Bladestorm initiated within 6 seconds in a 100% base duration build.

2. To make it easier to reach a high combo multiplier of 2.5 x or 3 x while chaining Bladestorms.

3. To increase the damage of Bladestorm in Duration specific builds for more invisibility, without having to use power strength mods.

4. To gain more duration for invisibility while sacrificing power strength mods and not losing overall damage output.

 

As an example of the last point, I was previously using a 230 % power strength build so that would give me 9200 damage per strike after gaining a 2 x damage multiplier from 15 strikes. The overall damage per strike including bleedout would be 31740. Without Rising Storm I would lose that damage after 3 seconds of not using another Bladestorm after the first one ends.

 

With my Rising Storm build with 185 % power strength I could reach a damage multiplier of 2.5 with 45 strikes on a large group of enemies or by chaining BS on smaller groups within 6 seconds of each other to get 9250 damage per strike that I can maintain between Bladestorms. The total damage including bleedout would be 31912.5 per strike, but the difference here is that I will maintain that damage and gain more damage between Bladestorms.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

RISING STORM WITH BLADESTORM AND THEN MELEE

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

These tests were done to determine the effect of duration mods on Rising Storm augment when used along with melee. For this 4 tests were done to determine the Rising Storm and melee combo counter duration with different power durations from mods.

Youtube taking too long to process videos so I've uploaded them in a compressed file to Google Docs > https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6Iv0IAMwbTERVA2U0xGVmlPdXM/view?usp=sharing

 

In the first test 169 % power Duration was used giving around 8 seconds on both the Rising Storm combo and Melee combo counters, whereas it should give around 10.

 

In the second test 232 % power duration was used and it showed around 9 to 10 seconds on both the Rising Storm combo and Melee combo counters, whereas it should give around 14 seconds.

 

In the third test 282 % power duration (max) was used and it showed around 11 seconds on both the Rising Storm combo and Melee combo counters, whereas it should give around 17 seconds.

 

It has been discussed online and on the wiki that the cap on the duration is 8 seconds but this is not the case. The effective cap on power duration mods may be 8 seconds after which there is a drastic reduction for any power duration above 133 % which should give 8 seconds. To confirm this the last test was done with 141 % power duration.

 

The result is that the combo multiplier lasts for around 7 seconds instead of 8. This leads to the conclusion that any power duration over 100 % has a much smaller effect on the Rising Storm augment than expected.

 

The final conclusion is that the calculation for power duration for the augment is as follows:

 

Rising Storm Duration for positive power duration = 3 + (3 * Power Duration/100)

 

To verify:

 

1. In the first test the duration is 8 seconds and according to the equation duration = 3 + 3 * 1.69 = 3 + 5.07 = 8.07 seconds

 

2. In the second test the duration is around 9 to 10 seconds and according to the equation duration = 3 + 3 * 2.32 = 9.96 seconds

 

3. In the third test the duration is around 11 seconds and according to the equation duration = 3 + 3 * 2.82 = 11.46 seconds

 

4. In the fourth test the duration is around 7 seconds and according to the equation duration = 3 + 3 * 1.41 = 7.23 seconds

 

Since all four of the values correspond closely we can safely assume that the calculation for positive power duration works according to the above formula.

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

FINAL BUILD

 

Bladestorm with melee build >

zGrTplU.jpg

 

141 % power duration is used to get around 11 seconds on Smoke Screen and around 7 seconds on Rising Storm melee combo counter. Overextended is used to reach more enemies with each cast of Bladestorm so as to get a higher combo counter initially. It can be replaced with Stretch if playing in a smaller tileset like a defense since enemies will be closer together anyway.

 

More duration can be used as per your preference.

 

Melee centric build > 

 

This involves a lot more duration while keeping Bladestorm only as a combo counter initiator.

G7Qc2vV.jpg

 

In game result of the above build, while using a low ranked weapon with a few mods on high level Grineer map (Kiste, Ceres), I easily managed to reach the 3 x multiplier with using 1 Bladestorm and then just meleeing while invisible. This shows how potent this mod is for a melee Ash  >

 

72b09SA.jpg

 

Even better results with infested, use Bladestorm once and managed to reach 500 + combo in a short time on a Dark Sector Survival.

 

Ycrj3ET.jpg

 

 

 

> In game results from user LazerSkink, using a melee centric combo builder build > https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/489835-ashs-rising-storm-augment-a-study/page-2#entry5515084

 

xMHeD0t.jpg

nQLr7VR.jpg

 

Build used >

 

8kdfIi1.jpg

 

 

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

CONCULSIONS (TL;DR) :

 

1. Melee attacks after use of a Rising Storm Bladestorm treats each melee strike as a part of the Rising Storm duration resetting it to its initial duration with each strike. (For example: 141% Power duration gives 7.46 seconds on the combo counter, which resets to 7.46 seconds for any melee strike done after the Bladestorm.)

 

2. The melee combo counter is not reset to 0 when it is started and then you melee strike in the air, miss strikes, hit objects or by using other powers. Therefore, one can hit anything or copter without risk of losing the combo counter.

 

Advantages of using Rising Storm with Bladestorm and then Meleeing:

 

1. To quickly gain high multipliers on the melee combo counter and then having an extended duration in which to melee to continue to gain combo counts.

 

2. To gain higher period on invisibility and use Bladestorm not as a spam ability but to gain high melee damage and increase the melee damage through more melee strikes.

 

3. To gain more melee damage much faster in melee centric situations such as Infested maps or playing with a Disarm Loki.

 

Thanks for reading and I hope it helps!

 

 

My other guides >

Sci_Ant's Comprehensive Chroma Armor Build Guide [in-Depth With Calculations And Results]

[Guide] Parkour 2.0 Tips And Tricks / Tutorial Videos Collection

Edited by Sci_Ant
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Recommended Posts

Nono, I've got those stats, at least for Defense. My extremely disorganized notes. I was just asking, to rephrase my original question, if anyone knew how to fit a Warframe-typical curve to this data, as in an exponent and a coefficient.

Graph it in Excel, add a trendline, and display the equation of the trendline.

 

For example, for wave-level for the first tab, defense, I end up getting
 
Exponential:
level = 8.1735e(0.0504*wave) etc.
 
Polynomial:
level = 0.0221*wave^2 + 0.3435*wave + 7.7992
 
Edit: Don't derail the thread further; if you need more help make your own thread or send me a PM :D
Edited by Darzk
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Graph it in Excel, add a trendline, and display the equation of the trendline.

 

For example, for wave-level for the first tab, defense, I end up getting

 

Exponential:

level = 8.1735e(0.0504*wave) etc.

 

Polynomial:

level = 0.0221*wave^2 + 0.3435*wave + 7.7992

 

Edit: Don't derail the thread further; if you need more help make your own thread or send me a PM :D

 

Haha, I'd knew you'd come to the rescue 'cos you're good with such stuff! :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Updated the OP with a result from my own gameplay for the melee centric build showing it's potential with weak weapons.

 

In game result of the above build, while using a low ranked weapon with a few mods on high level Grineer map (Kiste, Ceres), I easily managed to reach the 3 x multiplier with using 1 Bladestorm and then just meleeing while invisible. This shows how potent this mod is for a melee Ash  >

 

72b09SA.jpg

 

Even better results with infested, use Bladestorm once and managed to reach 500 + combo in a short time on a Dark Sector Survival.

Ycrj3ET.jpg

Edited by Sci_Ant
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hello this is something that ash players should be looking at. Some of us don't want to always be spam BS....lol.

 

Anways now that U17 is out, and no more stamina, can we start some retesting on this with new builds. I wouldn't mind helping if needed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hello this is something that ash players should be looking at. Some of us don't want to always be spam BS....lol.

 

Anways now that U17 is out, and no more stamina, can we start some retesting on this with new builds. I wouldn't mind helping if needed.

 

Thanks for the support! :)

 

I don't think we'll need to retest anything since neither the augment nor the melee combo counter had anything to do with and wasn't limited by the Stamina system. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for the support! :)

 

I don't think we'll need to retest anything since neither the augment nor the melee combo counter had anything to do with and wasn't limited by the Stamina system. 

 

Well one of them is using quick rest, and we also have another slot for utility. So wouldn't it be ok to get rid of quick rest? And if so for what, also droping hand spring into the new slot frees up one more? What would you suggest?

 

Edited: Excuse my incompetence. I was mistaking your build for LazerSkink. Anyways I will just play around with it to find out what gives me the most usage for that 1 slot. Thanks anyways.

Edited by megastorm
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well one of them is using quick rest, and we also have another slot for utility. So wouldn't it be ok to get rid of quick rest? And if so for what, also droping hand spring into the new slot frees up one more? What would you suggest?

 

Edited: Excuse my incompetence. I was mistaking your build for LazerSkink. Anyways I will just play around with it to find out what gives me the most usage for that 1 slot. Thanks anyways.

 

Hehe, no problemo! And I highly suggest a max duration build since it will give you 11 seconds on Rising Storm and 22 seconds on invisibility, perfect for meleeing to those high combo counters. Lazer may have reached 1111 + combo but the 4 x is still ahead at 1215, so realistically we're looking at aiming for 405 combo counter for the 3.5 damage multiplier as I have shown in my last result image. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Updated build post U17:

8kdfIi1.jpg

 

 

It is now a lot more free (though as you can see, I had to give a third Forma). You may replace Rending Turn and even Constitution with whatever you please. I may consider Mobilize since its mod cost is incredibly low (max rank is 5) and it provides 20% over Rending Turn and the other IPS parkour mods' 18%.

 

I'm not taking the elemental parkour mods into account just yet given they have a lot more mod cost (max 12) and for now will stick with this build. If I add anymore polarities, it may interfere with my other Ash Prime builds which may result in me pulling another "two of one frame because one is too strict with polarities" like I did with my Excalibur(s).

 

The same tips from my previous post apply here still, only difference now is the build is a lot more free than before.

Edited by LazerSkink
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Updated build post U17:

8kdfIi1.jpg

 

 

It is now a lot more free (though as you can see, I had to give a third Forma). You may replace Rending Turn and even Constitution with whatever you please. I may consider Mobilize since its mod cost is incredibly low (max rank is 5) and it provides 20% over Rending Turn and the other IPS parkour mods' 18%.

 

I'm not taking the elemental parkour mods into account just yet given they have a lot more mod cost (max 12) and for now will stick with this build. If I add anymore polarities, it may interfere with my other Ash Prime builds which may result in me pulling another "two of one frame because one is too strict with polarities" like I did with my Excalibur(s).

 

The same tips from my previous post apply here still, only difference now is the build is a lot more free than before.

 

Nice updated build. I'll update the OP with it. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...